Page names can actually be create automatically in Semantic Forms; see:


On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 6:26 PM, Jonathan D. Greene <> wrote:

Thank you for your detailed response.

** Let me preface with I am new to forms.

I was heading down one of the paths you identified; that of unique row
information each a separate page.

The advantage of that approach is the ability to query the whole data
set and present it in a complete table; or any subset to extract more
specific data. Great!

The disadvantages of that approach are:

* It clutters up the wiki with a number of sparse data pages that (in my
environment) others would likely stumble across.

* Pages (as far as I can tell **) need to be manually named. A user
can't, for example just click an 'Add Data' button and go about plugging
in information in fields to populate a row. There may be a work around
to this particular limitation by bringing in a UNIX timestamp as the
filename or the like, but you still have the first issue with the
abundance of sparse data pages.

The basic idea of a data table...
* Whose data is stored on a wiki single page
* Whose rows are editable through a form.
* Whose related queries can isolate rows or fields
Would be immensely useful!

As I looked at it **, the missing-link seems to be a database-like index
or key mechanism that can be used behind the scenes to number each row,
to shuffle the index values when rows are deleted, to provide the next
available index value when a row is created (through a form). Short of
such a mechanism, I don't think it is possible to use forms to manage
table entries without creating many data row pages.

If I am overlooking anything please write and let me know.

Thank You.

S Page wrote:
> Yaron Koren wrote in reply to Jonathan D. Greene:
>> In any case, it looks like you have only one question, and it's not
>> that basic. :) Yes, you can store multiple rows of data in a single
>> page, although you couldn't query that data through SMW, so it might
>> not be worth it. And why would you want the form to only display one
>> row?
> For an example of storing multiple rows of data on one page, see
> <> (scroll down)
> If you click the [edit with form] tab (please don't save, this is live
> data!) you can see this uses a Semantic Forms form for each "row", as
> explained in
> <>
>  So what you seem to be asking for is doable.
> This is fine for *displaying* information in rows on a page to users.
> But as Yaron alludes, it's useless for *querying*.  Your page
> "SmokeTest" may display an informative set of rows
>    Build#   Pass/Fail
>     759       Fail
>     760       Pass
>     762       Pass
> But to SMW, all you've said is
> * SmokeTest has a Build_number property with values 759, 760, and 762.
> * SmokeTest has a PassFail property with values Fail and Pass.
> There's *no* connection between the different values!
> You can try to force a connection using "many-valued" or n-ary
> properties, but currently neither SMW nor Semantic Forms supports them
> very well.  If you want useful querying, what you'll probably end up
> doing is creating a separate wiki page for each row
>   SmokeTest/run_42 has a Build_number property with value 759 and a
> PassFail property with value Fail
>   SmokeTest/run_43 has Build_number=760 and PassFail=Pass
>   SmokeTest/run_44 has Build_number=762 and PassFail=Pass
> Do you see the difference?
> Now that the information for each row is on a separate page, you can
> rebuild your table as a query for these, and you can query for
> particular kinds of rows ("Show me the build#s with failures").
> Semantic Forms has some support for creating such "semi-anonymous"
> pages, see
> <>,
> I haven't got around to using it yet.  In this area of test results we
> may instead use actual rows in a Google Docs spreadsheet together with
> a Google Docs form to fill it in.  If your data looks like a row in a
> spreadsheet, maybe a spreadsheet is a better tool than a wiki page.  :-)
> I hope this example helps you think about your page organization.
> Heh, it reminds me to file an Enhancement request for better subpage
> support in SMW queries.
> Yours sincerely,
> --
> =S Page

Jonathan D. Greene
Harris Corporation, Broadcast Communications Division
1160 U.S. Highway 22 East Bridgewater, NJ 08807-2912 U.S.A
T: +1.908.927.1219
F: +1.908.927.1233

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