Re: [Java-gnome-developer] Possibility to built SWING on top uf Java-GTK?

[Helgi H. G. <he...@bi...>]

Howdy.

I must agree with the man. I've been wondering about this for quite some ti=
me, now.

Recently I was finally able to get myself a Mac, and I'm running Mac OS 10.=
2 on it. Amazed as I was, it runs Swing apps like native Mac OS 10.2 apps, =
although the default (butt-ugly, pardon my French) Swing look can be used a=
s well.

I really do remember reading somewhere on java.sun.com that Swing was desig=
ned to have widgets that belong to all popular widget sets, and since Sun a=
re Unix-hackers I would only imagine they had taken Gtk+ into account (not =
that Gtk+ is exactly lacking widgets). Mac OS X obviously has everything an=
d I assume MFC does as well, according to what you just wrote. Regardless o=
f all of this, I've never seen a widget or a tool in Java Swing apps that I=
 haven't seen in any of these toolkits.

I also know that Gtk+ was designed specifically with language bindings in m=
ind, so I really can't believe that it's impossible or even that difficult =
to use native Gtk+ widgets instead of drawing the entire Swing thing from s=
cratch (like the Sun VM does).

This is just some rambling from me. :) I'm not good enough in Java (in fact=
 I barely know the language) to do this, but I would like to participate, o=
nce I get this f***ing gnome-gcj thing up and running.

Note: I have a strong personal policy of only using open-source software at=
 home, also I hate, HATE Swing as a seperate look and feel to everything el=
se, so I probably won't learn Java until I get gnome-gcj up. Furthermore...=
 I want to run it as native machine-code, I really don't like the smell of =
virtual machines altogether. :)

The only real political question I can see is... do people really want Swin=
g apps depending on JNI? I can only speak for myself, but I sure as s*** do=
n't mind one bit. In fact I favour it more than than that childish (flames =
to /dev/null) pure-Java concept.

Just a comment, for you all to know, this idea must be common, and I only a=
ssume interest is enough.

Peace.
Helgi Hrafn Gunnarsson
he...@bi...

On Wed, 08 Jan 2003 23:47:23 +0100
Linuxhippy <lin...@we...> wrote:

> Hi there again!
>=20
> My laptop is still broken, I write this mail with my old 15=B4 60Hz=20
> Monotir ;-)
>=20
> Very often I hear about OpenSource-VMs like Kaffe, GCJ, ORP and many othe=
rs.
> Many oft them are supporting AWT none of them have builtin-support for=20
> SWING.
>=20
> My IDEA (its only an idea!) is, to make not the same fault as SUN did=20
> with SWING (althought SWING is not bad, but its really slow and does=20
> absolutly not integrate in the native gui-interface).
> I thought that it should be possible  to reinvent SWING an the top of a=20
> native gui-toolkit, but I want to ask you here, because of here are the=20
> real gui-gurus! (especally Jeff!!!)
> This implementation does not need to be exatly 100% compytible, I know=20
> this is not possible....
>=20
>=20
> So please let me ask some questions relating to this theme:
>=20
> 1.) Would it be possible to use Java-GTK as the underlaying "platform".
> I know many things need to be reinvented in SWING style, but its better=20
> to code SWING in a "high-level-way" with java-gtk than dealing with=20
> native funktions.
> java-gtk does so many nice things for me (e.g. Memory handling), that I=20
> think it would be much easier to start with jgtk than from scratch...
>=20
> 2.) What about events and layouts?
> a) Would it be possible to widly emulate swing event, using and=20
> extending the current java-gtk event-model?
> b)How would it be possible to recode the swing-layouts using java-gtk. I =

> know that swt has realized some java-like layouts using gtk...
> Would it be possible too rebuild all the layout-managers using a=20
> gtk-layout with fixed position?
> Would it be possible with boxes and tables?
>=20
> 3.)Is it important to rebuild exactly that heredity-hirachy (I=B4m sorry =

> for my bad english, I know that word is wrong..) like sun does in swing?
>=20
>=20
> I know I not experienced with both Java/JNI/java-gtk enough to start a=20
> such project, but so many people are asking, and nobody does begin.
> This really bothers me so much, so that I want to start. I know I=B4m=20
> always a little bit rash, but so I=B4m ;-)
> I want to start this project, if its possible in most parts. I know its=20
> a very big amount of work, SWING is very big and SUN did not design=20
> SWING to be easy portable to native guis. But I=B4ve heard of a=20
> static-win32 Java-Compilier which translates SWING to native=20
> MFC-Programs, so its theoretical possible!
>=20
>=20
> Good luck again, Clemens
>=20
> PS: I was able to built Java-GTK on Windows using Cygwin.
> Hmm, but thats quite a very dirty port. It still requires an X-Server.
> The whole libraries (without the X-Server) are around ~20Mb (only GTK2,=20
> Pango, ZLIB.......).
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
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