From: <tho...@be...> - 2005-07-27 13:25:38
|
I know this is a stupid question, but I haven't found it in the FAQs. So, I'm adding targets to the Makefile (tinyx) and have successfully built. How do I determine the amount of flash that will be required for the program on the gumstix (I don't have the gumstix yet--trying to determine if I need an Xm version). Thanks, Dave Thomas |
From: Richard T. S. <rs...@pa...> - 2005-07-27 19:40:07
|
Another viewpoint: the extra 12 MB flash costs an additional $15. I certainly would have bought that capability if it had been available. By the time you get a system with all the components you will be approaching $200 so the extra flash is a 7% hit. No big deal. The thing is, stuff is being added all the time and there isn't a lot of space left with just the generic root fs. I don't have the numbers handy but I think it is like 100k before you have to start dropping things out of the build. Richard Stofer -----Original Message----- From: gum...@li... [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of tho...@be... Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 6:25 AM To: gum...@li... Subject: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? I know this is a stupid question, but I haven't found it in the FAQs. So, I'm adding targets to the Makefile (tinyx) and have successfully built. How do I determine the amount of flash that will be required for the program on the gumstix (I don't have the gumstix yet--trying to determine if I need an Xm version). Thanks, Dave Thomas ------------------------------------------------------- SF.Net email is sponsored by: Discover Easy Linux Migration Strategies from IBM. Find simple to follow Roadmaps, straightforward articles, informative Webcasts and more! Get everything you need to get up to speed, fast. http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7477&alloc_id=16492&op=click _______________________________________________ gumstix-users mailing list gum...@li... https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gumstix-users |
From: Doug S. <do...@pr...> - 2005-07-27 19:52:00
|
Regarding the buildroot, assuming there is extra storage (MMC or CF), what makes sense to me is only building the stuff required for kernel boot into the root_fs_arm. Then mount /usr/local onto MMC or CF and have there all of the additional binaries. There is no reason to have JamVM and many other things in the root file system unless they are need for the boot or convenience immediately after boot. Related to this idea, it would be nice to have a config where you select what goes into root file system and what ends up as /usr/local extra packages, and have different make tartgets like make root and make local or make extra. To the original question "How do I determine the amount of flash that will be required", run the buildroot make and look at the size of the root_fs_arm, compare that to your flash size. -- Doug |
From: Dave T. <Dav...@be...> - 2005-07-27 19:59:39
|
I agree--trouble is I can't get the xm for a while in the connex 400 Mhz-bt. Thanks, Dave Thomas ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard T. Stofer" <rs...@pa...> To: <gum...@li...> Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 3:39 PM Subject: RE: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? > Another viewpoint: the extra 12 MB flash costs an additional $15. I > certainly would have bought that capability if it had been available. > > By the time you get a system with all the components you will be approaching > $200 so the extra flash is a 7% hit. No big deal. > > The thing is, stuff is being added all the time and there isn't a lot of > space left with just the generic root fs. I don't have the numbers handy > but I think it is like 100k before you have to start dropping things out of > the build. > > Richard Stofer > > -----Original Message----- > From: gum...@li... > [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of > tho...@be... > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 6:25 AM > To: gum...@li... > Subject: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? > > > I know this is a stupid question, but I haven't found it in the FAQs. > > So, I'm adding targets to the Makefile (tinyx) and have successfully built. > How do I determine the amount of flash that will be required for the program > on the gumstix (I don't have the gumstix yet--trying to determine if I need > an Xm version). > > Thanks, > > Dave Thomas > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > SF.Net email is sponsored by: Discover Easy Linux Migration Strategies > from IBM. Find simple to follow Roadmaps, straightforward articles, > informative Webcasts and more! Get everything you need to get up to > speed, fast. http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7477&alloc_id=16492&op=click > _______________________________________________ > gumstix-users mailing list > gum...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gumstix-users > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > SF.Net email is Sponsored by the Better Software Conference & EXPO September > 19-22, 2005 * San Francisco, CA * Development Lifecycle Practices > Agile & Plan-Driven Development * Managing Projects & Teams * Testing & QA > Security * Process Improvement & Measurement * http://www.sqe.com/bsce5sf > _______________________________________________ > gumstix-users mailing list > gum...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gumstix-users > |
From: Richard T. S. <rs...@pa...> - 2005-07-27 23:30:31
|
The most recent build I have made (R527) has root_fs_arm as 2950428 bytes -----Original Message----- From: gum...@li... [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of Dave Thomas Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:02 PM To: gum...@li... Subject: Re: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? I agree--trouble is I can't get the xm for a while in the connex 400 Mhz-bt. Thanks, Dave Thomas |
From: <jer...@gm...> - 2005-08-01 06:49:53
|
Some more stupid questions about memory (tell me if I should ask for it=20 elsewhere, perhaps should it be in a FAQ) : - Is flash localised inside the CPU ? - What is the max memory size (flash) the CPU can handle ? is 16Mo already= =20 the end ? (and the max that can be put on the gumstix) - What can we do if we want more memory (with MMC or CF) AND ethernet (for= =20 exemple) - Is there a good official way to add rights on the MMC ? (ext2, ext3, jffs= 2=20 should be good ..?) 2005/7/28, Richard T. Stofer <rs...@pa...>: >=20 >=20 >=20 > The most recent build I have made (R527) has root_fs_arm as 2950428 bytes >=20 >=20 > -----Original Message----- > From: gum...@li...=20 > [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of Dave=20 > Thomas > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:02 PM > To: gum...@li... > Subject: Re: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? >=20 > I agree--trouble is I can't get the xm for a while in the connex 400=20 > Mhz-bt. >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Dave Thomas >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > ------------------------------------------------------- > SF.Net email is Sponsored by the Better Software Conference & EXPO=20 > September > 19-22, 2005 * San Francisco, CA * Development Lifecycle Practices=20 > Agile & Plan-Driven Development * Managing Projects & Teams * Testing & Q= A > Security * Process Improvement & Measurement * http://www.sqe.com/bsce5sf > _______________________________________________=20 > gumstix-users mailing list > gum...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gumstix-users=20 >=20 --=20 Jerome |
From: Don A. <do...@gu...> - 2005-08-01 15:52:34
|
Hi Jerome these are good questions. We can build the gumstix platforms (basix and connex) with either 4MB, 8MB or 16MB of flash. We offer products with 4MB or 16MB (called XM) at this time. Higher flash memory levels are not possible on the platforms due to engineering limitations. With the current product line offering a single ethernet (etherstix) and a single compact flash (cfstix) expansion board for the connex platform, it is easy to predict the near future with expansion boards of dual function that offer etherstix-type function with either a second RJ45 jack, a compact flash adapter or an mmc adapter for a range of connectivity and storage options. Don gumstix, inc. +++++++++++++++++++++ >Some more stupid questions about memory (tell me if I should ask for >it elsewhere, perhaps should it be in a FAQ) : >- Is flash localised inside the CPU ? >- What is the max memory size (flash) the CPU can handle ? is 16Mo >already the end ? (and the max that can be put on the gumstix) >- What can we do if we want more memory (with MMC or CF) AND >ethernet (for exemple) >- Is there a good official way to add rights on the MMC ? (ext2, >ext3, jffs2 should be good ..?) > >2005/7/28, Richard T. Stofer ><<mailto:rs...@pa...>rs...@pa...>: > > > >The most recent build I have made (R527) has root_fs_arm as 2950428 bytes > > >-----Original Message----- >From: ><mailto:gum...@li...>gum...@li... >[mailto:<mailto:gum...@li...>gum...@li...] >On Behalf Of Dave Thomas >Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:02 PM >To: <mailto:gum...@li...> >gum...@li... >Subject: Re: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? > >I agree--trouble is I can't get the xm for a while in the connex 400 Mhz-bt. > >Thanks, > >Dave Thomas > > > > >------------------------------------------------------- >SF.Net email is Sponsored by the Better Software Conference & EXPO September >19-22, 2005 * San Francisco, CA * Development Lifecycle Practices >Agile & Plan-Driven Development * Managing Projects & Teams * Testing & QA >Security * Process Improvement & Measurement * ><http://www.sqe.com/bsce5sf>http://www.sqe.com/bsce5sf >_______________________________________________ >gumstix-users mailing list ><mailto:gum...@li...>gum...@li... ><https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gumstix-users>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gumstix-users > > > > >-- >Jerome ==================================================================== Don Anderson http://www.gumstix.com Education & technical info: http://www.gumstix.com/support.html FAQ http://www.gumstix.org/tikiwiki/tiki-list_faqs.php Mailing list: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=38940 ==================================================================== -- |
From: Richard T. S. <rs...@pa...> - 2005-08-01 16:07:58
|
Don, Sign me up for dual Ethernet. The gumstix would make a great firewall (as in small and silent) using IPTABLES and something else to implement IP blocking based on cracking attempts. I currently use SmoothWall and it could actually work with 500MB of Compact Flash. But then, I would need CF and dual Ethernet. I could get by without Smoothwall and just use IPTABLES directly. Richard _____ From: gum...@li... [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of Don Anderson Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 8:52 AM To: gumstix-mailing-list Subject: Re: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? Hi Jerome these are good questions. We can build the gumstix platforms (basix and connex) with either 4MB, 8MB or 16MB of flash. We offer products with 4MB or 16MB (called XM) at this time. Higher flash memory levels are not possible on the platforms due to engineering limitations. With the current product line offering a single ethernet (etherstix) and a single compact flash (cfstix) expansion board for the connex platform, it is easy to predict the near future with expansion boards of dual function that offer etherstix-type function with either a second RJ45 jack, a compact flash adapter or an mmc adapter for a range of connectivity and storage options. Don gumstix, inc. +++++++++++++++++++++ Some more stupid questions about memory (tell me if I should ask for it elsewhere, perhaps should it be in a FAQ) : - Is flash localised inside the CPU ? - What is the max memory size (flash) the CPU can handle ? is 16Mo already the end ? (and the max that can be put on the gumstix) - What can we do if we want more memory (with MMC or CF) AND ethernet (for exemple) - Is there a good official way to add rights on the MMC ? (ext2, ext3, jffs2 should be good ..?) 2005/7/28, Richard T. Stofer <rs...@pa...>: The most recent build I have made (R527) has root_fs_arm as 2950428 bytes -----Original Message----- From: gum...@li... [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of Dave Thomas Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:02 PM To: gum...@li... Subject: Re: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? I agree--trouble is I can't get the xm for a while in the connex 400 Mhz-bt. Thanks, Dave Thomas ------------------------------------------------------- SF.Net email is Sponsored by the Better Software Conference & EXPO September 19-22, 2005 * San Francisco, CA * Development Lifecycle Practices Agile & Plan-Driven Development * Managing Projects & Teams * Testing & QA Security * Process Improvement & Measurement * http://www.sqe.com/bsce5sf _______________________________________________ gumstix-users mailing list gum...@li... https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gumstix-users -- Jerome ==================================================================== Don Anderson http://www.gumstix.com Education & technical info: http://www.gumstix.com/support.html FAQ http://www.gumstix.org/tikiwiki/tiki-list_faqs.php Mailing list: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=38940 ==================================================================== -- |
From: John D. <sv...@ot...> - 2005-08-02 12:08:30
Attachments:
smime.p7s
|
I would also like to see a dual-ethernet version. It would be like having the hardware of most routers, Bluetooth-access-points etc. custom built to your needs! Do you want DHCP server? Of course. Do you want also DNS server (most “home” routers do not have it)? Of course. NTP Server? Of course. The 16MB version I think could handle this. I am planning to order one when I return from vacations. I am waiting the “XM” + Bluetooth to get available. I have been using gumstix, for tests mainly, for over a year. I can see that it starts to “mature”. This is good. Some cleaning-up is needed on some projects (eliminate buildroot glitches, improve documentation) to start seeing impressive things from this little linux. Also, if there is an option to include GCC (native ARM) on the 16MB system, so that we can make projects ON gumstix, without messing-up with cross-compile, it would definitely help. Then the next step would be for us to have the dual-ethernet + Compact flash version of expansion card, mount CF as root, add a 4GB flash there, add a client to Gentoo’s source repository (emerge), and then we are there! We include whatever we like! Our mini-server is done! ULTRA-ULTRA portable, battery backup power (hook it to your car, and it will work for years!). What else do we need? I think I am really carried out… John. _____ From: gum...@li... [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of Richard T. Stofer Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 7:07 PM To: gum...@li... Subject: RE: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? Don, Sign me up for dual Ethernet. The gumstix would make a great firewall (as in small and silent) using IPTABLES and something else to implement IP blocking based on cracking attempts. I currently use SmoothWall and it could actually work with 500MB of Compact Flash. But then, I would need CF and dual Ethernet. I could get by without Smoothwall and just use IPTABLES directly. Richard _____ From: gum...@li... [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of Don Anderson Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 8:52 AM To: gumstix-mailing-list Subject: Re: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? Hi Jerome these are good questions. We can build the gumstix platforms (basix and connex) with either 4MB, 8MB or 16MB of flash. We offer products with 4MB or 16MB (called XM) at this time. Higher flash memory levels are not possible on the platforms due to engineering limitations. With the current product line offering a single ethernet (etherstix) and a single compact flash (cfstix) expansion board for the connex platform, it is easy to predict the near future with expansion boards of dual function that offer etherstix-type function with either a second RJ45 jack, a compact flash adapter or an mmc adapter for a range of connectivity and storage options. Don gumstix, inc. +++++++++++++++++++++ Some more stupid questions about memory (tell me if I should ask for it elsewhere, perhaps should it be in a FAQ) : - Is flash localised inside the CPU ? - What is the max memory size (flash) the CPU can handle ? is 16Mo already the end ? (and the max that can be put on the gumstix) - What can we do if we want more memory (with MMC or CF) AND ethernet (for exemple) - Is there a good official way to add rights on the MMC ? (ext2, ext3, jffs2 should be good ..?) 2005/7/28, Richard T. Stofer <rs...@pa...>: The most recent build I have made (R527) has root_fs_arm as 2950428 bytes -----Original Message----- From: gum...@li... [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of Dave Thomas Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:02 PM To: gum...@li... Subject: Re: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? I agree--trouble is I can't get the xm for a while in the connex 400 Mhz-bt. Thanks, Dave Thomas ------------------------------------------------------- SF.Net email is Sponsored by the Better Software Conference & EXPO September 19-22, 2005 * San Francisco, CA * Development Lifecycle Practices Agile & Plan-Driven Development * Managing Projects & Teams * Testing & QA Security * Process Improvement & Measurement * http://www.sqe.com/bsce5sf _______________________________________________ gumstix-users mailing list gum...@li... https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gumstix-users -- Jerome ==================================================================== Don Anderson http://www.gumstix.com Education & technical info: http://www.gumstix.com/support.html FAQ http://www.gumstix.org/tikiwiki/tiki-list_faqs.php Mailing list: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=38940 ==================================================================== -- |
From: Dave H. <dhy...@gm...> - 2005-08-02 13:08:26
|
Hi John, > Also, if there is an option to include GCC (native ARM) on the 16MB syste= m, > so that we can make projects ON gumstix, without messing-up with > cross-compile, it would definitely help.=20 Umm - the cross compiler on the PC is around 90 Mb. You could expect it to be in a similar ballpark for the ARM native version. It's interesting to note that 50% of that space is just the inlude files. There are almost 2000 header files. It would certainly be doable with an MMC card. You'd probably need an NFS mounted drive to build the toolchain, since you need just over 600 Mb of space in order to build the toolchain. --=20 Dave Hylands Vancouver, BC, Canada http://www.DaveHylands.com/ |
From: John D. <sv...@ot...> - 2005-08-02 14:46:46
Attachments:
smime.p7s
|
I can understand this. I did not realize the size needed, but it makes = sense. Since my last Visual Studio beta, came in 2 DVD + 1 CD!!! The idea to mount a flash memory disk (either MMC or CF) is possibly the = best solution. I am not that familiar with Linux development. I am much used to = Windows, and I find it difficult to figure out where to put files after = you complete the build with cross-compiler. The documentation of linux, = sometimes assumes that you have to be THE linux user, if you come to = cross-compiling. All how-to guides, mention just "make && make install" = as a solution to all. If not, dig deep to the makefile to see what is = needed and on which directory. Maybe it is a good idea for Gumstix, (if other people find difficulties = there also, and I am not the only one) to create an MMC (128/256MB) = charge let's say, $30-$50 in addition to the MMC cost, that will have a = ready-made cut-down gcc compiler, (cut-down means use only files/headers = needed) that we can chroot to it, and work. I assume chroot is the way = to go, since I know that you have to copy things to /usr/... directories = to make things work. The other (HERETIC) way is to supply Windows CE for this board. I hate = to say to all Linux fans, I am NOT trying to start a Windows vs. Linux = debate, but the new Visual Studio 2005, is something you get addicted = to. It is sooo smooth, to compile, deploy and debug applications = directly to a Pocket PC. Write a piece of code inside an IDE, press F5, = and compilation / deployment are automatic. Debugger is ready to = kick-in.=20 John. -----Original Message----- From: gum...@li... = [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of Dave = Hylands Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 4:08 PM To: gum...@li... Subject: Re: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? Hi John, > Also, if there is an option to include GCC (native ARM) on the 16MB = system, > so that we can make projects ON gumstix, without messing-up with > cross-compile, it would definitely help.=20 Umm - the cross compiler on the PC is around 90 Mb. You could expect it to be in a similar ballpark for the ARM native version. It's interesting to note that 50% of that space is just the inlude files. There are almost 2000 header files. It would certainly be doable with an MMC card. You'd probably need an NFS mounted drive to build the toolchain, since you need just over 600 Mb of space in order to build the toolchain. --=20 Dave Hylands Vancouver, BC, Canada http://www.DaveHylands.com/ ------------------------------------------------------- SF.Net email is sponsored by: Discover Easy Linux Migration Strategies from IBM. Find simple to follow Roadmaps, straightforward articles, informative Webcasts and more! Get everything you need to get up to speed, fast. http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_idt77&alloc_id=16492&op=C3=8Ck _______________________________________________ gumstix-users mailing list gum...@li... https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gumstix-users |
From: Dave H. <dhy...@gm...> - 2005-08-02 14:59:58
|
Hi John, > I am not that familiar with Linux development. I am much used to Windows,= and I find it difficult to figure out where to put files after you complet= e the build with cross-compiler. The documentation of linux, sometimes assu= mes that you have to be THE linux user, if you come to cross-compiling. All= how-to guides, mention just "make && make install" as a solution to all. I= f not, dig deep to the makefile to see what is needed and on which director= y. Well, ask questions on the list. There is no such thing as a dumb question, just dumb answers. There are a few things that really need to go in certain places because that's where other things expect to find them. For a lot of stuff, it really doesn't matter, and you can put it where it makes the most sense to you. This is especially true on the embedded systems. > Maybe it is a good idea for Gumstix, (if other people find difficulties t= here also, and I am not the only one) to create an MMC (128/256MB) charge l= et's say, $30-$50 in addition to the MMC cost, that will have a ready-made = cut-down gcc compiler, (cut-down means use only files/headers needed) that = we can chroot to it, and work. I assume chroot is the way to go, since I kn= ow that you have to copy things to /usr/... directories to make things work= . You could fit the entire thing on a 128Mb MMC card, and there wouldn't be any need to copy anything into /usr. The compiler could just run off the MMC card. One thing to be aware of though, the compiler can be fairly memory intensive as well, so you would have to limit the size/complexity of some of the compilation stuff being done. > The other (HERETIC) way is to supply Windows CE for this board. I hate to= say to all Linux fans, I am NOT trying to start a Windows vs. Linux debate= , but the new Visual Studio 2005, is something you get addicted to. It is s= ooo smooth, to compile, deploy and debug applications directly to a Pocket = PC. Write a piece of code inside an IDE, press F5, and compilation / deploy= ment are automatic. Debugger is ready to kick-in. I've heard rumors that somebody is working on a Windows CE port. P.S. The debugger on the gumstix works too. --=20 Dave Hylands Vancouver, BC, Canada http://www.DaveHylands.com/ |
From: John D. <sv...@ot...> - 2005-08-02 15:39:37
Attachments:
smime.p7s
|
Thanks for the info. I have tried to cross-compile Jeeps, and it needed = some libraries into specific directories for things to work. I am = familiar with Windows, where if a DLL is in the same directory as the = .EXE, everybody is happy. On Linux, shared libraries should go outside = the application. The 64MB RAM that gumstix has, was 5-10 years ago our desktop computer! = I can understand that it will have a hard time recompiling GNOME or KDE, = (my desktop computer has), but I can understand that there will be = limitations. As for the CE port, I hear about this for months, but still no progress. = My point of view is that it is not a good idea to do such a thing, "in = our leisure time". Even if some people will succeed, then they will = create a CE image, which will cost, (I think Micro$oft charges $3-$5 if = no GUI is involved) or create a project for Platform Builder, which = means that everyone needs a $1000 piece of software. My point of view is that this is Gumstix's job. They should do it, or = outsource it, and supply it as an option with their boards. It would be = great to have this (Windows CE) in such a low-cost board. I use gumstix to replace microcontrollers in my hobby electronics = projects. It is good to have Bluetooth, networking, tons of memory, fast = processor (compared to 8-bit microcontrollers). But, most companies, = charge thousands for their "development" boards. Gumstix is much more = reasonable, but their new XM-Bluetooth, starts to climb in price. I know = that hardware costs, but if I reach the point that the gumstix + = expansion board + windowsCE reaches the 250+ point, I buy a new PDA, = take its guts out, and there is my computer! John. -----Original Message----- From: gum...@li... = [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of Dave = Hylands Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 6:00 PM To: gum...@li... Subject: Re: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? Hi John, > I am not that familiar with Linux development. I am much used to = Windows, and I find it difficult to figure out where to put files after = you complete the build with cross-compiler. The documentation of linux, = sometimes assumes that you have to be THE linux user, if you come to = cross-compiling. All how-to guides, mention just "make && make install" = as a solution to all. If not, dig deep to the makefile to see what is = needed and on which directory. Well, ask questions on the list. There is no such thing as a dumb question, just dumb answers. There are a few things that really need to go in certain places because that's where other things expect to find them. For a lot of stuff, it really doesn't matter, and you can put it where it makes the most sense to you. This is especially true on the embedded systems. > Maybe it is a good idea for Gumstix, (if other people find = difficulties there also, and I am not the only one) to create an MMC = (128/256MB) charge let's say, $30-$50 in addition to the MMC cost, that = will have a ready-made cut-down gcc compiler, (cut-down means use only = files/headers needed) that we can chroot to it, and work. I assume = chroot is the way to go, since I know that you have to copy things to = /usr/... directories to make things work. You could fit the entire thing on a 128Mb MMC card, and there wouldn't be any need to copy anything into /usr. The compiler could just run off the MMC card. One thing to be aware of though, the compiler can be fairly memory intensive as well, so you would have to limit the size/complexity of some of the compilation stuff being done. > The other (HERETIC) way is to supply Windows CE for this board. I hate = to say to all Linux fans, I am NOT trying to start a Windows vs. Linux = debate, but the new Visual Studio 2005, is something you get addicted = to. It is sooo smooth, to compile, deploy and debug applications = directly to a Pocket PC. Write a piece of code inside an IDE, press F5, = and compilation / deployment are automatic. Debugger is ready to = kick-in. I've heard rumors that somebody is working on a Windows CE port. P.S. The debugger on the gumstix works too. --=20 Dave Hylands Vancouver, BC, Canada http://www.DaveHylands.com/ ------------------------------------------------------- SF.Net email is sponsored by: Discover Easy Linux Migration Strategies from IBM. Find simple to follow Roadmaps, straightforward articles, informative Webcasts and more! Get everything you need to get up to speed, fast. http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_idt77&alloc_id=16492&op=C3=8Ck _______________________________________________ gumstix-users mailing list gum...@li... https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gumstix-users |
From: Cedric <ced...@fr...> - 2005-08-02 15:23:58
|
On Tuesday 02 August 2005 16:46, John Doukakis wrote: > I can understand this. I did not realize the size needed, but it makes > sense. Since my last Visual Studio beta, came in 2 DVD + 1 CD!!! > > The idea to mount a flash memory disk (either MMC or CF) is possibly the > best solution. > > I am not that familiar with Linux development. I am much used to Windows, > and I find it difficult to figure out where to put files after you > complete the build with cross-compiler. The documentation of linux, > sometimes assumes that you have to be THE linux user, if you come to > cross-compiling. All how-to guides, mention just "make && make install" > as a solution to all. If not, dig deep to the makefile to see what is > needed and on which directory. In fact it really depend on the solution used to build the ROM and the application. For example, using OpenEmbedded (http://openembedded.org/) require much less work to do new package and already provide a lot of application. I see that some early work was done to support the Gumstix board, but it didn't move anymore. This solution provide package and image generation. It could be very usefull, so that we can have a repository of precompiled and tested package with a tiny minimal ROM. Adding new package will be as simple as doing ipkg install somestuff :) And of-course, it will be more easy for every one to have is own feed. What did you think of this idea ? > Maybe it is a good idea for Gumstix, (if other people find difficulties > there also, and I am not the only one) to create an MMC (128/256MB) > charge let's say, $30-$50 in addition to the MMC cost, that will have a > ready-made cut-down gcc compiler, (cut-down means use only files/headers > needed) that we can chroot to it, and work. I assume chroot is the way to > go, since I know that you have to copy things to /usr/... directories to > make things work. It's really not a good solution as you will not be able to compile every thing and will need a lot of memory and processor time. |
From: John D. <sv...@ot...> - 2005-08-02 17:20:24
Attachments:
smime.p7s
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I would really like to see improvements in this area. Unfortunately the last years, all programmers are getting spoiled with IDE and makefiles seem something of the past. The quality and easiness of the development system, affect both the speed and the quality of the final product. If it is difficult to spot bugs, then your project will have slow progress. The problem gets worse, by the fact that most popular microcontrollers have IDE from their companies (Microchip, Atmel). It is hard to go to makefiles and command line, when you need something bigger. I am not familiar with OpenEmbedded and to what extent this improves the situation mentioned, but if things can get simpler, then it is welcome by everybody. I do not see also, anything wrong, going the pre-built package way. Anybody can select his own packages, but dependencies can be built into them. Also I would like to see a "branch" of the buildroot, dedicated to storing the linux image into a MMC/CF card. It costs next to nothing to get an 128MB version of these, and 128MB is 32 times the original gumstix memory! John. -----Original Message----- From: gum...@li... [mailto:gum...@li...] On Behalf Of Cedric Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 6:23 PM To: gum...@li... Subject: Re: [Gumstix-users] Newbie: Program Size in Flash? On Tuesday 02 August 2005 16:46, John Doukakis wrote: > I can understand this. I did not realize the size needed, but it makes > sense. Since my last Visual Studio beta, came in 2 DVD + 1 CD!!! > > The idea to mount a flash memory disk (either MMC or CF) is possibly the > best solution. > > I am not that familiar with Linux development. I am much used to Windows, > and I find it difficult to figure out where to put files after you > complete the build with cross-compiler. The documentation of linux, > sometimes assumes that you have to be THE linux user, if you come to > cross-compiling. All how-to guides, mention just "make && make install" > as a solution to all. If not, dig deep to the makefile to see what is > needed and on which directory. In fact it really depend on the solution used to build the ROM and the application. For example, using OpenEmbedded (http://openembedded.org/) require much less work to do new package and already provide a lot of application. I see that some early work was done to support the Gumstix board, but it didn't move anymore. This solution provide package and image generation. It could be very usefull, so that we can have a repository of precompiled and tested package with a tiny minimal ROM. Adding new package will be as simple as doing ipkg install somestuff :) And of-course, it will be more easy for every one to have is own feed. What did you think of this idea ? > Maybe it is a good idea for Gumstix, (if other people find difficulties > there also, and I am not the only one) to create an MMC (128/256MB) > charge let's say, $30-$50 in addition to the MMC cost, that will have a > ready-made cut-down gcc compiler, (cut-down means use only files/headers > needed) that we can chroot to it, and work. I assume chroot is the way to > go, since I know that you have to copy things to /usr/... directories to > make things work. It's really not a good solution as you will not be able to compile every thing and will need a lot of memory and processor time. ------------------------------------------------------- SF.Net email is sponsored by: Discover Easy Linux Migration Strategies from IBM. Find simple to follow Roadmaps, straightforward articles, informative Webcasts and more! Get everything you need to get up to speed, fast. http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7477&alloc_id=16492&op=click _______________________________________________ gumstix-users mailing list gum...@li... https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gumstix-users |
From: Dave H. <dhy...@gm...> - 2005-08-02 17:38:33
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Hi John, > I would really like to see improvements in this area. Unfortunately the l= ast > years, all programmers are getting spoiled with IDE and makefiles seem > something of the past. Umm. Certainly any linux based IDE tools will work fine (i.e. Eclipse or others). > The problem gets worse, by the fact that most popular microcontrollers ha= ve > IDE from their companies (Microchip, Atmel). It is hard to go to makefile= s and > command line, when you need something bigger. Personally, I prefer command line tools. This is mostly because I have to deal with a half dozen or so different environments, some WIndows, some Linux, and if I had to learn a different IDE for each one (because so far I've yet to see anybody standardize) it would take forever. I use a decent editor (Visual SlickEdit) which can front-end any of my make sessions, run gdb sessions from within it, etc. I even build my Visual C++ stuff using the command line tools. Once you learn one set of GCC based tools, all of the other are VERY similar. In fact my makefiles for building gumstix stuff and my makefiles for building AVR stuff are about 90% identical (well, they actually include the same rules files). I run cygwin under Windows, so that I can have a real shell, and this also makes switching environments that much less painful. > The quality and easiness of the development system, affect both the speed= and > the quality of the final product. If it is difficult to spot bugs, then y= our > project will have slow progress. Here's my perspective after writing software for close to 20 years: 1 - Better not to write the bugs in the first place :) 2 - I think people get sucked in by all these whiz-bang IDE's and forget to DESIGN the software properly in the first place :) 3 - I always like to have some debug infrastructure which allows me to figure stuff out without the debugger. This becomes even more important when you need to support stuff when you're in the field, or talking to somebody in the field over the phone who doesn't know a debugger from a hole in the wall, but can probably type some commands and capture some output on a terminal program. --=20 Dave Hylands Vancouver, BC, Canada http://www.DaveHylands.com/ |
From: Tim A. <ti...@ut...> - 2005-08-09 17:55:47
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On 2 Aug 2005, at 16:23, Cedric wrote: [...] > In fact it really depend on the solution used to build the ROM and the > application. For example, using OpenEmbedded (http://openembedded.org/) > require much less work to do new package and already provide a lot of > application. Having just built an OpenEmbedded system for my NSLU2 (another small XScale-based Linux system) I think OpenEmbedded for the Gumstix would be a great idea. I much prefer the OE / BitBake configuration to the current buildroot system, it's very easy to build individual packages and deploy them with bitbake/ipkg. Tim |
From: Craig H. <cr...@gu...> - 2005-08-09 23:47:43
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On Aug 1, 2005, at 9:06 AM, Richard T. Stofer wrote: > I currently use SmoothWall and it could actually work with 500MB > of Compact Flash. But then, I would need CF and dual Ethernet. I > could get by without Smoothwall and just use IPTABLES directly. How about NFS mounting the 500MB? Presumably one side of the firewall is on you LAN... C |
From: Dave H. <dhy...@gm...> - 2005-07-27 20:17:56
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Hi Dave, > I know this is a stupid question, but I haven't found it in the FAQs. No such thing as a stupid question - just stupid answers :) > So, I'm adding targets to the Makefile (tinyx) and have successfully buil= t. How do I determine the amount of flash that will be required for the pr= ogram on the gumstix (I don't have the gumstix yet--trying to determine if = I need an Xm version). Well, the size of the root_fs_arm file in gumstix_buildroot is what gets loaded into flash. You need to round this up to the next multiple of 128K. u-boot uses two 128K pages (if I remember correctly). If you plan on making any changes to the filesystem once it's loaded, jffs2 wants upto 5 pages (128K each - you might get away with less, and you might not). --=20 Dave Hylands Vancouver, BC, Canada http://www.DaveHylands.com/ |
From: Craig H. <cr...@gu...> - 2005-08-09 23:46:29
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On Jul 27, 2005, at 6:25 AM, <tho...@be...> <tho...@be...> wrote: > > I know this is a stupid question, but I haven't found it in the FAQs. > > So, I'm adding targets to the Makefile (tinyx) and have > successfully built. How do I determine the amount of flash that > will be required for the program on the gumstix (I don't have the > gumstix yet--trying to determine if I need an Xm version). Once you've built the buildroot, check the size of the file root_fs_arm -- that's the image which gets copied to flash, so that shows you how much total flash space you'll need. Note that 2 sectors (256k total) of flash is used for the bootloader, leaving 30*128k (= 3.75MB) on the regular gumstix and 126*128k (= 25.75MB) on XM. C |