Re: [q-lang-users] A proposal to adopt Python tuple syntax

[John.Cowan <jc...@re...>]

Albert Graef scripsit:

> Identifying 1-tuples with their single members would certainly be the 
> most elegant solution, but unfortunately you can't do that in a language 
> where tuples are defined in a recursive fashion, so that you can 
> conveniently write generic functions operating on tuples of arbitrary sizes.

I agree.

> Why would you want to write something like ((A-B)) to mean (A-B) anyway?

Speaking as a human programmer, I wouldn't; speaking as someone who
writes code that generates code, I have found redundant generation of
parens to make my life simpler, secure in the knowledge that the next
stage will discard them.

> The (-99) is _not_ a 1-tuple simply because -X is not an atomic
> expression.

I guess that, as someone who knows more programming languages than I can
easily enumerate, I don't want to have to remember whether -99 is a
primary or an application; different languages take different views of it.
(Obviously -X is an always an application.)

> But I can't help it, I think that this syntax is just plain ugly.

De gustibus.

> Actually, I found that the most common problem related to Q's 1-tuple 
> syntax is that seasoned C or Pascal programmers write something like 
> foo(99) instead of foo 99, because it's what they are used to. 

Indeed, and in ML foo(99) works just fine, since there are no 1-tuples
and the 0-tuple syntax means something else.

> it's possible to relearn this, and if you want to learn a modern-style 
> FP language, you have to learn the curried function application style 
> anyway, so I don't see a real problem with this.

I think it is a real problem.

> Other opinions? I've thought about this problem for quite some time, but 
> maybe there's another, prettier solution I missed?

One approach is to have prefix syntax to mark tuples, like the #(...)
of Scheme or Smalltalk (but not implying that the tuple members are
literals).  This would be mandatory for 1-tuples and optional for all other
tuples.

-- 
John Cowan  www.ccil.org/~cowan  www.reutershealth.com  jc...@re...
In might the Feanorians / that swore the unforgotten oath
brought war into Arvernien / with burning and with broken troth.
and Elwing from her fastness dim / then cast her in the waters wide,
but like a mew was swiftly borne, / uplifted o'er the roaring tide.
        --the Earendillinwe