Re: [Rails-devel] Players total value (was: Some questions regarding a new release)

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I am with those who judge that A) is sufficient.
If I understand Stefan correctly, it's B) that can be switched on and off,
and that would be fine with me.

Erik.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stefan Frey [mailto:ste...@we...]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2011 5:09 PM
> To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
> Subject: Re: [Rails-devel] Players total value (was: Some questions
regarding
> a new release)
> 
> All:
> sorry I submitted a version of the mail, which was an older one and was
not
> fully edited to what it should have been:
> 
> I first considered the question of sure (or almost sure) closure of an
item
> before game end to be the relevant. But as many already complained this is
> ambiguous (in theory nearly all games can end before seeing the first tile
laid,
> even without thinking about bankruptcy).
> 
> For sure the on-going value can be configured to be an additional or
optional
> replacement of the end-of-game value. It was already on my to-do-list to
> make the current end-of-game value.
> 
> Feel free to suggest something better suited.
> 
> Stefan
> 
> 
> So my fully finished proposal is for an ongoing player value is stated
below:
> 
> A) For items that have a value at game end unequal to zero use that.
> 
> B) For items that have a value at game end equal to zero use the
purchasing
> cost defined below.
> 
> Purchasing price for type B items:
> 
> 1) The actual price paid to the bank is relevant (e.g after a bidding
process).
> 
> 2) if a bundle is sold the value of all Items of type B purchased from
bundles
> are evaluated by deducting first the current value of all type A items (at
the
> time of purchase) from the purchase price and then the remaining amount is
> distributed equally to all type B items of the bundle.
> 
> Some further remarks:
> a) Potential conversions (even automatic) are irrelevant until they occur.
> 
> b) Items might change their type from B to A without conversion if their
> game end value changes from zero to a non-zero value. This has no
> retrograde effect of the value of other items sold in a bundle with the
item.
> 
> Remark b) covers the case of the C&A:
> 
> The PRR share bundled with the C&A will be first assigned the difference
> between the purchase price of the C&A minus the value of the C&A. Later if
> a market price is available then the PRR share is valued by that.
> 
> 
> On Tuesday, December 20, 2011 08:07:14 am Stefan Frey wrote:
> > I thought about this, and used some ideas from accounting (however
> > adopted to the 18xx environment).
> >
> > What do you think about the following definition to evaluate items for
> > the player value displayed in Rails:
> >
> > B) Items that will close before end for sure will use the purchase
value.
> >
> >
> > For this we should internally however differentiate between game end
> > player value and ongoing current player value: This would allow us
> > easily to choose by game configuration to display end value or current
> value.
> >
> > However I suggest to defer implementation to the Rails 2.0 trunk.
> >
> > Stefan
> >
> > On Sunday, December 18, 2011 11:24:54 pm Erik Vos wrote:
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: John David Galt [mailto:jd...@di...]
> > > > Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2011 11:00 PM
> > > > To: Development list for Rails: an 18xx game
> > > > Subject: Re: [Rails-devel] Some questions regarding a new release
> > > >
> > > > On 2011-12-18 08:04, Erik Vos wrote:
> > > > > [1835] Net worth calculation seems a little off, I think it's
> > > > > getting confused particularly with the Prussian certs.  [Phil
> > > > > Davies 17-6-2010]
> > > >
> > > > I noticed this recently, too.  What seems to be happening is that
> > > > in both 1835 and 18EU, the minor companies are counted as zero in
> > > > net worth.
> > >
> > > While
> > >
> > > > this may be correct in the rules, it's a distortion for players
> > > > who want
> > >
> > > to use
> > >
> > > > net worth as a way to predict final positions.
> > > >
> > > > I suggest that in 1835, the privates and minors should be counted
> > > > as the value of the PR shares they will eventually trade for (77M
> > > > per 5% if PR
> > >
> > > has
> > >
> > > > not yet formed), while for 18EU, I would just count them all as
> > > > $100 each
> > >
> > > (as
> > >
> > > > a ballpark estimate).
> > >
> > > Hmm, if we are going to count privates/minors to their expected
> > > future value rather than their official current value, shouldn't we
> > > then also count 1830 C&A for $320 rather than $160?
> > > I would prefer to stick to the rules, and leave it to the players to
> > > take note of (or forget about) any expected future gains.
> > >
> > > Erik.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
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