perl-win32-gui-users

RE: [perl-win32-gui-users] msk.pl

[Ami Bar-Y. <am...@uf...>]

I'd imagine Aldo Calpini is the one that set up the project.  Source Forge
lists 10 people working in the project.  Aldo Calpini and Joe Stewart are
listed as project administrators.

I think 10 people having their hand in the oven is enough for a project this
size, but that's just my opinion.

I don't know how much time I'll be able to put in this.  I want to play with
it, but I've got a to-do list at work that's years long.  Attachments in the
mail list is as good for me as CVS access.  Either way, whatever I do with
this package I will gladly share here.


Thanks,
--
Ami Bar-Yadin (am...@uf...)


> -----Original Message-----
> From: per...@li...
> [mailto:per...@li...]On Behalf Of
> Mark Wilkinson
> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2001 8:42 PM
> Cc: List-Perl-Win32gui-users (E-mail)
> Subject: Re: [perl-win32-gui-users] msk.pl
>
>
> this is wonderful!
>
> Y'know... given that Win32::GUI is on Source-forge, these
> kinds of bug-fixes
> and upgrades really should be committed directly into the
> distributed code,
> rather than (or as well as) sent out to the group.  I see a
> lot of interesting
> ideas and bits and pieces of documentation etc. flow through
> this mailing
> list, but the code itself remains broken and/or badly
> documented in parts (eg.
> Menu's).  Is there anyone on the list whose responsibility it is to
> incorporate these snippets into the source code? Is there
> anyone out there
> with cvs write access?...Is there anyone out there who can
> give *me* cvs write
> access??  I would be willing to take up some of the slack
> myself if I had
> write access to the source.
>
> Mark
>
>
> Ami Bar-Yadin wrote:
>
> > I just joined the list, and a search of the archive does
> not show any
> > messages about the msk.pl program in the samples folder.
> >
> > As my first project to get familiar with Win32::GUI I
> finished msk.pl,
> > implementing the functionality it seemed to be aiming at.
> I thought I'll
> > share it with the group.  I also extended it a little, and
> I include a
> > slightly modified test.msk.  I use "usage.pl" to process
> command line
> > options, and I've included my copy of it.
> >
> > I think the original msk.pl and my version of it are just
> the beginning.
> > I'm going to take a look and see if I can read Visual Basic
> 6 form files
> > (.frm) and create Win32::GUI forms from them.  Leaving any
> VB code out, of
> > course.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > --
> > Ami Bar-Yadin (am...@uf...)
> >
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------
> >                Name: usage.pl
> >    usage.pl    Type: Perl Program (application/x-perl)
> >            Encoding: base64
> >
> >              Name: msk.pl
> >    msk.pl    Type: Perl Program (application/x-perl)
> >          Encoding: base64
> >
> >                Name: test.msk
> >    test.msk    Type: unspecified type (application/octet-stream)
> >            Encoding: 7bit
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Perl-Win32-GUI-Users mailing list
> Per...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/perl-win32-gui-users

RE: [perl-win32-gui-users] msk.pl

[Ami Bar-Y. <am...@uf...>]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Aldo Calpini [mailto:da...@pe...]
> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2001 5:44 AM
> To: Ami Bar-Yadin
> Cc: List-Perl-Win32gui-users (E-mail)
> Subject: Re: [perl-win32-gui-users] msk.pl
...
> I already made a tentative at this, look at frm2pl.pl in the samples
> directory.
...


I haven't noticed it.  I looked at it right now, and I think I see where
you're going with this.  I was thinking in a different direction.

I'm not sure why we'd want a frm2pl.pl long term.  It would be better if a
program could read the source frm file each time, allowing further changes
to the form to be done in VB IDE.

Msk.pl maybe could read input in several different formats: msk, frm, etc.
I'd probably want to rename it and rethink how it's used.  Making it into a
class module, with sub classes for the different input formats is one way to
go.  Most of msk.pl would move to this module.  Msk.pl, looking much
simpler, would become one kind of use of this module, and frm2pl.pl would be
another kind of use.  Another use would be for a program to use the module
to build it's dialog.  This probably should tie in with any GUI form
designers for Win32::GUI.  I haven't had a chance to look at them yet.


(As you can probably tell, I'm using Outlook.  I want to move these messages
over to Agent at home...I'm still hashing out how I want to do it.  Then my
replies will look like newsgroup messages ought to look like.  Please
forgive and bear with me.  I haven't participated in a group for quite a
while :-)


Thanks,
--
Ami Bar-Yadin (am...@uf...)

Re: [perl-win32-gui-users] msk.pl

[Mark W. <ma...@il...>]

Ami Bar-Yadin wrote:

> I think 10 people having their hand in the oven is enough for a project this
> size, but that's just my opinion.

well...  the evidence suggests otherwise.  If that were the case, then the
documentation would already be up-to-date.  However, since I have been on this
list I have seen two discussions go through about (my pet peeve) Menu widgets.
Several members of the list have posted their ideas, and working code...
(twice)... and yet the documentation in the CVS repository remains blank on the
subject.... which only means that the next person to install Win32::GUI is going
to wonder how to use the Menu widget and will post yet again to the group asking
us.

I guess I have been pampered by being a part of the BioPerl developers
community, which is extremely active and there is no "territoriality" beyond
good manners.  But I still think it is sad that there are, as you point out, 10
developers, but there has been no CVS activity in 7 months!  If the developers
are not active then it doesn't matter how many there are - the project has
stagnated :-(

If any of the developers are on the list - I am offering to help :-)  :-)
(at least w.r.t. improving the documentation...)

Mark

[perl-win32-gui-users] Improving the documentation (Was: [perl-win32-gui-users] msk.pl)

[Johan L. <jo...@ba...>]

Mark wrote:
>If any of the developers are on the list - I am offering to help :-)  :-)
>(at least w.r.t. improving the documentation...)

I know for a fact that Aldo would appreciate that a lot. Send him an email.


/J

------ ---- --- -- -- -- -  -   -    -        -
Johan Lindström                    Boss Casinos
Sourcerer                     jo...@ba...
                  http://www.bahnhof.se/~johanl/
If the only tool you have is a hammer,
everything tends to look
like a nail 

RE: [perl-win32-gui-users] msk.pl

[Ami Bar-Y. <am...@uf...>]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: per...@li...
> [mailto:per...@li...]On Behalf Of
> Mark Wilkinson
> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 8:09 AM
> To: Ami Bar-Yadin
> Cc: 'List-Perl-Win32gui-users (E-mail)'
> Subject: Re: [perl-win32-gui-users] msk.pl
> 
> 
> Ami Bar-Yadin wrote:
> 
> > I think 10 people having their hand in the oven is enough 
> > for a project this size, but that's just my opinion.
...
> But I still think it is sad that there are, as you point out, 10
> developers, but there has been no CVS activity in 7 months!  


That's not good.  That's down right sad.

Well, then we need a change.

Aldo, why did you put this project on Source Forge?


Thanks,
--
Ami Bar-Yadin (am...@uf...)

[perl-win32-gui-users] Re: Documentation (unpleasentries)

[Mark W. <ma...@il...>]

> If you would like to write a section for the HOW-TO for menus, that would be
> great!

It seems to me that it is more sensible to put documentation where it belongs - in
the documentation - rather than dispersing the fundamental knowledge around
various tutorials.  The existing HTML documentation, which purport to be created
from what used to be POD documentation,  is full of "TBA" references to objects,
methods, etc.  Yet it is clear that the objects and methods are now fairly well
defined, so... why??

( ... and don't get me started on the issue of moving POD documentation out of the
code itself - which is just begging for trouble in my opinion ;-)  )

I was unable to find your 'how-to' in any of the documentation I have (what is the
filename?).  Is it part of the CVS repository?  I'd like to have a look at it...

I guess my "complaint" (and it seems to be coming across as much more unpleasant
than I actually intended it to) is that there is documentation up the ying-yang!
Enough to sink a battleship!  But the *main* documentation, which IMO should be in
POD form (and better yet, in the code itself) is still not up to date relative to
all of the other available support materials.  So in order to learn how to use
some of the modules you have to search through pages and pages of tutorials and
other tangental documents, sometimes even source code, to achieve the inherently
simple goal of making a widget appear on the screen.

Again, I want to stress that this is **NOT** a criticism of anyone!  Like many of
you, I am a professional Perl coder, and I know how busy I get and how hard it is
to find time to work on my favorite projects... but that is, supposedly, why
Win32::GUI is on SourceForge - because the authors realized how valuable the code
was going to be, and very kindly decided to release it to the O.S. community so
that it would never become deprecated, even if they got too busy to support it
themselves.  But what has happened is that we now have an enormous amount of
"support" in the community, without the original project files themselves ever
being completed (at least w.r.t. documentation).

Feel free to flame me if I am getting on anyones nerves.  I don't mean to - I am
only offering a pair of hands and some free time to help, having just experienced
over the past couple of months what it is like to be a newcomer to the Win32::GUI
community...  I hope my comments are taken in the right light!

Best wishes!

M