Re: [Mentalunix-developers] Installer image 0.0.1

[Clinton E. <unk...@un...>]

I think that maybe everyone should CC stuff to mentalunix-
dev...@li.... I have been sending stuff to 
mentalinux-developers :) (hey, only the u and i switched). We need to 
make sure everyone is informed.

> > > hmm, well maybe an outline of the stuff you changed. 
> > I'm
> > > gonna take a look at Lycoris's installer as well
> > (modified
> > > Caldera Lizard).  As for packaging.  Sometime in the
> > near
> > > future, I'm gonna get going and install lfs again, and
> > try
> > > to build a packaging system for it. (it will be at
> > > lprs.sourceforge.net, but site isnt done yet...).  I
> > was
> > > thinking that the package system that I want, is very
> > > similar to apt, but with the additional features and
> > > greatness of Gentoo's emerge.  I need to sit down and
> > go
> > > through all of the ebuild/emerge/portage documentation,
> > as
> > > well as apt.  I'm personally thinking that we need to
> > go
> > > beyond just making tasks, and designing some app that
> > could
> > > be used in addition to dpkg and apt (kinda like
> > dselect,
> > > and that other app(can't remember name) do).
> > 
> > Why reinvent the wheel? We can just use deity for
> > managing packages (if 
> > anyone wants to browse through the package list). It
> > would be interesting to 
> > do new stuff, like allow users to submit the locations of
> > new packages they 
> > want to be packaged. For configuration we have Debconf--I
> > just finished my 
> > Guile Scheme Debconf interface (but it doesn't work
> > because of some wierdness 
> > with Scheme ports and normal I/O..ugh). We can force our
> > config program to 

Just a quick update--yes, it works now. I needed to run (force-output) 
on the port I was outputting to after sending the line to force the 
line to be written (because Scheme ports are buffered). Now it runs 
fine (I think..it ran the demo script that I converted into Scheme 
fine). I'll upload this soon (as soon as I make a package for it).

> > run from postinst or we can modify PGI to do that during
> > the install (I think 
> > that we should work on PGI a bit because it isn't quite
> > as slick as 
> > Mandrake's installer yet). 
> 
> i was thinking about that...  what i want to do isnt really
> make a new package manager, but make a general packaging
> system.  I'm not gonna make another rpm, or deb, its not
> worth it, and there's no point.  Think of something more
> along the lines of an app that will work in conjunction
> with apt, rpm, emerge, whatever and allow you to convert
> packages to your system.  Its gonna take a while, but i
> think its worth it.  i'll write up a white paper, and get
> the site done in the next day or 3, then you can check it
> out, and get a better idea what im thinkin of.

So, a meta-packager like what MPKG ended up being planned to be? Meta 
Packing would be nice. You should look at Debian's alien that can 
convert slack tgz and rpms into debs (and I think the other way 
around). You might want to work on adding more formats and better 
support to alien while working on a better frontend for it (of course, 
is alien -i foo.not_debian_package that hard to install an 
rpm/slack_package on Debian?)

> > As for a new pacakge format -- NO. That is a very bad
> > idea. We already have 
> > RPM, DEB (and soon udeb, the dnew deb format).  I think
> > that letting users 
> > build packages from source if they want is a good idea
> > (and you can do that 
> > now with apt-get -b source --include-deps package_foo). A
> > BSD ports like 
> > system would be good...and here is a good start: 
> > http://debianplanet.org/article.php?sid=271. Debports
> > doesn't build from 
> > source, but it is a tiny perl script so it couldn't be
> > too hard to make it 
> > build from source instead. It would be even better if it
> > let you rebuild the 
> > entire system from source with a simple make all...that
> > should go on the TODO 
> > list (of course a user that wanted to do that should just
> > run buildd because 
> > it is easier [automated]). 
> well, i already kinda responded to this above.  But,
> anyways, i'm not making something new and incompatible, but
> rather something that will work with everything.  i guess
> its kinda like an advanced ports system.

I changed a bit of debports to make it (1) work (it was 
using /var/state/apts/lists which is now /var/lib/apt/lists) and (2) 
build from source. I don't know much perl so I'm just going to upload 
my tiny changes when I upload the 0.0.2 installer disc (more on that 
later...)
 
> > > The next week or so I'm gonna be very busy, but I'll
> > still
> > > try to get some development stuff done.  This weekend
> > I'll
> > > attempt to get some documentation done as well. 
> > Sometime
> > > soon, we are gonna want to officially organize all of
> > this.
> > >  Basically we need to get a daily (or as close to daily
> > as
> > > possible) update on progress.  daily changelog(?). As
> > well
> > > as start assigning tasks to certain people (mainly to
> > help
> > > get stuff done!, but not necessarily saying that one
> > person
> > > is restricted to working on x project...).
> > 
> > I'm rewriting the website right now, so no one touch
> > that. I think I can (I 
> > don't know much php..but it is quite simple and has a
> > nice reference manual) 
> > add a journals page. An itneresting think to do with the
> > journals (developers 
> > daily logs) would be to have all of us check our
> > changelogs into a CVS tree 
> > and have the page read the log entries every day. I think
> > this would work 
> > best if a cron job run every day checked out the file and
> > dumped it as a 
> > plain text file to allow the page to read it...
> > 
> > As for planning: not right now. At least not long term
> > planning. As for the 
> > short term:
> > 
> > 1. Installer images (make them work...I think the
> > gdk-imlib I put on the 
> > installer cd is broken)
> > 2. Tweak kernel
> > 2. buildd system that is rebuilding specific packages
> > (e.g. KDE) from 
> > unstable for woody and imports pre-built packages from
> > other unnoficial 
> > sources
> > 3. Better debports (build from source)
> > 
> > Midterm:
> > 1. Even easier install
> > 2. ?
> > 
> > 
> > And a basic long term set of goals:
> > 1. Full Debian mirror that builds packages using GCC 3.x
> > instead of 2.95 
> > (better code)
> > 2. Optimized Debian builds (i586, i686, athlon)
> > 3. Mentalinux for the PPC and other archs Debian supports
> > 
> > > P.S.  If/when we find a new/better project home, it
> > might
> > > be a good idea to get some project related email
> > address
> > > started.  Also, let me know if you want me to do
> > anything
> > > about some small file hosting (will be accessable via
> > ssh).
> > 
> > I'm looking for a server to host us, but it is difficult
> > because of our hefty 
> > requirements. I think I'll post a sourceforge news item
> > soon (sf.net might 
> > not like it...)
> lol

> looks good.  I just got a new hard drive, so I got lots of
> free room now!!  I'm gonna start messing around with the
> mentalinux stuff, as well as lizard, and auto lfs.  if I
> can get my debian cd's burnt, i can get 2.2r6 running in
> the next day or two too.  or i'll just use mentalinux, and
> do it via web.  

Isn't lizard licensed under the QPL?  Last time I looked at it 
(admittedly over a year ago) it was...and the QPL is evil. Also, skip 
Debian 2.2r6. If you have ATA100 it won't even install...just wait for 
me to upload the _working_ Mentalinux ISO monday or tuesday (I'm 
building it now, but won't be able to upload until monday because of 
bandwidth). The gdk_imlib on the 0.0.1 install is broken, and the one 
that I made last night has a broken python-gnome 8-(. I seem that have 
bad luck with these things (this is what I get for running Debian 
unstable).

So now I guess we should do some general planning (nothing to 
detailed). I just want to compile a basic TODO list (e.g. * write 
second stage installer scripts) and start assigning tasks. I'll work on 
the website this weekend. Also, I know of at least one other person who 
will be testing the 0.0.2 installer image (on a laptop too). I think 
that someone is also going to test it on a desktop.

-- 
unknown_lamer (not at home)