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From: Eloi G. <el...@re...> - 2003-01-29 18:34:48
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I keep hearing about this PhatForm module. =20 What is it? What's it do? The reason I'm asking is because I'm about to start coding a classified = listing module & don't want to end up duplicating yet another module. = <grin> -Eloi George- |
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From: Don S. <do...@se...> - 2003-01-31 15:29:19
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I'm currently coding a listing module as well, for sites dedicated to listing one type of item, like houses or cars or books or whatever. Don. On Wed, 29 Jan 2003, Eloi George wrote: > I keep hearing about this PhatForm module. > > What is it? What's it do? > > The reason I'm asking is because I'm about to start coding a classified listing module & don't want to end up duplicating yet another module. <grin> > > -Eloi George- > |
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From: Jeremy A. <ja...@tu...> - 2003-01-31 15:36:19
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Adam and steven can tell you a lots more but it will allow you do documents that will be form based. So as an example, a surveys that had 30 multiple choice questions, a few text fields, and some questions with checkboxes. This is just a simple example it will do lots more and the end user will be able to make any form/survey. As things are going now it may replace poll too. You can find it in cvs under the asu_mods repository. > I keep hearing about this PhatForm module. > > What is it? What's it do? > > The reason I'm asking is because I'm about to start coding a classified > listing module & don't want to end up duplicating yet another module. > <grin> > > -Eloi George- -- Jeremy Agee phpWebSite Development Team (http://phpwebsite.appstate.edu) Appalachian State University SF.net id: jagee or 94756 |
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From: Don S. <do...@se...> - 2003-01-31 15:40:22
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Sounds similar to my listings mod but not for the same purpose. My mod also allows you to add multiple images to a listing and so on. PhatForm definitely sounds useful. Don. On Fri, 31 Jan 2003, Jeremy Agee wrote: > Adam and steven can tell you a lots more but it will allow you do > documents that will be form based. So as an example, a surveys that had > 30 multiple choice questions, a few text fields, and some questions with > checkboxes. This is just a simple example it will do lots more and the > end user will be able to make any form/survey. As things are going now it > may replace poll too. You can find it in cvs under the asu_mods > repository. > > > I keep hearing about this PhatForm module. > > > > What is it? What's it do? > > > > The reason I'm asking is because I'm about to start coding a classified > > listing module & don't want to end up duplicating yet another module. > > <grin> > > > > -Eloi George- > > > -- > Jeremy Agee > phpWebSite Development Team (http://phpwebsite.appstate.edu) > Appalachian State University > SF.net id: jagee or 94756 > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.NET email is sponsored by: > SourceForge Enterprise Edition + IBM + LinuxWorld = Something 2 See! > http://www.vasoftware.com > _______________________________________________ > Phpwebsite-developers mailing list > Php...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/phpwebsite-developers > > > |
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From: Steven L. <st...@tu...> - 2003-01-31 16:38:11
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Hello All, The Phatform module is, to put it simply, a form generator. Our first version we plan to release is nearing completion. I'd like to have a tarball up by this afternoon, but if that does not happen and you cannot wait, it can be found in our CVS repository under asu_mods/phatform_v2. The ability to create forms and fill out those forms is there, just the backend for viewing/editing the data entered is not finished. We hope to add the ability soon to use Phatform to make polls. These polls won't just be limited to radiobuttons, you can use any form element implemented in Phatform. Does this help to answer your questions? If you have any more, just post to the list and Adam and I will be glad to answer. -- Steven Levin Electronic Student Services Appalachian State University Phone: 828.262.2431 PhpWebsite Development Team URL: http://phpwebsite.appstate.edu Email: st...@NO... |
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From: Adam M. <ad...@tu...> - 2003-01-31 17:08:14
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A few more phat things about phatform :) A form can be created where a user can enter data into it and then return later and edit that data. Some kind of membership form to a club or something might be a good example of this. Also phatform is expandable. The way elements are handled is very abstract allowing us to add more form elements later without much fuss. I hope to have the file element added in the future which could handle file uploads to a form including images. As far as the 2 modules announced by Eloi and Don...phatform could be used as the tool for entering and storing the data you need to form your directory listings. Then your modules would only need to be a user interface allowing your users to "surf" your directory listing. I haven't actually tried this yet, but being intimately familiar with the guts of phatform, I can say that this is quite possible. Adam > Hello All, > > The Phatform module is, to put it simply, a form generator. Our first > version we plan to release is nearing completion. I'd like to have a > tarball up by this afternoon, but if that does not happen and you cannot > wait, it can be found in our CVS repository under asu_mods/phatform_v2. > The ability to create forms and fill out those forms is there, just the > backend for viewing/editing the data entered is not finished. We hope > to add the ability soon to use Phatform to make polls. These polls > won't just be limited to radiobuttons, you can use any form element > implemented in Phatform. Does this help to answer your questions? If > you have any more, just post to the list and Adam and I will be glad to > answer. > > -- > Steven Levin > Electronic Student Services > Appalachian State University > Phone: 828.262.2431 > PhpWebsite Development Team > URL: http://phpwebsite.appstate.edu > Email: st...@NO... > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.NET email is sponsored by: > SourceForge Enterprise Edition + IBM + LinuxWorld = Something 2 See! > http://www.vasoftware.com > _______________________________________________ > Phpwebsite-developers mailing list > Php...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/phpwebsite-developers --------------------------------------------------------------------- Adam Morton Developer - Electronic Student Services http://phpwebsite.appstate.edu Founder - Appalachian Linux Users Group http://alug.appstate.edu |
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From: Eloi G. <el...@re...> - 2003-01-31 17:09:14
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Cool. I can go work on other stuff! Next on my list is a Discussion module that interfaces with Comments & enables you to access module comments as forums. I figured that it might be easier than trying to interface phpBB or InvisionBoard with phpWS, since the main problem seems to be that these programs want to handle registrations, security, display and reporting on their own. This way, in stead of trying to hit 2 moving targets (phpWS core & thrid-party code) we can just concentrate on one. My initial design notes have 3 classes: Categories, Forums, & Topics which will use Comments methods for posting & display. I'm not sure about Categories, though. I'd like it to interface with FatCat instead, but can't figure out how to make the Category/Forum display look decent... OK, I'm rambling. Don, can you use it for multiple item types? I was hoping for something that's categorical & templatable, so you can use the one module for houses and boats and cars and the input, search & display screens will be unique to each. -Eloi- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Seiler" <do...@se...> To: "Eloi George" <el...@re...> Cc: <php...@li...> Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 11:29 AM Subject: Re: [Phpwebsite-developers] PhatForm > I'm currently coding a listing module as well, for sites dedicated to > listing one type of item, like houses or cars or books or whatever. |
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From: Don S. <do...@se...> - 2003-01-31 17:14:39
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My current design is for a single listing "type". However you define that type is up to you. You could add generic fields to allow you to list multiple items. However if you were listing only, say, cars, then you could have a manufacturer field and model field etc. Don. On Fri, 31 Jan 2003, Eloi George wrote: > Cool. I can go work on other stuff! > > Next on my list is a Discussion module that interfaces with Comments & > enables you to access module comments as forums. I figured that it might be > easier than trying to interface phpBB or InvisionBoard with phpWS, since the > main problem seems to be that these programs want to handle registrations, > security, display and reporting on their own. This way, in stead of trying > to hit 2 moving targets (phpWS core & thrid-party code) we can just > concentrate on one. My initial design notes have 3 classes: Categories, > Forums, & Topics which will use Comments methods for posting & display. I'm > not sure about Categories, though. I'd like it to interface with FatCat > instead, but can't figure out how to make the Category/Forum display look > decent... > > OK, I'm rambling. > > Don, can you use it for multiple item types? I was hoping for something > that's categorical & templatable, so you can use the one module for houses > and boats and cars and the input, search & display screens will be unique to > each. > > -Eloi- > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Don Seiler" <do...@se...> > To: "Eloi George" <el...@re...> > Cc: <php...@li...> > Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 11:29 AM > Subject: Re: [Phpwebsite-developers] PhatForm > > > > I'm currently coding a listing module as well, for sites dedicated to > > listing one type of item, like houses or cars or books or whatever. > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.NET email is sponsored by: > SourceForge Enterprise Edition + IBM + LinuxWorld = Something 2 See! > http://www.vasoftware.com > _______________________________________________ > Phpwebsite-developers mailing list > Php...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/phpwebsite-developers > > > |
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From: Mike N. <mh...@us...> - 2003-01-31 17:28:41
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On Fri, 2003-01-31 at 09:08, Eloi George wrote: > Cool. I can go work on other stuff! Eloi, I have a request. Please consider working on a Wiki module. As Php Website Module http://phpwiki.sourceforge.net/phpwiki/AsPhpWebsiteModule phpWiki module request https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=508469&group_id=33782&atid=409165 PostNuke and phpWebSite modules https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=513425&group_id=6121&atid=356121 http://wiki.org/ http://directory.google.com/Top/Computers/Software/Groupware/Wiki/?tc=1 -- Mike Noyes <mhnoyes @ users.sourceforge.net> http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ http://leaf-project.org/ http://sitedocs.sf.net/ http://ffl.sf.net/ |
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From: Eloi G. <el...@re...> - 2003-01-31 23:37:59
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> Eloi, > I have a request. Please consider working on a Wiki module. Mike, While I've heard the term before, I had no idea what a Wiki was. Now I'm just freaked out. It's like a "1984" adaptation written by Peter Pan's Lost Boys that then goes horribly, horribly wrong. <gasp> Are they really making the rules up as they go along? Code it? I'm not even sure these things should exist -- it's too "TouchyFeelyFreeLove", too "Nickelodeon". It's "zen writing". That can't be good! <shocked, stumbling> But I'm intrigued. It looks like Announcements with an automated mnemonic linking system, some sort of automatic cleanup and a changelog. And of course a much simpler interface. ArticleManager allows the SiteOp to grant free access to everyone to make/edit articles, and I can probably graft the other features onto it, but the interface will be the same "edit/save section then save page". Slightly less intuitive than edit&save, but it'll do the job. I'd like to try this feature addition out, but I'm not even sure if it'll be worth the amount of time I spent thinking about it. If you guys want to see Tinkerbell fly, clap your hands! I'll make it happen. So thanks, Mike. Now you've warped my fragile little mind. (hee hee) do it again! -Eloi George- |
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From: Mike N. <mh...@us...> - 2003-02-01 06:32:37
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On Fri, 2003-01-31 at 15:37, Eloi George wrote:
> > I have a request. Please consider working on a Wiki module.
>
> But I'm intrigued. It looks like Announcements with an automated mnemonic
> linking system, some sort of automatic cleanup and a changelog. And of
> course a much simpler interface.
Eloi,
I think of Wikis as a simplified combination of CVS and HTML. Wikis are
great for collaborating on small to medium size documents. The
changelog, diffs, and simplified tag structure are very useful. There
are many writers that aren't comfortable writing documents using XML,
DocBook, or HTML. Wikis allow these writers to contribute content to a
project.
You can even convert Wiki to DocBook.
http://docbook.org/wiki/moin.cgi/Wt2Db
> ArticleManager allows the SiteOp to grant
> free access to everyone to make/edit articles, and I can probably graft the
> other features onto it, but the interface will be the same "edit/save
> section then save page". Slightly less intuitive than edit&save, but it'll
> do the job.
Would this modification include changelog and diff capabilities?
> I'd like to try this feature addition out, but I'm not even sure if it'll be
> worth the amount of time I spent thinking about it.
I think Wiki functionality for phpWS is well worth the time you may
spend on the task.
> So thanks, Mike. Now you've warped my fragile little mind.
>
> (hee hee) do it again!
Take a look at this.
Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://www.wikipedia.org/
--
Mike Noyes <mhnoyes @ users.sourceforge.net>
http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/
http://leaf-project.org/ http://sitedocs.sf.net/ http://ffl.sf.net/
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From: Adam M. <ad...@tu...> - 2003-01-31 17:09:32
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Just curious Eloi....where did you hear about phatform? I thought we were being all quiet and covert about it....not that we were trying :) Adam > I keep hearing about this PhatForm module. > > What is it? What's it do? > > The reason I'm asking is because I'm about to start coding a classified > listing module & don't want to end up duplicating yet another module. > <grin> > > -Eloi George- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Adam Morton Developer - Electronic Student Services http://phpwebsite.appstate.edu Founder - Appalachian Linux Users Group http://alug.appstate.edu |
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From: Eloi G. <el...@re...> - 2003-01-31 17:38:39
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What'd you mean? You mentioned it here 2 weeks ago. I was wondering why it never came up again. <grin> Now that I know what it is though I'm very excited! -Eloi- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Adam Morton" <ad...@tu...> To: <php...@li...> Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [Phpwebsite-developers] PhatForm > Just curious Eloi....where did you hear about phatform? I thought we were > being all quiet and covert about it....not that we were trying :) |
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From: Mike N. <mh...@us...> - 2003-01-31 17:37:26
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On Fri, 2003-01-31 at 09:19, Adam Morton wrote: > Just curious Eloi....where did you hear about phatform? I thought we were > being all quiet and covert about it....not that we were trying :) Adam, My guess is Eloi noticed phatform in the following two cvs commits. https://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=3654387 https://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=3653375 -- Mike Noyes <mhnoyes @ users.sourceforge.net> http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ http://leaf-project.org/ http://sitedocs.sf.net/ http://ffl.sf.net/ |
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From: Steven L. <st...@tu...> - 2003-01-31 18:04:06
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Mike, Wow, you've got a real good eye. You must really be paying attention to have seen that going across. It took me a minute and thats my commit :) I didn't think anyone would notice one tiny sting in a serialized array. Steven These commit > On Fri, 2003-01-31 at 09:19, Adam Morton wrote: >> Just curious Eloi....where did you hear about phatform? I thought we >> were being all quiet and covert about it....not that we were trying :) > > Adam, > My guess is Eloi noticed phatform in the following two cvs commits. > > https://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=3654387 > https://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=3653375 > > -- > Mike Noyes <mhnoyes @ users.sourceforge.net> > http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ > http://leaf-project.org/ http://sitedocs.sf.net/ http://ffl.sf.net/ > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.NET email is sponsored by: > SourceForge Enterprise Edition + IBM + LinuxWorld = Something 2 See! > http://www.vasoftware.com > _______________________________________________ > Phpwebsite-developers mailing list > Php...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/phpwebsite-developers -- Steven Levin Electronic Student Services Appalachian State University Phone: 828.262.2431 PhpWebsite Development Team URL: http://phpwebsite.appstate.edu Email: st...@NO... |
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From: Mike N. <mh...@us...> - 2003-01-31 18:32:50
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On Fri, 2003-01-31 at 10:13, Steven Levin wrote: > Wow, you've got a real good eye. You must really be paying attention to > have seen that going across. It took me a minute and thats my commit :) > I didn't think anyone would notice one tiny sting in a serialized > array. Steven, I'm as blind as a bat, but I figured Eloi wasn't. So, I used the SF ML search to find the commits. :-) > > On Fri, 2003-01-31 at 09:19, Adam Morton wrote: > >> Just curious Eloi....where did you hear about phatform? I thought we > >> were being all quiet and covert about it....not that we were trying :) > > > > Adam, > > My guess is Eloi noticed phatform in the following two cvs commits. > > > > https://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=3654387 > > https://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=3653375 -- Mike Noyes <mhnoyes @ users.sourceforge.net> http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ http://leaf-project.org/ http://sitedocs.sf.net/ http://ffl.sf.net/ |
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From: Adam M. <ad...@tu...> - 2003-01-31 19:24:05
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I forgot we mentioned phatform on the list when we were talking about Item.php and Manager.php. We didn't mention it since then because we wanted the module to be a big suprise for everyone....suprise! :) Anyway, look for a tarball of the module to be posted to phpwebsite sometime today or tomorrow. Steven or I will be sure to post a link to the download on this mailing list as well. We've been working on tightening up the reporting side today and are quite close to a finished package. We have some statistical features slated as well the will make use of the GD libs in php to make dynamic bar graphs and give helpful, statistical information about the data submitted to your forms. This extension will probably not make it into the first release, but we need here at the university so you shouldn't have to wait long to see it (besides its kind of fun making dynamic graphics :) You should try it out if you haven't already). Adam > On Fri, 2003-01-31 at 10:13, Steven Levin wrote: >> Wow, you've got a real good eye. You must really be paying >> attention to >> have seen that going across. It took me a minute and thats my commit >> :) >> I didn't think anyone would notice one tiny sting in a serialized >> array. > > Steven, > I'm as blind as a bat, but I figured Eloi wasn't. So, I used the SF ML > search to find the commits. :-) > > >> > On Fri, 2003-01-31 at 09:19, Adam Morton wrote: >> >> Just curious Eloi....where did you hear about phatform? I thought >> we were being all quiet and covert about it....not that we were >> trying :) >> > >> > Adam, >> > My guess is Eloi noticed phatform in the following two cvs commits. >> > >> > https://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=3654387 >> https://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=3653375 > > -- > Mike Noyes <mhnoyes @ users.sourceforge.net> > http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ > http://leaf-project.org/ http://sitedocs.sf.net/ http://ffl.sf.net/ > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > This SF.NET email is sponsored by: > SourceForge Enterprise Edition + IBM + LinuxWorld = Something 2 See! > http://www.vasoftware.com > _______________________________________________ > Phpwebsite-developers mailing list > Php...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/phpwebsite-developers --------------------------------------------------------------------- Adam Morton Developer - Electronic Student Services http://phpwebsite.appstate.edu Founder - Appalachian Linux Users Group http://alug.appstate.edu |
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From: Eloi G. <el...@re...> - 2003-02-02 22:28:03
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> I think of Wikis as a simplified combination of CVS and HTML. Wikis are > great for collaborating on small to medium size documents. The > changelog, diffs, and simplified tag structure are very useful. There > are many writers that aren't comfortable writing documents using XML, > DocBook, or HTML. Wikis allow these writers to contribute content to a > project. Mike, that's a great way of putting it. The whole thing's starting to gel now. > Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia > http://www.wikipedia.org/ Cheez. You got me again. I like their syntax structure better. I didn't realize it could be so powerful. > Would this modification include changelog and diff capabilities? Sure. That part of it might take me a little longer because I'm new to CVSs & Difference Engines. I'm thinking I should encapsulate all the tag conversion & basic difference engine methods into one class that can be accessible from other phpWS modules. Module->Module links could then be effected by using namespaces. Links within the same module wouldn't require any. Since changelog standardization would be impossible, each module would be responsible for maintaining its own archives and interfacing with the Difference Engine. How does that Wiki->Wiki namespace capability work? Is there some sort of central registry? -Eloi George- |
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From: Mike N. <mh...@us...> - 2003-02-03 19:25:18
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On Sun, 2003-02-02 at 14:27, Eloi George wrote: > > Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia > > http://www.wikipedia.org/ > > Cheez. You got me again. > > I like their syntax structure better. I didn't realize it could be so > powerful. Eloi, Wikipedia is an extreme example. Most Wiki sites use them for FAQ, HOWTO, quick-start document, etc. collaboration. Larger documents (e.g. guides) still use DocBook SGML/XML. > > Would this modification include changelog and diff capabilities? > > Sure. Great. :-) > That part of it might take me a little longer because I'm new to CVSs > & Difference Engines. The phpwiki project has php pear abstracted port of wikiwikiweb. Maybe their source would help you. PhpWiki source http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/phpwiki/phpwiki/ PhpWiki 1.3 branch demo http://phpwiki.sourceforge.net/demo/ > I'm thinking I should encapsulate all the tag > conversion & basic difference engine methods into one class that can be > accessible from other phpWS modules. Module->Module links could then be > effected by using namespaces. Links within the same module wouldn't require > any. Since changelog standardization would be impossible, each module would > be responsible for maintaining its own archives and interfacing with the > Difference Engine. > > How does that Wiki->Wiki namespace capability work? Is there some sort of > central registry? Unfortunately, I'm not knowledgeable enough to answer the questions above. I'm not a programmer. I'm barely useful as a project admin. :-( -- Mike Noyes <mhnoyes @ users.sourceforge.net> http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ http://leaf-project.org/ http://sitedocs.sf.net/ http://ffl.sf.net/ |
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From: Robb D. <rdo...@ya...> - 2003-02-05 20:13:45
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I've been following recent discussion of wikiwikiwiki and it got me investigating the subject more. I've found a perl based program that would be great to "port to" a phpWebsite module. In the Open Source community it is a "wiki standard of sorts" which has attracted development and usage from private major corporations. TWikiTM - A Web Based Collaboration Platform http://twiki.org/ http://sourceforge.net/projects/twiki What do you think about the prospect for these functions to be translated into PHP? Robb Doyle/robb-AT-buckheadbodyworks.com a php coder wanna be <G> Mike Noyes <mh...@us...> wrote:On Sun, 2003-02-02 at 14:27, Eloi George wrote: > > Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia > > http://www.wikipedia.org/ > > Cheez. You got me again. > > I like their syntax structure better. I didn't realize it could be so > powerful. Eloi, Wikipedia is an extreme example. Most Wiki sites use them for FAQ, HOWTO, quick-start document, etc. collaboration. Larger documents (e.g. guides) still use DocBook SGML/XML. > > Would this modification include changelog and diff capabilities? > > Sure. Great. :-) > That part of it might take me a little longer because I'm new to CVSs > & Difference Engines. The phpwiki project has php pear abstracted port of wikiwikiweb. Maybe their source would help you. PhpWiki source http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/phpwiki/phpwiki/ PhpWiki 1.3 branch demo http://phpwiki.sourceforge.net/demo/ > I'm thinking I should encapsulate all the tag > conversion & basic difference engine methods into one class that can be > accessible from other phpWS modules. Module->Module links could then be > effected by using namespaces. Links within the same module wouldn't require > any. Since changelog standardization would be impossible, each module would > be responsible for maintaining its own archives and interfacing with the > Difference Engine. > > How does that Wiki->Wiki namespace capability work? Is there some sort of > central registry? Unfortunately, I'm not knowledgeable enough to answer the questions above. I'm not a programmer. I'm barely useful as a project admin. :-( -- Mike Noyes http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ http://leaf-project.org/ http://sitedocs.sf.net/ http://ffl.sf.net/ --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now |
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From: Mike N. <mh...@us...> - 2003-02-08 21:12:37
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On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 12:13, Robb Doyle wrote: > I've been following recent discussion of wikiwikiwiki and it got me > investigating the subject more. > I've found a perl based program that would be great to "port to" a > phpWebsite module. In the Open Source community it is a "wiki standard > of sorts" which has attracted development and usage from private major > corporations. > TWikiTM - A Web Based Collaboration Platform > http://twiki.org/ > http://sourceforge.net/projects/twiki > > What do you think about the prospect for these functions to be > translated into PHP? Everyone, The project below shows how Wiki functions can be integrated into a CMS written in PHP. Tiki! http://tikiwiki.sourceforge.net/ https://sourceforge.net/projects/tikiwiki -- Mike Noyes <mhnoyes @ users.sourceforge.net> http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ http://leaf-project.org/ http://sitedocs.sf.net/ http://ffl.sf.net/ |
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