rails-devel

Re: [Rails-devel] Open 1835 bugs (was: Some questions regarding a new release)

[Stefan F. <ste...@we...>]

Erik:
I suspect that you might have missed that e-mail about the open 1835 bug(s).
Or I missed your reply.
However I would like to know if you intend to close that before Christmas, 
otherwise I would release 1.5.5 today.
Stefan

1835 bug:

I just retested bug A of my previous mail with subject "Further 1835  
testing".

Seems that at least this bug is open:
> A) Player T2 nationalizes BA from T3: There is no option to nationalize the 
> 20% certificate first.

I assume that similar bug B is still open too:
> B) Player T3 sells 30% of WT: There is no selection to chosse either one 20% 
> or two 10% certificates for exchange of the president certificate.
> 
I had to fix the save file due to your removal of the special token lay step 
requirement by removing the superfluous skip orders.

Attached that save file for bug A.
Stefan



On Sunday, December 18, 2011 05:04:33 pm Erik Vos wrote:
> Stefan,
> 
> Only the following alleged-bug reports remain for 1835 (copied from my
> personal to-do list):
> 
> [1835] (Oddly enough, in a problem that resembles point 3 in reverse, the
> five PR tokens that are supposed
> to be reserved for exchanging minor company tokens *do* show up as
> available to be built.
> Next time I'll try to build them in arbitrary locations and see what
> happens -- both then and when
> the minor companies merge and there aren't any PR tokens for them.)  [JDG
> 11-10-2011]
> 
> [1835] Net worth calculation seems a little off, I think it's getting
> confused particularly with
> the Prussian certs.  [Phil Davies 17-6-2010]
> 
> And then we have the (very old) issue that in some cases PfB and OBB do not
> close where these (allegedly) should, necessitating a manual "Special"
> private close action.
> 
> JDG also had some requests and good ideas, such as showing what PR share
> percentage is reserved. But that's not a bug.
> 
> I may pick up some of these issues in the near future, but I don't consider
> any of these as urgent, because correct play is not inhibited (which is my
> main timing criterion).
> 
> It's up to you to decide if these issues preclude stating that "all
> remaining 1835 issues are fixed". In any case, I have no objections.
> 
> Erik.
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Stefan Frey [mailto:ste...@we...]
> > Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2011 4:26 PM
> > To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
> > Subject: [Rails-devel] Some questions regarding a new release
> > 
> > All:
> > if nobody objects I will prepare a new release for tonight or sometime
> > tomorrow (including the new background maps).
> > 
> > I have been pretty busy recently (unfortunately not with Rails) so I am
> 
> not
> 
> > sure if all remaining 1835 issues are fixed now. Erik could you please
> 
> advise
> 
> > me on this: If all are done, the new release will be 1.6.0 with 1835
> 
> promoted
> 
> > to full playability, otherwise it will remain 1.5.5.
> > 
> > What are the opinions to make the background maps the default option for
> > Rails? A major advantage is that the look much nicer, however (at least
> > currently) the seem take longer to be displayed on first appearance.
> > 
> > Stefan
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> - --
> 
> > Learn Windows Azure Live!  Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011 Microsoft is holding a
> > special Learn Windows Azure training event for developers. It will
> > provide
> 
> a
> 
> > great way to learn Windows Azure and what it provides. You can attend the
> > event by watching it streamed LIVE online.
> > Learn more at http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure
> > _______________________________________________
> > Rails-devel mailing list
> > Rai...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> --- Learn Windows Azure Live!  Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011
> Microsoft is holding a special Learn Windows Azure training event for
> developers. It will provide a great way to learn Windows Azure and what it
> provides. You can attend the event by watching it streamed LIVE online.
> Learn more at http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure
> _______________________________________________
> Rails-devel mailing list
> Rai...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel

Re: [Rails-devel] Open 1835 bugs (was: Some questions regarding a new release)

[Erik V. <eri...@xs...>]

Stefan,

Bugs A and B should have been fixed by my commits of about a month ago.
See the attached emails.

Erik.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stefan Frey [mailto:ste...@we...]
> Sent: Thursday, December 22, 2011 1:51 PM
> To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
> Subject: Re: [Rails-devel] Open 1835 bugs (was: Some questions regarding a
> new release)
> 
> Erik:
> I suspect that you might have missed that e-mail about the open 1835
bug(s).
> Or I missed your reply.
> However I would like to know if you intend to close that before Christmas,
> otherwise I would release 1.5.5 today.
> Stefan
> 
> 1835 bug:
> 
> I just retested bug A of my previous mail with subject "Further 1835
testing".
> 
> Seems that at least this bug is open:
> > A) Player T2 nationalizes BA from T3: There is no option to
> > nationalize the 20% certificate first.
> 
> I assume that similar bug B is still open too:
> > B) Player T3 sells 30% of WT: There is no selection to chosse either
> > one 20% or two 10% certificates for exchange of the president
certificate.
> >
> I had to fix the save file due to your removal of the special token lay
step
> requirement by removing the superfluous skip orders.
> 
> Attached that save file for bug A.
> Stefan
> 
> 
> 
> On Sunday, December 18, 2011 05:04:33 pm Erik Vos wrote:
> > Stefan,
> >
> > Only the following alleged-bug reports remain for 1835 (copied from my
> > personal to-do list):
> >
> > [1835] (Oddly enough, in a problem that resembles point 3 in reverse,
> > the five PR tokens that are supposed to be reserved for exchanging
> > minor company tokens *do* show up as available to be built.
> > Next time I'll try to build them in arbitrary locations and see what
> > happens -- both then and when the minor companies merge and there
> > aren't any PR tokens for them.)  [JDG 11-10-2011]
> >
> > [1835] Net worth calculation seems a little off, I think it's getting
> > confused particularly with the Prussian certs.  [Phil Davies
> > 17-6-2010]
> >
> > And then we have the (very old) issue that in some cases PfB and OBB
> > do not close where these (allegedly) should, necessitating a manual
> "Special"
> > private close action.
> >
> > JDG also had some requests and good ideas, such as showing what PR
> > share percentage is reserved. But that's not a bug.
> >
> > I may pick up some of these issues in the near future, but I don't
> > consider any of these as urgent, because correct play is not inhibited
> > (which is my main timing criterion).
> >
> > It's up to you to decide if these issues preclude stating that "all
> > remaining 1835 issues are fixed". In any case, I have no objections.
> >
> > Erik.
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Stefan Frey [mailto:ste...@we...]
> > > Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2011 4:26 PM
> > > To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
> > > Subject: [Rails-devel] Some questions regarding a new release
> > >
> > > All:
> > > if nobody objects I will prepare a new release for tonight or
> > > sometime tomorrow (including the new background maps).
> > >
> > > I have been pretty busy recently (unfortunately not with Rails) so I
> > > am
> >
> > not
> >
> > > sure if all remaining 1835 issues are fixed now. Erik could you
> > > please
> >
> > advise
> >
> > > me on this: If all are done, the new release will be 1.6.0 with 1835
> >
> > promoted
> >
> > > to full playability, otherwise it will remain 1.5.5.
> > >
> > > What are the opinions to make the background maps the default option
> > > for Rails? A major advantage is that the look much nicer, however
> > > (at least
> > > currently) the seem take longer to be displayed on first appearance.
> > >
> > > Stefan
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > -----
> > - --
> >
> > > Learn Windows Azure Live!  Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011 Microsoft is
> > > holding a special Learn Windows Azure training event for developers.
> > > It will provide
> >
> > a
> >
> > > great way to learn Windows Azure and what it provides. You can
> > > attend the event by watching it streamed LIVE online.
> > > Learn more at http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Rails-devel mailing list
> > > Rai...@li...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > -----
> > --- Learn Windows Azure Live!  Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011 Microsoft is
> > holding a special Learn Windows Azure training event for developers.
> > It will provide a great way to learn Windows Azure and what it
> > provides. You can attend the event by watching it streamed LIVE online.
> > Learn more at http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure
> > _______________________________________________
> > Rails-devel mailing list
> > Rai...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rails-devel

Re: [Rails-devel] Open 1835 bugs (was: Some questions regarding a new release)

[Stefan F. <ste...@we...>]

Erik,
you are right: I have only checked that I have enough money available to buy 
the 20% shares, forgot about the 50% markup.

Sorry for insisting on this, you were right both bugs are fixed.

Looking at test case B again  I realize that I do not really know how this
case is correctly handled, so I am asking the 1835 rule lawyers:

This test case features player T3 is president of WT with 50% (20% president + 
3 10% shares) and player T1 has 50% too (20% double share + 3 10% shares).

It is T3 turn in a SR:

A) T3 sells 10, 20 or 30%:
Here T3 swaps his president share with either 2 10% or 1 20% share of T1.
All is correctly offered in Rails.

B) T3 sells 40 or 50%:
T3 ends up with 10% or no share of WT.
But what is the final portfolio of T1? Will the 20% share
stay in his portfolio? 

This is the only available option in Rails for selling that amount in 
ONE action.

However it is easy for player T3 to strip T1 of his 20% certificate if he uses 
TWO actions in sequence.

First T3 sells 10% and swaps the president share for the 20% certificate and 
then sells the remaining shares in a separate action.

Is that an allowed maneuver in 1835?

Stefan

PS: An update version of test case B is attached.


On Thursday, December 22, 2011 03:38:04 pm you wrote:
> Stefan,
> 
> In your test case the BA doesn't have the cash to nationalise a 20% share.
> If you correct that, the choice will be possible.
> Sorry that I forgot to mention that I had to make this initial correction
> as well.  In this case, the elapsed time between starting and finishing
> the work was quite a bit longer than usual.
> 
> > And neither can I see the bug fixed in the attached e-mails, but maybe I
> 
> am
> 
> > off track today?
> 
> Maybe - I did mention bugs A and B in those emails.
> Perhaps you missed the (admittedly, not too clear) implication of "fixed"
> where I said "overhauled".
> 
> Erik.

Re: [Rails-devel] Open 1835 bugs (was: Some questions regarding a new release)

[John D. G. <jd...@di...>]

Stefan Frey wrote:
> Erik,
> you are right: I have only checked that I have enough money available to buy 
> the 20% shares, forgot about the 50% markup.
> 
> Sorry for insisting on this, you were right both bugs are fixed.
> 
> Looking at test case B again  I realize that I do not really know how this
> case is correctly handled, so I am asking the 1835 rule lawyers:
> 
> This test case features player T3 is president of WT with 50% (20% president + 
> 3 10% shares) and player T1 has 50% too (20% double share + 3 10% shares).
> 
> It is T3 turn in a SR:
> 
> A) T3 sells 10, 20 or 30%:
> Here T3 swaps his president share with either 2 10% or 1 20% share of T1.
> All is correctly offered in Rails.
> 
> B) T3 sells 40 or 50%:
> T3 ends up with 10% or no share of WT.
> But what is the final portfolio of T1? Will the 20% share
> stay in his portfolio? 
> 
> This is the only available option in Rails for selling that amount in 
> ONE action.
> 
> However it is easy for player T3 to strip T1 of his 20% certificate if he uses 
> TWO actions in sequence.
> 
> First T3 sells 10% and swaps the president share for the 20% certificate and 
> then sells the remaining shares in a separate action.
> 
> Is that an allowed maneuver in 1835?
> 
> Stefan

Good question.  I would rule that it is not allowed, unless the sales take place
on two separate stock turns.