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Re: [Pcbsd-developer] bootloader

From: Andrei K. <an...@bs...> - 2006-07-28 20:34:06

On Friday 28 July 2006 12:11 pm, Charles A. Landemaine wrote:
> On 7/28/06, pcb...@li...
>
> <pcb...@li...> wrote:
> > Anyways, the FreeBSD bootloader is very good at what it does, however
> > it lacks a little feature which end users love, namely eye candy...
>
> That's fine. If some one can figure out how to add a background image
> and to boot linux partitions, let's stick to the FreeBSD bootloader :)

The current FreeBSD bootmanager is called 'boot0'. It has replaced booteasy 
(which was indeed used in the past).

The FreeBSD boot manager can be installed during the installation to allow you 
to boot multiple operating systems. After the install, the boot manager can 
be configured with the boot0cfg program.

boot0cfg is command-line driven. Fortunately, you probably do not need to be 
concerned with most of the options. There are a couple of options that you 
might be interested in, though.

boot0cfg -B will install the boot manager onto the hard disk's MBR. This is 
one way to restore the boot manager if Windows should wipe it out. Of course, 
you would have to boot from a FreeBSD boot disk to use this if the boot 
manager had been wiped out. In addition, if you wish to make changes to the 
boot manager configuration, you will need to reinstall it using this command, 
followed by the changes you wish to make.

-v	
boot0cfg will be more verbose about what it is doing.

-b image	
Where image is the name of the boot image to use. The default is /boot/boot0.

-d drive	
Where drive is the drive number used by the PC's BIOS for referencing the 
disk. Usually this is 0x80 for the first drive, 0x81 for the second, and so 
on.

-f file	
Where file is the name of a file that the original MBR should be backed up to 
in case there are problems. If the file already exists, it will be truncated.

The -o option is also supported and it contains a comma-separated list of 
options.

packet	
If the PC's BIOS supports it, this will tell boot0cfg to use int 0x13 
extensions instead of CHS for disk IO. This will get around the 1024 cylinder 
boot limit described previously. However, if the PC's BIOS does not support 
this option, it may cause the system to hang on the next reboot.

noupdate	
By default, the boot manager can write to the MBR and update it (to set the 
active flag, etc). This can cause problems if you have hardware antivirus 
support enabled that prevents writing to the MBR and such. The noupdate 
option will prevent the boot manager from attempting to write to the MBR.

boot0cfg also supports the -s n option, where n is a number from 1 to 5 that 
specifies the default slice (commonly referred to as partitions in 
MS-DOS/Windows) to boot if no selection is made. The -t n option is also 
supported, where n is a number representing the number of "ticks" to wait 
before booting the default operating system. There are approximately 18.2 
ticks in a second.

Here is patch for replacing DOS boot name with Windows...
http://docs.freebsd.org/cgi/getmsg.cgi?fetch=1506483+0+archive/2005/freebsd-questions/20050612.freebsd-questions

Re: [Pcbsd-developer] PCBSD-Developer Digest, Vol 2, Issue 12

From: Charles A. L. <lan...@gm...> - 2006-07-28 19:11:48

On 7/28/06, pcb...@li...
<pcb...@li...> wrote:
> Anyways, the FreeBSD bootloader is very good at what it does, however
> it lacks a little feature which end users love, namely eye candy...

That's fine. If some one can figure out how to add a background image
and to boot linux partitions, let's stick to the FreeBSD bootloader :)

-- 
Charles A. Landemaine.

[Pcbsd-developer] ufs_dirhash problem possible solution

From: Andrei K. <an...@bs...> - 2006-07-28 18:08:33

Please test this solution for these bugs:
http://bugs.pcbsd.org/bug.php?op=show&bugid=96
http://bugs.pcbsd.org/bug.php?op=show&bugid=85&pos=15

# sysctl -a | grep dirhash
  UFS dirhash   291    54K       -      489  16,32,64,128,256,512
vfs.ufs.dirhash_docheck: 0
vfs.ufs.dirhash_mem: 421372
vfs.ufs.dirhash_maxmem: 2097152
vfs.ufs.dirhash_minsize: 2560

# sysctl vfs.ufs.dirhash_docheck=1
vfs.ufs.dirhash_docheck: 0 -> 1

Should solve dirhash problem.

Andrei

Re: [Pcbsd-developer] Grub

From: Federico L. <flo...@gm...> - 2006-07-28 15:50:48

On Saturday 29 July 2006 00:23, Andrei Kolu wrote:
> On Friday 28 July 2006 4:41 am, Mario =C4=90ani=C4=87 wrote:
> > On 7/28/06, Charles A. Landemaine <lan...@gm...> wrote:
> > > One more reason to drop the default FreeBSD bootloader, it doesn't
> > > load Linux on a number of PCs, while Grub does...
> >
> > Shall we go for grub2? :)
> >
> > Kind regards,
> > Mario
>
> Lack of knowledge how to run FreeBSD boot manager aka Boot Easy is no
> reason to drop it and use Grub instead.
>
> The FreeBSD boot process can read the kernel to load from virtually
> everywhere, no matter where the bootloader was started from. I.e. the
> bootloader can be on a floppy and still load a kernel from a harddisk. And
> it doesn't have to be told which kernels it should prepare for, it can re=
ad
> the filesystem by itself.
>
> Other OSes either narrow down your possible choices which kernel to load =
or
> they force you to prepare your bootloader for the target kernels. This is
> an obvious problem if you already shut down the system and forgot to tell
> the bootloader about the new kernel location. FreeBSD's bootloader can
> search for itself.
>
> FreeBSD boot manager is is using Forth based scripting language Ficl and =
is
> object-oriented.
>
> I prefer KISS (Keep It Stupid Simple) way of computing.
Haha!! I hope that was a typo!

Anyways, the FreeBSD bootloader is very good at what it does, however
it lacks a little feature which end users love, namely eye candy...

Cheers

Re: [Pcbsd-developer] Grub

From: Andrei K. <an...@bs...> - 2006-07-28 12:23:06

On Friday 28 July 2006 4:41 am, Mario =C4=90ani=C4=87 wrote:
> On 7/28/06, Charles A. Landemaine <lan...@gm...> wrote:
> > One more reason to drop the default FreeBSD bootloader, it doesn't
> > load Linux on a number of PCs, while Grub does...
>
> Shall we go for grub2? :)
>
> Kind regards,
> Mario
>
Lack of knowledge how to run FreeBSD boot manager aka Boot Easy is no reaso=
n=20
to drop it and use Grub instead.

The FreeBSD boot process can read the kernel to load from virtually=20
everywhere, no matter where the bootloader was started from. I.e. the=20
bootloader can be on a floppy and still load a kernel from a harddisk. And =
it=20
doesn't have to be told which kernels it should prepare for, it can read th=
e=20
filesystem by itself.=20

Other OSes either narrow down your possible choices which kernel to load or=
=20
they force you to prepare your bootloader for the target kernels. This is a=
n=20
obvious problem if you already shut down the system and forgot to tell the=
=20
bootloader about the new kernel location. FreeBSD's bootloader can search f=
or=20
itself.

=46reeBSD boot manager is is using Forth based scripting language Ficl and =
is=20
object-oriented.

I prefer KISS (Keep It Stupid Simple) way of computing.

Andrei

Re: [Pcbsd-developer] Grub

From: <mar...@gm...> - 2006-07-28 11:41:22

On 7/28/06, Charles A. Landemaine <lan...@gm...> wrote:
>
> One more reason to drop the default FreeBSD bootloader, it doesn't
> load Linux on a number of PCs, while Grub does...


Shall we go for grub2? :)

Kind regards,
Mario

--
> Charles A. Landemaine.
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
> Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share
> your
> opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash
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> _______________________________________________
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> PCB...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/pcbsd-developer
>

[Pcbsd-developer] Grub

From: Charles A. L. <lan...@gm...> - 2006-07-28 11:35:30

One more reason to drop the default FreeBSD bootloader, it doesn't
load Linux on a number of PCs, while Grub does...

-- 
Charles A. Landemaine.

[Pcbsd-developer] Comments on the system installer

From: Charles A. L. <lan...@gm...> - 2006-07-27 15:28:07

Luis Alberto, the Brazilian translator installed 1.2 recently and sent
me a few suggestions that we could have a look at for our new system
installer:

1. He liked the black splash screen with "PC-BSD" at the center of the screen.

2. Right after the splash screen, there is a blue-yellow-red-and-grey
sysinstall-like text-based screen that show a few options before
launching the installer(start graphical install; reset X to default
vesa driver; etc...). He suggested we keep the same look and feel as
the rest of the installer for more consistency. He found this option
screen a little primitive from a visual standpoint.

3. The screen where you select languages has a different look and feel
as the rest of the installer.

4. Where you select the HDD to install PC-BSD, if you select
"Customize DiskLabel", you can't go back if you change your mind. If
you don't want to customize DiskLabel anymore, the only way is
rebooting the computer.

5. Where you have to type your password, the sentence that says
passwords don't match is not visible enough and too far away from
where the user's eyes are focused.

6. After installation is done, the best thing would be to eject the
CD-ROM automatically instead of having to manually press the button of
the CD-ROM drive.

7. When you choose to install the additional languages, the buttons of
the wizard aren't translated, while the rest of the wizard is in
Brazilian Portuguese.

8. When you load KDE, there is the KDE splash screen that seems to be
the only piece of KDE that wasn't branded to PC-BSD, we might think
about branding it too. He suggested just keeping the loading icons and
text. I think a nice PC-BSD splash screen for KDE would be nice :)

9. Last, but not least, he suggested that the user could choose his
native language in the very beginning of the installation process like
on SuSE and Ubuntu.

-- 
Charles A. Landemaine.

Re: [Pcbsd-developer] PCBSD-Developer Digest, Vol 2, Issue 10

From: Andrei K. <an...@bs...> - 2006-07-27 11:50:34

On Wednesday 26 July 2006 3:58 pm, Charles A. Landemaine wrote:
> On 7/26/06, pcb...@li...
> <pcbsd-developer-> >System Installer - Prompt for settings before
> install
>
> > I'd like to have a choice in beginning of installation with radio
> > buttons:
> >
> > "How you want to set up users and all other settings for this computer:"
> > 1. Right now, right here.
> > 2. After system is installed- in the end on installation. (partitions
> > must be configured first anyway )
> > 3. After system is installed and rebooted up successfully. (partitions
> > must be configured first anyway)
> > 4. Set "handsfree installation" config from networked server, USB or
> > floppy disk (set up from XML file data: disk(s), user(s), language(s),
> > keyboard(s) and auto-installed PBIs).
>
> I think this is pointless. Whether the person types her information
> before, during or after installation doesn't matter, she will have the
> same effort. Now, joining all install steps together is important.
>
OK. Leave choice nr 2 out. I have my reasons to change set up order sometim=
es-=20
for example I install system, but there is no user for couple of minutes an=
d=20
then he/she can type username and password later. For "handsfree install"=20
this is obvious. If I know that this particular computer is compatible with=
=20
PC-BSD then I can type all setup information in the beginning, but if=20
something goes wrong in the middle of installations and I have to type all=
=20
this info again...

> > >System Installer - Set Timezone for system
> >
> > Set multiple keyboards for KDE, multiple languages and timezone.
>
> Multiple timezone? You can be only at one place at a time :) (unless
> you have a Doppelg=E4nger http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doppelganger )
>
Where did you read about multiple timezones? I said "... and timezone."

> > Xorg detects refresh rate automatically but manual intervention is good
> > to have.
>
> Yes it does, but it's wrong most of the time (X monitor config is
> always wrong in my case anyway).
>
Did you test my script? It works 100% of the times with my installations-=20
tested on 5 different computers so far. I haven't changed refresh rate this=
=20
year even once and Xorg detects maximum value automatically, unless you got=
=20
some ancient monitor that is crying for dumpster anyway...

> > >System Installer - Detect Laptop / Desktop (For setting Numlock)
> >
> > Detection is not necessary, user can decide itself if this particular
> > machine is desktop computer or notebook/laptop.
>
> Laptop detection is not necessary but it's a big plus. One more thing
> the user doesn't need to do to customize his computer.
>
We need just one radio button to activate numlock in control panel.

> > >System Installer - Use GRUB for bootloader?
> >
> > GRUB is too cryptic for casual user and FreeBSD bootloader is working
> > just fine- never had any problems at all.
>
> Grub can be set up automatically without any user intervention like
> Ubuntu does beautifully. A number of users have been dissapointed by
> the default FreeBSD bootloader since last year. In a nutshell, they
> say it's counter-intuitive, not customizable, and when you have to
> load PC-BSD that is on a 2nd hard-drive, instead of loading PC-BSD,
> the bootloader reboots the computer when you hit the "Drive 1" boot
> option.
>
I am very happy with FreeBSD boot loader and just hate GRUB bloat. FreeBSD=
=20
bootloader is VERY customizable if someone dare to look at scripts. And=20
booting up from second hard drive problem is PC-BSD installer bug not=20
bootloader one.

> > >System Installer - Display time elapsed for install and info screens.
> >
> > Display cpu, memory, disk usage like with "systat -vm" command.
>
> No bloat please :P
This is not a bloat, this is option to look at FreeBSD at first glance and =
see=20
how it works. I am always wondered how fast installer copying files to hard=
=20
drive and how much it use processor. This feature is must when something go=
es=20
awry.

>
> > And now my additional requests:
> > 1) Set multiple partitions for PC-BSD by default
> > like: /boot/, /etc/, /usr/, /home/. "/boot/" and "/rescue/" partitions
> > should be read-only and mounted r/w only when needed.
>
> There are advantages and drawbacks to this. I personnally don't want
> that on my system, it's a terrible waste of HDD space, and it's
> frustrating when you see you have 5GB left on /var and just 50MB free
> on /usr
Again, did you read what I said- there is no "/var" space in my post. "/boo=
t"=20
partition is 25+MB and common users don't have to touch it 99,9% of the tim=
es=20
and if something goes fubar it boots up in rescue mode at least.

Re: [Pcbsd-developer] PCBSD-Developer Digest, Vol 2, Issue 10

From: Charles A. L. <lan...@gm...> - 2006-07-26 22:58:41

On 7/26/06, pcb...@li...
<pcbsd-developer-> >System Installer - Prompt for settings before
install
> I'd like to have a choice in beginning of installation with radio buttons=
:
>
> "How you want to set up users and all other settings for this computer:"
> 1. Right now, right here.
> 2. After system is installed- in the end on installation. (partitions mus=
t be
> configured first anyway )
> 3. After system is installed and rebooted up successfully. (partitions mu=
st be
> configured first anyway)
> 4. Set "handsfree installation" config from networked server, USB or flop=
py
> disk (set up from XML file data: disk(s), user(s), language(s), keyboard(=
s)
> and auto-installed PBIs).

I think this is pointless. Whether the person types her information
before, during or after installation doesn't matter, she will have the
same effort. Now, joining all install steps together is important.

> >System Installer - Set Timezone for system
> Set multiple keyboards for KDE, multiple languages and timezone.

Multiple timezone? You can be only at one place at a time :) (unless
you have a Doppelg=E4nger http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doppelganger )

> Xorg detects refresh rate automatically but manual intervention is good t=
o
> have.

Yes it does, but it's wrong most of the time (X monitor config is
always wrong in my case anyway).

> >System Installer - Detect Laptop / Desktop (For setting Numlock)
> Detection is not necessary, user can decide itself if this particular mac=
hine
> is desktop computer or notebook/laptop.

Laptop detection is not necessary but it's a big plus. One more thing
the user doesn't need to do to customize his computer.

> >System Installer - Use GRUB for bootloader?
> GRUB is too cryptic for casual user and FreeBSD bootloader is working jus=
t
> fine- never had any problems at all.

Grub can be set up automatically without any user intervention like
Ubuntu does beautifully. A number of users have been dissapointed by
the default FreeBSD bootloader since last year. In a nutshell, they
say it's counter-intuitive, not customizable, and when you have to
load PC-BSD that is on a 2nd hard-drive, instead of loading PC-BSD,
the bootloader reboots the computer when you hit the "Drive 1" boot
option.

> >System Installer - Display time elapsed for install and info screens.
> Display cpu, memory, disk usage like with "systat -vm" command.

No bloat please :P

> And now my additional requests:
> 1) Set multiple partitions for PC-BSD by default
> like: /boot/, /etc/, /usr/, /home/. "/boot/" and "/rescue/" partitions sh=
ould
> be read-only and mounted r/w only when needed.

There are advantages and drawbacks to this. I personnally don't want
that on my system, it's a terrible waste of HDD space, and it's
frustrating when you see you have 5GB left on /var and just 50MB free
on /usr

--=20
Charles A. Landemaine.

Re: [Pcbsd-developer] Propose of enhancements for 1.3 roadmap

From: Mark A. G. <ma...@in...> - 2006-07-26 12:37:28

I think GRUB is very nice for a desktop oriented OS.

I think it should possibly have the option that none of the BSD's 
have(afaik) desktop/server install, and maybe
allow the user to individually choose what additional packages they wish 
to install like fbsd does.

-Mark

Andrei Kolu wrote:
> 1.3 Updates (September 2006) 
>
>   
>> System Installer - Prompt for settings before install
>>     
> I'd like to have a choice in beginning of installation with radio buttons:
>
> "How you want to set up users and all other settings for this computer:"
> 1. Right now, right here.
> 2. After system is installed- in the end on installation. (partitions must be 
> configured first anyway )
> 3. After system is installed and rebooted up successfully. (partitions must be 
> configured first anyway)
> 4. Set "handsfree installation" config from networked server, USB or floppy 
> disk (set up from XML file data: disk(s), user(s), language(s), keyboard(s) 
> and auto-installed PBIs).
>
>   
>> System Installer - Set Timezone for system
>>     
> Set multiple keyboards for KDE, multiple languages and timezone.
>
>   
>> System Installer - Enable Upgrade option
>>     
> Download installer patches over internet or local update server (local patches 
> made by admin).
>
>   
>> System Installer - Graphical Overhaul (Clean up look-n-feel)
>> System Installer - Monitor Refresh Selection
>>     
> Xorg detects refresh rate automatically but manual intervention is good to 
> have. I already made script for detecting and setting up resolution and 
> colour depth. http://forums.pcbsd.org/viewtopic.php?t=4382&highlight=
>
>   
>> System Installer - Detect Laptop / Desktop (For setting Numlock)
>>     
> Detection is not necessary, user can decide itself if this particular machine 
> is desktop computer or notebook/laptop.
>
>   
>> System Installer - Detect SMP Motherboard
>>     
> Then we have to load SMP kernel for installer and look at smp table.
>
>   
>> System Installer - Use GRUB for bootloader?
>>     
> GRUB is too cryptic for casual user and FreeBSD bootloader is working just 
> fine- never had any problems at all. For those who need bazillion operating 
> systems to boot- can use "whatever" bootloader they want.
>
>   
>> System Installer - Allow Sound Setup to be done or skipped.
>>     
> Sound module must be built into kernel already and detection should be done 
> within system initialization not by installer anyway. Support for multiple 
> sound cards for programs like GDAM. (Yes I worked as DJ when I was joung)
>
>   
>> System Installer - Display time elapsed for install and info screens.
>>     
> Display cpu, memory, disk usage like with "systat -vm" command.
>
> And now my additional requests:
> 1) Set multiple partitions for PC-BSD by default 
> like: /boot/, /etc/, /usr/, /home/. "/boot/" and "/rescue/" partitions should 
> be read-only and mounted r/w only when needed. 
> 2) Swap partition should be resizable and calculated by installer based on 
> installed RAM size. If computer got multiple hard drives then possibility to 
> set up multiple SWAP spaces.
> 3) Language files should be available also via Internet download in installer.
>
> Andrei
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
> Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your
> opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys -- and earn cash
> http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge&CID=DEVDEV
> _______________________________________________
> PCBSD-Developer mailing list
> PCB...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/pcbsd-developer
>
>
>
>

[Pcbsd-developer] Propose of enhancements for 1.3 roadmap

From: Andrei K. <an...@bs...> - 2006-07-26 09:43:58

1.3 Updates (September 2006) 

>System Installer - Prompt for settings before install
I'd like to have a choice in beginning of installation with radio buttons:

"How you want to set up users and all other settings for this computer:"
1. Right now, right here.
2. After system is installed- in the end on installation. (partitions must be 
configured first anyway )
3. After system is installed and rebooted up successfully. (partitions must be 
configured first anyway)
4. Set "handsfree installation" config from networked server, USB or floppy 
disk (set up from XML file data: disk(s), user(s), language(s), keyboard(s) 
and auto-installed PBIs).

>System Installer - Set Timezone for system
Set multiple keyboards for KDE, multiple languages and timezone.

>System Installer - Enable Upgrade option
Download installer patches over internet or local update server (local patches 
made by admin).

>System Installer - Graphical Overhaul (Clean up look-n-feel)
>System Installer - Monitor Refresh Selection
Xorg detects refresh rate automatically but manual intervention is good to 
have. I already made script for detecting and setting up resolution and 
colour depth. http://forums.pcbsd.org/viewtopic.php?t=4382&highlight=

>System Installer - Detect Laptop / Desktop (For setting Numlock)
Detection is not necessary, user can decide itself if this particular machine 
is desktop computer or notebook/laptop.

>System Installer - Detect SMP Motherboard
Then we have to load SMP kernel for installer and look at smp table.

>System Installer - Use GRUB for bootloader?
GRUB is too cryptic for casual user and FreeBSD bootloader is working just 
fine- never had any problems at all. For those who need bazillion operating 
systems to boot- can use "whatever" bootloader they want.

>System Installer - Allow Sound Setup to be done or skipped.
Sound module must be built into kernel already and detection should be done 
within system initialization not by installer anyway. Support for multiple 
sound cards for programs like GDAM. (Yes I worked as DJ when I was joung)

>System Installer - Display time elapsed for install and info screens.
Display cpu, memory, disk usage like with "systat -vm" command.

And now my additional requests:
1) Set multiple partitions for PC-BSD by default 
like: /boot/, /etc/, /usr/, /home/. "/boot/" and "/rescue/" partitions should 
be read-only and mounted r/w only when needed. 
2) Swap partition should be resizable and calculated by installer based on 
installed RAM size. If computer got multiple hard drives then possibility to 
set up multiple SWAP spaces.
3) Language files should be available also via Internet download in installer.

Andrei