rubycocoa-talk — talking about RubyCocoa

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Steven D. A. <st...@ar...>]

Yeah.  I agree without Apple's permission, loading the Ruby runtime  
into the iPhone would violate the EULA.  I do think there is a chance  
they could be talked into allowing this, but short of that, any  
solution would have to generate and link .o files in the same way  
Objective-C does.  It would be a Ruby compiler down to the bare metal,  
not a VM as the environment in which Ruby currently runs.

For all I know, Apple already has a bytecode-driven VM in the iPhone.   
If that is true, then the compiler could just compile to that bytecode  
and the problem is no different than the problems of, say, the Jruby  
project.  It's very similar with ARM, too, you just have to think of  
ARM's commands as the bytecode to use. :-)

On Mar 11, 2009, at 3:20 AM, Axel M. Roest wrote:

> At 23:21 -0400 10-03-2009, Steven Arnold wrote:
>> Disclaimer: IANAL, and for that reason this will be my last post on
>> the legal side of this issue.  My reading of the iPhone SDK agreement
>> below is my opinion only.
>
> I think it is more this part that's bothering us:
> 3.3.2 <stuff deleted>. No interpreted code may be downloaded and used
> in an Application except for code that is interpreted and run by
> Apple's Published APIs and built-in interpreter(s).
>
> As ruby is neither built-in, nor supported in the API, you're on  
> your own.
>
> just my 0.02...
>
> Axel
> -- 
> _________________________
> Axel Roest
> axelloroestello@{AIM/MSN} - Skype:axellofono - XOIP: 084-8749988
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Axel M. R. <rub...@ro...>]

At 23:21 -0400 10-03-2009, Steven Arnold wrote:
>Disclaimer: IANAL, and for that reason this will be my last post on 
>the legal side of this issue.  My reading of the iPhone SDK agreement
>below is my opinion only.

I think it is more this part that's bothering us:
3.3.2 <stuff deleted>. No interpreted code may be downloaded and used 
in an Application except for code that is interpreted and run by 
Apple's Published APIs and built-in interpreter(s).

As ruby is neither built-in, nor supported in the API, you're on your own.

just my 0.02...

Axel
-- 
_________________________
Axel Roest
axelloroestello@{AIM/MSN} - Skype:axellofono - XOIP: 084-8749988

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Steven A. <st...@ar...>]

Disclaimer: IANAL, and for that reason this will be my last post on  
the legal side of this issue.  My reading of the iPhone SDK agreement  
below is my opinion only.

Reading the SDK agreement at http://developer.apple.com/iphone/download.action?path=/iphone/iphone_sdk_for_iphone_os_2.2.1__9m2621a__final/iphone_sdk_agt_ea0495.pdf 
, I can see how the language might be interpreted to mean that you  
can't distribute an app except through the App Store, although even  
that (section 3.3.3) seems to apply only if you "enable additional  
features or functionality" beyond that of a normal app, such as e.g.  
allowing use of another carrier.

I see nothing at all prohibiting anyone from using tools other than  
XCode to write iPhone apps.  The agreement is very clear that any  
attempt to break the DRM of Apple is not allowed, but that is not what  
a Ruby->iPhone compiler would be intended to do, any more than the  
Objective-C compiler which is part of gcc -- a GPL-based app --  
intends to do that.

On Mar 10, 2009, at 8:51 PM, Jason Foreman wrote:

> I think you'll find the bigger problem is that no  
> RubyCocoa.framework exists in the iPhone SDK.  So you might be able  
> to get an app to compile and even run using Ruby in the simulator,  
> but you'll have a lot more work to do if you expect to run it on a  
> device.  You'd have to compile Ruby for ARM, along with RubyCocoa,  
> and get those working first.  Then you have the potential legal  
> hurdle as I mentioned in the preceding note.
>
> Bottom line, it just isn't worth trying to write an iPhone app using  
> Ruby at this time.  You can use Ruby as a tool in your build  
> processes, or to generate Obj-C code, or otherwise, but implementing  
> your program in Ruby is just not a wise idea.

We agree it is not feasible now to write an iPhone app in Ruby.  In  
order to do that, it does seem you'd need a parser and compiler that  
compiles to the ARM infrastructure.  I started the thread because I  
was wondering if there was any easier way to do this.  My current  
feeling is that no, there is not.

Having said that, in a world where some people begin projects like  
WINE, which attempt a complete re-implementation of Win32, this does  
not seem like an insurmountable goal -- merely a difficult one.   
RubyCocoa itself is a daring idea which I'm sure took quite a bit of  
effort to implement.  I wouldn't expect a Ruby-iPhone kit to be any  
easier.

steven

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Jason F. <ja...@th...>]

On Mar 10, 2009, at 7:12 PM, Steven Arnold wrote:
> I read the Apple iPhone SDK EULA at http://images.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/iphone.pdf
>  and I do not see anything in it that suggests that only Apple-
> provided tools may be used to create iPhone apps.  In fact, I don't
> even see anything that says you may only distribute an iPhone app via
> the iTunes App Store.  If I'm missing some language in the EULA,
> please correct me.

That document appears to be a user-level agreement; it seems to have  
nothing to do with the SDK.  Also note that the license to which you  
agree when downloading the SDK is *much* different than the legal  
contract you must sign to become a registered developer (and thus able  
to submit apps to the store).  The developer contract has some  
language that can be interpreted to mean you cannot use any code  
execution mechanism not explicitly supported by Apple (see below).


> My take: there is nothing in the EULA to prevent a tool that creates
> an iPhone app via Ruby.  While such a tool could possibly be used for
> "illegitimate" purposes (e.g. an app for use on jailbroken devices),
> let's not forget that ALL so-called illegitimate apps that exist today
> were created using XCode and Objective-C.  Allowing iPhone apps to be
> created using Ruby would not add any capability for illegitimate
> activity that does not already exist today.

I think you'll find the bigger problem is that no RubyCocoa.framework  
exists in the iPhone SDK.  So you might be able to get an app to  
compile and even run using Ruby in the simulator, but you'll have a  
lot more work to do if you expect to run it on a device.  You'd have  
to compile Ruby for ARM, along with RubyCocoa, and get those working  
first.  Then you have the potential legal hurdle as I mentioned in the  
preceding note.

Bottom line, it just isn't worth trying to write an iPhone app using  
Ruby at this time.  You can use Ruby as a tool in your build  
processes, or to generate Obj-C code, or otherwise, but implementing  
your program in Ruby is just not a wise idea.


Best of luck,

Jason

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Steven A. <st...@ar...>]

On Mar 10, 2009, at 7:06 PM, Timothy Perrett wrote:

> Yes, whilst your right about the legitimate aspect - remember in legal
> terms there is no notion of illegitimate being in anyway "ok". lol.
>
> Whilst it's true that people will always find ways to hack this device
> - apple will no doubt find ever more legal bean counters to stop
> people doing so.

I read the Apple iPhone SDK EULA at http://images.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/iphone.pdf 
  and I do not see anything in it that suggests that only Apple- 
provided tools may be used to create iPhone apps.  In fact, I don't  
even see anything that says you may only distribute an iPhone app via  
the iTunes App Store.  If I'm missing some language in the EULA,  
please correct me.

My take: there is nothing in the EULA to prevent a tool that creates  
an iPhone app via Ruby.  While such a tool could possibly be used for  
"illegitimate" purposes (e.g. an app for use on jailbroken devices),  
let's not forget that ALL so-called illegitimate apps that exist today  
were created using XCode and Objective-C.  Allowing iPhone apps to be  
created using Ruby would not add any capability for illegitimate  
activity that does not already exist today.

steven

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Timothy P. <ti...@ge...>]

Yes, whilst your right about the legitimate aspect - remember in legal  
terms there is no notion of illegitimate being in anyway "ok". lol.

Whilst it's true that people will always find ways to hack this device  
- apple will no doubt find ever more legal bean counters to stop  
people doing so.

If your just going to "play" with an app for personal usage, then I  
guess your at low risk - however anything much more than that I would  
consider it being fairly risky given the EULA and TOS.

God luck, whatever your choice

Tim

Sent from my iPhone

On 10 Mar 2009, at 22:47, Steven Arnold <st...@ar...>  
wrote:

>
> On Mar 10, 2009, at 3:42 PM, Neil Stevens wrote:
>
>> Timothy Perrett wrote:
>>> This is actually against the Apple EULA of the SDK. Its not that
>>> its not
>>> technically possible, its just that its leagally not :-)
>>
>> Depends on whether he's writing for the Apple side or the Jailbroken
>> side of iPhone development, heh.
>
> Right, this is intended for strictly legitimate apps sold on the App
> Store, indistinguishable from any other app other than that the source
> code is Ruby rather than Objective C.  First of all, I like Ruby way
> more than Objective C, and second, I want to use my preferred editor
> rather than XCode.
>
> steven
>
>
> --- 
> --- 
> --- 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Apps built with the Adobe(R) Flex(R) framework and Flex Builder(TM)  
> are
> powering Web 2.0 with engaging, cross-platform capabilities. Quickly  
> and
> easily build your RIAs with Flex Builder, the Eclipse(TM)based  
> development
> software that enables intelligent coding and step-through debugging.
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Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Steven A. <st...@ar...>]

On Mar 10, 2009, at 3:42 PM, Neil Stevens wrote:

> Timothy Perrett wrote:
>> This is actually against the Apple EULA of the SDK. Its not that  
>> its not
>> technically possible, its just that its leagally not :-)
>
> Depends on whether he's writing for the Apple side or the Jailbroken
> side of iPhone development, heh.

Right, this is intended for strictly legitimate apps sold on the App  
Store, indistinguishable from any other app other than that the source  
code is Ruby rather than Objective C.  First of all, I like Ruby way  
more than Objective C, and second, I want to use my preferred editor  
rather than XCode.

steven

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Neil S. <ne...@ha...>]

Timothy Perrett wrote:
> This is actually against the Apple EULA of the SDK. Its not that its not
> technically possible, its just that its leagally not :-)

Depends on whether he's writing for the Apple side or the Jailbroken
side of iPhone development, heh.

-- 
Neil Stevens - ne...@ha...

If you're seeing shades of gray, it's because you're not
looking close enough to see the black and white dots.

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Timothy P. <ti...@ge...>]

This is actually against the Apple EULA of the SDK. Its not that its not
technically possible, its just that its leagally not :-)

Cheers, Tim

On 10/03/2009 17:57, "Steven Arnold" <st...@ar...> wrote:

> Has there been any discussion on how we might be able to use Ruby to
> program the iPhone?  Since the iPhone is more resource-constrained
> than Mac OS X, perhaps what we need is a way to compile ruby files
> to .o files in exactly the same way that Objective-C does.  I.e., a
> modification of Apple's gcc might be the underlying tool that we use
> to implement Ruby on the iPhone.
> 
> Any other thoughts on easier approaches to solving this problem?
> steven
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
> Rub...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
> 

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Neil S. <ne...@ha...>]

Steven Arnold wrote:
> Has there been any discussion on how we might be able to use Ruby to  
> program the iPhone?  Since the iPhone is more resource-constrained  
> than Mac OS X, perhaps what we need is a way to compile ruby files  
> to .o files in exactly the same way that Objective-C does.  I.e., a  
> modification of Apple's gcc might be the underlying tool that we use  
> to implement Ruby on the iPhone.
> 
> Any other thoughts on easier approaches to solving this problem?

I'd look into MacRuby for that.  http://www.macruby.org/ if you didn't
see already.

I would think that using the ObjC runtime, which already has to be there
and loaded anyway, would make it lighter to use.
-- 
Neil Stevens - ne...@ha...

If you're seeing shades of gray, it's because you're not
looking close enough to see the black and white dots.

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Eloy D. <elo...@gm...>]

You might be interested in the following project: http://github.com/takuma104/iphone-rubycocoa/tree/master
I have no idea about its capabilities yet though.

Eloy

On 10 mrt 2009, at 18:57, Steven Arnold wrote:

> Has there been any discussion on how we might be able to use Ruby to
> program the iPhone?  Since the iPhone is more resource-constrained
> than Mac OS X, perhaps what we need is a way to compile ruby files
> to .o files in exactly the same way that Objective-C does.  I.e., a
> modification of Apple's gcc might be the underlying tool that we use
> to implement Ruby on the iPhone.
>
> Any other thoughts on easier approaches to solving this problem?
> steven
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
> Rub...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk

[Rubycocoa-talk] Ruby on the iPhone?

[Steven A. <st...@ar...>]

Has there been any discussion on how we might be able to use Ruby to  
program the iPhone?  Since the iPhone is more resource-constrained  
than Mac OS X, perhaps what we need is a way to compile ruby files  
to .o files in exactly the same way that Objective-C does.  I.e., a  
modification of Apple's gcc might be the underlying tool that we use  
to implement Ruby on the iPhone.

Any other thoughts on easier approaches to solving this problem?
steven

[Rubycocoa-talk] [ANN] MacRuby 0.4

[Laurent S. <lau...@gm...>]

Hi,

After several months of development and some slight delays, MacRuby
0.4 is now available. Get it here while it's still hot!

MacRuby is a version of Ruby 1.9, ported to run directly on top of Mac
OS X core technologies such as the Objective-C common runtime and
garbage collector, and the CoreFoundation framework. While still a
work in progress, it is the goal of MacRuby to enable the creation of
full-fledged Mac OS X applications which do not sacrifice performance
in order to enjoy the benefits of using Ruby.

You can learn more about MacRuby, and download a binary installer,
from the website:

http://ruby.macosforge.org

Or about this release more specifically, on our blog:

http://www.macruby.org/post/macruby-04

Enjoy,

Laurent

[Rubycocoa-talk] casting a struct

[Steve C. <sco...@gm...>]

Here's an inspect of an object pointer I'm trying to unpack:

#<OSX::ObjcPtr:0xe0e25a cptr=0x2191ec0 allocated_size=0
encoding={_CFURLRequest=}>

So I try to cast it:

p ns_url_request._CFURLRequest.cast_as('{_CFURLRequest=CFURLRequest}')

Which fails with:

Can't convert object to type '{_CFURLRequest=CFURLRequest}'

I found the following information on casting to struct from the objc pdf:

structure {name=type...}

I've tried many different variations on that struct cast string.  Does
anyone know what the proper form is?

-Steve

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] subclassing, hit a wall

[Allison N. <dem...@ma...>]

Oh, yeah, I should have seen that. You walked straight into GIL  
deadlock hell. It's a good lesson to learn though - if you're going to  
call a blocking Cocoa function, make sure that there is never a call  
back into Ruby during the treatment of the function.

I normally work around this by writing an obj-c wrapper for the  
function that doesn't block (the equivalent of choosing a non-blocking  
version of the API if it exists).

Does anyone know of a more elegant solution to this?



Envoyé de mon iPhone

Le 15 févr. 09 à 05:09, Steve Conover <sco...@gm...> a écrit :

> For the record...
>
> I had an rtfm problem, I was using
> NSURLConnection.sendSynchronousRequest_returningResponse_error, which,
> according to the docs:
>
> "A synchronous load is built on top of the asynchronous loading code
> made available by the class. The calling thread is blocked while the
> asynchronous loading system performs the URL load on a thread spawned
> specifically for this load request. No special threading or run loop
> configuration is necessary in the calling thread in order to perform a
> synchronous load."
>
> I'm still fuzzy on the details here but the key seems to be the
> blocking part.  So I switched to an asynchronous and got it to work.
>
> Thanks for your suggestions Allison.
>
> -Steve
>
> On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 4:48 PM, Steve Conover <sco...@gm...>  
> wrote:
>> I agree that the class methods aren't the problem - it appears to me
>> like the initialization may have completed, and somewhere on the way
>> to calling startLoading there's either a blocking call that I'm not
>> aware of, or something else.
>>
>> What are the tools the Rubycocoa people bring to bear when there's a
>> mystery like this?  Is there a debugger one can easily fire up to see
>> what's going on?  Ruby-debug isn't much help - the hang is apparently
>> just after the return from canonicalRequestForRequest...
>>
>> -Steve
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 12:55 PM, Allison Newman  
>> <dem...@ma...> wrote:
>>> I don't have any good ideas as to what is going wrong, except to say
>>> that it would appear to me that the injection of class methods is  
>>> not
>>> the real problem, it's a red-herring.  you can see in the trace that
>>> they are correctly called, and they return without any obvious
>>> problems, so I'm guessing the real problem is elsewhere.
>>>
>>> What happens if you remove either the definition of the function,  
>>> the
>>> call to objc_class_method, or both?  Does it still work, or does it
>>> hang?  Have you tried implementing the class in Objective-C to see
>>> what happens (this would at least make sure that you are returning
>>> reasonable values from your functions, if it works in obj-c).  I'm
>>> wondering about that 0 that you return for canInitWithRequest:   
>>> isn't
>>> that function supposed to return a boolean, hence false, rather  
>>> than 0?
>>>
>>> Ummm, apart from that, I'm not too familiar with NSURLProtocol, so I
>>> can't offer up any special insight to the actual implementation :-)
>>>
>>>
>>> Le 14 févr. 09 à 20:35, Steve Conover a écrit :
>>>
>>>>>> objc_class_method(:canInitWithRequest_, '@:@@')
>>>>>> def self.canInitWithRequest(ns_url_request)
>>>>>>  p" canInitWithRequest"
>>>>>>  0
>>>>>> end
>>>
>>>
>>> --- 
>>> --- 
>>> --- 
>>> --- 
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Open Source Business Conference (OSBC), March 24-25, 2009, San  
>>> Francisco, CA
>>> -OSBC tackles the biggest issue in open source: Open Sourcing the  
>>> Enterprise
>>> -Strategies to boost innovation and cut costs with open source  
>>> participation
>>> -Receive a $600 discount off the registration fee with the source  
>>> code: SFAD
>>> http://p.sf.net/sfu/XcvMzF8H
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
>>> Rub...@li...
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>>>
>>
>
> --- 
> --- 
> --- 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Open Source Business Conference (OSBC), March 24-25, 2009, San  
> Francisco, CA
> -OSBC tackles the biggest issue in open source: Open Sourcing the  
> Enterprise
> -Strategies to boost innovation and cut costs with open source  
> participation
> -Receive a $600 discount off the registration fee with the source  
> code: SFAD
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/XcvMzF8H
> _______________________________________________
> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
> Rub...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] subclassing, hit a wall

[Steve C. <sco...@gm...>]

For the record...

I had an rtfm problem, I was using
NSURLConnection.sendSynchronousRequest_returningResponse_error, which,
according to the docs:

"A synchronous load is built on top of the asynchronous loading code
made available by the class. The calling thread is blocked while the
asynchronous loading system performs the URL load on a thread spawned
specifically for this load request. No special threading or run loop
configuration is necessary in the calling thread in order to perform a
synchronous load."

I'm still fuzzy on the details here but the key seems to be the
blocking part.  So I switched to an asynchronous and got it to work.

Thanks for your suggestions Allison.

-Steve

On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 4:48 PM, Steve Conover <sco...@gm...> wrote:
> I agree that the class methods aren't the problem - it appears to me
> like the initialization may have completed, and somewhere on the way
> to calling startLoading there's either a blocking call that I'm not
> aware of, or something else.
>
> What are the tools the Rubycocoa people bring to bear when there's a
> mystery like this?  Is there a debugger one can easily fire up to see
> what's going on?  Ruby-debug isn't much help - the hang is apparently
> just after the return from canonicalRequestForRequest...
>
> -Steve
>
> On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 12:55 PM, Allison Newman <dem...@ma...> wrote:
>> I don't have any good ideas as to what is going wrong, except to say
>> that it would appear to me that the injection of class methods is not
>> the real problem, it's a red-herring.  you can see in the trace that
>> they are correctly called, and they return without any obvious
>> problems, so I'm guessing the real problem is elsewhere.
>>
>> What happens if you remove either the definition of the function, the
>> call to objc_class_method, or both?  Does it still work, or does it
>> hang?  Have you tried implementing the class in Objective-C to see
>> what happens (this would at least make sure that you are returning
>> reasonable values from your functions, if it works in obj-c).  I'm
>> wondering about that 0 that you return for canInitWithRequest:  isn't
>> that function supposed to return a boolean, hence false, rather than 0?
>>
>> Ummm, apart from that, I'm not too familiar with NSURLProtocol, so I
>> can't offer up any special insight to the actual implementation :-)
>>
>>
>> Le 14 févr. 09 à 20:35, Steve Conover a écrit :
>>
>>>>> objc_class_method(:canInitWithRequest_, '@:@@')
>>>>> def self.canInitWithRequest(ns_url_request)
>>>>>   p" canInitWithRequest"
>>>>>   0
>>>>> end
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Open Source Business Conference (OSBC), March 24-25, 2009, San Francisco, CA
>> -OSBC tackles the biggest issue in open source: Open Sourcing the Enterprise
>> -Strategies to boost innovation and cut costs with open source participation
>> -Receive a $600 discount off the registration fee with the source code: SFAD
>> http://p.sf.net/sfu/XcvMzF8H
>> _______________________________________________
>> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
>> Rub...@li...
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>>
>

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] subclassing, hit a wall

[Steve C. <sco...@gm...>]

I agree that the class methods aren't the problem - it appears to me
like the initialization may have completed, and somewhere on the way
to calling startLoading there's either a blocking call that I'm not
aware of, or something else.

What are the tools the Rubycocoa people bring to bear when there's a
mystery like this?  Is there a debugger one can easily fire up to see
what's going on?  Ruby-debug isn't much help - the hang is apparently
just after the return from canonicalRequestForRequest...

-Steve

On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 12:55 PM, Allison Newman <dem...@ma...> wrote:
> I don't have any good ideas as to what is going wrong, except to say
> that it would appear to me that the injection of class methods is not
> the real problem, it's a red-herring.  you can see in the trace that
> they are correctly called, and they return without any obvious
> problems, so I'm guessing the real problem is elsewhere.
>
> What happens if you remove either the definition of the function, the
> call to objc_class_method, or both?  Does it still work, or does it
> hang?  Have you tried implementing the class in Objective-C to see
> what happens (this would at least make sure that you are returning
> reasonable values from your functions, if it works in obj-c).  I'm
> wondering about that 0 that you return for canInitWithRequest:  isn't
> that function supposed to return a boolean, hence false, rather than 0?
>
> Ummm, apart from that, I'm not too familiar with NSURLProtocol, so I
> can't offer up any special insight to the actual implementation :-)
>
>
> Le 14 févr. 09 à 20:35, Steve Conover a écrit :
>
>>>> objc_class_method(:canInitWithRequest_, '@:@@')
>>>> def self.canInitWithRequest(ns_url_request)
>>>>   p" canInitWithRequest"
>>>>   0
>>>> end
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Open Source Business Conference (OSBC), March 24-25, 2009, San Francisco, CA
> -OSBC tackles the biggest issue in open source: Open Sourcing the Enterprise
> -Strategies to boost innovation and cut costs with open source participation
> -Receive a $600 discount off the registration fee with the source code: SFAD
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/XcvMzF8H
> _______________________________________________
> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
> Rub...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] subclassing, hit a wall

[Allison N. <dem...@ma...>]

I don't have any good ideas as to what is going wrong, except to say  
that it would appear to me that the injection of class methods is not  
the real problem, it's a red-herring.  you can see in the trace that  
they are correctly called, and they return without any obvious  
problems, so I'm guessing the real problem is elsewhere.

What happens if you remove either the definition of the function, the  
call to objc_class_method, or both?  Does it still work, or does it  
hang?  Have you tried implementing the class in Objective-C to see  
what happens (this would at least make sure that you are returning  
reasonable values from your functions, if it works in obj-c).  I'm  
wondering about that 0 that you return for canInitWithRequest:  isn't  
that function supposed to return a boolean, hence false, rather than 0?

Ummm, apart from that, I'm not too familiar with NSURLProtocol, so I  
can't offer up any special insight to the actual implementation :-)


Le 14 févr. 09 à 20:35, Steve Conover a écrit :

>>> objc_class_method(:canInitWithRequest_, '@:@@')
>>> def self.canInitWithRequest(ns_url_request)
>>>   p" canInitWithRequest"
>>>   0
>>> end

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] subclassing, hit a wall

[Steve C. <sco...@gm...>]

Exactly

On 2/14/09, Allison Newman <dem...@ma...> wrote:
> Steve,
>
> Just to clarify, you're trying to subclass NSURLProtocol, and you want
> to override/create functions that are to be called from Objective C,
> Is that right?
>
> Alli
>
> Le 14 févr. 09 à 18:02, Steve Conover a écrit :
>
>> Hi everyone.
>>
>> I'm trying to make my own URL Protocol.  I've been marching along
>> pretty well but have hit a hang problem - if you can spot the problem
>> I'd appreciate help, but I might be even more interested in what you'd
>> do to debug the problem - I don't even know what to try next.
>>
>> It seems that I've defined startLoading properly - the framework
>> complains if it's not there, or the method signature is incorrect.
>> canonicalRequestForRequest gets called and then the whole operation
>> hangs - startLoading never gets invoked.
>>
>>
>> My class:
>>
>> require 'osx/cocoa'
>>
>> OSX.require_framework 'WebKit'
>>
>> class LocalProtocol < OSX::NSURLProtocol
>>
>>  objc_class_method(:canInitWithRequest_, '@:@@')
>>  def self.canInitWithRequest(ns_url_request)
>>    p" canInitWithRequest"
>>    0
>>  end
>>
>>  objc_class_method(:canonicalRequestForRequest_, '@:@@')
>>  def self.canonicalRequestForRequest(ns_url_request)
>>    p"canonicalRequestForRequest #{ns_url_request.inspect}"
>>    ns_url_request
>>  end
>>
>>  def startLoading
>>    p "startLoading"
>>  end
>>
>>  def stopLoading
>>    p "stopLoading"
>>  end
>>
>> end
>>
>>
>>
>> Calling code:
>>
>>    protocol = LocalProtocol.alloc
>>
>>    OSX::NSURLProtocol.registerClass(LocalProtocol)
>>
>>    url = OSX::NSURL.alloc.initWithString("local://foo")
>>    url_request = OSX::NSURLRequest.requestWithURL(url)
>>    url_response = OSX::NSURLResponse.alloc
>>    response =
>> OSX
>> ::NSURLConnection
>> .sendSynchronousRequest_returningResponse_error(url_request,
>> url_response, nil)
>>    str = "." * response.length
>>    response.getBytes_length(str)
>>
>>
>> Console result:
>>
>> " canInitWithRequest"
>> " canInitWithRequest"
>> " canInitWithRequest"
>> "canonicalRequestForRequest #<OSX::NSURLRequest:0x8beeee
>> class='NSURLRequest' id=0x2003e50>"
>> <HANGS HERE FOREVER>
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>> Steve
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Open Source Business Conference (OSBC), March 24-25, 2009, San
>> Francisco, CA
>> -OSBC tackles the biggest issue in open source: Open Sourcing the
>> Enterprise
>> -Strategies to boost innovation and cut costs with open source
>> participation
>> -Receive a $600 discount off the registration fee with the source
>> code: SFAD
>> http://p.sf.net/sfu/XcvMzF8H
>> _______________________________________________
>> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
>> Rub...@li...
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Open Source Business Conference (OSBC), March 24-25, 2009, San Francisco, CA
> -OSBC tackles the biggest issue in open source: Open Sourcing the Enterprise
> -Strategies to boost innovation and cut costs with open source participation
> -Receive a $600 discount off the registration fee with the source code: SFAD
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/XcvMzF8H
> _______________________________________________
> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
> Rub...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>

-- 
Sent from my mobile device

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] subclassing, hit a wall

[Allison N. <dem...@ma...>]

Steve,

Just to clarify, you're trying to subclass NSURLProtocol, and you want  
to override/create functions that are to be called from Objective C,  
Is that right?

Alli

Le 14 févr. 09 à 18:02, Steve Conover a écrit :

> Hi everyone.
>
> I'm trying to make my own URL Protocol.  I've been marching along
> pretty well but have hit a hang problem - if you can spot the problem
> I'd appreciate help, but I might be even more interested in what you'd
> do to debug the problem - I don't even know what to try next.
>
> It seems that I've defined startLoading properly - the framework
> complains if it's not there, or the method signature is incorrect.
> canonicalRequestForRequest gets called and then the whole operation
> hangs - startLoading never gets invoked.
>
>
> My class:
>
> require 'osx/cocoa'
>
> OSX.require_framework 'WebKit'
>
> class LocalProtocol < OSX::NSURLProtocol
>
>  objc_class_method(:canInitWithRequest_, '@:@@')
>  def self.canInitWithRequest(ns_url_request)
>    p" canInitWithRequest"
>    0
>  end
>
>  objc_class_method(:canonicalRequestForRequest_, '@:@@')
>  def self.canonicalRequestForRequest(ns_url_request)
>    p"canonicalRequestForRequest #{ns_url_request.inspect}"
>    ns_url_request
>  end
>
>  def startLoading
>    p "startLoading"
>  end
>
>  def stopLoading
>    p "stopLoading"
>  end
>
> end
>
>
>
> Calling code:
>
>    protocol = LocalProtocol.alloc
>
>    OSX::NSURLProtocol.registerClass(LocalProtocol)
>
>    url = OSX::NSURL.alloc.initWithString("local://foo")
>    url_request = OSX::NSURLRequest.requestWithURL(url)
>    url_response = OSX::NSURLResponse.alloc
>    response =  
> OSX 
> ::NSURLConnection 
> .sendSynchronousRequest_returningResponse_error(url_request,
> url_response, nil)
>    str = "." * response.length
>    response.getBytes_length(str)
>
>
> Console result:
>
> " canInitWithRequest"
> " canInitWithRequest"
> " canInitWithRequest"
> "canonicalRequestForRequest #<OSX::NSURLRequest:0x8beeee
> class='NSURLRequest' id=0x2003e50>"
> <HANGS HERE FOREVER>
>
>
> Regards,
> Steve
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Open Source Business Conference (OSBC), March 24-25, 2009, San  
> Francisco, CA
> -OSBC tackles the biggest issue in open source: Open Sourcing the  
> Enterprise
> -Strategies to boost innovation and cut costs with open source  
> participation
> -Receive a $600 discount off the registration fee with the source  
> code: SFAD
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/XcvMzF8H
> _______________________________________________
> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
> Rub...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk

[Rubycocoa-talk] subclassing, hit a wall

[Steve C. <sco...@gm...>]

Hi everyone.

I'm trying to make my own URL Protocol.  I've been marching along
pretty well but have hit a hang problem - if you can spot the problem
I'd appreciate help, but I might be even more interested in what you'd
do to debug the problem - I don't even know what to try next.

It seems that I've defined startLoading properly - the framework
complains if it's not there, or the method signature is incorrect.
canonicalRequestForRequest gets called and then the whole operation
hangs - startLoading never gets invoked.


My class:

require 'osx/cocoa'

OSX.require_framework 'WebKit'

class LocalProtocol < OSX::NSURLProtocol

  objc_class_method(:canInitWithRequest_, '@:@@')
  def self.canInitWithRequest(ns_url_request)
    p" canInitWithRequest"
    0
  end

  objc_class_method(:canonicalRequestForRequest_, '@:@@')
  def self.canonicalRequestForRequest(ns_url_request)
    p"canonicalRequestForRequest #{ns_url_request.inspect}"
    ns_url_request
  end

  def startLoading
    p "startLoading"
  end

  def stopLoading
    p "stopLoading"
  end

end



Calling code:

    protocol = LocalProtocol.alloc

    OSX::NSURLProtocol.registerClass(LocalProtocol)

    url = OSX::NSURL.alloc.initWithString("local://foo")
    url_request = OSX::NSURLRequest.requestWithURL(url)
    url_response = OSX::NSURLResponse.alloc
    response = OSX::NSURLConnection.sendSynchronousRequest_returningResponse_error(url_request,
url_response, nil)
    str = "." * response.length
    response.getBytes_length(str)


Console result:

" canInitWithRequest"
" canInitWithRequest"
" canInitWithRequest"
"canonicalRequestForRequest #<OSX::NSURLRequest:0x8beeee
class='NSURLRequest' id=0x2003e50>"
<HANGS HERE FOREVER>


Regards,
Steve

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] bridging between ruby and objective-C

[Jason F. <ja...@th...>]

You could, if so inclined, provide a declaration of the class in a  
header and no declaration, which should let you define a (pointer)  
variable of that type.  That means you'd have some duplicate code- 
you'd have to decide if the extra maintenance is worth the gain.

Jason


On Feb 10, 2009, at 4:19 AM, Allison Newman <dem...@ma...> wrote:

> Just to add to what Eloy has said, the problem is that Ruby classes  
> don't exist at compile time, they are created by the ruby compiler  
> at runtime, so the compiler can't know about them (with the possible  
> exception of the built-in classes; you'd have to ask Laurent about  
> that!).  So even for MacRuby, where Ruby classes ARE Objective-C  
> classes, you can't use static typing for Ruby objects.  You'll have  
> the compiler complaining about an unknown type, or some other  
> syntatic error, depending on where you try to use the definition.
>
> One way to think about this is that you don't have .h files in  
> Ruby.  These files exist for precisely this reason in the various  
> flavours of C.
>
> Hope that helps,
>
> Alli
>
> On Tuesday, February 10, 2009, at 11:11AM, "Eloy Duran" <elo...@gm... 
> > wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Looking at your blog post it seems you are talking about MacRuby,
>> which is a different project then RubyCocoa to which you have posted
>> this.
>>
>> Having said that, no I don't think it's possible.
>>
>> - Eloy
>>
>> On 10 feb 2009, at 09:03, S. Woodside wrote:
>>
>>> I want to call back and forth between Ruby and ObjC objects, I've
>>> figured it out in a basic way and posted it here:
>>>
>>> http://simonwoodside.com/weblog/2009/2/10/wondeful_joy_mix_ruby_and/
>>>
>>> However, it would be nice if on the ObjC side I could actually  
>>> declare
>>> objects of a type defined on the Ruby side instead of using "id"...
>>> and have the compiler, or at least just the linker understand that.
>>> Does anyone know if it's possible?
>>>
>>> --simon
>>>
>>>
>>> PS sorry for cross-posting with the google group, but i realized  
>>> that
>>> it doesn't seem to be active.
>>>
>>> --- 
>>> --- 
>>> --- 
>>> --- 
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with
>>> Adobe(R)AIR(TM)
>>> software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills
>>> and code to
>>> build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the
>>> power of local
>>> resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR
>>> SDK and
>>> Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/ 
>>> adobe-com
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
>>> Rub...@li...
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>>
>>
>> --- 
>> --- 
>> --- 
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with  
>> Adobe(R)AIR(TM)
>> software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills  
>> and code to
>> build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the  
>> power of local
>> resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe  
>> AIR SDK and
>> Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/ 
>> adobe-com
>> _______________________________________________
>> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
>> Rub...@li...
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>>
>>
>
> --- 
> --- 
> --- 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with  
> Adobe(R)AIR(TM)
> software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills  
> and code to
> build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the  
> power of local
> resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR  
> SDK and
> Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/ 
> adobe-com
> _______________________________________________
> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
> Rub...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] bridging between ruby and objective-C

[Allison N. <dem...@ma...>]

 ugh! Ruby INTERPRETER, not ruby compiler... bien entendu

On Tuesday, February 10, 2009, at 11:19AM, "Allison Newman" <dem...@ma...> wrote:
> Just to add to what Eloy has said, the problem is that Ruby classes don't exist at compile time, they are created by the ruby compiler at runtime, so the compiler can't know about them (with the possible exception of the built-in classes; you'd have to ask Laurent about that!).  So even for MacRuby, where Ruby classes ARE Objective-C classes, you can't use static typing for Ruby objects.  You'll have the compiler complaining about an unknown type, or some other syntatic error, depending on where you try to use the definition.
>
>One way to think about this is that you don't have .h files in Ruby.  These files exist for precisely this reason in the various flavours of C.
>
>Hope that helps,
>
>Alli
>
>On Tuesday, February 10, 2009, at 11:11AM, "Eloy Duran" <elo...@gm...> wrote:
>>Hi,
>>
>>Looking at your blog post it seems you are talking about MacRuby,
>>which is a different project then RubyCocoa to which you have posted  
>>this.
>>
>>Having said that, no I don't think it's possible.
>>
>>- Eloy
>>
>>On 10 feb 2009, at 09:03, S. Woodside wrote:
>>
>>> I want to call back and forth between Ruby and ObjC objects, I've
>>> figured it out in a basic way and posted it here:
>>>
>>> http://simonwoodside.com/weblog/2009/2/10/wondeful_joy_mix_ruby_and/
>>>
>>> However, it would be nice if on the ObjC side I could actually declare
>>> objects of a type defined on the Ruby side instead of using "id"...
>>> and have the compiler, or at least just the linker understand that.
>>> Does anyone know if it's possible?
>>>
>>> --simon
>>>
>>>
>>> PS sorry for cross-posting with the google group, but i realized that
>>> it doesn't seem to be active.
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with  
>>> Adobe(R)AIR(TM)
>>> software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills  
>>> and code to
>>> build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the  
>>> power of local
>>> resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR  
>>> SDK and
>>> Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/adobe-com
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
>>> Rub...@li...
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>>
>>
>>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with Adobe(R)AIR(TM)
>>software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills and code to
>>build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the power of local
>>resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR SDK and
>>Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/adobe-com
>>_______________________________________________
>>Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
>>Rub...@li...
>>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>>
>>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with Adobe(R)AIR(TM)
>software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills and code to
>build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the power of local
>resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR SDK and
>Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/adobe-com
>_______________________________________________
>Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
>Rub...@li...
>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>
>

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] bridging between ruby and objective-C

[Allison N. <dem...@ma...>]

 Just to add to what Eloy has said, the problem is that Ruby classes don't exist at compile time, they are created by the ruby compiler at runtime, so the compiler can't know about them (with the possible exception of the built-in classes; you'd have to ask Laurent about that!).  So even for MacRuby, where Ruby classes ARE Objective-C classes, you can't use static typing for Ruby objects.  You'll have the compiler complaining about an unknown type, or some other syntatic error, depending on where you try to use the definition.

One way to think about this is that you don't have .h files in Ruby.  These files exist for precisely this reason in the various flavours of C.

Hope that helps,

Alli

On Tuesday, February 10, 2009, at 11:11AM, "Eloy Duran" <elo...@gm...> wrote:
>Hi,
>
>Looking at your blog post it seems you are talking about MacRuby,
>which is a different project then RubyCocoa to which you have posted  
>this.
>
>Having said that, no I don't think it's possible.
>
>- Eloy
>
>On 10 feb 2009, at 09:03, S. Woodside wrote:
>
>> I want to call back and forth between Ruby and ObjC objects, I've
>> figured it out in a basic way and posted it here:
>>
>> http://simonwoodside.com/weblog/2009/2/10/wondeful_joy_mix_ruby_and/
>>
>> However, it would be nice if on the ObjC side I could actually declare
>> objects of a type defined on the Ruby side instead of using "id"...
>> and have the compiler, or at least just the linker understand that.
>> Does anyone know if it's possible?
>>
>> --simon
>>
>>
>> PS sorry for cross-posting with the google group, but i realized that
>> it doesn't seem to be active.
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with  
>> Adobe(R)AIR(TM)
>> software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills  
>> and code to
>> build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the  
>> power of local
>> resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR  
>> SDK and
>> Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/adobe-com
>> _______________________________________________
>> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
>> Rub...@li...
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with Adobe(R)AIR(TM)
>software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills and code to
>build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the power of local
>resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR SDK and
>Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/adobe-com
>_______________________________________________
>Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
>Rub...@li...
>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk
>
>

Re: [Rubycocoa-talk] bridging between ruby and objective-C

[Eloy D. <elo...@gm...>]

Hi,

Looking at your blog post it seems you are talking about MacRuby,
which is a different project then RubyCocoa to which you have posted  
this.

Having said that, no I don't think it's possible.

- Eloy

On 10 feb 2009, at 09:03, S. Woodside wrote:

> I want to call back and forth between Ruby and ObjC objects, I've
> figured it out in a basic way and posted it here:
>
> http://simonwoodside.com/weblog/2009/2/10/wondeful_joy_mix_ruby_and/
>
> However, it would be nice if on the ObjC side I could actually declare
> objects of a type defined on the Ruby side instead of using "id"...
> and have the compiler, or at least just the linker understand that.
> Does anyone know if it's possible?
>
> --simon
>
>
> PS sorry for cross-posting with the google group, but i realized that
> it doesn't seem to be active.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Create and Deploy Rich Internet Apps outside the browser with  
> Adobe(R)AIR(TM)
> software. With Adobe AIR, Ajax developers can use existing skills  
> and code to
> build responsive, highly engaging applications that combine the  
> power of local
> resources and data with the reach of the web. Download the Adobe AIR  
> SDK and
> Ajax docs to start building applications today-http://p.sf.net/sfu/adobe-com
> _______________________________________________
> Rubycocoa-talk mailing list
> Rub...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rubycocoa-talk