From: Ray D. <ray...@ya...> - 2005-08-26 16:01:31
|
Hi Fan, I think this is a question best answered by the development team itself, so I'm forwarding this to the list instead of replying to you directly. As for how many developers, at a glance when I see the jython-checkins lately, I usually see 3 names there, Frank, Brian, and Samuele... I may have missed some, I apologize if I did. I also wonder about the plan for Jython though, i.e.: whether the final 2.2 be compliant with CPython 2.2... or going to 2.4 directly... or what exactly? Cheers, Ray --- FAN <sha...@gm...> wrote: > I just wander why Jython hadn't release new version > for serveral > years. Is this due to the license issue, or > technology problem or lack > of voluntary development? > How many developer is there for Jython now? I want > to join the dev > group and do something for Jython. Is there any > requirment for this? __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com |
From: Berlin B. <ber...@gm...> - 2005-08-26 18:12:17
|
I will say, that the Jython project is an amazing way to work with Java if not the only way to add scripting(and yes a full language) to java libraries. I have been trying to get it on our project(work).=20 It could really help out, especially if you can't using cygwin and if you want dynamic code. In terms of the development. They have added a lot of stuff to the release mentioned(that is about a month ago). My only next request is for Jython to work with the standard Python libraries like twistedmatrix and other popular CPython frameworks.=20 But, all in due time. On 8/26/05, Greg Knaddison <gre...@gm...> wrote: > One question is why you need the new version? >=20 > I have yet to see a major bug in the 2.1 version. New releases can be > the sign of lots of different things including >=20 > -an unstable project > -a poorly thought out project > -an "immature" project >=20 > Infrequent releases can be a sign of a lack of interest in a project > or with problems with the project. They can also be a sign that the > project was relatively bug free in its implementation and that it was > based on a mature technology from the beginning which doesn't need > constant releases. >=20 > In the case of Jython, I believe that it is more a case of the latter: > Python is a fairly mature language and Jython2.1 was rather bug free. > Improvements on Jython2.1 are "gravy" in my opinion. Look at all the > support Jython gets (Coyote, Weblogic) years after the last "release". > This is a sign that it works well! >=20 > Greg >=20 > On 8/26/05, could ildg <cou...@gm...> wrote: > > I am always looking forward the jython2.4, > > Who knows when it will be delivered? > > > > On 8/27/05, Ray Djajadinata <ray...@ya...> wrote: > > > Hi Fan, > > > > > > I think this is a question best answered by the > > > development team itself, so I'm forwarding this to the > > > list instead of replying to you directly. > > > > > > As for how many developers, at a glance when I see the > > > jython-checkins lately, I usually see 3 names there, > > > Frank, Brian, and Samuele... I may have missed some, I > > > apologize if I did. > > > > > > I also wonder about the plan for Jython though, i.e.: > > > whether the final 2.2 be compliant with CPython 2.2... > > > or going to 2.4 directly... or what exactly? > > > > > > Cheers, > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > --- FAN <sha...@gm...> wrote: > > > > > > > I just wander why Jython hadn't release new version > > > > for serveral > > > > years. Is this due to the license issue, or > > > > technology problem or lack > > > > of voluntary development? > > > > How many developer is there for Jython now? I want > > > > to join the dev > > > > group and do something for Jython. Is there any > > > > requirment for this? > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > > > SF.Net email is Sponsored by the Better Software Conference & EXPO > > > September 19-22, 2005 * San Francisco, CA * Development Lifecycle Pra= ctices > > > Agile & Plan-Driven Development * Managing Projects & Teams * Testing= & QA > > > Security * Process Improvement & Measurement * http://www.sqe.com/bsc= e5sf > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Jython-users mailing list > > > Jyt...@li... > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/jython-users > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > > SF.Net email is Sponsored by the Better Software Conference & EXPO > > September 19-22, 2005 * San Francisco, CA * Development Lifecycle Pract= ices > > Agile & Plan-Driven Development * Managing Projects & Teams * Testing &= QA > > Security * Process Improvement & Measurement * http://www.sqe.com/bsce5= sf > > _______________________________________________ > > Jython-users mailing list > > Jyt...@li... > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/jython-users > > >=20 >=20 > ------------------------------------------------------- > SF.Net email is Sponsored by the Better Software Conference & EXPO > September 19-22, 2005 * San Francisco, CA * Development Lifecycle Practic= es > Agile & Plan-Driven Development * Managing Projects & Teams * Testing & Q= A > Security * Process Improvement & Measurement * http://www.sqe.com/bsce5sf > _______________________________________________ > Jython-users mailing list > Jyt...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/jython-users > |
From: Greg K. <gre...@gm...> - 2005-08-26 18:30:26
|
On 8/26/05, Berlin Brown <ber...@gm...> wrote: > I will say, that the Jython project is an amazing way to work with > Java if not the only way to add scripting(and yes a full language) to > java libraries. I have been trying to get it on our project(work). > It could really help out, especially if you can't using cygwin and if > you want dynamic code. Yes, exactly! >=20 > In terms of the development. They have added a lot of stuff to the > release mentioned(that is about a month ago). >=20 Yes, and I don't want to diminish that. I (and a lot of people I know) are very much looking forward to Jython 2.2 and further releases. There is a lot of great work going on now and I applaud it (can you hear me clapping?). But in the mean time, Jython is a great language and works fine without any of the new features. > My only next request is for Jython to work with the standard Python > libraries like twistedmatrix and other popular CPython frameworks. > But, all in due time. >=20 Sure, sure, but those things are all convenience issues at this point, right? You could work around the problems with extra Jython or Java code, but it's easier to just wait for 2.2, right? Greg |
From: could i. <cou...@gm...> - 2005-08-26 17:00:43
|
I am always looking forward the jython2.4, Who knows when it will be delivered? On 8/27/05, Ray Djajadinata <ray...@ya...> wrote: > Hi Fan, >=20 > I think this is a question best answered by the > development team itself, so I'm forwarding this to the > list instead of replying to you directly. >=20 > As for how many developers, at a glance when I see the > jython-checkins lately, I usually see 3 names there, > Frank, Brian, and Samuele... I may have missed some, I > apologize if I did. >=20 > I also wonder about the plan for Jython though, i.e.: > whether the final 2.2 be compliant with CPython 2.2... > or going to 2.4 directly... or what exactly? >=20 > Cheers, > Ray >=20 >=20 > --- FAN <sha...@gm...> wrote: >=20 > > I just wander why Jython hadn't release new version > > for serveral > > years. Is this due to the license issue, or > > technology problem or lack > > of voluntary development? > > How many developer is there for Jython now? I want > > to join the dev > > group and do something for Jython. Is there any > > requirment for this? >=20 > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com >=20 >=20 > ------------------------------------------------------- > SF.Net email is Sponsored by the Better Software Conference & EXPO > September 19-22, 2005 * San Francisco, CA * Development Lifecycle Practic= es > Agile & Plan-Driven Development * Managing Projects & Teams * Testing & Q= A > Security * Process Improvement & Measurement * http://www.sqe.com/bsce5sf > _______________________________________________ > Jython-users mailing list > Jyt...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/jython-users > |
From: Greg K. <gre...@gm...> - 2005-08-26 17:56:48
|
One question is why you need the new version? I have yet to see a major bug in the 2.1 version. New releases can be the sign of lots of different things including -an unstable project -a poorly thought out project -an "immature" project Infrequent releases can be a sign of a lack of interest in a project or with problems with the project. They can also be a sign that the project was relatively bug free in its implementation and that it was based on a mature technology from the beginning which doesn't need constant releases. In the case of Jython, I believe that it is more a case of the latter: Python is a fairly mature language and Jython2.1 was rather bug free.=20 Improvements on Jython2.1 are "gravy" in my opinion. Look at all the support Jython gets (Coyote, Weblogic) years after the last "release". This is a sign that it works well! Greg On 8/26/05, could ildg <cou...@gm...> wrote: > I am always looking forward the jython2.4, > Who knows when it will be delivered? >=20 > On 8/27/05, Ray Djajadinata <ray...@ya...> wrote: > > Hi Fan, > > > > I think this is a question best answered by the > > development team itself, so I'm forwarding this to the > > list instead of replying to you directly. > > > > As for how many developers, at a glance when I see the > > jython-checkins lately, I usually see 3 names there, > > Frank, Brian, and Samuele... I may have missed some, I > > apologize if I did. > > > > I also wonder about the plan for Jython though, i.e.: > > whether the final 2.2 be compliant with CPython 2.2... > > or going to 2.4 directly... or what exactly? > > > > Cheers, > > Ray > > > > > > --- FAN <sha...@gm...> wrote: > > > > > I just wander why Jython hadn't release new version > > > for serveral > > > years. Is this due to the license issue, or > > > technology problem or lack > > > of voluntary development? > > > How many developer is there for Jython now? I want > > > to join the dev > > > group and do something for Jython. Is there any > > > requirment for this? > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > > SF.Net email is Sponsored by the Better Software Conference & EXPO > > September 19-22, 2005 * San Francisco, CA * Development Lifecycle Pract= ices > > Agile & Plan-Driven Development * Managing Projects & Teams * Testing &= QA > > Security * Process Improvement & Measurement * http://www.sqe.com/bsce5= sf > > _______________________________________________ > > Jython-users mailing list > > Jyt...@li... > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/jython-users > > >=20 >=20 > ------------------------------------------------------- > SF.Net email is Sponsored by the Better Software Conference & EXPO > September 19-22, 2005 * San Francisco, CA * Development Lifecycle Practic= es > Agile & Plan-Driven Development * Managing Projects & Teams * Testing & Q= A > Security * Process Improvement & Measurement * http://www.sqe.com/bsce5sf > _______________________________________________ > Jython-users mailing list > Jyt...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/jython-users > |
From: Scott L. <sl...@sl...> - 2005-08-26 18:20:04
|
On Aug 26, 2005, at 10:56 AM, Greg Knaddison wrote: > One question is why you need the new version? A good question, and you're right that Jython 2.1 is tremendously useful. I diagnose a large J2EE monster with it all the time. I could spend a lot of hunting around, adding logging, doing long builds, waiting for it to reload, trying again...or I could just set up a simple experiment in Jython and _know_ what's going on. A ten-line script, or even something interactive. (Which might become a jUnit test later.) At the same time, there are all kinds of things to look forward to in Jython 2.2. The recent alpha doesn't work well enough for me to use it, but it's got me drooling anyway. If FAN wants to join in and make it happen sooner, I don't want to discourage that. I've been meaning to open up CVS and try my hand at making some patches also. Regards, Scott -- Scott Lamb <http://www.slamb.org/> |
From: Ray D. <ray...@ya...> - 2005-08-27 16:17:27
|
--- Greg Knaddison <gre...@gm...> wrote: > One question is why you need the new version? A lot of really nice things have happened to CPython since then, so altho you really don't need a new version, you miss those things that you're already accustomed to in 2.2 and 2.3. (and 2.4). > I have yet to see a major bug in the 2.1 version. > New releases can be > the sign of lots of different things including > > -an unstable project > -a poorly thought out project > -an "immature" project > > Infrequent releases can be a sign of a lack of > interest in a project > or with problems with the project. They can also be > a sign that the > project was relatively bug free in its > implementation and that it was > based on a mature technology from the beginning > which doesn't need > constant releases. > > In the case of Jython, I believe that it is more a > case of the latter: > Python is a fairly mature language and Jython2.1 was > rather bug free. > Improvements on Jython2.1 are "gravy" in my opinion. > Look at all the > support Jython gets (Coyote, Weblogic) years after > the last "release". > This is a sign that it works well! Well, CPython is a mature implementation, it works well, but it keeps evolving with 2.2, 2.3, and 2.4 release. People can't help but wondering whether Jython is dead since it'd been stuck at 2.1 for almost 2 years (or 3?). Also, infrequent releases are different from abandoned. I believe before Brian took the initiative, Jython state was closer to the latter, correct me if I'm wrong. Ray ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs |
From: Greg K. <gre...@gm...> - 2005-08-29 15:19:35
|
On 8/27/05, Ray Djajadinata <ray...@ya...> wrote: >=20 > A lot of really nice things have happened to CPython > since then, so altho you really don't need a new > version, you miss those things that you're already > accustomed to in 2.2 and 2.3. (and 2.4). >=20 Seems more like an annoyance than a deal breaker. And there are workarounds for many of these such as the "Try True" block I know people add to the top of Jython scripts. >=20 > Well, CPython is a mature implementation, it works > well, but it keeps evolving with 2.2, 2.3, and 2.4 > release. People can't help but wondering whether > Jython is dead since it'd been stuck at 2.1 for almost > 2 years (or 3?). >=20 Maybe they can't help wondering, but if they can search and read newsgroups and forums and...they can see it's not "dead". > Also, infrequent releases are different from > abandoned. I believe before Brian took the initiative, > Jython state was closer to the latter, correct me if > I'm wrong. >=20 From my understanding, you are wrong. For a long time Samuele Pedroni has been working on the "new style classes". This past December/January he moved to PyPy project and Brian Zimmer took over the major work on Jython finishing off the new style classes and opening up Jython for more volunteer/patch contribution. Also, in the world of Open Source is there really such a thing as "abandoned"? The code exists somewhere, you can always get it and hack it if you want. Regards, Greg |
From: Ray D. <ray...@ya...> - 2005-08-29 16:08:59
|
--- Greg Knaddison <gre...@gm...> wrote: > Seems more like an annoyance than a deal breaker. > And there are > workarounds for many of these such as the "Try True" > block I know > people add to the top of Jython scripts. Never said it was a deal breaker. Hey, I agree with you that 2.1 works well for what it is. But annoyances are annoyances. Why do people have to do all kinds of workarounds instead of just being able to use it? "If you want it just add it yourself" doesn't really work. The reality is that most people just want to use Jython so they can work faster and look good in front of boss/get on with their lives/play more with their kids/spend more time with significant other, etc. Having to add all kinds of workarounds makes it more likely to them to just turn to another solution. ("Well this is free software, if you don't like it, you're always free to turn to others" is not particularly helping Jython's case, is it?) > > Well, CPython is a mature implementation, it works > > well, but it keeps evolving with 2.2, 2.3, and 2.4 > > release. People can't help but wondering whether > > Jython is dead since it'd been stuck at 2.1 for > almost > > 2 years (or 3?). > > > Maybe they can't help wondering, but if they can > search and read > newsgroups and forums and...they can see it's not > "dead". Yeah. It was "not dead", like you said. It was not ALIVE. When something is ALIVE, like CPython, you don't have to dig deep to see its aliveness. Its aliveness is there right shining in your face. You go like, "Okay, okay, CPython!! I know you're alive already!!" Such had not been the case with Jython before the PSF grant initiative happened. You had to really listen carefully for a pulse there... > From my understanding, you are wrong. For a long > time Samuele Pedroni > has been working on the "new style classes". This > past > December/January he moved to PyPy project and Brian > Zimmer took over > the major work on Jython finishing off the new style > classes and > opening up Jython for more volunteer/patch > contribution. Yeah. This was and is great news as always. I'm really thankful that there are people like Brian Zimmer and Samuele Pedroni and the rest of the Jython team. > Also, in the world of Open Source is there really > such a thing as > "abandoned"? The code exists somewhere, you can > always get it and > hack it if you want. Well yeah but again... not everyone is a Jim Hugunin. If an open source project is abandoned, most people will simply turn to other projects. Or people who can afford to commit the time and/or have the expertise will create their own solution (be it because they think they can create a "better Python", or what have you). Which would really be a pity if it were to happen to Jython since it is such a great thing. I really don't want to clutter my brain with some guy's notion of a "better Python" like boo. I just want Python on my JVM, so Jython is really the greatest thing :) Regards, Ray __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com |