pyobjc-dev

[Pyobjc-dev] pyobjc 2.0 on Leopard with MacPython?

[Mikeal R. <mi...@os...>]

I can't seem to find any documentation for building/installing  
pyobjc2.0 on Leopard for MacPython.

For a variety of reasons I don't use the Python that is installed on  
Leopard by default and need to get pyobjc running in 2.5.1 MacPython.

It would be really nice is pyobjc2 was in the cheeseshop like the old  
1.x is.

-Mikeal

Re: [Pyobjc-dev] pyobjc 2.0 on Leopard with MacPython?

[Barry W. <bar...@gm...>]

Mikeal,

pyobjc2 requires the 10.5 SDK. Unfortunately the MacPython DMG
distribution is built against the 10.4u SDK. In order to use pyobjc2
with the MacPython distribution, you have to compile the Python
framework from source. I've done this. You're welcome to give my build
a try (http://rieke-server.physiol.washington.edu/~barry/python/python-2.5.1-macosx2007-11-26.dmg).
It will install in the same location as the 10.4u SDK (I can't figure
out a way around this), so you might want to move the current
Python.framework to somewhere safe before you install the new one.

Once installed, you'll have to rebuild any extensions, since they
generally have to be built with the same SDK as the interpreter.
pyobjc2 should now build and run fine (checkout the pyobjc2 source
from svn). The only hickup I've noticed is that the Xcode debugger
sometimes chokes when loading pyobjc2 applications that use the
MacPython framework since it appears that it doesn't contain some of
the expected debugging symbols.

Let me know how things go.

Barry

On Dec 24, 2007 12:01 AM, Mikeal Rogers <mi...@os...> wrote:
> I can't seem to find any documentation for building/installing
> pyobjc2.0 on Leopard for MacPython.
>
> For a variety of reasons I don't use the Python that is installed on
> Leopard by default and need to get pyobjc running in 2.5.1 MacPython.
>
> It would be really nice is pyobjc2 was in the cheeseshop like the old
> 1.x is.
>
> -Mikeal
>
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Re: [Pyobjc-dev] pyobjc 2.0 on Leopard with MacPython?

[Ronald O. <ron...@ma...>]

On 24 Dec, 2007, at 20:44, Barry Wark wrote:

> Mikeal,
>
> pyobjc2 requires the 10.5 SDK. Unfortunately the MacPython DMG
> distribution is built against the 10.4u SDK.

Both are technically true ;-). The MacPython DMG, and will continue to  
be, build agains the 10.4 SDK because 10.5 wasn't out when the latest  
release of Python was done.

PyObjC2 is slightly more complicated: it currently requires the 10.5  
SDK to build, but the architecture allows building on 10.4 as well.  
That support incomplete at the moment, patches would be more than  
welcome. What AFAIK needs to be done is implementing a number of C  
functions that emulate the Objective-C 2.0 runtime API. Most of that  
work is already done, and no rocket science is involved.


> In order to use pyobjc2
> with the MacPython distribution, you have to compile the Python
> framework from source. I've done this. You're welcome to give my build
> a try (http://rieke-server.physiol.washington.edu/~barry/python/python-2.5.1-macosx2007-11-26.dmg 
> ).
> It will install in the same location as the 10.4u SDK (I can't figure
> out a way around this), so you might want to move the current
> Python.framework to somewhere safe before you install the new one.

To be honest I believe this is a waste of time, what you'll end up  
with is a home-build version of python that is the same version as the  
system-installed one and misses a number of features. The resulting  
framework might run on 10.4 as well, but you don't know that without  
testing (AFAIK a number of unix API's that are used by the posixmodule  
have changed to be more in line with the current revision of the UNIX  
specificiation).

Ronald

Re: [Pyobjc-dev] pyobjc 2.0 on Leopard with MacPython?

[Barry W. <bar...@gm...>]

Ronald,

Thanks for the clarification! In the long run, it would definitely be
worth the effort to get pyobjc2 working on the 10.4u.sdk. On a side
note, would you be willing to share what features are present in the
system python that aren't available in the MacPython build (for 10.5)?

barry

On Dec 26, 2007 3:18 AM, Ronald Oussoren <ron...@ma...> wrote:
>
> On 24 Dec, 2007, at 20:44, Barry Wark wrote:
>
> > Mikeal,
> >
> > pyobjc2 requires the 10.5 SDK. Unfortunately the MacPython DMG
> > distribution is built against the 10.4u SDK.
>
> Both are technically true ;-). The MacPython DMG, and will continue to
> be, build agains the 10.4 SDK because 10.5 wasn't out when the latest
> release of Python was done.
>
> PyObjC2 is slightly more complicated: it currently requires the 10.5
> SDK to build, but the architecture allows building on 10.4 as well.
> That support incomplete at the moment, patches would be more than
> welcome. What AFAIK needs to be done is implementing a number of C
> functions that emulate the Objective-C 2.0 runtime API. Most of that
> work is already done, and no rocket science is involved.
>
>
> > In order to use pyobjc2
> > with the MacPython distribution, you have to compile the Python
> > framework from source. I've done this. You're welcome to give my build
> > a try (http://rieke-server.physiol.washington.edu/~barry/python/python-2.5.1-macosx2007-11-26.dmg
> > ).
> > It will install in the same location as the 10.4u SDK (I can't figure
> > out a way around this), so you might want to move the current
> > Python.framework to somewhere safe before you install the new one.
>
> To be honest I believe this is a waste of time, what you'll end up
> with is a home-build version of python that is the same version as the
> system-installed one and misses a number of features. The resulting
> framework might run on 10.4 as well, but you don't know that without
> testing (AFAIK a number of unix API's that are used by the posixmodule
> have changed to be more in line with the current revision of the UNIX
> specificiation).
>
> Ronald

Re: [Pyobjc-dev] pyobjc 2.0 on Leopard with MacPython?

[Ronald O. <ron...@ma...>]

On 26 Dec, 2007, at 18:49, Barry Wark wrote:

> Ronald,
>
> Thanks for the clarification! In the long run, it would definitely be
> worth the effort to get pyobjc2 working on the 10.4u.sdk. On a side
> note, would you be willing to share what features are present in the
> system python that aren't available in the MacPython build (for 10.5)?

I know of two differences:

1) dtrace support in the python interpreter.

I've asked if these patches can be shared, but haven't received a  
response yet.  This support is probably based on, or equal to, patches  
for this floating around on the net.  For completeness sake: dtrace is  
a system tracing tool that was invented by Sun and allows very deep  
inspecting (system call tracing on steroids).  The patches in the  
interpreter emit events when the python stacklevel changes, making it  
easier to tie events to python code instead of code in the interpreter.

2) "import CoreGraphics".

These are Apple's limited bindings to CoreGraphics, which are also  
present on 10.4. PyObjC2 also includes CoreGraphics bindings as part  
of "import Quartz", and those are way more complete.

Ronald

>
>
> barry
>
> On Dec 26, 2007 3:18 AM, Ronald Oussoren <ron...@ma...>  
> wrote:
>>
>> On 24 Dec, 2007, at 20:44, Barry Wark wrote:
>>
>>> Mikeal,
>>>
>>> pyobjc2 requires the 10.5 SDK. Unfortunately the MacPython DMG
>>> distribution is built against the 10.4u SDK.
>>
>> Both are technically true ;-). The MacPython DMG, and will continue  
>> to
>> be, build agains the 10.4 SDK because 10.5 wasn't out when the latest
>> release of Python was done.
>>
>> PyObjC2 is slightly more complicated: it currently requires the 10.5
>> SDK to build, but the architecture allows building on 10.4 as well.
>> That support incomplete at the moment, patches would be more than
>> welcome. What AFAIK needs to be done is implementing a number of C
>> functions that emulate the Objective-C 2.0 runtime API. Most of that
>> work is already done, and no rocket science is involved.
>>
>>
>>> In order to use pyobjc2
>>> with the MacPython distribution, you have to compile the Python
>>> framework from source. I've done this. You're welcome to give my  
>>> build
>>> a try (http://rieke-server.physiol.washington.edu/~barry/python/python-2.5.1-macosx2007-11-26.dmg
>>> ).
>>> It will install in the same location as the 10.4u SDK (I can't  
>>> figure
>>> out a way around this), so you might want to move the current
>>> Python.framework to somewhere safe before you install the new one.
>>
>> To be honest I believe this is a waste of time, what you'll end up
>> with is a home-build version of python that is the same version as  
>> the
>> system-installed one and misses a number of features. The resulting
>> framework might run on 10.4 as well, but you don't know that without
>> testing (AFAIK a number of unix API's that are used by the  
>> posixmodule
>> have changed to be more in line with the current revision of the UNIX
>> specificiation).
>>
>> Ronald