From: Kevin R. K. <ke...@kr...> - 2014-01-18 01:11:29
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In order to enact the plan to use perl tidy to clean up our coding format, I need to know what we all think is the "standard" code format. To that end, the following survey asks 27 questions about various perl tidy options. These are by no means all potential options, but I think it covers the basics. If you have a specific setting that you do not see, feel free to respond to the mailing list: http://kwiksurveys.com/s.asp?sid=4ncamjs0iymia4t267133 I reserve the right to interpret the answers in a meaningful fashion. Some options cannot be used together, and some options used together would just be silly. After this is implemented, we can certainly change individual options if the result is bad. Kevin |
From: George C. <ge...@fe...> - 2014-01-18 02:06:57
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Hi Kevin, I don't do mh development, but I can share what another project I'm on did. We faced a lot of angst during the migration to perltidy, and describe some of the resulting implementation here: http://foswiki.org/Development/CodingStandards#Formatting_Code and http://foswiki.org/Development/PerlTidy But to summarize briefly, we went with mandatory tidy for the core project, and "opt-in" for the user contributed extensions. It's controlled by a "TIDY" file located in the directories. For the project core we went with the default perltidy settings. No-one can override it. Some dev's choose to use alternative settings for their contributed extensions, but those are generally maintained by single developers. The one issue we later discovered is that perltidy is version sensitive, and the defaults change over time. So suddenly after a package upgrade on our svn server, we were all getting rejected commits due to the files failing the tidy check. What made it worse was that different distributions release their versions at different times. Depending upon the distribution packagers, (.deb, .rpm, .ebuild, BSD Port, etc,) it was more or less difficult to get everyone on the same release. One trick with tidy that is rather well hidden but quite handy is a tag that will exclude tidy from blocks of code: http://perltidy.sourceforge.net/perltidy.html#skipping_selected_sections_of_code So if you have a block of carefully crafted code for readability, surround it with #>>> and #<<< comments. We still run on a subversion repository with github shadow which makes the pre/post commit exits pretty easy. Hopefully we will complete the migration to git. It will be interesting to see how you implement git controls on this. We have not yet written the tidy hooks for git, or I'd offer to share. George On 01/17/2014 08:11 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan wrote: > In order to enact the plan to use perl tidy to clean up our coding > format, I need to know what we all think is the "standard" code format. > > To that end, the following survey asks 27 questions about various perl > tidy options. These are by no means all potential options, but I > think it covers the basics. If you have a specific setting that you > do not see, feel free to respond to the mailing list: > > http://kwiksurveys.com/s.asp?sid=4ncamjs0iymia4t267133 > > I reserve the right to interpret the answers in a meaningful fashion. > Some options cannot be used together, and some options used together > would just be silly. > > After this is implemented, we can certainly change individual options > if the result is bad. > > Kevin > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > CenturyLink Cloud: The Leader in Enterprise Cloud Services. > Learn Why More Businesses Are Choosing CenturyLink Cloud For > Critical Workloads, Development Environments & Everything In Between. > Get a Quote or Start a Free Trial Today. > http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=119420431&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk > > > ________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe from this list, go to: http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=1365 > |
From: John <jo...@to...> - 2014-01-18 02:10:44
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On 01/17/14 19:11, Kevin Robert Keegan wrote: > In order to enact the plan to use perl tidy to clean up our coding > format, I need to know what we all think is the "standard" code format. I completed the survey and I went through multiple phases of reaction...starting with "I would go to WAR if *that* style was used" to "oh man...I am not sure what I think anymore" to "the decision as to style needs to be weighted based on how much code the responder contributes". Thanks for putting this out there! John |
From: Kevin R. K. <ke...@kr...> - 2014-01-18 03:01:02
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George, thanks that is very helpful. On Fri, Jan 17, 2014 at 6:06 PM, George Clark <ge...@fe...> wrote: > Hi Kevin, > > I don't do mh development, but I can share what another project I'm on > did. We faced a lot of angst during the migration to perltidy, and > describe some of the resulting implementation here: > http://foswiki.org/Development/CodingStandards#Formatting_Code and > http://foswiki.org/Development/PerlTidy > > But to summarize briefly, we went with mandatory tidy for the core > project, and "opt-in" for the user contributed extensions. It's controlled > by a "TIDY" file located in the directories. For the project core we went > with the default perltidy settings. No-one can override it. Some > dev's choose to use alternative settings for their contributed extensions, > but those are generally maintained by single developers. > > The one issue we later discovered is that perltidy is version sensitive, > and the defaults change over time. So suddenly after a package upgrade on > our svn server, we were all getting rejected commits due to the files > failing the tidy check. What made it worse was that different > distributions release their versions at different times. Depending upon > the distribution packagers, (.deb, .rpm, .ebuild, BSD Port, etc,) it was > more or less difficult to get everyone on the same release. > > One trick with tidy that is rather well hidden but quite handy is a tag > that will exclude tidy from blocks of code: > > http://perltidy.sourceforge.net/perltidy.html#skipping_selected_sections_of_code > So if you have a block of carefully crafted code for readability, > surround it with #>>> and #<<< comments. > > We still run on a subversion repository with github shadow which makes the > pre/post commit exits pretty easy. Hopefully we will complete the > migration to git. It will be interesting to see how you implement git > controls on this. We have not yet written the tidy hooks for git, or I'd > offer to share. > > George > > > On 01/17/2014 08:11 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan wrote: > > In order to enact the plan to use perl tidy to clean up our coding format, > I need to know what we all think is the "standard" code format. > > To that end, the following survey asks 27 questions about various perl > tidy options. These are by no means all potential options, but I think it > covers the basics. If you have a specific setting that you do not see, > feel free to respond to the mailing list: > > http://kwiksurveys.com/s.asp?sid=4ncamjs0iymia4t267133 > > I reserve the right to interpret the answers in a meaningful fashion. > Some options cannot be used together, and some options used together would > just be silly. > > After this is implemented, we can certainly change individual options if > the result is bad. > > Kevin > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > CenturyLink Cloud: The Leader in Enterprise Cloud Services. > Learn Why More Businesses Are Choosing CenturyLink Cloud For > Critical Workloads, Development Environments & Everything In Between. > Get a Quote or Start a Free Trial Today. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=119420431&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk > > > > ________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe from this list, go to: http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=1365 > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > CenturyLink Cloud: The Leader in Enterprise Cloud Services. > Learn Why More Businesses Are Choosing CenturyLink Cloud For > Critical Workloads, Development Environments & Everything In Between. > Get a Quote or Start a Free Trial Today. > > http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=119420431&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk > ________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe from this list, go to: > http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=1365 > > > |
From: Kevin R. K. <ke...@kr...> - 2014-01-24 20:45:24
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So we have 13 responses to the survey. This is a pretty low number, but luckily in most cases it seems we have broad consensus, meaning 8+ votes for a particular style. The answers that have less of a consensus, are mostly what I would deem very nuanced differences, that most people are not likely to have a dominant preference on. I want to hold off on releasing the results, so as not to bias anyone. But I do want to encourage anyone who has any desire to have a voice in this to vote by next Friday. At that point I will post the results for discussion. On Fri, Jan 17, 2014 at 7:00 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan <ke...@kr...>wrote: > > On 01/17/2014 08:11 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan wrote: >> >> http://kwiksurveys.com/s.asp?sid=4ncamjs0iymia4t267133 >> >> |
From: Thomas P. <pai...@gm...> - 2014-01-25 17:56:01
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I just completed the survey now, not that I have really any experience or knowledge on coding. I picked answers that I would like to see the code done as, that may help me learn to code better. I am keen to see a standard code base. One thing I found that while trying to learn to create my own code, is that examples I was following along with, and then suggestions by other users were all wildly different, and I didn't really understand what I was doing or using or implementing, it either just worked by luck, or by chance. On 24 January 2014 15:45, Kevin Robert Keegan <ke...@kr...> wrote: > So we have 13 responses to the survey. This is a pretty low number, but > luckily in most cases it seems we have broad consensus, meaning 8+ votes > for a particular style. The answers that have less of a consensus, are > mostly what I would deem very nuanced differences, that most people are not > likely to have a dominant preference on. > > I want to hold off on releasing the results, so as not to bias anyone. > But I do want to encourage anyone who has any desire to have a voice in > this to vote by next Friday. At that point I will post the results for > discussion. > > > On Fri, Jan 17, 2014 at 7:00 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan <ke...@kr...>wrote: > >> On 01/17/2014 08:11 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan wrote: >>> >>> http://kwiksurveys.com/s.asp?sid=4ncamjs0iymia4t267133 >>> >>> > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > CenturyLink Cloud: The Leader in Enterprise Cloud Services. > Learn Why More Businesses Are Choosing CenturyLink Cloud For > Critical Workloads, Development Environments & Everything In Between. > Get a Quote or Start a Free Trial Today. > > http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=119420431&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk > ________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe from this list, go to: > http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=1365 > > > -- -=/>Thom |
From: Carl F. <fri...@co...> - 2014-01-25 21:36:18
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Thomas, One of the problems with Perl is the infamous "There's more than one way to do it" This has often driven me to distraction, but it is a plus and a minus for the perl language. Perl is not an easy language to learn. Those who are already facile with awk, gawk, or sed, and know regular expressions and Unix command line hackery, do very well. Those of us who are just part-time perlers: it's always a struggle, and you need to constantly refer to books and good code examples. Do you have any perl reference books? I've found all of the O'Reilly books helpful, and Apress has a particularly good one as well, "Pro Perl" by Peter Wainwright. O'Reilly books are completely DRM free; Apress requires a password. For either, you can make as many copies as you want for your own use. I have perhaps 50 digital reference books, which I keep on my iPad, (some) iPhone, and every PC in regular use. They are invaluable. O'Reilly has multiple formats (including for Kindle); can't remember with Apress. Good luck, and with patience and persistence, you will get it. Besides, the folks on this list are remarkable for their patience and willingness to help. It's a great list. Thanks to all. Carl Friedberg www.about.me/carl.friedberg fri...@co... www.comets.com Problems Solved From: Thomas Paine [mailto:pai...@gm...] Sent: Saturday, January 25, 2014 12:56 PM To: Kevin Robert Keegan Cc: The main list for the MisterHouse home automation program Subject: Re: [mh] Perl Tidy Survey - aka "27 Questions About Things You Never Thought About in Coding" I just completed the survey now, not that I have really any experience or knowledge on coding. I picked answers that I would like to see the code done as, that may help me learn to code better. I am keen to see a standard code base. One thing I found that while trying to learn to create my own code, is that examples I was following along with, and then suggestions by other users were all wildly different, and I didn't really understand what I was doing or using or implementing, it either just worked by luck, or by chance. On 24 January 2014 15:45, Kevin Robert Keegan <ke...@kr...<mailto:ke...@kr...>> wrote: So we have 13 responses to the survey. This is a pretty low number, but luckily in most cases it seems we have broad consensus, meaning 8+ votes for a particular style. The answers that have less of a consensus, are mostly what I would deem very nuanced differences, that most people are not likely to have a dominant preference on. I want to hold off on releasing the results, so as not to bias anyone. But I do want to encourage anyone who has any desire to have a voice in this to vote by next Friday. At that point I will post the results for discussion. On Fri, Jan 17, 2014 at 7:00 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan <ke...@kr...<mailto:ke...@kr...>> wrote: On 01/17/2014 08:11 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan wrote: http://kwiksurveys.com/s.asp?sid=4ncamjs0iymia4t267133 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ CenturyLink Cloud: The Leader in Enterprise Cloud Services. Learn Why More Businesses Are Choosing CenturyLink Cloud For Critical Workloads, Development Environments & Everything In Between. Get a Quote or Start a Free Trial Today. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=119420431&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe from this list, go to: http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=1365 -- -=/>Thom |