html-template-users — Discussion of HTML::Template and related modules

Re: [htmltmpl] Small questions.

[Sam T. <sa...@tr...>]

On Wed, 17 May 2006, Matias Alejo Garcia wrote:

>> Are you using caching?  Are you pre-caching your templates during
>> server startup?  If so then you can have as many includes as you want
>> and it won't make a bit of difference at runtime.
>
> Yes, we are using  shared_cached. We are no precaching, but we will once we
> reach our beta version.

Yeesh - shared_cache is terrible.  I really should remove it.  It's
no faster than file_cache and much more prone to problems.  Both are
much slower than regular cache mode.

-sam

Re: [htmltmpl] Small questions.

[Matias A. G. <ma...@ni...>]

On 5/17/06, Sam Tregar <sa...@tr...> wrote:
>
> On Wed, 17 May 2006, Matias Alejo Garcia wrote:
>
> > So, some of our pages include 200 templates (we use shared_cached=3D>1)=
.
> These
> > 'include' strategy helps our designer because its HTML code is
> reutilized
> > over and over.
> > Would you say this is a correct approach? What about performace? I know
> be
> > need to benchmark, but it there any commets you can make? Thanks!
>
> Are you using caching?  Are you pre-caching your templates during
> server startup?  If so then you can have as many includes as you want
> and it won't make a bit of difference at runtime.


Yes, we are using  shared_cached. We are no precaching, but we will once we
reach our beta version.

Thanks! Great news!

mat=EDas

-sam
>



--=20
Mat=EDas Alejo Garc=EDa

NITS Argentina
    | http://www.nits.com.ar

Re: [htmltmpl] Small questions.

[Sam T. <sa...@tr...>]

On Wed, 17 May 2006, Matias Alejo Garcia wrote:

> So, some of our pages include 200 templates (we use shared_cached=>1). These
> 'include' strategy helps our designer because its HTML code is reutilized
> over and over.
> Would you say this is a correct approach? What about performace? I know be
> need to benchmark, but it there any commets you can make? Thanks!

Are you using caching?  Are you pre-caching your templates during
server startup?  If so then you can have as many includes as you want
and it won't make a bit of difference at runtime.

-sam

Re: [htmltmpl] TMPL_SET -- this would be nice to have.

[Roger B. W. <ro...@fi...>]

On Wed, May 17, 2006 at 09:00:53AM -0400, Dmitri Tikhonov wrote:

>Oh, this is very neat.  Is this it (confused by author name):
>http://search.cpan.org/~djr/HTML-Template-Set-1.009/Set.pm

No - mine predates that, but I didn't upload it to CPAN because while it
is good enough for my use I don't think it's good enough for general
distribution.

>Maybe we can get Sam to integrate it into HTML::Template proper?

That won't happen.

>> Copy on request.
>Not sure what you mean by that...

If you would like a copy - it's very small, 689 bytes - let me know and
I'll send it to you directly.

Roger

Re: [htmltmpl] TMPL_SET -- this would be nice to have.

[Philip T. <phi...@gm...>]

Sometime Today, DT cobbled together some glyphs to say:

> Maybe we can get Sam to integrate it into HTML::Template proper?

Not going to happen.  read list archives and documentation for why.

-- 
God made everything out of nothing, but the nothingness shows through.
 		-- Paul Valery

Re: [htmltmpl] TMPL_SET -- this would be nice to have.

[Dmitri T. <dti...@vo...>]

On Wed, 2006-05-17 at 08:54 -0400, Roger Burton West wrote:
> On Wed, May 17, 2006 at 08:51:02AM -0400, Dmitri Tikhonov wrote:
> 
> >1. Is this feasible to implement?
> 
> I have done that very thing in my HTML::Template::Set extension
> module.

Oh, this is very neat.  Is this it (confused by author name):
http://search.cpan.org/~djr/HTML-Template-Set-1.009/Set.pm

Maybe we can get Sam to integrate it into HTML::Template proper?

> Copy on request.

Not sure what you mean by that...

  - Dmitri.

Re: [htmltmpl] TMPL_SET -- this would be nice to have.

[Roger B. W. <ro...@fi...>]

On Wed, May 17, 2006 at 08:51:02AM -0400, Dmitri Tikhonov wrote:

>1. Is this feasible to implement?

I have done that very thing in my HTML::Template::Set extension module.
Copy on request.

Roger

[htmltmpl] TMPL_SET -- this would be nice to have.

[Dmitri T. <dti...@vo...>]

Dear List,

In most of my templates, I have a header and a footer templates that get
included from the main template, which I assume is a very common
scenario.  My problem is that <title> tag is in the header template and
it needs to change for each template.  There are two approaches that I
can currently use:

1. Put <title> tag into main template.  This works, but I do not believe
   having <title> outside of <head> is correct HTML[1].

2. Set title from CGI script.  This is not very convenient and, in my
   mind, breaks the paradigm.

The best solution, in my mind, would be something like this:

----  template search_results.tmpl  ----
<TMPL_SET NAME='TITLE' VALUE='Search Results'>
<!-- this is where title is used -->
<TMPL_INCLUDE NAME="_header.tmpl">
<some_html_here>
<TMPL_INCLUDE NAME="_footer.tmpl">
----  end of template  ----

Questions:

1. Is this feasible to implement?
2. Is such feature compatible with HTML::Template philosophy?
3. (Bonus question) is there another approach besides the two above that
   I can use right now?

Thank you,

  - Dmitri.

1. http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/struct/global.html#h-7.4.2

Re: [htmltmpl] Small questions.

[Roger B. W. <ro...@fi...>]

On Wed, May 17, 2006 at 09:21:35AM -0300, Matias Alejo Garcia wrote:

>2) Wouldn't be nice to have a template comment tag?

You can get the same effect with:

<tmpl_if name=i_am_never_going_to_set_this_variable>
comments here
</tmpl_if>

Roger

[htmltmpl] Small questions.

[Matias A. G. <ma...@ni...>]

Hi all!

I've been using Template::HTML for 3 months, I would like to ask you a few
questions

1) In our project we are using around 50 different templates, It is very
common for us to do something like:

<tmpl_loop departments>

<tmpl_if show_picture>
   <tmpl_if picture_url>
           <tmpl_include user_picture.tmpl>
   </tmpl_if>
</tmpl_if>

<tmpl_if users>
    <tmpl_loop>
       <tmpl_include show_user.tmpl>
    </tmpl_loop>
</tmpl_if>

</tmpl_loop>

So, some of our pages include 200 templates (we use shared_cached=3D>1). Th=
ese
'include' strategy helps our designer because its HTML code is reutilized
over and over.
Would you say this is a correct approach? What about performace? I know be
need to benchmark, but it there any commets you can make? Thanks!



2) Wouldn't be nice to have a template comment tag?
I think it would be useful to describe template, and not generate HTML.  Fo=
r
example:
<!-- <tmpl_comment>
 This template shows a user. bla bla
 Inputs:
  - bla bla
</tmpl_comment>
-->
or

<!--
# This template shows a user. bla bla
# Inputs:
#  - bla bla
-->

In our project we 'compile' the templates before installing to production,
so normal HTML comments are taken away, but I think that the 'comment' tag
would be interesting to have.


Thanks!
mat=EDas

--=20
Mat=EDas Alejo Garc=EDa

NITS Argentina
    | http://www.nits.com.ar

Re: [htmltmpl] Template Error Managment

[Jamie K. <jkr...@gm...>]

Thanks Dan,

Good suggestion. I'll look in to it.

On 4/27/06, Dan Horne <dan...@re...> wrote:
> Hi
>
> Since you're using CGI::Application, have a look at
> CGI::Application::Plugin::MessageStack
>
> Dan
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: htm...@li...
> > [mailto:htm...@li...] On
> > Behalf Of Jamie Krasnoo
> > Sent: Friday, 28 April 2006 08:15
> > To: htm...@li...
> > Subject: [htmltmpl] Template Error Managment
> >
> >
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I was just wondering what some of you do for displaying
> > Errors to forms and other sections of your script through
> > HTML::Template. I'm currently using CGI::Application and
> > Data::FormValidator with H::T and I'm finding that I'm
> > defining errors within the template and using <TMPL_IF> to
> > display them if they're toggled. Using this method errors can
> > add up quite a bit. What method do you use to manage and display them?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Jamie
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web
> > services, security? Get stuff done quickly with
> > pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download
> > IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache
> > Geronimo
> > http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=3Dk&kid=120709&bid&3057&dat=121642
> > _______________________________________________
> > Html-template-users mailing list
> > Htm...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/html-template-users
> >
>
>

RE: [htmltmpl] Template Error Managment

[Dan H. <dan...@re...>]

Hi

Since you're using CGI::Application, have a look at
CGI::Application::Plugin::MessageStack=20

Dan

> -----Original Message-----
> From: htm...@li...=20
> [mailto:htm...@li...] On=20
> Behalf Of Jamie Krasnoo
> Sent: Friday, 28 April 2006 08:15
> To: htm...@li...
> Subject: [htmltmpl] Template Error Managment
>=20
>=20
> Hi all,
>=20
> I was just wondering what some of you do for displaying=20
> Errors to forms and other sections of your script through=20
> HTML::Template. I'm currently using CGI::Application and=20
> Data::FormValidator with H::T and I'm finding that I'm=20
> defining errors within the template and using <TMPL_IF> to=20
> display them if they're toggled. Using this method errors can=20
> add up quite a bit. What method do you use to manage and display them?
>=20
> Thanks,
>=20
> Jamie
>=20
>=20
> -------------------------------------------------------
> Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web=20
> services, security? Get stuff done quickly with=20
> pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download=20
> IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache=20
> Geronimo=20
> http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=3Dk&kid=120709&bid&3057&dat=121642
> _______________________________________________
> Html-template-users mailing list=20
> Htm...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/html-template-users
>=20

Re: [htmltmpl] Template Error Managment

[Mathew R. <mat...@ne...>]

In our application we use an "errors" TMPL_LOOP variable -> the=20
application code populates this variable with any errors, as in:

  push @errors, { message =3D> translate("Some error text") };

then the templates:

  <TMPL_INCLUDE errors.tmpl>

where errors.tmpl contains

  <TMPL_IF errors>
    ... <TMPL_LOOP errors> ... <TMPL_VAR message> ... </TMPL_LOOP> ...
  </TMPL_IF>

Hope this helps,
Mathew

Jamie Krasnoo wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I was just wondering what some of you do for displaying Errors to
> forms and other sections of your script through HTML::Template. I'm
> currently using CGI::Application and Data::FormValidator with H::T and
> I'm finding that I'm defining errors within the template and using
> <TMPL_IF> to display them if they're toggled. Using this method errors
> can add up quite a bit. What method do you use to manage and display
> them?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jamie
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, securit=
y?
> Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job =
easier
> Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geron=
imo
> http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=3Dk&kid=120709&bid&3057&dat=121642
> _______________________________________________
> Html-template-users mailing list
> Htm...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/html-template-users
>  =20

[htmltmpl] Template Error Managment

[Jamie K. <jkr...@gm...>]

Hi all,

I was just wondering what some of you do for displaying Errors to
forms and other sections of your script through HTML::Template. I'm
currently using CGI::Application and Data::FormValidator with H::T and
I'm finding that I'm defining errors within the template and using
<TMPL_IF> to display them if they're toggled. Using this method errors
can add up quite a bit. What method do you use to manage and display
them?

Thanks,

Jamie

Re: [htmltmpl] ESCAPE=XML

[Mathew R. <mat...@ne...>]

Hi Sam,

The highly modified version of H::T that I use, does contain an 
extensible ESCAPE plugin mechanism - main features:
- users can plugin their own ESCAPEs by deriving from H::T::ESCAPE
- ESCAPE modules are loaded at parse-time
- extra escaping modules:
  DOUBLE_QUOTE - which simply puts double quotes around the TMPL_VAR
  STRIP_NEWLINE - does as it says

The only items that I haven't specifically addressed in the escape-loader:
- I havent tested it against H::T::Expr 0.07 yet...
- the path that the modules loaded from; the current implementation does:
    eval "use HTML::Template::ESCAPE::${escape};";
  This has the effect that user-defined modules need to located in the 
system-directories rather than user-directories (which should be an easy 
fix)

It shouldn't be too much work to send a patch...
Mathew

Sam Tregar wrote:
> On Wed, 26 Apr 2006, Jim Spath wrote:
>
>> Just joined the list... excuse me if this has been posted before, but I
>> didn't find a good way to search the mailing list archives.
>>
>> I use HTML::Template for XML templates frequently, and think that
>> ESCAPE=XML would be a useful addition.  So far as I know HTML escaping
>> and XML escaping are slightly different.
>
> Patches welcome.  I'd take it either as a patch adding just these
> escapes or as a system allowing users to plugin new escape code (which
> others have asked for before).
>
> -sam
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security?
> Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job 
> easier
> Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache 
> Geronimo
> http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642
> _______________________________________________
> Html-template-users mailing list
> Htm...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/html-template-users

Re: [htmltmpl] ESCAPE=XML

[Sam T. <sa...@tr...>]

On Wed, 26 Apr 2006, Jim Spath wrote:

> Just joined the list... excuse me if this has been posted before, but I
> didn't find a good way to search the mailing list archives.
>
> I use HTML::Template for XML templates frequently, and think that
> ESCAPE=XML would be a useful addition.  So far as I know HTML escaping
> and XML escaping are slightly different.

Patches welcome.  I'd take it either as a patch adding just these
escapes or as a system allowing users to plugin new escape code (which
others have asked for before).

-sam

Re: [htmltmpl] ESCAPE=XML

[Andrew B. <an...@br...>]

On 4/26/06 at 1:08 PM, js...@fo... (Jim Spath) wrote:

> Hi all,
>=20
> Just joined the list... excuse me if this has been posted before, but
> I didn't find a good way to search the mailing list archives.

At the bottom of all list messages is a link to the list info page. From
there you can view and search the archive.

Also available at
<http://www.mail-archive.com/html-template-users%40lists.sourceforge.net
/>

>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Html-template-users mailing list
> Htm...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/html-template-users

Re: [htmltmpl] ESCAPE=XML

[Tom H. <tom...@pu...>]

Jim Spath wrote:
 > Hi all,
 >
 > Just joined the list... excuse me if this has been posted before, but I
 > didn't find a good way to search the mailing list archives.
 >
 > I use HTML::Template for XML templates frequently, and think that
 > ESCAPE=XML would be a useful addition.  So far as I know HTML escaping
 > and XML escaping are slightly different.
 >
 > Thanks!
 > - Jim Spath
 >

How are they different?

 From here: http://www.w3.org/TR/2000/REC-xml-20001006#syntax

(&) => "&"
(<) => "&lt;"
(>) => "&gt;"
(') => "&apos;"
(") => "&quot;"

What other escaping is necessary for XML?

Tom

[htmltmpl] ESCAPE=XML

[Jim S. <js...@fo...>]

Hi all,

Just joined the list... excuse me if this has been posted before, but I
didn't find a good way to search the mailing list archives.

I use HTML::Template for XML templates frequently, and think that
ESCAPE=3DXML would be a useful addition.  So far as I know HTML escaping
and XML escaping are slightly different.

Thanks!
- Jim Spath

[htmltmpl] ANNOUNCE: HTML::Template::Expr v0.07

[Sam T. <sa...@tr...>]

CHANGES

     - Added support for ESCAPE attribute in combination with EXPR.
       (Michael Peters)

     - Fixed a bug where functions which returned 0 or more than one
       return value would cause a stack under or overflow.  Functions
       are now called in scalar context, eliminating the problem.
       Thanks to Jamie Krasnoo for the spot.

DESCRIPTION

This module provides an extension to HTML::Template which allows
expressions in the template syntax.  This is purely an addition - all
the normal HTML::Template options, syntax and behaviors will still
work.

Expression support includes comparisons, math operations, string
operations and a mechanism to allow you add your own functions at
runtime.


AVAILABILITY

This module is available on SourceForge.  Download it at:

   http://html-template.sourceforge.net

The module is also available on CPAN.  You can get it using CPAN.pm or
go to:

   http://www.cpan.org/authors/id/S/SA/SAMTREGAR/


CONTACT INFO

You can join the HTML::Template mailing-list by visiting:

   http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/html-template-users

Re: [htmltmpl] H::T::Expr and escape

[Sam T. <sa...@tr...>]

On Fri, 14 Apr 2006, Michael Peters wrote:

>> I'll try my simple approach and see how that works first.
>
> This is a very simple (naive?) approach, so I may have missed something,
> but it seems to work.

Thanks, applied!

-sam

Re: [htmltmpl] H::T::Expr and escape

[Michael P. <mp...@pl...>]

Michael Peters wrote:
> 
> Sam Tregar wrote:
>> On Fri, 14 Apr 2006, Michael Peters wrote:
>>
>>> So by making the "parser smart enough" do you mean copying that huge
>>> regex from H::T and modifying it with the expr regex?
>> Yeah, or using Parse::RecDescent.  H::T::E already uses it for
>> expressions, so using it for parsing the template itself might not be
>> much slower.
> 
> I'll try my simple approach and see how that works first.

This is a very simple (naive?) approach, so I may have missed something,
but it seems to work.

-- 
Michael Peters
Developer
Plus Three, LP

Re: [htmltmpl] H::T::Expr and escape

[Sam T. <sa...@tr...>]

On Fri, 14 Apr 2006, Michael Peters wrote:

> Yeah, that makes sense, I guess I didn't really think it through. Would
> it make sense though to allow it to be used if the entire expression
> returned false?

No, I don't.  Default for normal variables is only used when a value
isn't set, false or undefined both count.  I suppose I could be
persuaded though if a good use-case was presented.

-sam

Re: [htmltmpl] H::T::Expr and escape

[Michael P. <mp...@pl...>]

Sam Tregar wrote:
> On Fri, 14 Apr 2006, Michael Peters wrote:
> 
>> So by making the "parser smart enough" do you mean copying that huge
>> regex from H::T and modifying it with the expr regex?
> 
> Yeah, or using Parse::RecDescent.  H::T::E already uses it for
> expressions, so using it for parsing the template itself might not be
> much slower.

I'll try my simple approach and see how that works first.

>> It looks like it also doesn't support 'default'.
> 
> What the heck would default do for expressions?  I can't think of
> anything reasonable...  There's no single variable to examine for a
> value in the general case.

Yeah, that makes sense, I guess I didn't really think it through. Would
it make sense though to allow it to be used if the entire expression
returned false?

>> A very simple approach would be to take any tmpl_vars/loops, etc that
>> use expr and capture anything before the expr="..." and after it and
>> then just add them to the generated tags. This however doesn't solve the
>> sub-ref problem.
> 
> What's the sub-ref problem?

I'm not sure :) I think I just mis-read your other email.

-- 
Michael Peters
Developer
Plus Three, LP

Re: [htmltmpl] H::T::Expr and escape

[Sam T. <sa...@tr...>]

On Fri, 14 Apr 2006, Michael Peters wrote:

> So by making the "parser smart enough" do you mean copying that huge
> regex from H::T and modifying it with the expr regex?

Yeah, or using Parse::RecDescent.  H::T::E already uses it for
expressions, so using it for parsing the template itself might not be
much slower.

> It looks like it also doesn't support 'default'.

What the heck would default do for expressions?  I can't think of
anything reasonable...  There's no single variable to examine for a
value in the general case.

> A very simple approach would be to take any tmpl_vars/loops, etc that
> use expr and capture anything before the expr="..." and after it and
> then just add them to the generated tags. This however doesn't solve the
> sub-ref problem.

What's the sub-ref problem?

-sam