perldoc2-developers

[perldoc2-developers] Meet the team

[Joergen W. L. <joe...@gm...>]

Hello and welcome everybody,

let me express my gratitude to all of you for joining the team of 
perldoc 2.0. Since this is quite a new project I would like to take the 
opportunity to introduce you to each other. Please feel free to correct 
me if I'm mistaken or missing out on some facts.


Herbert Breunung, aka 'sir_lichtkind':

The first one to join the team was *Herbert*, known as 'sir_lichtkind' 
in sourceforge. Herbert is involved in creating what might well be the 
'kernel' of the documentation for Perl6.

He also is an active member of the german Perl community and contributor 
to the translation efforts on perl-community.org. Herbert also is 
involved in the developement of PCE (now called kephra for various 
reasons). Apart from being able to do translations to german (and 
probably czech) he is working on making kephra fit for the creation of 
translations.


Nicolas François, aka 'nekral':

*Nicolas*, also know as 'nekral' on sourceforge, is the current 
maintainer of po4a, a tool that converts documentation from multiple 
formats (POD, to mention just one) into a gettext-compatible format and 
back.

perldoc 2.0 uses po4a extensively to convert the original .pod-files 
into gettext-pot for ease of translation and mainteneance.


Paul Gaborit, aka 'gaborit':

I am very happy to see *Paul* join the team. Paul seems to be the only 
survivor of the french translation project which has started some years 
ago as a joined effort of the french perl newsgroup. He still maintains 
the french repository.


Jörg Plate, aka 'patterner':

*Jörg*, one of the Hamburg.pm regulars calls himself "Software 
Artificer" - someone who performs fireworks show - but with software. 
Jörg has volunteered to help in creation the framework for the actual 
translation platform. Seeing him join put me under some pressure since 
now I have to switch from 'abstract' mode to 'practical'. Expect some 
real code, soon.

Also on the list, but not (yet?) on sourceforge is

Robert Sedlacek:

*Robert* is also an active member of Hamburg.pm. He has also opted to 
help with the creation of the framework. Although he was born in 
Austria, he has now accustomed to the harsh climate of Germany's north. 
If we are nice to him, he might be providing the Austrian translation.

Joergen W. Lang, aka 'joergen_lang':

I am working as a freelance translator for O'Reilly Germany since 1999. 
I have since then co-translated about 14 books like 'Learning Perl', 
'Perl Hacks', 'Perl in a nutshell' to name but a few. I am a Perl hacker 
since 1996. The idea of working on the translation of the Perl docs was 
lingering around for quite some time.

On the 2006 Euro OSCON in Brussels I had the chance to talk to Damian 
Conway and 'Barbie', two leading figures in the world of [Pp]erl.

Both strongly encouraged me in not only translating the docs but also 
creating a common platform for the translation to other languages. So, 
there you have it! ;o)


Again, welcome to you all and a big 'thank you, merci, danke' for 
joining and helping with the various aspects of this project.


Greetings from Hamburg, Germany,

Joergen

Re: [perldoc2-developers] Meet the team

[Nicolas <nic...@ce...>]

Hello all,

On Thu, Nov 09, 2006 at 01:57:46PM +0100, Joergen W. Lang wrote:
> Hello and welcome everybody,

Thank you J=F6rgen for setting up this project.

> Nicolas Fran=E7ois, aka 'nekral':
>=20
> *Nicolas*, also know as 'nekral' on sourceforge, is the current=20
> maintainer of po4a, a tool that converts documentation from multiple=20
> formats (POD, to mention just one) into a gettext-compatible format and=
=20
> back.
>=20
> perldoc 2.0 uses po4a extensively to convert the original .pod-files=20
> into gettext-pot for ease of translation and mainteneance.

I've made a Makefile to call po4a and update the POTs, POs, and
translations.

    http://nekral.homelinux.net/perldoc2/

You can have a look at it and see how it works (I took the translations
from the existing French translations=20

I also have the French POs for version 5.6.2 and 5.9.4, but I would like
to make tests for merging from a version to the other (I did it manually,
but would like to do it in the makefile). The makefile also lack a rule t=
o
detect strings translated differently from one PO to the other.

The Makefile has rules like all-pots, all-update-po, all-translate

update_pots_fr, translate_fr, update_po_fr
or even update_pots_fr_5.8.8, translate_fr_5.8.8 and update_po_fr_5.8.8

It can also show statistics: all-stats, stats_fr and stats_fr_5.8.8

The versions and languages are auto detected.

I will commit it if we agree on the hierarchy it creates in translations

> Paul Gaborit, aka 'gaborit':
>=20
> I am very happy to see *Paul* join the team. Paul seems to be the only=20
> survivor of the french translation project which has started some years=
=20
> ago as a joined effort of the french perl newsgroup. He still maintains=
=20
> the french repository.

In addition to helping in the infrastructure, I will also happily
participate in the translation and review process of the French
translation.

Cheers,
--=20
Nekral

Re: [perldoc2-developers] Meet the team

[<pl...@pa...>]

Moin moin

> "Software Artificer" - someone who performs fireworks show - but  
> with software.
Fireworks..?

Artificer \Ar*tif"i*cer\, n. [Cf. F. artificier, fr. LL. artificiarius.]
   1. An artistic worker; a mechanic or manufacturer; one whose  
occupation requires
      skill or knowledge of a particular kind, as a silversmith.
   3. A cunning or artful fellow. [Obs.] --B. Jonson.
   Syn: Artisan; artist. See {Artisan}.
n 1: someone who is the first to think of or make something [syn:  
{inventor}, {discoverer}]
   2: a skilled worker who practices some trade or handicraft [syn:  
{craftsman}, {artisan}, {journeyman}]

I'l looking forward to helping this project.

Regards,
Jörg

Re: [perldoc2-developers] Meet the team

[Robert 'p. S. <rs...@47...>]

Good morning everybody,

Joergen W. Lang said:
> *Robert* is also an active member of Hamburg.pm. He has also opted to
> help with the creation of the framework. Although he was born in
> Austria, he has now accustomed to the harsh climate of Germany's north.
> If we are nice to him, he might be providing the Austrian translation.

Actually, we speak German too :) Btw, I already have an SF account, I jus=
t
had to find it again, since it's last usage lies a while back:

  http://sourceforge.net/users/dunkelheit/

gr.,
Robert

--=20
# Robert 'phaylon' Sedlacek
# Perl 5/Catalyst Developer in Hamburg, Germany
{ EMail =3D> ' rs...@47... ', Web =3D> ' http://474.at ' }

Re: [perldoc2-developers] Meet the team

[Nicolas <nek...@gm...>]

Hello all,

I'm resending this mail, with the "From" address subscribed to the list.
Please ignore my other answer (no need to moderate it).

On Thu, Nov 09, 2006 at 01:57:46PM +0100, Joergen W. Lang wrote:
> Hello and welcome everybody,

Thank you J=F6rgen for setting up this project.

> Nicolas Fran=E7ois, aka 'nekral':
>=20
> *Nicolas*, also know as 'nekral' on sourceforge, is the current=20
> maintainer of po4a, a tool that converts documentation from multiple=20
> formats (POD, to mention just one) into a gettext-compatible format and=
=20
> back.
>=20
> perldoc 2.0 uses po4a extensively to convert the original .pod-files=20
> into gettext-pot for ease of translation and mainteneance.

I've made a Makefile to call po4a and update the POTs, POs, and
translations.

        http://nekral.homelinux.net/perldoc2/

You can have a look at it and see how it works (I took the translations
from the existing French translations

I also have the French POs for version 5.6.2 and 5.9.4, but I would like
to make tests for merging from a version to the other (I did it manually,
but would like to do it in the makefile). The makefile also lack a rule t=
o
detect strings translated differently from one PO to the other.

The Makefile has rules like all-pots, all-update-po, all-translate

update_pots_fr, translate_fr, update_po_fr
or even update_pots_fr_5.8.8, translate_fr_5.8.8 and update_po_fr_5.8.8

It can also show statistics: all-stats, stats_fr and stats_fr_5.8.8

The versions and languages are auto detected.

I will commit this proposal if we agree on the hierarchy it creates in th=
e
'translations' directory.

> Paul Gaborit, aka 'gaborit':
>=20
> I am very happy to see *Paul* join the team. Paul seems to be the only=20
> survivor of the french translation project which has started some years=
=20
> ago as a joined effort of the french perl newsgroup. He still maintains=
=20
> the french repository.

In addition to helping in the infrastructure, I will also happily
participate in the translation and review process of the French
translation.



Answering Herbert's question, po4a extracts the strings from the English
pod, put them in a PO file, and once the PO file is translated, it can
reinject the translated strings in the POD structure (hence generating a
translated POD).

It eases the maintenance of translations because it automates the
update of a translation from one version to the other.

When po4a is run on a later version, if some of the extracted strings are
the same, then these strings are already translated. If they are just a
little bit different, then they are marked as "fuzzy" (which means the
translation needs to be reviewed), and new strings are also detected.

It can also ease the translation because it can detect strings used in
different files.


Other advantage inherent to the use of a PO file are:
 * it is a common format for translators,
 * I like it for reviewing the translations (you do not only review the
   translation looking for typos, you check that the translation matches
   the English original text).
 * You can translate parts of a document (the translated document will
   then be a mix of English and translated text). This means that if a
   translator vanish, we can still distribute an accurate documentation.
   (This point is configurable; some people do not like it)

Another note: if an existing translation exist, po4a can try to reuse it
to initialize the first POs (that's what I did with the French
translation to test the infrastructure).

I'm stopping here my po4a advertisement.

Cheers,
--=20
Nekral

Re: [perldoc2-developers] Meet the team

[Joergen W. L. <joe...@gm...>]

Hi Nicolas,

Nicolas François schrieb:

> I've made a Makefile to call po4a and update the POTs, POs, and
> translations.
> 
>         http://nekral.homelinux.net/perldoc2/
> 
> You can have a look at it and see how it works (I took the translations
> from the existing French translations

Hey, great job! I downloaded the files at top level but did not want to 
wget all the stuff in /translations/fr/. If you find the time, maybe you 
could make a tarball for that directory. That would be nice!

Otherwise it would be great to have those french pot files in the 
repository to play with. If something changes just commit the new 
version. After all, that's what SVN is for. :o)

(Apart from that, SVN activity keeps us up in the "charts" on 
SoureForge... )

> I also have the French POs for version 5.6.2 and 5.9.4, but I would like
> to make tests for merging from a version to the other (I did it manually,
> but would like to do it in the makefile). The makefile also lack a rule to
> detect strings translated differently from one PO to the other.
 >
> The Makefile has rules like all-pots, all-update-po, all-translate
> 
> update_pots_fr, translate_fr, update_po_fr
> or even update_pots_fr_5.8.8, translate_fr_5.8.8 and update_po_fr_5.8.8
> 
> It can also show statistics: all-stats, stats_fr and stats_fr_5.8.8
> 
> The versions and languages are auto detected.
> 
> I will commit this proposal if we agree on the hierarchy it creates in the
> 'translations' directory.

I can't wait to try it. As far as I can see on your webserver the 
directory structure corresponds with that on the SVN server. Only 
difference is the extra directory 'other' for 'unsupported' versions, or 
versions that might have to be migrated to the project.

>> Paul Gaborit, aka 'gaborit':

[...]

> In addition to helping in the infrastructure, I will also happily
> participate in the translation and review process of the French
> translation.

Yay! So the project *is* moving.

> I'm stopping here my po4a advertisement.

:o)

Joergen

Re: [perldoc2-developers] Meet the team

[Nicolas <nek...@gm...>]

On Sat, Nov 18, 2006 at 01:12:08AM +0100, Joergen W. Lang wrote:
> 
> Otherwise it would be great to have those french pot files in the 
> repository to play with. If something changes just commit the new 
> version. After all, that's what SVN is for. :o)

I committed the French POs for perldoc 5.6.2 and 5.8.8 and the Makefile to
play with them.

The top of Makefile explains some of the rules.

I noticed that you committed some 5.9.2 directories instead of 5.9.4. Is
there a reason, or is it just a typo?

If you want to play with the Makefile, you can for example change the
translation of "NAME" in one PO, then run "make merge_fr" and see how this
change is propagated to other POs.
You can also generate the translations with "make translate_fr".

Kind Regards,
-- 
Nekral

Re: [perldoc2-developers] Meet the team

[Joergen W. L. <joe...@gm...>]

Hi Nicolas and all the others,

thanks for committing the french POs and the Makefile. I hope to find 
some time to have closer look during the next few days.

5.9.2 directories: This is obviously a mistake on my side. I will change 
that - well - actually - now.

Joergen

Nicolas François schrieb:
> On Sat, Nov 18, 2006 at 01:12:08AM +0100, Joergen W. Lang wrote:
>> Otherwise it would be great to have those french pot files in the 
>> repository to play with. If something changes just commit the new 
>> version. After all, that's what SVN is for. :o)
> 
> I committed the French POs for perldoc 5.6.2 and 5.8.8 and the Makefile to
> play with them.
> 
> The top of Makefile explains some of the rules.
> 
> I noticed that you committed some 5.9.2 directories instead of 5.9.4. Is
> there a reason, or is it just a typo?
> 
> If you want to play with the Makefile, you can for example change the
> translation of "NAME" in one PO, then run "make merge_fr" and see how this
> change is propagated to other POs.
> You can also generate the translations with "make translate_fr".
> 
> Kind Regards,