rails-devel

[Rails-devel] Changes & UI ideas

[Erik V. <eri...@hc...>]

I have committed a bunch of changes, mainly to bring the
OR Model/View interface in line with the recent changes to 
other types of round. I've also cleaned up some old code.

UI changes are minimal, but I have been pondering a few more.

I'm no longer very happy with the varying use of the OR window buttons.
In particular I think that the payout decision can better be done 
in a popup than by the standard buttonsm which are renamed for that purpose.

Perhaps the revenue entry should as well be put into a popup.

I fact I'm inclining to an approach previously proposed by Brett,
to have a fixed set of buttons as in the 1830 PC game, which 
are enabled/disabled as appropriate. I'm not sure if buttons should
also be added to initiate tile and token laying, as that would imply 
an extra mouse click.

Having a fixed set of buttons will also give a quieter look -
it's now a bit chaotic with buttons appearing and disappearing all the time.
Special actions (like the M&H/NYC swap) could be put under a "Special"
button.
Undo/Redo would be moved to a menu bar, as in the other windows.
Comments?


Talking about popups, I am also considering to replace some popup
choice lists by a set of radio buttons, at least in those cases where
a choice must be made between equivalent options, such as in selecting
a company start price. The current choice list initially shows 
the top price ($100) only, and the list must be scrolled to see the other
values. 
I think it would be better to show all prices on equal footing.

Other cases are different. For instance, train buying has a preferred choice

(the next train from the Bank) and I think it's OK to show just that one on
top.

As JOptionPane does not have a radio button version, I have created 
a simple generic dialog (RadioButtonDialog) that takes an arbitrary number 
of options (a String array). These options are shown as a list of radio
buttons, 
with OK and Cancel buttons.
As an experiment, I have replaced the par price choice list, 
that is shown when starting a company, by a set of radio buttons. 
I have /not/ replaced the price list that pops up when buying 
the B&O private, so you can still compare the two possibilities. 
Let me know what you think about it.


>From here I will continue to complete Undo/Redo to the
point that perhaps Save/Load can be implemented.
By then I think we will have a firm enough basis to resume adding
more functionality.

Erik Vos

Re: [Rails-devel] Changes & UI ideas

[Brett L. <wak...@gm...>]

On Thu, 2007-07-05 at 21:18 +0200, Erik Vos wrote:

> I'm no longer very happy with the varying use of the OR window buttons.
> In particular I think that the payout decision can better be done 
> in a popup than by the standard buttonsm which are renamed for that purpose.
> 
> Perhaps the revenue entry should as well be put into a popup.
> 

Just to get this out of the way, I despise pop-ups.  I really hate apps
that over-use pop-ups (especially modal pop-ups) to present every
niggling little detail to the user and force the user to click an OK
button to go back to whatever they were doing before the pop-up
interruption.

I don't want to get into the habit of forcing things into the user's
face with pop-ups unless it's absolutely necessary.

That being said, I do think there are a few, occasional good things to
put into a pop-up, such as critical application errors.

Right now, the popup for setting the value of a new company is okay
simply because it's one of the few decisions that *must* be made before
play can move forward. So, having that be an interruption is, to me, a
good use of a pop-up.

> I fact I'm inclining to an approach previously proposed by Brett,
> to have a fixed set of buttons as in the 1830 PC game, which 
> are enabled/disabled as appropriate. I'm not sure if buttons should
> also be added to initiate tile and token laying, as that would imply 
> an extra mouse click.
> 

Yes. I'd much prefer this style of interface where all of the
information needed to play the game is on a single "screen". Being that
we're already using a multi-window approach, I'd like to keep the total
number of windows to a minimum.



> Having a fixed set of buttons will also give a quieter look -
> it's now a bit chaotic with buttons appearing and disappearing all the time.
> Special actions (like the M&H/NYC swap) could be put under a "Special"
> button.
> Undo/Redo would be moved to a menu bar, as in the other windows.
> Comments?

Agreed.  I don't mind having context-specific buttons that appear and
disappear from the button list. However, I do agree that
enabling/disabling existing buttons is easier on the window layout than
adding/subtracting whole buttons.


> Talking about popups, I am also considering to replace some popup
> choice lists by a set of radio buttons, at least in those cases where
> a choice must be made between equivalent options, such as in selecting
> a company start price. The current choice list initially shows 
> the top price ($100) only, and the list must be scrolled to see the other
> values. 
> I think it would be better to show all prices on equal footing.
> 

It's certainly worth trying. Perhaps this is a good option to make a
user-configurable option? 

Would it be much work or complicate things unnecessarily to have both
layout options available?


> As an experiment, I have replaced the par price choice list, 
> that is shown when starting a company, by a set of radio buttons. 
> I have /not/ replaced the price list that pops up when buying 
> the B&O private, so you can still compare the two possibilities. 
> Let me know what you think about it.
> 

I'll check it out.

> >From here I will continue to complete Undo/Redo to the
> point that perhaps Save/Load can be implemented.
> By then I think we will have a firm enough basis to resume adding
> more functionality.

Awesome. I think we can do another release soon, perhaps when the last
bit of Undo/Redo work is complete but before you start on Save/Load?

 ---Brett.


The trouble with being punctual is that people think you have nothing more
important to do.

Re: [Rails-devel] Changes & UI ideas

[Erik V. <eri...@hc...>]

> > In particular I think that the payout decision can better be done 
> > in a popup than by the standard buttonsm which are renamed 
> for that purpose.
> > 
> > Perhaps the revenue entry should as well be put into a popup.
> > 
> 
> Just to get this out of the way, I despise pop-ups.  I really 
> hate apps
> that over-use pop-ups (especially modal pop-ups) to present every
> niggling little detail to the user and force the user to click an OK
> button to go back to whatever they were doing before the pop-up
> interruption.
> 
> I don't want to get into the habit of forcing things into the user's
> face with pop-ups unless it's absolutely necessary.

I fully agree with that. 
 
> That being said, I do think there are a few, occasional good things to
> put into a pop-up, such as critical application errors.
> 
> Right now, the popup for setting the value of a new company is okay
> simply because it's one of the few decisions that *must* be 
> made before
> play can move forward. So, having that be an interruption is, to me, a
> good use of a pop-up.

Indeed, I'm only talking about decisions that must be taken before
anything else can be done.
The payout/withhold choice (and 'split', in some games) is 
such an inescapable decision. As long as we can't calculate revenue,
revenue entry is also required, but we can leave that as it is now.

> > I fact I'm inclining to an approach previously proposed by Brett,
> > to have a fixed set of buttons as in the 1830 PC game, which 
> > are enabled/disabled as appropriate. I'm not sure if buttons should
> > also be added to initiate tile and token laying, as that 
> would imply 
> > an extra mouse click.
> > 
> 
> Yes. I'd much prefer this style of interface where all of the
> information needed to play the game is on a single "screen". 
> Being that
> we're already using a multi-window approach, I'd like to keep 
> the total
> number of windows to a minimum.
> 
> 
> 
> > Having a fixed set of buttons will also give a quieter look -
> > it's now a bit chaotic with buttons appearing and 
> disappearing all the time.
> > Special actions (like the M&H/NYC swap) could be put under 
> a "Special"
> > button.
> > Undo/Redo would be moved to a menu bar, as in the other windows.
> > Comments?
> 
> Agreed.  I don't mind having context-specific buttons that appear and
> disappear from the button list. However, I do agree that
> enabling/disabling existing buttons is easier on the window 
> layout than
> adding/subtracting whole buttons.
> 
> 
> > Talking about popups, I am also considering to replace some popup
> > choice lists by a set of radio buttons, at least in those 
> cases where
> > a choice must be made between equivalent options, such as 
> in selecting
> > a company start price. The current choice list initially shows 
> > the top price ($100) only, and the list must be scrolled to 
> see the other
> > values. 
> > I think it would be better to show all prices on equal footing.
> > 
> 
> It's certainly worth trying. Perhaps this is a good option to make a
> user-configurable option? 
> 
> Would it be much work or complicate things unnecessarily to have both
> layout options available?

One option for all such choice lists together, or one option per choice
list?
It is certainly doable, and not really a big deal, but it looks a bit like 
overkill to me to apply it to all such lists.

> > As an experiment, I have replaced the par price choice list, 
> > that is shown when starting a company, by a set of radio buttons. 
> > I have /not/ replaced the price list that pops up when buying 
> > the B&O private, so you can still compare the two possibilities. 
> > Let me know what you think about it.
> > 
> 
> I'll check it out.
> 
> > >From here I will continue to complete Undo/Redo to the
> > point that perhaps Save/Load can be implemented.
> > By then I think we will have a firm enough basis to resume adding
> > more functionality.
> 
> Awesome. I think we can do another release soon, perhaps when the last
> bit of Undo/Redo work is complete but before you start on Save/Load?

Yes, that would be a good moment. Should not take too long.

Erik.

Re: [Rails-devel] Changes & UI ideas

[Brett L. <wak...@gm...>]

On Thu, 2007-07-05 at 21:55 +0200, Erik Vos wrote:
> > 
> > > Talking about popups, I am also considering to replace some popup
> > > choice lists by a set of radio buttons, at least in those 
> > cases where
> > > a choice must be made between equivalent options, such as 
> > in selecting
> > > a company start price. The current choice list initially shows 
> > > the top price ($100) only, and the list must be scrolled to 
> > see the other
> > > values. 
> > > I think it would be better to show all prices on equal footing.
> > > 
> > 
> > It's certainly worth trying. Perhaps this is a good option to make a
> > user-configurable option? 
> > 
> > Would it be much work or complicate things unnecessarily to have both
> > layout options available?
> 
> One option for all such choice lists together, or one option per choice
> list?
> It is certainly doable, and not really a big deal, but it looks a bit like 
> overkill to me to apply it to all such lists.

When starting a game, have a selectable option of choosing your
preferred list UI: dropdowns or radio button lists.

This kind of option could be completely unnecessary, but it seems like a
good potential candidate for just letting the user choose what they
prefer.

 ---Brett.


Alexander Hamilton started the U.S. Treasury with nothing - and that was
the closest our country has ever been to being even.
	-- The Best of Will Rogers