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From: Jeff D. <da...@da...> - 2001-09-02 17:15:31
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What's the concensus on the current page scoring scheme? <ramble> I haven't hacked it into my new database API yet, and I'm not sure I want to. Personally, I don't think it's particularly useful as it is now. Currently the "page score" is basically a count of how many pages link to pages which link to the page. (Not quite -- pages can be counted twice. i.e. in the following case, the score of C will be 2, not 1 --- A gets counted twice...) A--->B---->C | ^ +--->D-----+ Anyhow, the general idea is: the more links there are to a page, the higher it's score.... Currently neighboring pages which high scores are listed at the bottom of each page in the wiki. I never use this feature --- never even look at it. My take on the matter is: if everyone links to a page (therefore giving it a high score) I don't really need help finding it... These are pages that one is likely to stumble upon just by following random links in pages. Actually, if the score were done in reverse, revscore of page A = how many different pages can I get to from A in n clicks I think it might be more useful. A high revscore indicates that a page is likely to be a good "index page" or starting point for exploration, since it links to lots of things... These then are pages which you are likely to stumble upon if you randomly follow backlinks... </ramble> Anyhow, as I said, I never use the "5 best incoming/outgoing links". Does anyone? Jeff PS: Anybody have any preferences on the tab-width=4 vs tab-width=8 issue? If no one says anything I'm going to start using tab-width=8, 'cause thats my preference.... |
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From: Christian R. R. <ki...@as...> - 2001-09-02 18:19:10
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On Sun, 2 Sep 2001, Jeff Dairiki wrote: > I think it might be more useful. A high revscore indicates that a page > is likely to be a good "index page" or starting point for exploration, > since it links to lots of things... These then are pages which you > are likely to stumble upon if you randomly follow backlinks... Agreed. Much better than incoming links. However, the incoming links do provide a (flawed) navigation mechanism, in lack of something better. > Anyhow, as I said, I never use the "5 best incoming/outgoing links". > Does anyone? Nope. Ripped it out when I made the templates. However, I sometime long for a site-wide "links" bar which provide navigation (the thing wikis are very bad at). I've hacked mine into the templates. PS: is CVS in a working state? Was wondering because I really need the table support. Thanks! Take care, -- Christian Reis, Senior Engineer, Async Open Source, Brazil. http://async.com.br/~kiko/ | [+55 16] 272 3330 | NMFL |
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From: Adam S. <ad...@pe...> - 2001-09-02 20:09:43
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> Nope. Ripped it out when I made the templates. However, I sometime > long for a site-wide "links" bar which provide navigation (the thing > wikis are very bad at). I've hacked mine into the templates. i'm still running moinmoin but i had the same problem, especially with my site because i get a lot of visitors coming to specific pages and never really figuring out what the hell it's all about. if anyone's curious i just built basic side bars and hacked them into the config file. > PS: is CVS in a working state? Was wondering because I really need the > table support. Thanks! i'm waiting for revisions (something like KeptPages) and table markup. moinmoin is great but i need the templating and i don't want to hack it into the source for every upgrade. the other thing i wish is that there was a standard wiki syntax cause it's gonna suck retraining users. adam. |
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From: Christian R. R. <ki...@as...> - 2001-09-02 20:16:32
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On Sun, 2 Sep 2001, Adam Shand wrote: > i'm still running moinmoin but i had the same problem, especially with my > site because i get a lot of visitors coming to specific pages and never > really figuring out what the hell it's all about. if anyone's curious i > just built basic side bars and hacked them into the config file. How do you define the sidebar contents? Just textually? What would be nice (heh) would be to configure a sidebar and have a checkbutton when editing a page to "add to sidebar". The sidebar could build dynamically based on the pages selected, and the developer could choose what classifies as an important link or not. Organizing the sidebar into groups and having separators would be the next great step. It's not that hard to think up UI for this. Don't know about implementation :) Take care, -- Christian Reis, Senior Engineer, Async Open Source, Brazil. http://async.com.br/~kiko/ | [+55 16] 272 3330 | NMFL |
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From: Adam S. <ad...@pe...> - 2001-09-02 20:33:19
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> How do you define the sidebar contents? Just textually? yep, it's just a variable in moin_config.py. > What would be nice (heh) would be to configure a sidebar and have a > checkbutton when editing a page to "add to sidebar". The sidebar could > build dynamically based on the pages selected, and the developer could > choose what classifies as an important link or not. yep this is part of what i've been thinking about for a long time, the marriage of wiki's with weblogs. i want a weblog framework (ability to register users, import rss feeds, run polls etc) but with the central part being a wiki rather then a story engine. drupal (drop.org) almost has this with their book module but it's too structured for my taste. by controlling gravity (drupals notion of karma) you can even allow anonymous edits which is pretty cool, but because it isn't really set up for that it has no backups etc. > Organizing the sidebar into groups and having separators would be the > next great step. It's not that hard to think up UI for this. Don't > know about implementation :) yeah ... i agree. pikiepikie has some good features along this way but it's missing a lot of other features as well. adam. |
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From: Reini U. <ru...@x-...> - 2001-09-02 18:26:59
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Jeff Dairiki schrieb: > Anyhow, as I said, I never use the "5 best incoming/outgoing links". > Does anyone? I do. But I got a lot of pages, so every navigation help is welcome. outgoing is not that interesting as incoming, but it is similar to a summary of links. > PS: Anybody have any preferences on the tab-width=4 vs tab-width=8 > issue? If no one says anything I'm going to start using tab-width=8, > 'cause thats my preference.... tab-width=8 please set the emacs local var in the footer so it's no issue at all. it's only a problem for e.g. corman lisp where the author uses 4, but doesn't use emacs nor the local vars markup. -- Reini Urban http://xarch.tu-graz.ac.at/home/rurban/ |
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From: Adam S. <ad...@pe...> - 2001-09-02 20:11:23
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> Anyhow, as I said, I never use the "5 best incoming/outgoing links". > Does anyone? i never do on other peoples phpwiki's. adam. |
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From: Steve W. <sw...@pa...> - 2001-09-08 20:56:26
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Finally getting around to this thread... :-) On Sun, 2 Sep 2001, Jeff Dairiki wrote: > Anyhow, as I said, I never use the "5 best incoming/outgoing links". > Does anyone? I don't, though occasionally it's interesting to look at. I think this info should be moved off to some kind of "meta" page, or perhaps something in the Info link. It's always refreshing to go back to c2.com and see how clean and simple the interface is; personally the only thing I'd change clicking on the title search to find all pages linking to the one you're looking at, since it's not intuitive, but that's a small thing. > > PS: Anybody have any preferences on the tab-width=4 vs tab-width=8 > issue? If no one says anything I'm going to start using tab-width=8, > 'cause thats my preference.... I actually rangled over this for some time with some programmer friends. I think I posted a link to this list that was something written by jwz about why you should not use tabs at all. It was pretty sound. I don't have the greatest eyesight in the world. I use a font size of 12 in Emacs on a 19" monitor, and I can read quite well. With indents of 8 spaces, the code will quite often wrap around and will look like a total mess. I could go to an 8 pt font, but I will get eye strain. Originally I went for 2 or 3 spaces indenting. 4 seems too much to me :-) Also, I don't think code should extend beyond 80 columns, which is why you always see me doing crap like: $query = "select foo from bar " . "where blah='blippy' and " . "bar=42 sort by ascending"; Why 80 columns? Readability again. The reason magazines and newspapers print in columns is because the human brain can best read lines that are 6-8 words long. Anything shorter or longer slows down the reading process considerably. My 2 cents. I think the PEAR guidelines are good ones. cheers ~swain --- http://www.panix.com/~swain/ "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." -- Frank Zappa http://pgp.document_type.org:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xF7323BAC |
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From: Reini U. <ru...@x-...> - 2001-09-09 10:16:51
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Steve Wainstead schrieb:
> Why 80 columns? Readability again. The reason magazines and newspapers
> print in columns is because the human brain can best read lines that are
> 6-8 words long. Anything shorter or longer slows down the reading process
> considerably.
well said!
And I though I was the only one who knew this :) (but you worked for a
newspaper)
Layouters and fast-readers even count in eye-hops, where a hop is a word or
a easy to identify group of words. You normally read in 3-5 hops and can
train up to 5-6 hops.
80 chars for reading is a pretty large number for readers, but okay
for programmers.
in my current php project people don't do any linebreaks, but my emacs does.
so I don't care.
like: <td align="right"><br><form name="search" <? echo 'action="'
. tep_href_link(FILENAME_ADMIN_USERS, tep_get_all_get_params(), 'NONSSL') .
'"'; ?> method="get"><?php echo
tep_span_class("smallText",'',' '.HEADING_TITLE_SEARCH . ' <input
type="text" name="search" value="'. $HTTP_GET_VARS['search'] . '"
size="8"> ' . tep_image_submit(DIR_WS_IMAGES . 'button_search.gif',
IMAGE_SEARCH)); ?></form></td>
--
Reini Urban
http://xarch.tu-graz.ac.at/home/rurban/
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