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From: <mal...@cs...> - 2002-02-01 03:30:42
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The page-preview mode available from the edit window is good, but something needs to be put at the top of the page to make it clear that the edit window is at the bottom of the page. I just made a change to NewInlineMarkup which is a very long page. I previewed my changes, but didn't realise that the edit window was available at the bottom. I bit of going back and forth was required before I could work out how to save my changes. Even after a fair while using wikis, I still find it frustrating that using the back button on my browser does not allow me to go back to an edit page. What is the problem here? Can't we find a way around it? Malcolm -- Malcolm Ryan - mal...@cs... - http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~malcolmr/ AI Dept, CSE, UNSW, Australia, Phone: +61 2 9385-6906 Fax: +61 2 9385-4936 "He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous." - Matt 5:45 |
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From: Steve W. <sw...@pa...> - 2002-02-01 07:04:42
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On Fri, 1 Feb 2002, Malcolm Ross Kinsella Ryan wrote:
> Even after a fair while using wikis, I still find it frustrating that
> using the back button on my browser does not allow me to go back to an edit
> page. What is the problem here? Can't we find a way around it?
This can probably be disabled easily (just kill the test of the version
numbers) but then you subject yourself to the Lost Update Problem. The
solution is locking, and WebDAV is the standard to handle this. WebDAV is
now included in GNOME, OSX, Windows and many other places, and Apache
supports it with mod_webdav (or thereabouts). WebDAV extends the HTTP
protocol with a host of new methods like LOCK, UNLOCK, DELETE, COPY,
MOVE...
There is no native PHP support for Webdav yet, as far as I know. There is
an implementation out there though. But this may not solve your wish to
"go back and edit again" come to think of it.
~swain
---
http://www.panix.com/~swain/
"Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring
production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid."
-- Frank Zappa
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From: <mal...@cs...> - 2002-02-02 00:38:12
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On Fri, Feb 01, 2002 at 02:04:38AM -0500, Steve Wainstead wrote: > > On Fri, 1 Feb 2002, Malcolm Ross Kinsella Ryan wrote: > > > Even after a fair while using wikis, I still find it frustrating that > > using the back button on my browser does not allow me to go back to an edit > > page. What is the problem here? Can't we find a way around it? > > This can probably be disabled easily (just kill the test of the version > numbers) but then you subject yourself to the Lost Update Problem. The > solution is locking, and WebDAV is the standard to handle this. Okay. You've lost me now. I'm not that familiar with the code to understand this, this question might be totally naive, but here goes: Couldn't the refresh setting on the Edit page be set to zero so that the cached copy is ignored and page is always reloaded when the user presses "Back"? Then going back to an Edit page would be equivalent to pressing "Edit" again, wouldn't it? Malcolm -- Malcolm Ryan - mal...@cs... - http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~malcolmr/ AI Dept, CSE, UNSW, Australia, Phone: +61 2 9385-6906 Fax: +61 2 9385-4936 "He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous." - Matt 5:45 |
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From: <mal...@cs...> - 2002-02-02 00:49:50
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On Sat, Feb 02, 2002 at 11:38:00AM +1100, Malcolm Ross Kinsella Ryan wrote: > > Couldn't the refresh setting on the Edit page be set to zero so that the > cached copy is ignored and page is always reloaded when the user presses > "Back"? Then going back to an Edit page would be equivalent to pressing > "Edit" again, wouldn't it? To make it clear, I mean adding the header: <meta http-equiv="Expires" content="0"> To the edit pages. Malcolm -- Malcolm Ryan - mal...@cs... - http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~malcolmr/ AI Dept, CSE, UNSW, Australia, Phone: +61 2 9385-6906 Fax: +61 2 9385-4936 "He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous." - Matt 5:45 |
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From: <mal...@cs...> - 2002-02-02 02:30:38
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On Sat, Feb 02, 2002 at 11:38:00AM +1100, Malcolm Ross Kinsella Ryan wrote: > > Okay. You've lost me now. I'm not that familiar with the code to understand > this, this question might be totally naive, but here goes: > > Couldn't the refresh setting on the Edit page be set to zero so that the > cached copy is ignored and page is always reloaded when the user presses > "Back"? Then going back to an Edit page would be equivalent to pressing > "Edit" again, wouldn't it? Actually, now that I come to test it, I find that on 1.3.2 wikis I _can_ use the Back button. At least with my current browser (Netscape 6.2 on Win98). It appears to always reload wiki pages. It must have something to do with the cache configuration. Malcolm -- Malcolm Ryan - mal...@cs... - http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~malcolmr/ AI Dept, CSE, UNSW, Australia, Phone: +61 2 9385-6906 Fax: +61 2 9385-4936 "He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous." - Matt 5:45 |
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From: Steve W. <sw...@pa...> - 2002-02-02 20:42:28
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On Sat, 2 Feb 2002, Malcolm Ross Kinsella Ryan wrote:
> Couldn't the refresh setting on the Edit page be set to zero so that the
> cached copy is ignored and page is always reloaded when the user presses
> "Back"? Then going back to an Edit page would be equivalent to pressing
> "Edit" again, wouldn't it?
Yes, this could work. Good idea!
~swain
---
http://www.panix.com/~swain/
"Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring
production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid."
-- Frank Zappa
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From: Jeff D. <da...@da...> - 2002-02-02 22:34:01
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On Sat, 2 Feb 2002 15:41:55 -0500 (EST) "Steve Wainstead" <sw...@pa...> wrote: > On Sat, 2 Feb 2002, Malcolm Ross Kinsella Ryan wrote: > > > Couldn't the refresh setting on the Edit page be set to zero so that the> > cached copy is ignored and page is always reloaded when the user presses> > "Back"? Then going back to an Edit page would be equivalent to pressing> > "Edit" again, wouldn't it? Up until a couple of days ago, this is (inadvertently) how 1.3.x behaved. (When you turn on PHP's session support, it turns out, by default it sends all kinds of "please don't cache me" HTTP headers which don't get sent when one doesn't enable sessions.) I thought this was what you (Malcolm) were initially complaining about. I certainly prefer (and think safer) the older behavior: that when you back up to a previous edit form, your (unsaved) changes don't get wiped. So a couple of days ago, after Malcolm brought up the subject, I figured out what was going on and "fixed" it. The latest CVS code should act like the old (pre-1.3) PhpWiki: you can back up to a stale edit form without losing any edits you may have made. Now I'm confused. Which way _do_ y'all think is better? |
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From: Adam S. <ad...@pe...> - 2002-02-02 23:05:42
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> Now I'm confused. Which way _do_ y'all think is better? I would prefer that when I hit the back button it goes back to the version of the page which has my potentially unsaved pages in it. If I don't want my changes and want to start over I can hit the edit button instead. I think this provides more options then the other way around. Adam. |
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From: John K. <jo...@ke...> - 2002-02-01 07:53:06
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At 2:30 pm +1100 1/2/02, Malcolm Ross Kinsella Ryan wrote: >Even after a fair while using wikis, I still find it frustrating that >using the back button on my browser does not allow me to go back to an edit >page. What is the problem here? Can't we find a way around it? How does pressing 'Back' differ from pressing 'EditText'? Apart from seeing the preview, which you could add back in if you like? John. PS And a big newbie 'Hello' to the list from Leeds, England. -- --------------------------------------------------------- email: jo...@ke... phone: 07944 755613 web: www.kershaw.org AOL: johnkershaw --------------------------------------------------------- |
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From: Anthony F. <Vu...@vu...> - 2002-02-01 08:40:01
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In message <a05101012b87ff802b66b@[80.0.5.9]>
John Kershaw <jo...@ke...> wrote:
> At 2:30 pm +1100 1/2/02, Malcolm Ross Kinsella Ryan wrote:
> >Even after a fair while using wikis, I still find it frustrating that
> >using the back button on my browser does not allow me to go back to an edit
> >page. What is the problem here? Can't we find a way around it?
>
> How does pressing 'Back' differ from pressing 'EditText'? Apart from
> seeing the preview, which you could add back in if you like?
"Back" pops an entry off the history stack, anything else adds another
entry on to the stack. The extra clutter makes it harder for those who
like using the ordering in the stack as part of their navigation.
Anthony
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From: <mal...@cs...> - 2002-02-02 00:26:00
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On Fri, Feb 01, 2002 at 07:52:08AM +0000, John Kershaw wrote: > At 2:30 pm +1100 1/2/02, Malcolm Ross Kinsella Ryan wrote: > >Even after a fair while using wikis, I still find it frustrating that > >using the back button on my browser does not allow me to go back to an edit > >page. What is the problem here? Can't we find a way around it? > > How does pressing 'Back' differ from pressing 'EditText'? Apart from > seeing the preview, which you could add back in if you like? Well, for one, the 'Back' button is in the same place for every web page. I am used to using it, without thinking. But that's beside the point. The question is not "Why can't users use the controls we provide?" but "How can we provide controls that the users can use?" Malcolm -- Malcolm Ryan - mal...@cs... - http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~malcolmr/ AI Dept, CSE, UNSW, Australia, Phone: +61 2 9385-6906 Fax: +61 2 9385-4936 "He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous." - Matt 5:45 |
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