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From: D.B. M. <db...@ho...> - 2008-11-09 04:31:18
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Greets, > From: pstieber > To: jazzplusplus-updates > Subject: SF.net SVN: jazzplusplus:[620] web/htdocs/buildingtex2rtf/index.php > Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2008 04:07:00 +0000 > > Revision: 620 > http://jazzplusplus.svn.sourceforge.net/jazzplusplus/?rev=620&view=rev > Author: pstieber > Date: 2008-11-09 04:07:00 +0000 (Sun, 09 Nov 2008) > > Log Message: > ----------- > Updated the build instructions. May not be 100% correct, but close. > <<snip>> I'll be checking this directly.... Regards, Donald B _________________________________________________________________ Time for change? Find your ideal job with SEEK. http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau%2F%3Ftracking%3Dsk%3Atl%3Ask%3Anine%3A0%3Ahottag%3Achange&_t=757263783&_r=SEEK_tagline&_m=EXT |
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From: Pete S. <pst...@gm...> - 2008-11-09 17:30:21
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PS>> Updated the build instructions. May not be 100% PS>> correct, but close. DM> Hmmm....ok...tex2rtf builds okay, however when it DM> comes to building jazz itself, it has no idea that DM> tex2rtf has been installed in DM> $HOME/Jazz++/TestInstall/bin because such is not DM> in $PATH. DM> DM> Perhaps DESTDIR for the text2rtf build should have DM> been '/usr/local/wx289/bin' instead? Then the --prefix option to configure would need to be /usr/local/wx289 and the user would need root access to install tex2rtf. You could copy the tex2rtf binary to /usr/local/wx289/bin or set your PATH appropriately to get around this. Pete |
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From: D.B. M. <db...@ho...> - 2008-11-09 18:48:56
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> Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2008 09:30:08 -0800 > From: pstieber > To: jazzplusplus-devel > Subject: Re: [jazzplusplus-devel] SF.net SVN: jazzplusplus:[620] web/htdocs/buildingtex2rtf/index.php > > PS>> Updated the build instructions. May not be 100% > PS>> correct, but close. > > DM> Hmmm....ok...tex2rtf builds okay, however when it > DM> comes to building jazz itself, it has no idea that > DM> tex2rtf has been installed in > DM> $HOME/Jazz++/TestInstall/bin because such is not > DM> in $PATH. > DM> > DM> Perhaps DESTDIR for the text2rtf build should have > DM> been '/usr/local/wx289/bin' instead? > > Then the --prefix option to configure would need to be /usr/local/wx289 > and the user would need root access to install tex2rtf. > > You could copy the tex2rtf binary to /usr/local/wx289/bin or set your > PATH appropriately to get around this. > > Pete I know I'm being painful asking this .... this being the case, then why bother invoking su for the wx build to install it in /usr/local ? That is to say, why don't we just install wx in the user's $HOME instead so that all 3 packages don't need root_priv at all? I'm only thinking of users who might not like having to work this out...(I think my mind mumbling 'consistent approach' or such and similar... <grin>)....I just linked tex2rtf into the wx289/bin path because I'm pathetically lazy. Shoot me if I'm getting annoying... Regards, Donald B _________________________________________________________________ Time for change? Find your ideal job with SEEK. http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau%2F%3Ftracking%3Dsk%3Atl%3Ask%3Anine%3A0%3Ahottag%3Achange&_t=757263783&_r=SEEK_tagline&_m=EXT |
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From: Kevin C. <ke...@co...> - 2008-11-09 20:31:32
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On 9 November 2008 at 18:48, "D.B. Moore" <db...@ho...> wrote: > I know I'm being painful asking this .... this being the case, > then why bother invoking su for the wx build to install it > in /usr/local ? That is to say, why don't we just install > wx in the user's $HOME instead so that all 3 packages don't > need root_priv at all? I'm only thinking of users who might > not like having to work this out...(I think my mind mumbling > 'consistent approach' or such and similar... <grin>)....I just > linked tex2rtf into the wx289/bin path because I'm pathetically > lazy. Shoot me if I'm getting annoying... I package a lot of things, and nearly all of them default to /usr/local for the default prefix; some default to /usr. Installing as root is pretty standard. I'd say that anyone who could build jazz++ and the prerequisites would likely be able to alter the $PREFIX if they wanted to. I'll advocate for /usr/local. --prefix=$HOME isn't too hard to do, if desired. That's my $0.02. Thanks... -- Kevin |
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From: D.B. M. <db...@ho...> - 2008-11-10 04:12:08
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> To: jazzplusplus-devel > Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2008 12:31:23 -0800 > From: kevinc > Subject: Re: [jazzplusplus-devel] SF.net SVN: jazzplusplus:[620] web/htdocs/buildingtex2rtf/index.php > > > On 9 November 2008 at 18:48, "D.B. Moore" <db...@ho...> wrote: > > > I know I'm being painful asking this .... this being the case, > > then why bother invoking su for the wx build to install it > > in /usr/local ? That is to say, why don't we just install > > wx in the user's $HOME instead so that all 3 packages don't > > need root_priv at all? I'm only thinking of users who might > > not like having to work this out...(I think my mind mumbling > > 'consistent approach' or such and similar... <grin>)....I just > > linked tex2rtf into the wx289/bin path because I'm pathetically > > lazy. Shoot me if I'm getting annoying... > > I package a lot of things, and nearly all of them default to /usr/local > for the default prefix; some default to /usr. Installing as root is > pretty standard. I'd say that anyone who could build jazz++ and the > prerequisites would likely be able to alter the $PREFIX if they > wanted to. I'll advocate for /usr/local. --prefix=$HOME isn't too > hard to do, if desired. > > That's my $0.02. > > Thanks... > -- > Kevin Oh yes, I agree.....all I'm saying is, the user becomes root to install the wx build anyway, so why not for tex2rtf as well? The way the tex2rtf build is presented, the 'unknowledgeable user' will -need- to alter their PATH in ~/.bash_profile anyhow before jazz will actually build, and again for the aforesaid 'unknowledgeable user' , they made need a pointer to this if they don't actually know what's going wrong. As it stands now, the door is left wide open to a swag of 'jazz does not compile' emails, because, technically speaking, the build instructions are wrong. I do realize these emails are all hypothetical, what I'm talking about in reality does not exist -- the situation exists that so called 'unknowledgeable users' might happen along here, be willing to give it a try but in the same moment be totally reliant on following the instructions to-the-letter (c&p), and for all I know these people might not speak english as a first language or at all. Remember, I'm the one who wrote up the line in the web-docs which says that even unknowledgeable users should be able to build jazz from svn with as little effort as cutting&pasting the instructions on the web-site straight into their shells...this issue with tex2rtf actually breaks that premise. Right now, what I've cited is a lie...and I know it...I'm resting uneasy. My primary concern is accuracy of content, nothing more. Yes, people that are capable of building jazz presently can alter their path 'if they wanted to' -- the point really is that they **have** to, or the jazz build will fail. Myself...I really don't care at all - I will see an omission like this and quick as blink sort it out forthwith. That said, I will report it in the guise of this hypothetical 'unknowledgeable user', as an example of foresight. Granted, there might be less than a dozen people working with the current jazz++ right now.....right now, anyone who comes along and follows the online instructions, is headed for disappointment -- sometimes, you only get one shot at impressing users....'they can't even get the build instructions right'. That's what I'm saying, looking in my mirror. Eventually, {release), tex2rtf has to go somewhere -- putting it in the same location as the jazz binary for the moment is fine by me -- this being the case, perhaps the web-docs should include lines somewhere (before build jazz), to add ; export PATH=$HOME/Jazz++/TestInstall:$PATH to the user's ~/.bash_profile Then this all goes away and the given instructions work 'out of the box' again. In theory, this should never be a problem until {release}, at which time this path addition would conflict with a system installed jazz in /usr or /usr/local and thus would need be removed. It's a lot nicer to be able to just type 'jazz' at the prompt and get results too....imho. Regards, Donald B PS: Btw, I did hotbot search (yahoo engine) for the word tex2rtf and guess what came up as the topmost return? Free exposure.... _________________________________________________________________ Time for change? Find your ideal job with SEEK. http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau%2F%3Ftracking%3Dsk%3Atl%3Ask%3Anine%3A0%3Ahottag%3Achange&_t=757263783&_r=SEEK_tagline&_m=EXT |
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From: Pete S. <pst...@gm...> - 2008-11-11 02:44:08
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DM = D.B. Moore
DM>>> I know I'm being painful asking this .... this being the case,
DM>>> then why bother invoking su for the wx build to install it
DM>>> in /usr/local ? That is to say, why don't we just install
DM>>> wx in the user's $HOME instead so that all 3 packages don't
DM>>> need root_priv at all? I'm only thinking of users who might
DM>>> not like having to work this out...(I think my mind mumbling
DM>>> 'consistent approach' or such and similar... <grin>)....I just
DM>>> linked tex2rtf into the wx289/bin path because I'm pathetically
DM>>> lazy. Shoot me if I'm getting annoying...
KC = Kevin Cosgrove
KC>> I package a lot of things, and nearly all of them default to
KC>> /usr/local for the default prefix; some default to /usr.
KC>> Installing as root is pretty standard. I'd say that anyone
KC>> who could build jazz++ and the prerequisites would likely
KC>> be able to alter the $PREFIX if they wanted to. I'll
KC>> advocate for /usr/local. --prefix=$HOME isn't too hard to do,
KC>> if desired.
DM> Oh yes, I agree.....all I'm saying is, the user becomes
DM> root to install the wx build anyway, so why not for
DM> tex2rtf as well? The way the tex2rtf build is presented,
DM> the 'unknowledgeable user' will -need- to alter their
DM> PATH in ~/.bash_profile anyhow before jazz will actually
DM> build, and again for the aforesaid 'unknowledgeable user',
DM> they made need a pointer to this if they don't actually
DM> know what's going wrong. As it stands now, the door is
DM> left wide open to a swag of 'jazz does not compile'
DM> emails, because, technically speaking, the build
DM> instructions are wrong. I do realize these emails are all
DM> hypothetical, what I'm talking about in reality does not
DM> exist -- the situation exists that so called
DM> 'unknowledgeable users' might happen along here, be willing
DM> to give it a try but in the same moment be totally reliant
DM> on following the instructions to-the-letter (c&p), and
DM> for all I know these people might not speak english as
DM> a first language or at all.
DM>
DM> Remember, I'm the one who wrote up the line in the web-docs
DM> which says that even unknowledgeable users should be able
DM> to build jazz from svn with as little effort as cutting &
DM> pasting the instructions on the web-site straight into their
DM> shells...this issue with tex2rtf actually breaks
DM> that premise.
DM> Right now, what I've cited is a lie...and I know it...I'm
DM> resting uneasy. My primary concern is accuracy of content,
DM> nothing more. Yes, people that are capable of building jazz
DM> presently can alter their path 'if they wanted to' -- the
DM> point really is that they **have** to, or the jazz build will
DM> fail.
DM>
DM> Myself...I really don't care at all - I will see an omission
DM> like this and quick as blink sort it out forthwith. That
DM> said, I will report it in the guise of this hypothetical
DM> 'unknowledgeable user', as an example of foresight. Granted,
DM> there might be less than a dozen people working with the
DM> current jazz++ right now.....right now, anyone who comes
DM> along and follows the online instructions, is headed for
DM> disappointment -- sometimes, you only get one shot at
DM> impressing users....'they can't even get the build
DM> instructions right'.
DM>
DM> That's what I'm saying, looking in my mirror. Eventually,
DM> {release), tex2rtf has to go somewhere -- putting it in
DM> the same location as the jazz binary for the moment is fine
DM> by me -- this being the case, perhaps the web-docs should
DM> include lines somewhere (before build jazz), to add;
DM>
DM> export PATH=$HOME/Jazz++/TestInstall:$PATH
DM>
DM> to the user's ~/.bash_profile
DM>
DM> Then this all goes away and the given instructions work
DM> 'out of the box' again. In theory, this should never be
DM> a problem until {release}, at which time this path
DM> addition would conflict with a system installed jazz in
DM> /usr or /usr/local and thus would need be removed. It's
DM> a lot nicer to be able to just type 'jazz' at the
DM> prompt and get results too....imho.
I caused the problem by worrying about a potential user that may not
have root access on a machine. I faced this situation at work when a
colleague attempted to install wxWidgets at a user site and didn't have
root access. I copied the instructions from a work web site I generated.
The autotools and autoconf in particular default to /usr/local as the
installation location. For wxWidgets, I like the idea of specifying
/usr/local/wx{version} so that multiple versions can be loaded and I can
wipe out the entire install by removing that directory. Otherwise I
would have to remove particular files in /usr/local/bin, /usr/local/lib,
/usr/local/include... and this can be a pain if the user has other codes
installed in these directories. I'm not sure in wxWidgets has a "make
uninstall" command, but even if it does, I don't want to rely on it as
the user may erase their build directory.
So for now, I think I'll assume everyone that is building Jazz++ is a
developer, or helping me debug problems and change the instructions to...
1. Assume the developer has root access and if they don't assume they
are smart enough to deal with the "--prefix=..." configure option.
2. Use --prefix-/usr/local/wx289 for wxWidgets and have the user build
and install both release and debug versions of the wxWidgets library.
3. Use the default prefix (/usr/local) for tex2rtf. The only files that
get installed are tex2rtf and tex2rtf_gui in the /usr/local/bin
directory and this is usually included in the users path. This code
will use the release version of wxWidgets. I don't want to deal with
tex2rtf issues at this point.
4. Give instructions for both a debug and release build of Jazz++ and
the developer can choose.
Does this sound OK?
I'd really prefer to work on the code instead of these instructions. I
still don't have it recording MIDI :-(
Pete
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From: D.B. M. <db...@ho...> - 2008-11-11 07:10:02
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> Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2008 18:44:01 -0800 > From: pstieber > To: jazzplusplus-devel > Subject: Re: [jazzplusplus-devel] SF.net SVN: jazzplusplus:[620] web/htdocs/buildingtex2rtf/index.php > > <<snip>> > > > Pete said; > I caused the problem by worrying about a potential user that may not > have root access on a machine. I faced this situation at work when a > colleague attempted to install wxWidgets at a user site and didn't have > root access. I copied the instructions from a work web site I generated. > > The autotools and autoconf in particular default to /usr/local as the > installation location. For wxWidgets, I like the idea of specifying > /usr/local/wx{version} so that multiple versions can be loaded and I can > wipe out the entire install by removing that directory. Otherwise I > would have to remove particular files in /usr/local/bin, /usr/local/lib, > /usr/local/include... and this can be a pain if the user has other codes > installed in these directories. I'm not sure in wxWidgets has a "make > uninstall" command, but even if it does, I don't want to rely on it as > the user may erase their build directory. > This is all entirely sane, especially as many distros ship wx standard > > So for now, I think I'll assume everyone that is building Jazz++ is a > developer, or helping me debug problems and change the instructions to... > > 1. Assume the developer has root access and if they don't assume they > are smart enough to deal with the "--prefix=..." configure option. > 2. Use --prefix-/usr/local/wx289 for wxWidgets and have the user build > and install both release and debug versions of the wxWidgets library. > 3. Use the default prefix (/usr/local) for tex2rtf. The only files that > get installed are tex2rtf and tex2rtf_gui in the /usr/local/bin > directory and this is usually included in the users path. This code > will use the release version of wxWidgets. I don't want to deal with > tex2rtf issues at this point. > 4. Give instructions for both a debug and release build of Jazz++ and > the developer can choose. > > Does this sound OK? > Sounds good to me, my only gripe was that the given instructions for tex2rtf placed the binaries outside $PATH and broke the jazz build instructions, nothing more. I also presume (as opposed to assume) that anyone building jazz++ is a developer/tester or helper - what I assume here is someone will prove that presumption to be wrong ;-) > I'd really prefer to work on the code instead of these instructions. I > still don't have it recording MIDI :-( Indeed....if you want me to do anything, just aim me... I haven't checked record functions yet -- I do know the bank/patch selection isn't working for me... Regards, Don _________________________________________________________________ Time for change? Find your ideal job with SEEK. http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau%2F%3Ftracking%3Dsk%3Atl%3Ask%3Anine%3A0%3Ahottag%3Achange&_t=757263783&_r=SEEK_tagline&_m=EXT |
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From: D.B. M. <db...@ho...> - 2008-11-09 14:34:32
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Greets, From: db.mo To: jazzplusplus-devel Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2008 04:31:12 +0000 Subject: Re: [jazzplusplus-devel] SF.net SVN: jazzplusplus:[620] web/htdocs/buildingtex2rtf/index.php > From: pstieber > To: jazzplusplus-updates > Subject: SF.net SVN: jazzplusplus:[620] web/htdocs/buildingtex2rtf/index.php > Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2008 04:07:00 +0000 > > Revision: 620 > http://jazzplusplus.svn.sourceforge.net/jazzplusplus/?rev=620&view=rev > Author: pstieber > Date: 2008-11-09 04:07:00 +0000 (Sun, 09 Nov 2008) > > Log Message: > ----------- > Updated the build instructions. May not be 100% correct, but close. > <<snip>> > >I'll be checking this directly.... Hmmm....ok...tex2rtf builds okay, however when it comes to building jazz itself, it has no idea that tex2rtf has been installed in $HOME/Jazz++/TestInstall/bin because such is not in $PATH . Perhaps DESTDIR for the text2rtf build should have been '/usr/local/wx289/bin' instead? Regards, Donald B _________________________________________________________________ Take a summer road trip with Windows Live Hotmail. Multiple prizes and the ultimate dream beach house! http://www.ninemsn.com.au/hotmailroadtrip |
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