Thread: [Pas-dev] Progress of Pas ?
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From: Kaare R. <ka...@ka...> - 2002-06-28 09:37:16
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I wonder if this project went to sleep last month? There was a bundle of messages when I entered the mailing list, but I had to focus on my business - the IRS reporting is due July 1 - and since that time there has been no messages from you developers. Are you on vacation? Did you abandon the project? What happened. I ask because I'm still seriously in doubt as to where I will go with my OSS project Freemoney. I've decided that I need to break out of the "everything in the page" style that Interchange, EmbPerl and Mason supports. I know that they probably can use modules, but my understanding is that it's somewhat bolted on. I do believe that Pas has a better strategy, but also that there is a lot of work to be done before it can act as what I want. Menus, security and stuff as I laid out before. What is your advice? I hope to have more time after July 1, but now there's a large pile of work building up while i do the accounting and reporting :-( -- Kaare Rasmussen --Linux, spil,-- Tlf: 3816 2582 Kaki Data tshirts, merchandize Fax: 3816 2501 Howitzvej 75 Åben 14.00-18.00 Web: www.suse.dk 2000 Frederiksberg Lørdag 11.00-17.00 Email: ka...@ka... |
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From: Kaare R. <ka...@ka...> - 2002-06-28 10:09:54
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> Could you tell me, just out of interest, what does Freemoney do?? Freemoney is a financial application with Customer, Product, Order, General Ledger and Accounts Receivables. It is a project I started "for fuN" and because I have a business here. I've personally used it since May 2001 and it is now in a state where I can say that I use it for all my business needs - except Accounts Payables, which I can handle manually. The design and development has been ad hoc and has really been a learning process as to what can be done on the Net - and has been slow due to the lack of time. So I would describe the current status as "prototype finished" - though it's a working prototype (I use it, remember?). The prototype is based on - PostgreSQL as database - Perl as language - Apache as web server - Interchange as embedded language There's nothing wrong with Interchange per se, but I've evaluated the development process and decided that it's a very error prone and non-extensible model to blend database, process and presentation code in one html page. That's why Pas seems to be the best model. I also think that Perl needs a real application server to stand up against Java and Python and the like. -- Kaare Rasmussen --Linux, spil,-- Tlf: 3816 2582 Kaki Data tshirts, merchandize Fax: 3816 2501 Howitzvej 75 Åben 14.00-18.00 Web: www.suse.dk 2000 Frederiksberg Lørdag 11.00-17.00 Email: ka...@ka... |
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From: Kyle R . B. <mo...@vo...> - 2002-06-28 14:40:44
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> > Could you tell me, just out of interest, what does Freemoney do??
>
> Freemoney is a financial application with Customer, Product, Order, General
> Ledger and Accounts Receivables.
> It is a project I started "for fuN" and because I have a business here. I've
> personally used it since May 2001 and it is now in a state where I can say
> that I use it for all my business needs - except Accounts Payables, which I
> can handle manually.
> The design and development has been ad hoc and has really been a learning
> process as to what can be done on the Net - and has been slow due to the
> lack of time.
> So I would describe the current status as "prototype finished" - though it's
> a working prototype (I use it, remember?).
>
> The prototype is based on
> - PostgreSQL as database
> - Perl as language
> - Apache as web server
> - Interchange as embedded language
>
> There's nothing wrong with Interchange per se, but I've evaluated the
> development process and decided that it's a very error prone and
> non-extensible model to blend database, process and presentation code in one
> html page.
If we can come up a design for the features you need, perhaps we can start
building them. I'm no accountant, though I have built sites that sell
on the internet.
> That's why Pas seems to be the best model.
Thank you for that statement.
> I also think that Perl needs a
> real application server to stand up against Java and Python and the like.
So do we. Perl certinly has as much (or more) potential as those other
technologies...no one has sat down and designed an enterprise level
application server...at least not beyond integrating the interpreter into
Apache. Application servers need more than just language support in a
web-server.
Thanks,
Kyle
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wisdom and Compassion are inseparable.
-- Christmas Humphreys
mo...@vo... http://www.voicenet.com/~mortis
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From: Kyle R . B. <mo...@vo...> - 2002-06-28 14:28:11
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> I wonder if this project went to sleep last month? There was a bundle of
> messages when I entered the mailing list, but I had to focus on my business
> - the IRS reporting is due July 1 - and since that time there has been no
> messages from you developers.
> Are you on vacation? Did you abandon the project? What happened.
It did go to sleep. Two of the primary developers (Justin Bedard and myself)
both work for the same employer. We've been busy working long hours on a
project for our employer and havn't had the time to dedicate to Pas.
We have used Pas for 2 internal projects at work, and when we are working
on, or maintaining those projects, we often get the opportunity to do some
work on Pas as well. Unfortunatly we haven't been working on those projects
recently.
This project is not abandoned. For our needs, and the needs of the some of
the other users that we're aware of, Pas is already stable and useful. At
my employer, the two applications we've used it for have been running and
used successfuly since December of 2001.
> I ask because I'm still seriously in doubt as to where I will go with my OSS
> project Freemoney. I've decided that I need to break out of the "everything
> in the page" style that Interchange, EmbPerl and Mason supports. I know that
> they probably can use modules, but my understanding is that it's somewhat
> bolted on.
>
> I do believe that Pas has a better strategy, but also that there is a lot of
> work to be done before it can act as what I want. Menus, security and stuff
> as I laid out before.
Well, Pas, as it is designed, is infrastructre software. In the same vein
as jsps/servelts, it's a tool you can use to build applications on top of.
At at former employer, I had started a project to create an ecommerce framework
on top of Pas, but the project never got much buy-in from the management, so
it floundered.
I would be willing to work with you to build these features on top of Pas,
I think they'd make a great basis for building higher level applications.
I'm sure the other developers would be willing to help as well. I am not
currently using Pas for ecommerce website development, so my needs are
probably different from yours. Our internal applications don't need
accounting, product catalogs, shopping baskets, or other common ecommerce
features. We're using Pas for web-based data entry applications.
> What is your advice?
> I hope to have more time after July 1, but now there's a large pile of work
> building up while i do the accounting and reporting :-(
Well, my advice is to do what's best for your and your application. If
that happens to be going with another technology, then by all means do so.
I would hate to have you decide to go with Pas and have your project fail.
I've done 2 ecommerce websites (one in Perl, and one in Java), which is what
caused me to start Pas to create a framework for the next sites I was going to
have to build. I beleive that the servlet model is a good design for doing
application servers, and I beleive that Perl is a good language/technology
for the type of development that you need to do for web sites.
Based on that, I beleive Pas would work well for an ecommerce site. It
just might take alot of implemented features to get it to the point where
it's useful for you. If you're willing to work with us, and can afford to
spend the time, we will help you build the components you need - especialy
if you're willing to have those components released as opensource (either
as part of Pas, or as part of a project based on Pas).
Another factor you have to consider is that even though we're happy to
help you succeed in your project, the time we dedicate this project is
largely personal. So thinks may not go as fast as you need them to (like
the last month or so).
Thank you for considering Pas. I wish you success, whatever route you
decide to take.
Best regards,
Kyle R. Burton
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wisdom and Compassion are inseparable.
-- Christmas Humphreys
mo...@vo... http://www.voicenet.com/~mortis
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From: Kaare R. <ka...@ka...> - 2002-06-28 19:18:54
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> It did go to sleep. Two of the primary developers (Justin Bedard and > myself) both work for the same employer. We've been busy working long > hours on a project for our employer and havn't had the time to dedicate to > Pas. Tell me about it... > work on Pas as well. Unfortunatly we haven't been working on those > projects recently. The solution: Use Pas for all your projects; include as much code into Pas as possible :-) > currently using Pas for ecommerce website development, so my needs are > probably different from yours. Our internal applications don't need Freemoney is not YAWS (Yet Another Web Shop :-)), as I'm sure you already figured out from my other email. I use Interchange for Web Shopping - and it's really very nice for that. > features. We're using Pas for web-based data entry applications. This is exactly what I need. > Another factor you have to consider is that even though we're happy to > help you succeed in your project, the time we dedicate this project is > largely personal. So thinks may not go as fast as you need them to (like > the last month or so). Freemoney is my personal project. I really don't have the time for it, but hey, it's fun, so I make time for it. I'm in no real hurry. I'm happy with the current state of my project, but I realize that it is not the way to go for what I want. Now is the time to stop and think. If you have the time and energy, we might develop objects that are generic enough to go into Pas - and maybe some that are dedicated to my project. But first, this weekend is for IRS :-( -- Kaare Rasmussen --Linux, spil,-- Tlf: 3816 2582 Kaki Data tshirts, merchandize Fax: 3816 2501 Howitzvej 75 Åben 12.00-18.00 Email: ka...@we... 2000 Frederiksberg Lørdag 11.00-17.00 Web: www.suse.dk |
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