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From: Giuseppe P. <gi...@gm...> - 2012-11-24 22:45:14
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Hi,
On Sat, Nov 24, 2012 at 11:02 PM, Andrej N. Gritsenko <an...@re...>wrote:
>
> I should admit, VALA code is simpler than pure C due to built-in GTK
> classes handling.
>
gtkmm also does this, I know anyway that while easier to write requires more
memory and being a wrapper it is slower than gtk (I confirm this after
writing
several gtk and gtkmm apps for linux embedded boards)
so it is unusable for the LXDE project.
I was overreacted about "cannot be debugged", I'm sorry. VALA doesn't
> generate binary code, it generates C code, like this:
>
> g_return_val_if_fail (_tmp18_ <= _tmp19_, NULL);
> _tmp20_ = start;
> _tmp21_ = end;
> _tmp22_ = start;
> _tmp23_ = g_strndup (((gchar*) self) + _tmp20_, (gsize) (_tmp21_ -
> _tmp22_));
> result = _tmp23_;
>
well, this is more similar to assembly than C :)
Cheers,
Giuseppe.
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From: Andrej N. G. <an...@re...> - 2012-11-24 22:54:58
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Hello!
You have written on Saturday, 24 November, at 14:01:
>On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 02:46:26AM +0800, PCMan wrote:
>> Here are some news about lxpanel2.
>Cool. I need my usual automake-1.12 patch for autogen.sh. Should I make
>one?
>I think almost all LXDE packages are affected. So my question: Do we
>really need that version check in autogen.sh? Is there a better solution
>like using "autoreconf -i"?
I believe that running
intltoolize -cf && autoreconf -if && rm -rf autom4te.cache
is pretty much enough. For packages that use gtk-doc (libfm and
menu-cache) it will require
gtkdocize --copy && intltoolize -cf && autoreconf -if && rm -rf autom4te.cache
WBR, Andriy.
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From: Henry G. <hsg...@gm...> - 2012-11-25 00:34:43
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On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 12:54:41AM +0200, Andrej N. Gritsenko wrote:
> You have written on Saturday, 24 November, at 14:01:
> >On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 02:46:26AM +0800, PCMan wrote:
> >> Here are some news about lxpanel2.
>
> >Cool. I need my usual automake-1.12 patch for autogen.sh. Should I make
> >one?
>
> >I think almost all LXDE packages are affected. So my question: Do we
> >really need that version check in autogen.sh? Is there a better solution
> >like using "autoreconf -i"?
>
> I believe that running
>
> intltoolize -cf && autoreconf -if && rm -rf autom4te.cache
Yes! Except I get an error:
intltoolize: unrecognized option '-cf'
This works for me:
intltoolize -c -f && autoreconf -if && rm -rf autom4te.cache
Can we put this into autogen.sh instead of the current script?
>
> is pretty much enough. For packages that use gtk-doc (libfm and
> menu-cache) it will require
>
> gtkdocize --copy && intltoolize -cf && autoreconf -if && rm -rf autom4te.cache
s/-cf/-c -f/
Thanks,
Henry
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From: PCMan <pcm...@gm...> - 2012-11-25 04:21:34
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Well, people complaining about vala here missed some points. 1. This brings no additional dependency as it generated plain C code. 2. It's very easy to link C code and Vala code together. 3. You can call Vala code from plain C and call C from Vala directly. 4. Of course applets/plugins can completely be written in plain C. So existing code does not need to be ported to Vala at all. Porting will be easy. 5. The performance of Vala code is almost the same as C code. It only added some safety checks to prevent crashes, which are good. 6. Using new versions of vala causes no problems at all. The tarball generated by Automake actually ships the generated C code along with vala code. That means, you only need a C compiler when building from the tarball. Given the above reasons, language choice is not an issue and plain C language can be used together. So contributors who only want to use C can continue using it. The only valid point is debugging can be affected due to the poorer readability of the generated code. Cheers On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 2:46 AM, PCMan <pcm...@gm...> wrote: > Here are some news about lxpanel2. > > I just finished multi-screen / multi-monitor support. > One can have different panels on different monitors. > Besides, one can also have multiple panels on the same side. > Positioning and sizing of the panels also becomes more flexible. > The latest code in the online git repo is in a much better shape now. > http://lxde.git.sourceforge.net/git/gitweb.cgi?p=lxde/lxpanel2;a=summary > > Currently you have to edit the config file manually. > Later I'll finish GUI configuration dialogs. > What's lacking now are good applets. > > Cheers! > > |
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From: Andrej N. G. <an...@re...> - 2012-11-25 15:44:23
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Hello!
PCMan has written on Sunday, 25 November, at 12:21:
>Well, people complaining about vala here missed some points.
I don't complain, I just doubt it can generate very reliable code.
Basically due to two reasons:
1) it disables many of compiler warnings (I think it will generate them
if not disabled) but it generates many compilation warnings still;
2) it generates code which casts every argument, so I assume there is no
types check at all, all arguments become type-less which is error-prone.
And since it's not very well debuggable, fixing bugs is much less
easy than in case of C code.
>1. This brings no additional dependency as it generated plain C code.
>2. It's very easy to link C code and Vala code together.
>3. You can call Vala code from plain C and call C from Vala directly.
>4. Of course applets/plugins can completely be written in plain C. So
>existing code does not need to be ported to Vala at all. Porting will be
>easy.
That is good so give us the final version of API, with some detailed
documentation for the best. I would like to have weather applet in it,
for example. :)
And I still want it to be compilable on older systems, desirably even
on such as current stable versions of Debian, RHEL, etc. - with glib 2.24
and gtk 2.20. :)
And also I would like it a lot if you could fix regression, i.e. add
a possibility to have pseudo-transparency when using Openbox. :)
Thank you for your great work!
Andriy.
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From: Julien L. <gi...@ub...> - 2012-11-25 12:20:35
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Le 11/24/2012 07:46 PM, PCMan a écrit : > I just finished multi-screen / multi-monitor support. > One can have different panels on different monitors. > Besides, one can also have multiple panels on the same side. > Positioning and sizing of the panels also becomes more flexible. > The latest code in the online git repo is in a much better shape now. > http://lxde.git.sourceforge.net/git/gitweb.cgi?p=lxde/lxpanel2;a=summary xutils.vala is missing from the source tree, could you add it ? I'm preparing a debian/ directory so we can add it the daily PPA, but I need to be able to build it locally first :-) Also, that would be nice to have an example of a C applet in the tree, so C coders will not be scared with all this Vala code :-) Is there an API documentation somewhere to write applet in C and Vala, with reference to the old lxpanel API (this will help porting)? Or do we have to read the source code ? Regards, Julien Lavergne |
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From: PCMan <pcm...@gm...> - 2012-11-25 13:39:22
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Thanks, I just added the missing file. It's still in an early stage and it's not for production use. No configuration UI is available. Unfortunately, available options in the config file is not documented, yet. About the applet API, I'll write docs for it later. Currently I'm trying to simplify and refactor the applet API. The dynamic plugin part is also being improved now. So, after these things are finished and API is more stablized, I'll write some docs for applet development. It should be as easy to do as in the old lxpanel. Otherwise I consider it a bug. Cheers! On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 8:20 PM, Julien Lavergne <gi...@ub...> wrote: > Le 11/24/2012 07:46 PM, PCMan a écrit : > > I just finished multi-screen / multi-monitor support. > > One can have different panels on different monitors. > > Besides, one can also have multiple panels on the same side. > > Positioning and sizing of the panels also becomes more flexible. > > The latest code in the online git repo is in a much better shape now. > > http://lxde.git.sourceforge.net/git/gitweb.cgi?p=lxde/lxpanel2;a=summary > xutils.vala is missing from the source tree, could you add it ? I'm > preparing a debian/ directory so we can add it the daily PPA, but I need > to be able to build it locally first :-) > > Also, that would be nice to have an example of a C applet in the tree, > so C coders will not be scared with all this Vala code :-) Is there an > API documentation somewhere to write applet in C and Vala, with > reference to the old lxpanel API (this will help porting)? Or do we have > to read the source code ? > > Regards, > Julien Lavergne > |
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From: Jonathan N. <j.n...@ch...> - 2012-11-26 11:44:28
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hello i'm a blind user and have managed to get the LXDe desktop pretty accessible. i'v spoken with one of the maintainers for the pcmanfm file manager and they said that they were going to work on getting the file manager working better with the Orca screen reader. This is fantastic news and highly appreciated. I was hoping while this work is being done to the lxpanel. If taking a lookg at it to see if the panle could also be accessible to the Orca screen reader? This is the last hurddle for the LXDE desktop to be 100% accessible. Thanks for your time and help along with all of your work on LXDE. On 11/25/2012 08:39 AM, PCMan wrote: > Thanks, I just added the missing file. > It's still in an early stage and it's not for production use. > No configuration UI is available. > Unfortunately, available options in the config file is not documented, > yet. > About the applet API, I'll write docs for it later. > Currently I'm trying to simplify and refactor the applet API. > The dynamic plugin part is also being improved now. > So, after these things are finished and API is more stablized, > I'll write some docs for applet development. > It should be as easy to do as in the old lxpanel. > Otherwise I consider it a bug. > Cheers! > > > On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 8:20 PM, Julien Lavergne <gi...@ub... > <mailto:gi...@ub...>> wrote: > > Le 11/24/2012 07:46 PM, PCMan a écrit : > > I just finished multi-screen / multi-monitor support. > > One can have different panels on different monitors. > > Besides, one can also have multiple panels on the same side. > > Positioning and sizing of the panels also becomes more flexible. > > The latest code in the online git repo is in a much better shape > now. > > > http://lxde.git.sourceforge.net/git/gitweb.cgi?p=lxde/lxpanel2;a=summary > xutils.vala is missing from the source tree, could you add it ? I'm > preparing a debian/ directory so we can add it the daily PPA, but > I need > to be able to build it locally first :-) > > Also, that would be nice to have an example of a C applet in the tree, > so C coders will not be scared with all this Vala code :-) Is there an > API documentation somewhere to write applet in C and Vala, with > reference to the old lxpanel API (this will help porting)? Or do > we have > to read the source code ? > > Regards, > Julien Lavergne > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Monitor your physical, virtual and cloud infrastructure from a single > web console. Get in-depth insight into apps, servers, databases, vmware, > SAP, cloud infrastructure, etc. Download 30-day Free Trial. > Pricing starts from $795 for 25 servers or applications! > http://p.sf.net/sfu/zoho_dev2dev_nov > > > _______________________________________________ > Lxde-list mailing list > Lxd...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/lxde-list |
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From: PCMan <pcm...@gm...> - 2012-11-26 14:01:31
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I believed that the new lxpanel2 will be at least more accessible than the old lxpanel. It tries to reuse standard gtk3 widgets whenever possible to utilize the accessibility support built into gtk. Accessibility does matters! When the new panel is ready for testing, I'll announce on the list and you can test to see if it works with orca. If not, we can fix it. :-) On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 7:44 PM, Jonathan Nadeau <j.n...@ch...>wrote: > hello i'm a blind user and have managed to get the LXDe desktop pretty > accessible. i'v spoken with one of the maintainers for the pcmanfm file > manager and they said that they were going to work on getting the file > manager working better with the Orca screen reader. This is fantastic news > and highly appreciated. I was hoping while this work is being done to the > lxpanel. If taking a lookg at it to see if the panle could also be > accessible to the Orca screen reader? This is the last hurddle for the LXDE > desktop to be 100% accessible. Thanks for your time and help along with all > of your work on LXDE. > > > On 11/25/2012 08:39 AM, PCMan wrote: > > Thanks, I just added the missing file. > It's still in an early stage and it's not for production use. > No configuration UI is available. > Unfortunately, available options in the config file is not documented, yet. > About the applet API, I'll write docs for it later. > Currently I'm trying to simplify and refactor the applet API. > The dynamic plugin part is also being improved now. > So, after these things are finished and API is more stablized, > I'll write some docs for applet development. > It should be as easy to do as in the old lxpanel. > Otherwise I consider it a bug. > Cheers! > > > On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 8:20 PM, Julien Lavergne <gi...@ub...>wrote: > >> Le 11/24/2012 07:46 PM, PCMan a écrit : >> > I just finished multi-screen / multi-monitor support. >> > One can have different panels on different monitors. >> > Besides, one can also have multiple panels on the same side. >> > Positioning and sizing of the panels also becomes more flexible. >> > The latest code in the online git repo is in a much better shape now. >> > >> http://lxde.git.sourceforge.net/git/gitweb.cgi?p=lxde/lxpanel2;a=summary >> xutils.vala is missing from the source tree, could you add it ? I'm >> preparing a debian/ directory so we can add it the daily PPA, but I need >> to be able to build it locally first :-) >> >> Also, that would be nice to have an example of a C applet in the tree, >> so C coders will not be scared with all this Vala code :-) Is there an >> API documentation somewhere to write applet in C and Vala, with >> reference to the old lxpanel API (this will help porting)? Or do we have >> to read the source code ? >> >> Regards, >> Julien Lavergne >> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Monitor your physical, virtual and cloud infrastructure from a single > web console. Get in-depth insight into apps, servers, databases, vmware, > SAP, cloud infrastructure, etc. Download 30-day Free Trial. > Pricing starts from $795 for 25 servers or applications!http://p.sf.net/sfu/zoho_dev2dev_nov > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lxde-list mailing lis...@li...https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/lxde-list > > > |
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From: Jonathan N. <j.n...@ch...> - 2012-11-26 14:34:30
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Thank you for all your work it is highlyt appreciated. Also thanks for caring about accessibility. Have a great day. On 11/26/2012 09:01 AM, PCMan wrote: > I believed that the new lxpanel2 will be at least more accessible than > the old lxpanel. > It tries to reuse standard gtk3 widgets whenever possible to utilize > the accessibility support built into gtk. Accessibility does matters! > When the new panel is ready for testing, I'll announce on the list and > you can test to see if it works with orca. If not, we can fix it. :-) > > > On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 7:44 PM, Jonathan Nadeau <j.n...@ch... > <mailto:j.n...@ch...>> wrote: > > hello i'm a blind user and have managed to get the LXDe desktop > pretty accessible. i'v spoken with one of the maintainers for the > pcmanfm file manager and they said that they were going to work on > getting the file manager working better with the Orca screen > reader. This is fantastic news and highly appreciated. I was > hoping while this work is being done to the lxpanel. If taking a > lookg at it to see if the panle could also be accessible to the > Orca screen reader? This is the last hurddle for the LXDE desktop > to be 100% accessible. Thanks for your time and help along with > all of your work on LXDE. > > > On 11/25/2012 08:39 AM, PCMan wrote: >> Thanks, I just added the missing file. >> It's still in an early stage and it's not for production use. >> No configuration UI is available. >> Unfortunately, available options in the config file is not >> documented, yet. >> About the applet API, I'll write docs for it later. >> Currently I'm trying to simplify and refactor the applet API. >> The dynamic plugin part is also being improved now. >> So, after these things are finished and API is more stablized, >> I'll write some docs for applet development. >> It should be as easy to do as in the old lxpanel. >> Otherwise I consider it a bug. >> Cheers! >> >> >> On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 8:20 PM, Julien Lavergne >> <gi...@ub... <mailto:gi...@ub...>> wrote: >> >> Le 11/24/2012 07:46 PM, PCMan a écrit : >> > I just finished multi-screen / multi-monitor support. >> > One can have different panels on different monitors. >> > Besides, one can also have multiple panels on the same side. >> > Positioning and sizing of the panels also becomes more >> flexible. >> > The latest code in the online git repo is in a much better >> shape now. >> > >> http://lxde.git.sourceforge.net/git/gitweb.cgi?p=lxde/lxpanel2;a=summary >> xutils.vala is missing from the source tree, could you add it >> ? I'm >> preparing a debian/ directory so we can add it the daily PPA, >> but I need >> to be able to build it locally first :-) >> >> Also, that would be nice to have an example of a C applet in >> the tree, >> so C coders will not be scared with all this Vala code :-) Is >> there an >> API documentation somewhere to write applet in C and Vala, with >> reference to the old lxpanel API (this will help porting)? Or >> do we have >> to read the source code ? >> >> Regards, >> Julien Lavergne >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Monitor your physical, virtual and cloud infrastructure from a single >> web console. Get in-depth insight into apps, servers, databases, vmware, >> SAP, cloud infrastructure, etc. Download 30-day Free Trial. >> Pricing starts from $795 for 25 servers or applications! >> http://p.sf.net/sfu/zoho_dev2dev_nov >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Lxde-list mailing list >> Lxd...@li... <mailto:Lxd...@li...> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/lxde-list > > |
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