Prices not populated....

Help
2013-02-01
2013-04-06
  • Sherwin Gaddis

    Sherwin Gaddis - 2013-02-01

    Hi

    I was looking for the documentation on how to load the prices to the price table. I am still working on a clean install of 4.1.1(8).
    I am working on a windows 2008 server. I got the ICD10's to load and SNOMED and RxNORM. I ran those under the External Database Import Utility. But I have looked in the price table and there is no data. Where do I find this data?

    Thanks,

    Sherwin

     
  • Mangalesh

    Mangalesh - 2013-02-03

    Sherwin,

    Did you check under the 'Code Types' list? You need to check all the codes that you want to use.

    MJ :)

     
  • Sherwin Gaddis

    Sherwin Gaddis - 2013-02-04

    MJ,

    I have looked there and checked the code to use but there are still not prices connected to the codes. When I pull up the under services the ICD10 diagnosis, under the standard column, there are no values. Is there something else that I should have imported to fill this section of the tables?

    Sherwin

     
  • Mangalesh

    Mangalesh - 2013-02-04

    Sorry Sherwin, don't know much about SNOMED or RxNORM. Do you get standardized prices with these?
    MJ :)

     
  • Sherwin Gaddis

    Sherwin Gaddis - 2013-02-05

    I am sure that there are no prices that come with the drugs.

     
  • Robert Rambo

    Robert Rambo - 2013-02-05

    I wonder if a drug price list could be had from your supplier drug rep etc?

     
  • Sherwin Gaddis

    Sherwin Gaddis - 2013-02-06

    Ok this is getting off track. The question as about the standard pricing for the ICD10.

    Where do I find the Standard Pricing for ICD10 and how is it uploaded to the database?

    Thanks!

     
  • Brady Miller

    Brady Miller - 2013-02-06

    Hi,
    No standard prices are in the ICD10 standard database tables that are imported. If desired, you could set prices for them in Administration->Services.
    -brady
    OpenEMR

     
  • Sherwin Gaddis

    Sherwin Gaddis - 2013-02-21

    Thank Brady,

    Are the ICD10 prices set manually?

    sherwin
    openmedpractice.com

     
  • Brady Miller

    Brady Miller - 2013-02-22

    Hi Sherwin,
    You could set them manually or import them into the codes table (this can be done for any code set; I am a bit confused that you are setting prices for diagnostic does, though; sure you don't mean the ICD10 procedure codes?).
    -brady
    OpenEMR

     
  • Sherwin Gaddis

    Sherwin Gaddis - 2013-02-22

    Brady,

    I am groping in the dark here. Way back in 3.2 it was clear how to import everything to do with the ICD9 and CPT4 codes and import the fees (prices). The documentation told you where the go and get all these files. Now it is not so clear to me. The way codes are imported is much improved from back then. But where I am lost is that there is no clear documentation I can find on prices for the ICD10's. The ICD9's still have the fees that I imported years ago. Yes, no standard prices imported when I setup the ICD10's after the database upgrade.

    Could you post the documentation on importing the ICD10's standard pricing (fees)?

    Thanks

    Sherwin
    openmedpractice.com

     
  • Brady Miller

    Brady Miller - 2013-02-22

    Hi,

    Please point me to the set of official standardized ICD9 fees…
    My billing knowledge is really limited, but can you charge a patient for having a cold or diabetes?

    The current importing mechanism imports the reference ICD9/ICD10 information in separate tables(note this is configurable in Administration->Lists->Code Types->External; for example, setting it to No means it will only look in the codes table as it did in the past; so there is always the option to continue using the codes table as you were; note the CPT4 uses No, so you will import these just like you previously did into the codes table).

    If you are using the ICD9 reference tables (external set to ICD9 diagnosis), here is how a code look up happens:
    1. Searching is done in the reference tables.
    2. The data that is returned from the search also includes matching items in the 'codes' table
    Thus if you search for diabetes in the references tables, then the fee sheet will also collect the matching information in the codes table(such as a fee) for this item, if it exists. This is why you store customization/prices/flags in the codes table even though the lookups are done in the reference tables.

    Just realize this is very configurable from the Administration->Lists->Code types screen and that you can still set it to work like the old way if you desire.

    -brady
    OpenEMR

     
  • CVerk

    CVerk - 2013-02-22

    Pricing is associated with CPT procedure codes.Most plans contract on the basis of the Medicare CMS fee schedules. Commonly, commercial plans are something like 120-130% of the RBRVS medicare fee schedule. This is an area you need to watch closely to make sure your fees at least equal to allowables on EOB's because they tend to discount you elsewhere in the fee schedules and you will not remain financially viable if you do not pay attention to these

    http://www.cms.gov/Medicare/Medicare-Fee-for-Service-Payment/PhysicianFeeSched/index.html?redirect=/physicianfeesched/

    ICD 9 and 10 are diagnosis codes which are used to justify whatever procedure code you are billing for.There is not a fee associated with a diagnosis code. CPT codes are owned by the AMA and data tables of them must be purchased from them.  They do not come with a fee schedule, and the medicare fees are changed frequently at the whim of congress/fiscal cliffs etc.

     
  • Sherwin Gaddis

    Sherwin Gaddis - 2013-02-23

    I am going to have to admit that Brady is talking over my head with some of what he is saying.

    I think cverk got closer to what I want to know. I do know that some of this is understanding the background in which the information is coming from.

    I went to the link that Cverk pointed to and I followed the links to
    http://www.cms.gov/Medicare/Medicare-Fee-for-Service-Payment/PhysicianFeeSched/Downloads/RVU12D.zip

    I looked into this zip file and I found a file named ANES2012.txt and it gave a list of Conversion Factor for Locality. This reminded me  of the load_doc_fees.plx that Rod developed back in 2008.

    I do understand what Brady explained about how the data is collected. I get that. But not to sound like a "duncy head". I was just looking for a simple answer as to do I need to import updated fees like the load_doc_fees.plx once did?

    If I do, where do i find it?

    Thanks for putting up with my questions.

    Regards,
    Sherwin

     
  • CVerk

    CVerk - 2013-02-23

    I suppose if you knew what you were doing you could use the excel file in that zip file PPRRVU12.xlsx and keep the fields for relative value, conversion factor for medicare, and what you desire your fee schedule to be such as 135% of medicare.  Use the spreadsheet to calculate your fees, export as a CVS file and then import to openemr's database.  I would have to defer to those in the know about copyright issues to that as I have not done fees that way. I had manually built up the codes we used from purchased AMA code books in my original Medisoft billing program from which we extracted and entered data into Openemr in that manner. It has then been a process to go through and update fees annually or as supply costs like vaccines increase to keep current.  It says on the file that only the codes and descriptions are copyrighted, so I guess you would just not use those fields, or maybe just purchase a new CPT book, which you should probably have anyway. I believe the AMA sells CPT codes in database format that you could collate to. It is also a trick to pay attention to codes that are for procedures not covered by Medicare and thus not listed in their relative value files such as preventive care exam codes. I have taken the approach that if there is not an adjustment amount for a code on an EOB, I need to look at recalculating the fee for that code, with at least annual review of all codes.

     

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