#104 Valencian translation

closed-rejected
5
2007-06-08
2006-09-14
Bernat
No

Hi.

I've translated nsis to valencian language. Since it
still doesn't have a Microsoft language code, I've used
the code for user-defined language as suggested at the
forum.
Please, add this translation if everything is ok.

Cheers.

Discussion

1 2 > >> (Page 1 of 2)
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2006-09-15

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    A quick look at Wikipedia said Valencian is another name for
    the Catalan language. We already have a Catalan translation
    and it seems quite similar to yours. Is there a difference
    between those two languages or are they really the same
    language under a different name?

    http://nsis.cvs.sourceforge.net/nsis/NSIS/Contrib/Language%20files/Catalan.nlf?view=markup

     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2006-09-15
    • assigned_to: nobody --> kichik
     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2006-09-15
    • summary: Add translation files --> Valencian translation
     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2006-09-15
    • labels: --> Language File
     
  • Bernat

    Bernat - 2006-09-15

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    This translation it's not the same as the catalan, although
    it's similar. I won't go into detail about the confussion
    because it's too much politics.

    We've done an Abiword translation which uses the files I'm
    sending you for the installer. You can check it here if you
    want to:
    http://www.softwarevalencia.com/baixar/abiword-setup-2.4.5.exe

     
  • Bernat

    Bernat - 2006-09-23

    Translation files now correctly synchonized with cvs

     
  • Bernat

    Bernat - 2006-09-23

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    Sorry, I didn't notice the changes on CVS.

    I've synched the files with the CVS and uploaded a new
    attachment. I hope everything is correct now.

     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2006-09-23
    • status: open --> closed-accepted
     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2006-09-23

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    Thanks, added.

     
  • Robert Millan

    Robert Millan - 2007-04-18

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    > A quick look at Wikipedia said Valencian is another name for
    > the Catalan language. We already have a Catalan translation
    > and it seems quite similar to yours. Is there a difference
    > between those two languages or are they really the same
    > language under a different name?

    "Valencian" can either be used as an alternate name for Catalan, or
    as the name of a southern dialect of Catalan.

    The translation you have added to NSIS, however, is not Valencian by
    any of these names. It's a translation following the grammar made
    up by a rogue institution called RACV, that promotes this unofficial
    grammar as part of their political agenda.

    It seems they're already taking advantage of "Valencian" support in
    NSIS to push their pretension in other projects. Would you please
    consider removing it? I don't think dialect translations shouldn't
    have their place in NSIS (we have in fact done such proper translations
    in other projects, like Gaim), but letting radical groups use it to
    promote their political views is IMHO seriously detrimental.

    If you have further questions, please let me know. I'm positive we
    can dispell any missunderstanding surrounding this issue.

    Thanks

     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2007-04-19

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    No. I refuse to get into these translation politics. Unless you can provide clear proof that this translation is pure evil, I will not take a stand.

     
  • Bernat

    Bernat - 2007-04-19

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    I made this translation of NSIS to the language I speak, and I shared it for others to benefit without causing problems to those who don't want to.

    By the way, the Royal Academy of Valencian Culture (RACV) is a respectable entity founded in 1915 and recognized by the Spanish Ministry of Culture.

     
  • Robert Millan

    Robert Millan - 2007-04-20

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    Berarma wrote:
    > I made this translation of NSIS to the language I speak, and I shared it
    > for others to benefit without causing problems to those who don't want to.

    I'm not sure what language you speak, but the language you _write_ is clearly
    not Valencian. Valencian language has an official grammar that is acknowledged
    by all universities in the world, by the Valencian government, by the Spanish
    government and by the Valencian Language Academy (which is the official
    institution in charge for Valencian linguistics).

    As I said before, I don't object to your invented language being present in
    NSIS or anywhere else. Heck, there are even people translating to Klingon
    and I respect them just like I respect you. Just don't call it Valencian
    because that's missleading and almost any Valencian speaker will be puzzled
    when she picks "Valencian" and sees a grammar completely different than
    what she learnt at school. That's all.

    Berarma wrote:
    > By the way, the Royal Academy of Valencian Culture (RACV) is a respectable
    > entity founded in 1915

    Sure, that's fine. But even if they're respectable (we're not going to discuss
    on that, I hope), that doesn't grant them the right to decide that Valencian needs
    a new grammar and start pushing it behind the backs of all the academical world
    and anyone else.

    Berarma wrote:
    > and recognized by the Spanish Ministry of Culture.

    In what sense? Are you impliing that the Ministry of Culture has declared RACV's
    invented grammar as the official one? If you're impliing that, I challenge you
    to provide a credible reference to this. Otherwise, please don't confuse things.

    kichik wrote:
    > No. I refuse to get into these translation politics. Unless you can
    > provide clear proof that this translation is pure evil, I will not take a
    > stand.

    There's nothing wrong with the translation itself. There's a very small minority
    of Valencian speakers who use this grammar as part of their political activism.
    Bernardo seems to be one of them, and I don't think they should be excluded from
    using whatever grammar they like. However, this grammar is *not* Valencian
    grammar. In Valencian land even a 10-year-old kid that just learnt to write can
    tell them appart (although if he hasn't heard about all this RACV stuff he would
    just identify it as a text full of mistakes).

     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2007-04-20

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    Please don't have this discussion here.

     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2007-04-20

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    Please don't have this discussion here.

     
  • Robert Millan

    Robert Millan - 2007-04-24

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    Bernardo,

    After speaking with Amir, we agreed that we could reach a compromise if you
    also accept it. The compromise would be that we have two Valencian translations
    (one following official grammar and yours following RACV grammar), and that
    neither of them gets to be called "Valencian" outright. For example, they
    could be displayed as:

    - "Valencian (southern Catalan)"
    - "Valencian (RACV)"

    Is that suitable for you?

     
  • Bernat

    Bernat - 2007-04-24

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    Robert,
    I can't be in favour of that. I find it confusing and totally unnecessary. It seems that as you couldn't remove my translation now you try adding another one as last resort to displace mine.

    I don't think there's a need for two catalan translations. In fact, most problably, they would be the same (or almost) and the second one would never get updated, as no one really needs it. People who speaks catalan know there's a catalan translation and won't care of "southern catalan". Although, if you're really interested (I doubt it) you could call it just "southern catalan".

    This is my opinion. Please, don't fight it.

     
  • Robert Millan

    Robert Millan - 2007-04-25

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    Hi Bernardo,

    I'm already giving up by accepting that your translation, which is not Valencian (and
    I have substantial evidence to prove that), is referenced in equal terms as official
    Valencian.

    Amir doesn't want us to fight here. If we can reach an agreement, then he doesn't have
    to be bothered about all these arguments. I have sent you my proposal, which I think is
    very generous considering that I can easily proof the translation you submitted doesn't
    pass a dictionary test to determine if it's Valencian or not.

    If you don't like my proposal, you can propose something else. But if your proposal is just
    "go away, my translation is the one true Valencian" then it's impossible that we can agree
    on anything.

     
  • Pere Pérez

    Pere Pérez - 2007-05-03

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    Since this "valencian" translation is totally **cked up, I'm submitting a corrected one, based on Bernardo's one (I haven't retranslated it) but with all the typos corrected.

     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2007-05-03

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    That's it. You have until June to reach an understanding or both Catalan and Valencian are removed.

     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2007-06-08
    • status: closed-accepted --> closed-rejected
     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2007-06-08

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    Both languages are removed as of version 2.28 until you all solve this on your own. NSIS will not be the fighting ground for a political argument.

     
  • Bernat

    Bernat - 2007-06-08

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    I took for granted it was going to stay as it was as I think it's the best agreement that benefits all.

    Valencians nor catalans deserve this punishment because a few negative comments without sense. I think you should reconsider your decission and get back both translations as before. I hope you're all with me.

    Best regards.

     
  • Amir Szekely

    Amir Szekely - 2007-06-08

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    No. Solve this on your own and come back to me with a solution and not with complaints.

     
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