Re: [oll-user] Finally, the revised instructions - please review!

[Joshua N. <jos...@gm...>]

I think the general idea (and correct me if I'm wrong) is to compare
already "perfected" works of art with how other notation editors fair. This
means that replicating a publication quality score is key for comparison.

So, fundamentally, I would disagree with the premise that we should have a
say in line breaking. This also has to do with the fact that there are
about as many books about notation rules and fundamental ideas about
engraving as there are people who engrave, so not one approach to engraving
is superior above the others.

That's why I think we should stick to the finale product and replication of
the version we are copying, because ultimately this isn't a challenge on
which system of engraving and rules we follow are best, but how the
fundamental output a program compares to another.

IC,

Josh


On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 11:14 AM, Urs Liska <ul...@op...> wrote:

>
>
> Phil Holmes <ma...@ph...> schrieb:
> >But my point is that a good engraving program should not need manual
> >breaking.  It should just Do The Right Thing (TM).   So a valid
> >comparison is of the output of the programs with no manual breaking
> >applied.
> >
> >--
> >Phil Holmes
> >
> >
> >  ----- Original Message -----
> >  From: Marc Sabatella
> >  To: Phil Holmes
> >  Cc: Janek Warchoł ; OpenLilyLib User
> >  Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2014 4:44 PM
> >Subject: Re: [oll-user] Finally, the revised instructions - please
> >review!
> >
> >
> >Everyone's workflow is surely different.  For me, getting line breaks
> >the way I want them early in the process is essential, because it has
> >major impact on spacing.  For example, consideriing just the Estrella
> >challenge, until the line breaks are in, I would not know which systems
> >might need extra space between staves, and until I know this, I would
> >not know which markings might need manual positioning, etc.  But I can
> >believe others might prefer differently.  So I don't know that the
> >rules have to say *when* you set the line breaks - just that when it
> >comes to the final comparison, in most cases, it will make for more
> >sensible comparisons if we all do it the same way.  If we don't choose
> >the same line breaks, then we are encountering different issues, making
> >comparison less meaningful.
> >  —
> >  Marc Sabatella
> >
> >
> >
> >On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 3:58 AM, Phil Holmes <ma...@ph...>
> >wrote:
> >
> >
> >    ----- Original Message -----
> >    From: "Janek Warchoł" <lem...@gm...>
> >    To: "OpenLilyLib User" <ope...@li...>
> >    Sent: Saturday, January 25, 2014 11:16 PM
> > Subject: [oll-user] Finally, the revised instructions - please review!
> >
> >
> >    > Hello,
> >
> > > * i have added a rule that the submissions should have the same line
> >> breaking as the original engraving. This is because if the line
> >breaking
> >    > is significantly different, it becomes hard to compare different
> >    > engravings. What do you think?
> >
> >
> >I'm happy with everything except this. I think line-break decisions are
> >an
> >aspect to how good the overall result is, and thus how good the
> >engraving
> >program is. Forcing line breaks could easily distort the overall
> >output.
> >I'd accept that one of the final tweaks might be to adjust margins,
> >staff
> >sizes and forced linebreaks to most closely imitate the original, but
> >it
> >should be a final adjustment, not an early one. Early work should never
> >
> >    involve forced breaks.
> >
> >    --
> >    Phil Holmes
> >
> >
>
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> Line breaking should definitely be fixed _before_ finetuning of the score.
> But I agree that default line breaking is a category to be compared.
>
> I think everybody should definitely have a "saved state" before manual
> line breaking.
> Whether he then proceeds immediately with line breaking or does other
> stuff like proofreading first isn't _that_ essential.
>
> Urs
> --
> Urs Liska
> openlilylib.org
>
>
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