Can I ask you to please urgently look into my requests for a cc/bcc field to an external email account to be added to all mail going out of PGV?
Please see my recent post Users not imported where I explained that I had shifted web host provider and converting to UTF8.
Got a message form my elderly user on Thursday saying that she was trying to change her surname and that her family because of the É appearing as É - it's also my surname and naturally enough appears quite a few time, wanting to know if there was another way of changing the surname rather than one by one..
I had told her previously to refrain from accessing the old site because of the shift to a new web host/address. So I was quite puzzled as to how she has gotten access to the new site as I had not told her of the new address.
I then received an internal message from her yesterday which she had sent from the login page telling me that she could no longer access the site as her password was no longer working. I was even more puzzled as the site and new admin email address had only just been propagated.
On further enquiry from me today after I had sent her a stern note not to use the site as I was still testing it and my puzzlement of how she got the new address it turns out that PGV had sent her an email on Thursday as soon as I had added the users to the database informing her that her password had been approved with a link to the website.
All this without my knowledge - here I was castigating her for ignoring my instructions while all the while she was dutifully following those sent by PGV without my being aware of it.
It made me to be blunt and if you don't mind my saying look like a right idiot and I had to profusely apologise to her for my ignorance of the workings of PGV.
Similar emails would have sent to other users.
I have posted my trials and attempts to make changes to the email system but I don't have the necessary expertise so can I please plead with you to look into this with some urgency to avoid similar occurrences but more importantly so that the administrator is made fully aware of all that is happening in running the site,
Thanks very much.
Jean
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Jean
If you simply imported the users table into the new database, or performed an upgrade, the 'system' would send no emails. If, on the other hand, you accessed each user and changed their status rights, privileges or access, then the system would send a message advising them so.
I believe you've already been advised on adding a bcc. I can't imagine that it will be a high priority RFE for the developers as its has not been a bone of contention in the 5+ years I've been with this project.
-Stephen
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I guess that you better add another reason for the emails going out as I did none of those that you mentioned however on reflection it seems to have occurred when I changed my admin account ermail address to reflect the one on the new server.
Had known that this would happen then I would have held back on changing it till testing was complete on the site and used it as a the ideal tool to inform users of the new website details once I had completed the installation.
You also fail to empathise with both me and my elderly user. Not only did it cause undue confusion and suspicion on both sides but it also diminished my credibility in her eyes and certainly did not help with gaining her future cooperation.
<< I believe you've already been advised on adding a bcc.>>
Please be kind enough to point me to where this advise had been given. My last remark on the Tracker site asked the question as to whom is the person responsible for addressing this issue and it has yet to be answered. If it's not Greg then who is it that's looking after the ticket?
As far I can ascertain it's an issue that no one wants to address or is being classed as too hard to tackle.
I certainly don't wish to be put in the position of having to apologise again for my ignorance of the program's workings and having to ask my user to send me copies of emails sent by PGV without my knowledge to find out what is going on. It's not professional and it labels me out as being very amateurish and incompetent which I am not.
Just because it hasn't been an issue in the previous five years it doesn't mean that it should not now be recognised as one which causes considerable inconvenience and embarrassment and as such deserves a certain high degree of urgency and priority.
As I have stated I don't mind experimenting myself if only someone would point me in the right direction. That's not an unreasonable request, is it?
Jean
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Jean
As I've said, this is not something that the very few developers we have will spend much time on, as its hardly a major concern or problem. In an earlier posting of yours, Gerry responded:
"The PGV e-mail system will only send e-mails to registered users, so using it as a general e-mail handler won't work."
This is what I've also stated. As to a response on an RFE, review the several hundred RFEs and you'll see some as much as four or more years old, without additional comment or replies.
For your RFE to be 'resolved', a bored developer, or someone new, will have to read it, think that it is something of a priority that will markedly improve PGC and interesting enough that they wish to spend their valuable time in contributing the code.
As I've said, and while I can't speak for anyone but myself, I can't envision given the projects I know are being addresses and the several very complicated changes to code in the SVN branch lines, that this would be a priority for anyone currently working on PGV, especially as there are so few developers.
"You also fail to empathise with both me and my elderly user."
We have over 325 edit rights users (we don't grant 'access-only' rights as we require frequent visits and contributions to maintain an account) and over 50 of those are like me, elderly. I'm most empathetic with the issues that users can have, but I've found hardly any unable to overcome all problems. As to your attempt to 'secretly' establish a new site, it would appear that you created the issue yourself. Personally, I would not have imported your USER table or activated the account for access (easy to switch on and off) until the site was functioning in a manner which met your goals.
If you must, export your user table and import the email addresses and names into your email client and use it to communicate with your users - much easier to develop a system than using what was intended as a simple notification system within PGV.
As always, JOHO. Hopefully you can use our experiences, and those of the many other satisfied PGV admins, to modify PGV's operations to meet your special needs. There are usually at least two ways to reach satisfactory results, so consider alternatives before spending a ton of time trying to reinvent PGV. Always ready to help.
-Stephen
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Anonymous
-
2009-09-27
Jean
Perhaps I can directly address your paragraoh:
*"Please be kind enough to point me to where this advise had been given. My last remark on the Tracker site asked the question as to whom is the person responsible for addressing this issue and it has yet to be answered. If it's not Greg then who is it that's looking after the ticket? As far I can ascertain it's an issue that no one wants to address or is being classed as too hard to tackle."*
The short answer is that no-one is looking after the 'ticket', and no-one is responsible for addressing it. Sorry, but thats the way it is. You have raised a Features Request, and it "might" be looked at sometime. Your best hope is that some other user, with the necessary skills, reads your request and develops a solution for it.
PGV is developed totally by voluntary developers in their private time, for no payment, and there are very few of them as well. So its not all that surprising that they work mainly on things that interest them personally, or that are requested by a lot of people. As Stephan has said, you are the first and only person asking for this in the years that I have been using PGV.
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
Points taken and I gathered as much but were are not talking about nuclear science here and neither am asking anyone of you to spend any of your valuable time on my request. The Feature request should be closed as I have resigned myself to the fact that it will never be actioned.
<< "The PGV e-mail system will only send e-mails to registered users, so using it as a general e-mail handler won't work.">>
Who is talking about a general e-mail handler? Not to belabour the point but would not the adminitrator be the number 1 registered user and despite the risk of again repeating myself BE MADE AWARE OF ALL COMMUNICATIONS EMANATING FROM HIM AND BEARING BEARING HIS SIGNATURE, PARTICULARLY IF THESE ARE AUTOMATED RESPONSES? And why not, it has the capabilities?
<< Hopefully you can use our experiences, and those of the many other satisfied PGV admins, to modify PGV's operations to meet your special needs. >>
That is precisely what I am seeking and neither I am a dissatisfied administrator.
All I am asking for since your knowledge of the convolutions of the program is superior to mine is to point me to the files and code that are used by the email section of the program so that I can experiment with it myself, taking full responsibility for it. If that is not possible then say so and I will continue to delve into it single-handedly. I'm up to the challenge.
<< was intended as a simple notification system within PGV>>
Not so simple otherwise I would have resovled the issue by myself without seeking assistance.
<< As to your attempt to 'secretly' establish a new site, it would appear that you created the issue yourself.>>
I have no idea Stephen where you got his secrecy idea from - have you properly read my remark? I too can be wise after the event but who could have predicted that the program would send out new confirmations to exiting users on changing the admin address unless you had been pre warned or it had previously happened to you. It was the natural and logical thing to do at the time blissfully unaware of the consequences.
Raising it here will hopefully prevent others from falling into the same trap.
Jean
If you would like to refer to this comment somewhere else in this project, copy and paste the following link:
Adding BCC is (almost certainly) trivial. It's the surrounding user-interface stuff that would take the time. Who do you send it to? Admin? There can be more than one admin. Not all of them may want to receive mails. A new configurable item?
You need to write help text, get it translated, etc. You need to decide on defaults, and make sure they work on sites that are upgrading from earlier versions of PGV.
A 30-second look at the code reveals that
(1) The functions_mail.php script has lines like this:
Well the ideal would be to add an optional new field to the Site Amninistrator's user page just below the Email Address field, that way he can choose for himself. If left blank then none would be sent
GEDCOM Administrators as you say would not necessarily want the option so leave them out..
If and only if and when you have a spare moment please have a look at the Request for new password post where I describe my attempts.
Ta very much
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Hi
Can I ask you to please urgently look into my requests for a cc/bcc field to an external email account to be added to all mail going out of PGV?
Please see my recent post Users not imported where I explained that I had shifted web host provider and converting to UTF8.
Got a message form my elderly user on Thursday saying that she was trying to change her surname and that her family because of the É appearing as É - it's also my surname and naturally enough appears quite a few time, wanting to know if there was another way of changing the surname rather than one by one..
I had told her previously to refrain from accessing the old site because of the shift to a new web host/address. So I was quite puzzled as to how she has gotten access to the new site as I had not told her of the new address.
I then received an internal message from her yesterday which she had sent from the login page telling me that she could no longer access the site as her password was no longer working. I was even more puzzled as the site and new admin email address had only just been propagated.
On further enquiry from me today after I had sent her a stern note not to use the site as I was still testing it and my puzzlement of how she got the new address it turns out that PGV had sent her an email on Thursday as soon as I had added the users to the database informing her that her password had been approved with a link to the website.
All this without my knowledge - here I was castigating her for ignoring my instructions while all the while she was dutifully following those sent by PGV without my being aware of it.
It made me to be blunt and if you don't mind my saying look like a right idiot and I had to profusely apologise to her for my ignorance of the workings of PGV.
Similar emails would have sent to other users.
I have posted my trials and attempts to make changes to the email system but I don't have the necessary expertise so can I please plead with you to look into this with some urgency to avoid similar occurrences but more importantly so that the administrator is made fully aware of all that is happening in running the site,
Thanks very much.
Jean
Jean
If you simply imported the users table into the new database, or performed an upgrade, the 'system' would send no emails. If, on the other hand, you accessed each user and changed their status rights, privileges or access, then the system would send a message advising them so.
I believe you've already been advised on adding a bcc. I can't imagine that it will be a high priority RFE for the developers as its has not been a bone of contention in the 5+ years I've been with this project.
-Stephen
Hi Stephen
Thanks for your reply.
I guess that you better add another reason for the emails going out as I did none of those that you mentioned however on reflection it seems to have occurred when I changed my admin account ermail address to reflect the one on the new server.
Had known that this would happen then I would have held back on changing it till testing was complete on the site and used it as a the ideal tool to inform users of the new website details once I had completed the installation.
You also fail to empathise with both me and my elderly user. Not only did it cause undue confusion and suspicion on both sides but it also diminished my credibility in her eyes and certainly did not help with gaining her future cooperation.
<< I believe you've already been advised on adding a bcc.>>
Please be kind enough to point me to where this advise had been given. My last remark on the Tracker site asked the question as to whom is the person responsible for addressing this issue and it has yet to be answered. If it's not Greg then who is it that's looking after the ticket?
As far I can ascertain it's an issue that no one wants to address or is being classed as too hard to tackle.
I certainly don't wish to be put in the position of having to apologise again for my ignorance of the program's workings and having to ask my user to send me copies of emails sent by PGV without my knowledge to find out what is going on. It's not professional and it labels me out as being very amateurish and incompetent which I am not.
Just because it hasn't been an issue in the previous five years it doesn't mean that it should not now be recognised as one which causes considerable inconvenience and embarrassment and as such deserves a certain high degree of urgency and priority.
As I have stated I don't mind experimenting myself if only someone would point me in the right direction. That's not an unreasonable request, is it?
Jean
Jean
As I've said, this is not something that the very few developers we have will spend much time on, as its hardly a major concern or problem. In an earlier posting of yours, Gerry responded:
"The PGV e-mail system will only send e-mails to registered users, so using it as a general e-mail handler won't work."
This is what I've also stated. As to a response on an RFE, review the several hundred RFEs and you'll see some as much as four or more years old, without additional comment or replies.
For your RFE to be 'resolved', a bored developer, or someone new, will have to read it, think that it is something of a priority that will markedly improve PGC and interesting enough that they wish to spend their valuable time in contributing the code.
As I've said, and while I can't speak for anyone but myself, I can't envision given the projects I know are being addresses and the several very complicated changes to code in the SVN branch lines, that this would be a priority for anyone currently working on PGV, especially as there are so few developers.
"You also fail to empathise with both me and my elderly user."
We have over 325 edit rights users (we don't grant 'access-only' rights as we require frequent visits and contributions to maintain an account) and over 50 of those are like me, elderly. I'm most empathetic with the issues that users can have, but I've found hardly any unable to overcome all problems. As to your attempt to 'secretly' establish a new site, it would appear that you created the issue yourself. Personally, I would not have imported your USER table or activated the account for access (easy to switch on and off) until the site was functioning in a manner which met your goals.
If you must, export your user table and import the email addresses and names into your email client and use it to communicate with your users - much easier to develop a system than using what was intended as a simple notification system within PGV.
As always, JOHO. Hopefully you can use our experiences, and those of the many other satisfied PGV admins, to modify PGV's operations to meet your special needs. There are usually at least two ways to reach satisfactory results, so consider alternatives before spending a ton of time trying to reinvent PGV. Always ready to help.
-Stephen
Jean
Perhaps I can directly address your paragraoh:
*"Please be kind enough to point me to where this advise had been given. My last remark on the Tracker site asked the question as to whom is the person responsible for addressing this issue and it has yet to be answered. If it's not Greg then who is it that's looking after the ticket? As far I can ascertain it's an issue that no one wants to address or is being classed as too hard to tackle."*
The short answer is that no-one is looking after the 'ticket', and no-one is responsible for addressing it. Sorry, but thats the way it is. You have raised a Features Request, and it "might" be looked at sometime. Your best hope is that some other user, with the necessary skills, reads your request and develops a solution for it.
PGV is developed totally by voluntary developers in their private time, for no payment, and there are very few of them as well. So its not all that surprising that they work mainly on things that interest them personally, or that are requested by a lot of people. As Stephan has said, you are the first and only person asking for this in the years that I have been using PGV.
Steve, kiwi
A final word on this subject.
Points taken and I gathered as much but were are not talking about nuclear science here and neither am asking anyone of you to spend any of your valuable time on my request. The Feature request should be closed as I have resigned myself to the fact that it will never be actioned.
<< "The PGV e-mail system will only send e-mails to registered users, so using it as a general e-mail handler won't work.">>
Who is talking about a general e-mail handler? Not to belabour the point but would not the adminitrator be the number 1 registered user and despite the risk of again repeating myself BE MADE AWARE OF ALL COMMUNICATIONS EMANATING FROM HIM AND BEARING BEARING HIS SIGNATURE, PARTICULARLY IF THESE ARE AUTOMATED RESPONSES? And why not, it has the capabilities?
<< Hopefully you can use our experiences, and those of the many other satisfied PGV admins, to modify PGV's operations to meet your special needs. >>
That is precisely what I am seeking and neither I am a dissatisfied administrator.
All I am asking for since your knowledge of the convolutions of the program is superior to mine is to point me to the files and code that are used by the email section of the program so that I can experiment with it myself, taking full responsibility for it. If that is not possible then say so and I will continue to delve into it single-handedly. I'm up to the challenge.
<< was intended as a simple notification system within PGV>>
Not so simple otherwise I would have resovled the issue by myself without seeking assistance.
<< As to your attempt to 'secretly' establish a new site, it would appear that you created the issue yourself.>>
I have no idea Stephen where you got his secrecy idea from - have you properly read my remark? I too can be wise after the event but who could have predicted that the program would send out new confirmations to exiting users on changing the admin address unless you had been pre warned or it had previously happened to you. It was the natural and logical thing to do at the time blissfully unaware of the consequences.
Raising it here will hopefully prevent others from falling into the same trap.
Jean
Adding BCC is (almost certainly) trivial. It's the surrounding user-interface stuff that would take the time. Who do you send it to? Admin? There can be more than one admin. Not all of them may want to receive mails. A new configurable item?
You need to write help text, get it translated, etc. You need to decide on defaults, and make sure they work on sites that are upgrading from earlier versions of PGV.
A 30-second look at the code reveals that
(1) The functions_mail.php script has lines like this:
$mail_object->FromName = $PGV_SMTP_FROM_NAME;
$mail_object->AddAddress($to);
(2) $mail_object is defined in the file class.phpmailer.php, which shows it also supports a AddBCC() method.
Thanks for your reply Greg
Well the ideal would be to add an optional new field to the Site Amninistrator's user page just below the Email Address field, that way he can choose for himself. If left blank then none would be sent
GEDCOM Administrators as you say would not necessarily want the option so leave them out..
If and only if and when you have a spare moment please have a look at the Request for new password post where I describe my attempts.
Ta very much