pythoncard-users — PythonCard Users and Developers

Re: [Pythoncard-users] PythonCard suitability for a project; looking for opinions

[Steven D'A. <st...@cy...>]

On Sat, Sep 11, 2004 at 12:59:14PM -0500, Brad Allen wrote:

> Here is the first question: Am I crazy for considering PythonCard for 
> use in a production environment? PythonCard is obviously not yet 
> mature, and still has many gaps in the feature set, not to mention 
> bugs. On the plus side, it seems to me that when users report bugs on 
> this mailing list, they are generally identified quickly and fixed. 
> It also seems to me that if we run into problems or gaps in the 
> PythonCard feature set, we can fall back on the more mature wxPython, 
> and so have a mix of wxPython and PythonCard in our GUI logic. Also, 
> because PythonCard is open source, we can look under the hood figure 
> out what's wrong if we need to.  Is this a fair assessment?

It sounds like you've already answered your own question. Perhaps you are 
looking for something that you can take to your bosses and show them a 
"real" [cough] application, something with grunt.

Perhaps not quite Microsoft Office written in PythonCard, but something 
like MYOB or Quickbooks?

So how about it guys, what's the biggest, most complicated application 
you know of written in PythonCard?



> Second question: Do you see PythonCard as primarily a tool for 
> building GUIs for small, simple apps, or do you think it will scale 
> well to more complex apps, in terms of managing that complexity ? 
> The app I'm imagining will require many windows, many dialog boxes, 
> dynamically changing global menus, contextual menus, keyboard 
> shortcuts (including function keys), and validation for data entry 
> fields. It would also be nice but not required to have search results 
> that populate as the user types, layouts changing within a given 
> window, tab order between fields, drag & drop of files onto fields to 
> populate paths, user-draggable icon objects, and tabbed interface in 
> some windows.

That sounds less like a question about PythonCard itself and more like a 
question about your ability to design and manage the GUI. Unless I'm badly 
mistaken, PythonCard can provide all of those interface objects.



> I'd be grateful for any thoughts you can provide on this.

It seems to me that if you want some reassurance that PythonCard will have 
the grunt needed, perhaps you should knock up a quick and dirty 
application as proof of concept. For instance, suppose you decide that 
your application might have at most 5 windows with 10 text fields and 10 
buttons each open at any one time. 

Write yourself a quick application that creates 25 windows with 50 text
fields and 50 buttons each. It doesn't need to do anything except let you
move from window to window clicking on buttons, cutting and pasting text,
etc. That will give you some idea of the performance of PythonCard under
your hardware, with a fairly high safety factor. (A factor of five.)

If PythonCard fails that test, then maybe you look elsewhere, or maybe you
reduce your safety factor and accept the higher risk. If it passes, then
it is no guarantee that it will do what you want, but at least you now
have some idea of what sort of performance you can expect.

Oh, and by the way: you aren't testing your app on your shiny new
dual-processor Pentium4 with 512MB of RAM, oh no, you are testing it on an
old P2 with 128MB.

Can PythonCard talk to your database (assuming you have one)? Knock up a 
quick test to see. If it fails, again you've saved yourself a lot of time.

The idea is, before you commit to 1000 man-hours to build the application, 
commit to 30 hours to build a few test apps and run some benchmarks.

Good luck!



-- 
Steven D'Aprano 
Operations Manager 
Cybersource Pty Ltd, ABN 13 053 904 082 
Level 4, 10-16 Queen St, Melbourne VIC 3000 
Tel: +61 3 9621 2377   Fax: +61 3 9621 2477 
Web: http://www.cybersource.com.au 

[Pythoncard-users] Re: PythonCard suitability for a project; looking for opinions

[normanwinn <nor...@on...>]

>
>
>Hi. I've been spending the last few days taking a look at PythonCard, 
>and I really like it. Kudos to Kevin, Dan, and the rest of you guys 
>for your generosity in building such a nifty open-source tool and 
>continuing to plug away at improving it. I'm a Python newbie of about 
>six months, but I found PythonCard .8 to be very approachable.  It 
>didn't take long to install and get the samples working. The tutorial 
>walkthroughs were essential to helping me learn the basics, even 
>though there were some bumps along the way (some small changes are 
>needed to update the tutorials for .8, such as the reference to 
>on_openBackground).
>
>I was looking at PythonCard as a prospective GUI tool for a project 
>at work. This project is a client-server-database application 
>designed to replace an aging FileMaker solution with a MS SQL Server 
>solution for the IT dept database. We need a full client app, not 
>just a web interface, and it needs to be cross-platform so it can run 
>the GUI on all the computers we manage. We also don't want to spend a 
>million years building it, so a scripting approach makes sense rather 
>than trying to do it in C++ or Java. So, that leaves us with choices 
>like Runtime Revolution, RealBasic, Omnis Studio, etc. Or, we could 
>go with open source tools like Perl, Python, Ruby, etc. For a variety 
>of reasons, we really like Python the best among these choices, and a 
>pure Python solution is likely to be a fairly practical and scalable 
>approach as our app grows in complexity. We've used Python shell 
>scripts in our environment to great success; it seems like a very 
>approachable cross-platform language with many virtues.
>
>The only trouble with Python is that it's not so easy to build GUIs. 
>At least, not as easy as in proprietary platforms like RunRev, 
>FileMaker, and RealBasic. We have a serious learning curve to climb 
>on that front. At least, that's what I thought until I tried 
>PythonCard. I've already been able to make a little headway 
>prototyping the client app in PythonCard, though I have a long ways 
>to go in really understanding the capabilities available in 
>PythonCard. So, I have a number of questions, but before I dig in too 
>much deeper, I'd like to get some opinions on a couple of basic 
>questions.
>
>Here is the first question: Am I crazy for considering PythonCard for 
>use in a production environment? PythonCard is obviously not yet 
>mature, and still has many gaps in the feature set, not to mention 
>bugs. On the plus side, it seems to me that when users report bugs on 
>this mailing list, they are generally identified quickly and fixed. 
>It also seems to me that if we run into problems or gaps in the 
>PythonCard feature set, we can fall back on the more mature wxPython, 
>and so have a mix of wxPython and PythonCard in our GUI logic. Also, 
>because PythonCard is open source, we can look under the hood figure 
>out what's wrong if we need to.  Is this a fair assessment?
>
>Second question: Do you see PythonCard as primarily a tool for 
>building GUIs for small, simple apps, or do you think it will scale 
>well to more complex apps, in terms of managing that complexity ? 
>The app I'm imagining will require many windows, many dialog boxes, 
>dynamically changing global menus, contextual menus, keyboard 
>shortcuts (including function keys), and validation for data entry 
>fields. It would also be nice but not required to have search results 
>that populate as the user types, layouts changing within a given 
>window, tab order between fields, drag & drop of files onto fields to 
>populate paths, user-draggable icon objects, and tabbed interface in 
>some windows.
>
>I'd be grateful for any thoughts you can provide on this.
>

I'm a little disappointed you didn't get a reply. I, like you, am 
playing with Python with almost the same hopes and intentions. I have a 
large Filemaker project which I could probably sell if I knocked it into 
shape. I understand that others have not replied as they are interested 
in the nitty-gritty of PythonCard. However, your questions, while 
directed at the PythonCard list, are at the heart of whether and when 
the big move from Windows and Mac platforms will take place. I have just 
been playing with Delphi as a magazine I bought had a screen capture 
project using it. I found, just like when I used Delphi previously, that 
when I want to add functionality, it invites me in. Why? There is 
extensive help, there are legion examples to be cut and paste. The IDE 
is consistent. The app builder just works. It is fast.

Now comes the difficult bit. Difficult as it feels wrong to criticise, 
however gently, those who give of their time and expertise freely. 
First, why is Python so good? The simple answer is that there is a 
controlling influence. Guido the guide (who has a sword up his sleeve).  
I think in this surmise lies the reason that going about using Python 
for large, professional projects does not just 'invite you in'. In this 
area there is no arbitrator, no coordinator. I expect there are strong 
reasons that there is a 'Boa Constructor' project, a 'PythonCard' 
project, a 'Glade' project and many, many others. It feels, from the 
outside looking in, that all these riches combined could give us better 
than Delphi. And if we had that the world would move to Python and the 
writing would be on the wall for the evil empire. Instead the latter are 
issuing free versions of the .net tools, Novell fosters mono.net making 
it cross platform - the empire is fighting back and has formidable weapons.

There may be an answer at hand. What could unite the Python forces is 
money. Money to free the developers from other constraints. Where would 
the money come from? I would suggest the EU. They throw large sums of 
money around for much less useful things. If Guido the guide could be 
enrolled to take on not just the language but a standardised tool set 
and project builder then the EU would get an unheard of return on 
capital invested,

Norman Winn

Re: [Pythoncard-users] MultiColumnList questions

[Alex T. <al...@tw...>]

At 10:08 12/09/2004 -0700, Kevin Altis wrote:

>On Sep 12, 2004, at 9:52 AM, Arthur Elsenaar wrote:
>
>>
>>ah, good it's in wxPython.
>>
>>>Note this is an initialization-time only setting, can't be changed once 
>>>the list exists.
>>
>>does this mean one cannot do this in a pythoncard script, only in the 
>>framework because of the initialization order?

It's passed in to the init function in wxPython; so the limitations apply 
equally to wxPython direct as to PythonCard.

The limitation is that you can't change the "heading-ness" of the list - 
whatever it is when the list is created, so it remains. So if Kevin changes 
Pythoncard to allow this to be specified, you'll need to specify it the way 
you want in the resource editor - it won't be possible to leave headings 
off in the resource editor, and later add them from within the script, or 
vice versa. (Of course, you'll be able to leave them *blank* in the 
resource editor, and have the script supply the values, but not to change 
their existence.)

-- Alex.

Re: [Pythoncard-users] Resource Editor - Choice Component - Update String Selection doesn't work

[Kevin A. <al...@se...>]

On Sep 12, 2004, at 10:05 AM, Gregory Pi=F1ero wrote:

> Sorry, I forgot to describe the bug.  This is a specific problem only=20=

> with the resource editor.
>
> Basically what happens is I open resource editor, select 'Choice' (or=20=

> 'Combobox'), then I go to the properties window, select items, type in=20=

> [1,2,3] (or ['1','2','3'] either causes it), click update, then I go=20=

> to stringselection, press the drop down button and see 1,2,3.  I=20
> choose 1, and nothing seems to happen, then I hit update, and still=20
> nothing happens.  Finally I hit save and code is generated without a=20=

> stringselection specified.
>
> Does that explain it better?
>
> -Greg
>
Yep, that's a real bug. Line 205 of=20
resourceEditor/modules/propertyEditor.py should be:

         if propName not in ['label', 'stringSelection', 'text',=20
'toolTip']:

and line 364 should be:

         if propName in ['label', 'stringSelection', 'text', 'toolTip']=20=

or propName in checkItems:

ka=

Re: [Pythoncard-users] MultiColumnList questions

[Kevin A. <al...@se...>]

On Sep 12, 2004, at 9:52 AM, Arthur Elsenaar wrote:

>
> On Sep 12, 2004, at 13:37, Alex Tweedly wrote:
>
>> I looked into the first question (Can I have a multicolumn list with 
>> no headers ?)
>>
>> There is a parameter to pass into wxListCtrl, but there's no 
>> equivalent in PythonCard. We'd need to add a "heading" field to the 
>> resource, and then use it to control whether or not wx.LC_NO_HEADER 
>> was passed in to wx.ListCtrl.__init__
>
> ah, good it's in wxPython.
>
>> Note this is an initialization-time only setting, can't be changed 
>> once the list exists.
>
> does this mean one cannot do this in a pythoncard script, only in the 
> framework because of the initialization order?
>
> Thanks, I'll try your suggestion.
>
> Arthur
>
In general, if the PythonCard component doesn't support one of the 
styles supported by the underlying wxPython control, you'll have to 
subclass the PythonCard component or just modify it to suit your 
purposes. PythonCard will look for components in a directory called 
appcomponents in your main application directory before it loads from 
the default component list, so that can be used to override which 
version of a component is used if you want something 
application-specific. If you decide to provide you're own about the 
only thing you need to provide in the subclass is a replacement 
__init__ method, so just copy that from the original and change the 
style.

In the case of this style, it is something that PythonCard really 
should support, so I'll make appropriate modifications to the 
multicolumnlist component and post something here once that is done.

ka

Re: [Pythoncard-users] Resource Editor - Choice Component - Update String Selection doesn't work

[<gre...@co...>]

Sorry, I forgot to describe the bug.  This is a specific problem only 
with the resource editor.

Basically what happens is I open resource editor, select 'Choice' (or 
'Combobox'), then I go to the properties window, select items, type in 
[1,2,3] (or ['1','2','3'] either causes it), click update, then I go to 
stringselection, press the drop down button and see 1,2,3.  I choose 1, 
and nothing seems to happen, then I hit update, and still nothing 
happens.  Finally I hit save and code is generated without a 
stringselection specified.

Does that explain it better?

-Greg


Kevin Altis wrote:

> On Sep 12, 2004, at 9:40 AM, Gregory Piñero wrote:
> 
>> Actually, it seems to only happen with numbers as items.  Also I typed 
>> them as [1,2,3] in the resource editor field.  Maybe it's required to 
>> do, ['1','2','3'] ?
>>
>> -Greg
>>
>>
>> Gregory Piñero wrote:
>>
>>> Minor bug?  Maybe this was already fixed in the latest version?  
>>> Below is the code generated by the resource editor.  You can use it 
>>> to replicate the bug, but any example should work.
>>> -Greg
>>> Version Info:
>>> PythonCard version: 0.8
>>> wxPython version: 2.5.2.7
>>> Python version: 2.3.3 (#51, Dec 18 2003, 20:22:39) [MSC v.1200 32 bit 
>>> (Intel)]
>>> Platform: win32
>>> {'application':{'type':'Application',
>>>           'name':'Template',
>>>     'backgrounds': [
>>>     {'type':'Background',
>>>           'name':'bgTemplate',
>>>           'title':'Standard Template with no menus',
>>>           'position':(198, 198),
>>>           'size':(490, 582),
>>>          'components': [
>>> {'type':'Choice',
>>>     'name':'Choice1',
>>>     'position':(118, 78),
>>>     'size':(130, -1),
>>>     'backgroundColor':(255, 128, 255),
>>>     'foregroundColor':(0, 0, 255),
>>>     'items':['1', '2', '3', '4', '5', '6'],
>>>     },
>>> ] # end components
>>> } # end background
>>> ] # end backgrounds
>>> } }
>>>
> 
> You didn't say what the bug was before, but I assume you mean that the 
> items in the list are strings? If so, yes, the items in the list must be 
> strings for all the components that have an items list attribute. Use 
> str() and int() to convert back and forth in your code if you need to 
> work with integers internally, but display them as strings in the 
> components.
> 
> If you wanted to use stringSelection to select the item '3' in the list 
> then you would do something like:
> 
> self.components.Choice1.stringSelection = '3'
> 
> but if you wanted to select the item by its numeric position in the 
> list, remember to use an integer as well as that the list is zero-based, 
> like most things in Python.
> 
> self.components.Choice1.selection = 2
> 
> ka
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
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> _______________________________________________
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> 

[Pythoncard-users] Freezing Applications?

[<gre...@co...>]

Ok, my last question for today!  Sorry for all the list traffic I'm making.

Sometimes when I'm running my pyCard application, the whole thing will 
just freeze.  It seems to happen only in child windows.  It's probably 
something I'm doing wrong, and I'm not asking anyone to debug my whole 
application.  I'm just curious if you guys have heard of that happening, 
or can offer some guidance as to what sort of things could be causing 
that, or where I would begin trying to fix it.

If you think it might be a bug in PyCard, I'll send you all my code so 
you can test it, but I'm pretty sure it's my own fault somehow... so 
I'll hold off on that.

Thanks,

-Greg

Re: [Pythoncard-users] Resource Editor - Choice Component - Update String Selection doesn't work

[Kevin A. <al...@se...>]

On Sep 12, 2004, at 9:40 AM, Gregory Pi=F1ero wrote:

> Actually, it seems to only happen with numbers as items.  Also I typed=20=

> them as [1,2,3] in the resource editor field.  Maybe it's required to=20=

> do, ['1','2','3'] ?
>
> -Greg
>
>
> Gregory Pi=F1ero wrote:
>
>> Minor bug?  Maybe this was already fixed in the latest version? =20
>> Below is the code generated by the resource editor.  You can use it=20=

>> to replicate the bug, but any example should work.
>> -Greg
>> Version Info:
>> PythonCard version: 0.8
>> wxPython version: 2.5.2.7
>> Python version: 2.3.3 (#51, Dec 18 2003, 20:22:39) [MSC v.1200 32 bit=20=

>> (Intel)]
>> Platform: win32
>> {'application':{'type':'Application',
>>           'name':'Template',
>>     'backgrounds': [
>>     {'type':'Background',
>>           'name':'bgTemplate',
>>           'title':'Standard Template with no menus',
>>           'position':(198, 198),
>>           'size':(490, 582),
>>          'components': [
>> {'type':'Choice',
>>     'name':'Choice1',
>>     'position':(118, 78),
>>     'size':(130, -1),
>>     'backgroundColor':(255, 128, 255),
>>     'foregroundColor':(0, 0, 255),
>>     'items':['1', '2', '3', '4', '5', '6'],
>>     },
>> ] # end components
>> } # end background
>> ] # end backgrounds
>> } }
>>

You didn't say what the bug was before, but I assume you mean that the=20=

items in the list are strings? If so, yes, the items in the list must=20
be strings for all the components that have an items list attribute.=20
Use str() and int() to convert back and forth in your code if you need=20=

to work with integers internally, but display them as strings in the=20
components.

If you wanted to use stringSelection to select the item '3' in the list=20=

then you would do something like:

self.components.Choice1.stringSelection =3D '3'

but if you wanted to select the item by its numeric position in the=20
list, remember to use an integer as well as that the list is=20
zero-based, like most things in Python.

self.components.Choice1.selection =3D 2

ka=

Re: [Pythoncard-users] MultiColumnList questions

[Arthur E. <ar...@ia...>]

On Sep 12, 2004, at 13:37, Alex Tweedly wrote:

> I looked into the first question (Can I have a multicolumn list with 
> no headers ?)
>
> There is a parameter to pass into wxListCtrl, but there's no 
> equivalent in PythonCard. We'd need to add a "heading" field to the 
> resource, and then use it to control whether or not wx.LC_NO_HEADER 
> was passed in to wx.ListCtrl.__init__

ah, good it's in wxPython.

> Note this is an initialization-time only setting, can't be changed 
> once the list exists.

does this mean one cannot do this in a pythoncard script, only in the 
framework because of the initialization order?

Thanks, I'll try your suggestion.

Arthur

> There's a cheap hack that I used to test how it might work - use the 
> existence (or not) of columnheadings to determine whether or not the 
> list should have headings. Not the right long term answer, but a quick 
> easy way to get it if you need it soon ....
> in components/multicolumnlist.py, at line 95, add
>
>         if aResource.columnHeadings == []:
>             rules |= wx.LC_NO_HEADER
>
> so you will then  have
>        if aResource.rules:
>             rules = wx.LC_HRULES | wx.LC_VRULES
>         else:
>             rules = 0
>
>         if aResource.columnHeadings == []:
>             rules |= wx.LC_NO_HEADER
>
>         self._rules = aResource.rules
>          etc.
>
> -- Alex.

Re: [Pythoncard-users] Resource Editor - Choice Component - Update String Selection doesn't work

[<gre...@co...>]

Actually, it seems to only happen with numbers as items.  Also I typed 
them as [1,2,3] in the resource editor field.  Maybe it's required to 
do, ['1','2','3'] ?

-Greg


Gregory Piñero wrote:

> Minor bug?  Maybe this was already fixed in the latest version?  Below 
> is the code generated by the resource editor.  You can use it to 
> replicate the bug, but any example should work.
> 
> -Greg
> 
> 
> Version Info:
> PythonCard version: 0.8
> wxPython version: 2.5.2.7
> Python version: 2.3.3 (#51, Dec 18 2003, 20:22:39) [MSC v.1200 32 bit 
> (Intel)]
> Platform: win32
> 
> 
> {'application':{'type':'Application',
>           'name':'Template',
>     'backgrounds': [
>     {'type':'Background',
>           'name':'bgTemplate',
>           'title':'Standard Template with no menus',
>           'position':(198, 198),
>           'size':(490, 582),
> 
>          'components': [
> 
> {'type':'Choice',
>     'name':'Choice1',
>     'position':(118, 78),
>     'size':(130, -1),
>     'backgroundColor':(255, 128, 255),
>     'foregroundColor':(0, 0, 255),
>     'items':['1', '2', '3', '4', '5', '6'],
>     },
> 
> ] # end components
> } # end background
> ] # end backgrounds
> } }
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
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> Project Admins to receive an Apple iPod Mini FREE for your judgement on
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> _______________________________________________
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> Pyt...@li...
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> 

[Pythoncard-users] Resource Editor - Choice Component - Update String Selection doesn't work

[<gre...@co...>]

Minor bug?  Maybe this was already fixed in the latest version?  Below 
is the code generated by the resource editor.  You can use it to 
replicate the bug, but any example should work.

-Greg


Version Info:
PythonCard version: 0.8
wxPython version: 2.5.2.7
Python version: 2.3.3 (#51, Dec 18 2003, 20:22:39) [MSC v.1200 32 bit 
(Intel)]
Platform: win32


{'application':{'type':'Application',
           'name':'Template',
     'backgrounds': [
     {'type':'Background',
           'name':'bgTemplate',
           'title':'Standard Template with no menus',
           'position':(198, 198),
           'size':(490, 582),

          'components': [

{'type':'Choice',
     'name':'Choice1',
     'position':(118, 78),
     'size':(130, -1),
     'backgroundColor':(255, 128, 255),
     'foregroundColor':(0, 0, 255),
     'items':['1', '2', '3', '4', '5', '6'],
     },

] # end components
} # end background
] # end backgrounds
} }

Re: [Pythoncard-users] ComboBox- Allows text entry, then ignores it?

[Alex T. <al...@tw...>]

At 17:33 12/09/2004 +0100, Alex Tweedly wrote:

>Sounds like you just need a simple List component - fill in the items and 
>they can only choose one of them ...

Oops - missed the fact that you wanted a drop-down :-(
Choice is of course what you wanted ...

-- Alex.

Re: [Pythoncard-users] ComboBox- Allows text entry, then ignores it?

[Alex T. <al...@tw...>]

At 11:38 12/09/2004 -0400, Gregory Pi=F1ero wrote:

>Kevin,
>
>Your answer makes sense.  I guess all I really want to do is disable text=
=20
>entry so the user must choose one of the list items.  I'm wondering  if=20
>I'm using the wrong GUI component?  For example on a web form, a drop-down=
=20
>box type thing only presents the preset choices, so I just want a GUI=20
>version of that type of webform thing.
>
>I'll  play with the resource editor a bit, see if there's something that=20
>already works like that.  Otherwise I'll look up how to just disable text=
=20
>entry.

Sounds like you just need a simple List component - fill in the items and=20
they can only choose one of them ...

btw - don't be misled by the "minimallist" sample - that's really a=20
minimalmulticolumnlist
I don't think there is a simple sample of a basic list - though the 'list=20
of samples' in the "Sample Launcher" is one.

-- Alex.

Re: [Pythoncard-users] ComboBox- Allows text entry, then ignores it?

[<gre...@co...>]

I'd vote for dropdown, but I figured in the future you guys would have a 
'toolbar' in the resource editor where each component is a button with a 
picture of itself.  Kind of like Visual Basic?  Seems most intuitive to 
me that way.  ah well, that's probably patented though ;-)

-Greg


Kevin Altis wrote:

> On Sep 12, 2004, at 8:38 AM, Gregory Piñero wrote:
> 
>> Kevin,
>>
>> Your answer makes sense.  I guess all I really want to do is disable 
>> text entry so the user must choose one of the list items.  I'm 
>> wondering  if I'm using the wrong GUI component?  For example on a web 
>> form, a drop-down box type thing only presents the preset choices, so 
>> I just want a GUI version of that type of webform thing.
>>
>> I'll  play with the resource editor a bit, see if there's something 
>> that already works like that.  Otherwise I'll look up how to just 
>> disable text entry.
>>
> 
> You want the Choice component. Maybe we should rename that component 
> DropDown or PopupMenu?
> 
> ka
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by: YOU BE THE JUDGE. Be one of 170
> Project Admins to receive an Apple iPod Mini FREE for your judgement on
> who ports your project to Linux PPC the best. Sponsored by IBM. 
> Deadline: Sept. 13. Go here: http://sf.net/ppc_contest.php
> _______________________________________________
> Pythoncard-users mailing list
> Pyt...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/pythoncard-users
> 

Re: [Pythoncard-users] ComboBox- Allows text entry, then ignores it?

[Kevin A. <al...@se...>]

On Sep 12, 2004, at 8:38 AM, Gregory Pi=F1ero wrote:

> Kevin,
>
> Your answer makes sense.  I guess all I really want to do is disable=20=

> text entry so the user must choose one of the list items.  I'm=20
> wondering  if I'm using the wrong GUI component?  For example on a web=20=

> form, a drop-down box type thing only presents the preset choices, so=20=

> I just want a GUI version of that type of webform thing.
>
> I'll  play with the resource editor a bit, see if there's something=20
> that already works like that.  Otherwise I'll look up how to just=20
> disable text entry.
>

You want the Choice component. Maybe we should rename that component=20
DropDown or PopupMenu?

ka

Re: [Pythoncard-users] ComboBox- Allows text entry, then ignores it?

[<gre...@co...>]

Kevin,

Your answer makes sense.  I guess all I really want to do is disable 
text entry so the user must choose one of the list items.  I'm wondering 
  if I'm using the wrong GUI component?  For example on a web form, a 
drop-down box type thing only presents the preset choices, so I just 
want a GUI version of that type of webform thing.

I'll  play with the resource editor a bit, see if there's something that 
already works like that.  Otherwise I'll look up how to just disable 
text entry.

-Greg


Kevin Altis wrote:

> On Sep 11, 2004, at 5:11 PM, Gregory Piñero wrote:
> 
>> A combobox lets me write text in it instead of forcing me to select 
>> one of its listed choices, however this text does appear to do 
>> anything as it does not show up in .stringselection.  This is even the 
>> case when I type in the exact same text as a listed choice in the 
>> combobox.
>>
>> This could be a bug depending on the desired behavior here.  I believe 
>> the desired behavior should be to not allow text entry into a 
>> combobox, or giving an option to turn on text entry.  But if the user 
>> is allowed to enter his own text, it should be picked up somewhere, 
>> right?
>>
> I don't believe the underlying wxPython ComboBox does anything with the 
> text the user types in the field, but rather leaves it up to you to 
> decide whether you want to do some processing. PythonCard does not bind 
> the EVT_TEXT_ENTER event, but you can handle the keyPress event, and do 
> some processing if event.keyCode == 13, otherwise just call 
> event.skip(). That way if the user presses Return you can add the text 
> to the ComboBox list. You can use the keyPress or textUpdate event if 
> you want to look at the current text and then change the stringSelection 
> based on what the user has typed. I believe that by default the 
> selection will be changed only when the user clicks on the dropdown arrow.
> 
> If PythonCard is not behaving the same as the ComboBox in the wxPython 
> demo then there could be a bug in the PythonCard component, but I'm 
> pretty sure it is working the same.
> 
> ka
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by: YOU BE THE JUDGE. Be one of 170
> Project Admins to receive an Apple iPod Mini FREE for your judgement on
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> _______________________________________________
> Pythoncard-users mailing list
> Pyt...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/pythoncard-users
> 

Re: [Pythoncard-users] TextField - Setting Enabled to false not working?

[<gre...@co...>]

Ah yes, silly mistake with using the string 'false'.  My syntax 
highlighting doesn't pick up True/False, so I figured they weren't 
keywords...

I'm still confused about the general False vs 0 issue in python, are 
they interchangeable? ..but that's off topic for for this list.

Sorry for the false alarm.

Greg


Kevin Altis wrote:
> On Sep 11, 2004, at 4:48 PM, Gregory Piñero wrote:
> 
>> I am wondering if I have run into a bug.  In the textarea and 
>> textfield components, if I create them during runtime, and set enabled 
>> to false, it does not get grayed out and I am still able to edit the 
>> component. Additionally, I tried setting editable to false and nothing 
>> seemed to change from that either, as I appeared to be able to still 
>> edit the text.
>>
>> By the way, what is the difference between editable and enabled?
>>
>> Version Info:
>> PythonCard version: 0.8
>> wxPython version: 2.5.2.7
>> Python version: 2.3.3 (#51, Dec 18 2003, 20:22:39) [MSC v.1200 32 bit 
>> (Intel)]
>> Platform: win32
>>
>> Here's the part of my code where I am creating the textfield. (sorry 
>> if email bungles the tabs.)
>>
>> editable='False'
>> tooltip=''
>> widgetDefn={'type':'TextField',
>>             'name':'txt'+ column[0],
>>             'position':(xPosWidget, yPos),
>>             'text':'',
>>             'editable':editable,
>>             'enabled':editable,
>>             
>> 'toolTip':tooltip,                                                 
>> 'size':(20,-1)}
>> self.components[widgetDefn['name']]=widgetDefn
>>
> 
> Um, you aren't setting them to False, you're setting them to a string 
> 'False' and all strings except the empty string '' evaluate to True. 
> Change the line above to:
> 
> editable = False
> 
> Enabled applies to all controls and determines whether those controls 
> get mouse clicks, whether the user can type text in them, select items 
> in a list, etc. Editable only applies to fields and determines whether 
> you can type text into the field or not. You can still copy text from 
> the field. The widgets sample shows off both attributes.
> 
> BTW, please don't respond to another message to post a new question. The 
> mail message headers that mail clients use to show message threads are 
> still there even though your mail client may not show them, and so it 
> screws up the display of those threads.
> 
> ka
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by: YOU BE THE JUDGE. Be one of 170
> Project Admins to receive an Apple iPod Mini FREE for your judgement on
> who ports your project to Linux PPC the best. Sponsored by IBM. 
> Deadline: Sept. 13. Go here: http://sf.net/ppc_contest.php
> _______________________________________________
> Pythoncard-users mailing list
> Pyt...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/pythoncard-users
> 

Re: [Pythoncard-users] MultiColumnList questions

[Alex T. <al...@tw...>]

At 23:38 11/09/2004 -0700, Kevin Altis wrote:


>MultiColumnList wraps wx.ListCtrl so just look at that control in the 
>wxPython demo as well as the wxWidgets/wxPython documentation. Just use 
>the wxPython method calls for whatever you need to do.

I looked into the first question (Can I have a multicolumn list with no 
headers ?)

There is a parameter to pass into wxListCtrl, but there's no equivalent in 
PythonCard. We'd need to add a "heading" field to the resource, and then 
use it to control whether or not wx.LC_NO_HEADER was passed in to 
wx.ListCtrl.__init__

Note this is an initialization-time only setting, can't be changed once the 
list exists.

[ Kevin - I tried adding this as an extra parameter and found there's still 
some things I don't know about resources :-)
   I'll email you off-list about it .... ]

There's a cheap hack that I used to test how it might work - use the 
existence (or not) of columnheadings to determine whether or not the list 
should have headings. Not the right long term answer, but a quick easy way 
to get it if you need it soon ....
in components/multicolumnlist.py, at line 95, add

         if aResource.columnHeadings == []:
             rules |= wx.LC_NO_HEADER

so you will then  have
        if aResource.rules:
             rules = wx.LC_HRULES | wx.LC_VRULES
         else:
             rules = 0

         if aResource.columnHeadings == []:
             rules |= wx.LC_NO_HEADER

         self._rules = aResource.rules
          etc.

-- Alex.

Re: [Pythoncard-users] MultiColumnList questions

[Kevin A. <al...@se...>]

On Sep 11, 2004, at 9:57 PM, Brad Allen wrote:

> More questions about MultiColumnList:
>
> Is there a way to specify the width of a given column?
> How about justification of text to right/left/center?
> Can I highlight a column header to show that a given column has been 
> selected for sorting?
>
> I haven't found much documentation on how to use MultiColumnLists, so 
> I resorted to looking at multicolumnlist.py. I didn't see answers to 
> my questions there, so I'm guessing those features don't exist yet in 
> PythonCard. Should I start look into using wxPython calls when I need 
> to do this kind of stuff?
>
MultiColumnList wraps wx.ListCtrl so just look at that control in the 
wxPython demo as well as the wxWidgets/wxPython documentation. Just use 
the wxPython method calls for whatever you need to do.

ka

Re: [Pythoncard-users] MultiColumnList questions

[Brad A. <bra...@ma...>]

More questions about MultiColumnList:

Is there a way to specify the width of a given column?
How about justification of text to right/left/center?
Can I highlight a column header to show that a given column has been 
selected for sorting?

I haven't found much documentation on how to use MultiColumnLists, so 
I resorted to looking at multicolumnlist.py. I didn't see answers to 
my questions there, so I'm guessing those features don't exist yet in 
PythonCard. Should I start look into using wxPython calls when I need 
to do this kind of stuff?

Thanks!

Re: [Pythoncard-users] MultiColumnList questions

[Kevin A. <al...@se...>]

On Sep 11, 2004, at 2:02 PM, Arthur Elsenaar wrote:

> Hi,
>
> some questions regarding the MultiColumnList. When I add items to the 
> MultiColumnList, automatically I get a Heading. Is there a way to 
> disable Headings all together? On OS X these headings take too much 
> vertical space.
>
> Another space related question, is it possible to narrow vertical 
> space, so rows become much smaller? I tried changing the font size, 
> but the row size doesn't change accordingly?
>
>
Hi Arthur,
I'm sorry but I don't know the answer offhand. Maybe someone that has 
used the underlying wx.ListCtrl will know. This might be a good 
question for the wxPython-users mailing list.

ka

Re: [Pythoncard-users] ComboBox- Allows text entry, then ignores it?

[Kevin A. <al...@se...>]

On Sep 11, 2004, at 5:11 PM, Gregory Pi=F1ero wrote:

> A combobox lets me write text in it instead of forcing me to select=20
> one of its listed choices, however this text does appear to do=20
> anything as it does not show up in .stringselection.  This is even the=20=

> case when I type in the exact same text as a listed choice in the=20
> combobox.
>
> This could be a bug depending on the desired behavior here.  I believe=20=

> the desired behavior should be to not allow text entry into a=20
> combobox, or giving an option to turn on text entry.  But if the user=20=

> is allowed to enter his own text, it should be picked up somewhere,=20
> right?
>
I don't believe the underlying wxPython ComboBox does anything with the=20=

text the user types in the field, but rather leaves it up to you to=20
decide whether you want to do some processing. PythonCard does not bind=20=

the EVT_TEXT_ENTER event, but you can handle the keyPress event, and do=20=

some processing if event.keyCode =3D=3D 13, otherwise just call=20
event.skip(). That way if the user presses Return you can add the text=20=

to the ComboBox list. You can use the keyPress or textUpdate event if=20
you want to look at the current text and then change the=20
stringSelection based on what the user has typed. I believe that by=20
default the selection will be changed only when the user clicks on the=20=

dropdown arrow.

If PythonCard is not behaving the same as the ComboBox in the wxPython=20=

demo then there could be a bug in the PythonCard component, but I'm=20
pretty sure it is working the same.

ka=

Re: [Pythoncard-users] TextField - Setting Enabled to false not working?

[Kevin A. <al...@se...>]

On Sep 11, 2004, at 4:48 PM, Gregory Pi=F1ero wrote:

> I am wondering if I have run into a bug.  In the textarea and=20
> textfield components, if I create them during runtime, and set enabled=20=

> to false, it does not get grayed out and I am still able to edit the=20=

> component. Additionally, I tried setting editable to false and nothing=20=

> seemed to change from that either, as I appeared to be able to still=20=

> edit the text.
>
> By the way, what is the difference between editable and enabled?
>
> Version Info:
> PythonCard version: 0.8
> wxPython version: 2.5.2.7
> Python version: 2.3.3 (#51, Dec 18 2003, 20:22:39) [MSC v.1200 32 bit=20=

> (Intel)]
> Platform: win32
>
> Here's the part of my code where I am creating the textfield. (sorry=20=

> if email bungles the tabs.)
>
> editable=3D'False'
> tooltip=3D''
> widgetDefn=3D{'type':'TextField',
>             'name':'txt'+ column[0],
>             'position':(xPosWidget, yPos),
>             'text':'',
>             'editable':editable,
>             'enabled':editable,
>             'toolTip':tooltip,                                		=
		=20
> 'size':(20,-1)}
> self.components[widgetDefn['name']]=3DwidgetDefn
>

Um, you aren't setting them to False, you're setting them to a string=20
'False' and all strings except the empty string '' evaluate to True.=20
Change the line above to:

editable =3D False

Enabled applies to all controls and determines whether those controls=20
get mouse clicks, whether the user can type text in them, select items=20=

in a list, etc. Editable only applies to fields and determines whether=20=

you can type text into the field or not. You can still copy text from=20
the field. The widgets sample shows off both attributes.

BTW, please don't respond to another message to post a new question.=20
The mail message headers that mail clients use to show message threads=20=

are still there even though your mail client may not show them, and so=20=

it screws up the display of those threads.

ka

[Pythoncard-users] ComboBox- Allows text entry, then ignores it?

[<gre...@co...>]

A combobox lets me write text in it instead of forcing me to select one 
of its listed choices, however this text does appear to do anything as 
it does not show up in .stringselection.  This is even the case when I 
type in the exact same text as a listed choice in the combobox.

This could be a bug depending on the desired behavior here.  I believe 
the desired behavior should be to not allow text entry into a combobox, 
or giving an option to turn on text entry.  But if the user is allowed 
to enter his own text, it should be picked up somewhere, right?

Let me know,

Greg

Version Info:
PythonCard version: 0.8
wxPython version: 2.5.2.7
Python version: 2.3.3 (#51, Dec 18 2003, 20:22:39) [MSC v.1200 32 bit 
(Intel)]
Platform: win32

[Pythoncard-users] TextField - Setting Enabled to false not working?

[<gre...@co...>]

I am wondering if I have run into a bug.  In the textarea and textfield 
components, if I create them during runtime, and set enabled to false, 
it does not get grayed out and I am still able to edit the component. 
Additionally, I tried setting editable to false and nothing seemed to 
change from that either, as I appeared to be able to still edit the text.

By the way, what is the difference between editable and enabled?

Version Info:
PythonCard version: 0.8
wxPython version: 2.5.2.7
Python version: 2.3.3 (#51, Dec 18 2003, 20:22:39) [MSC v.1200 32 bit 
(Intel)]
Platform: win32

Here's the part of my code where I am creating the textfield. (sorry if 
email bungles the tabs.)

editable='False'
tooltip=''
widgetDefn={'type':'TextField',
             'name':'txt'+ column[0],
             'position':(xPosWidget, yPos),
             'text':'',
             'editable':editable,
             'enabled':editable,
             'toolTip':tooltip,                                				 
'size':(20,-1)}
self.components[widgetDefn['name']]=widgetDefn