fxruby-users — General-purpose discussion list for FXRuby

Re: [Fxruby-users] (Non)modal dialogues.

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Fri, 18 Jul 2003, Lyle Johnson wrote:

> Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:
>
> > Yes, that helps.  I'm puzzled about this design though: the Dialog
> > box would have to ask the application to ask the dialog box?  This
> > runs counter to "Tell, don't ask", IMO, if I understood that
> > philosophy correctly.
>
> [execute] starts a modal event loop for the dialog box. The code
> [is like]:
>
>      def execute(placement=PLACEMENT_CURSOR)
>        create;  show(placement)
>        getApp().runModalFor(self)
>      end
>
> [...] When you later send either the ID_ACCEPT or ID_CANCEL
> [it is like]

>      def onCmdAccept
>        getApp().stopModal(self, 1)
>        hide
>      end
>
> So again, it is the application that keeps track of who's modal and who
> isn't.

OK, this fits in with "finish what you start".  But since a dialog
box may operate modally or nonmodally, to not make that available to
themselves
...

Right, I think I have managed to argue myself rount to the opposite
viewpoint to which I had before:  A DialogBox should never need to
know if it is modal or not, because the flexible way to operate is
to rely on the message target system alone.  If the caller uses the
return value from execute(), that is their choice.  Also, it is up to
the caller to hide the DialogBox if they invoked it nonmodally,
because this is more in line with "tell, don't ask", the box doesn't
even have to ask itself, and because nonmodal operation doesn't make
it clear when the window is no longer needed.

I can think of things that way round, unless that reasoning is
flawed...
>
> Hope this helps,
>
        Thank you,
        Hugh
> Lyle
>
>

Re: [Fxruby-users] (Non)modal dialogues.

[Lyle J. <jl...@cf...>]

Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:

>> On Fri, 18 Jul 2003, Lyle Johnson wrote:
>>
>> >      getApp().modal?(theDialogBox)
>>
>> Yes, that helps.  I'm puzzled about this design though: the Dialog
>> box would have to ask the application to ask the dialog box?  This
> 
> I've just checked: it doesn't even inherit this method.

I'm not sure what you mean. getApp() is an inherited instance method for 
FXDialogBox. As we've discussed before, the way it's listed in the 
documentation is as an attr_reader called "app", although you can use it 
either way, i.e.

     getApp().modal?(...)

or

     app.modal?(...)

The getApp() method is inherited from FXId, way up there in the class 
hierarchy.

And modal? is just an instance method for FXApp.

Lyle

Re: [Fxruby-users] (Non)modal dialogues.

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Fri, 18 Jul 2003, Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:

> On Fri, 18 Jul 2003, Lyle Johnson wrote:
>
> >      getApp().modal?(theDialogBox)
>
> Yes, that helps.  I'm puzzled about this design though: the Dialog
> box would have to ask the application to ask the dialog box?  This

I've just checked: it doesn't even inherit this method.
        Hugh

Re: [Fxruby-users] (Non)modal dialogues.

[Lyle J. <jl...@cf...>]

Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:

> Yes, that helps.  I'm puzzled about this design though: the Dialog
> box would have to ask the application to ask the dialog box?  This
> runs counter to "Tell, don't ask", IMO, if I understood that
> philosophy correctly.

The dialog box doesn't own the information about whether it's modal or 
not, the application does. When you do:

     dialogBox.execute

the application starts a modal event loop for the dialog box. The code 
for FXDialogBox#execute is of course implemented in C++, but if it were 
in Ruby it would look something like this:

     def execute(placement=PLACEMENT_CURSOR)
       create
       show(placement)
       getApp().runModalFor(self)
     end

At this point, control returns to the event loop which is now modal for 
this dialog box. When you later send either the ID_ACCEPT or ID_CANCEL 
command message to the dialog box, this modal loop is terminated. In 
Ruby code, the message handlers for those would look something like:

     def onCmdAccept
       getApp().stopModal(self, 1)
       hide
     end

     def onCmdCancel
       getApp().stopModal(self, 0)
       hide
     end

So again, it is the application that keeps track of who's modal and who 
isn't.

Hope this helps,

Lyle

Re: [Fxruby-users] (Non)modal dialogues.

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Fri, 18 Jul 2003, Lyle Johnson wrote:

> Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:
>
> > FXDialogBoxes can be modal or nonmodal, and if they are model it
> > makes sense to use ID_ACCEPT or ID_CANCEL to effect the return value
> > of execute, otherwise one makes them disappear with hide.
> >
> > So, how does code in a subclassed FXDialogBox test whether the box
> > is modal or not?
>
> You should be able to use:
>
>      getApp().modal?(theDialogBox)
>
> Hope this helps,

Yes, that helps.  I'm puzzled about this design though: the Dialog
box would have to ask the application to ask the dialog box?  This
runs counter to "Tell, don't ask", IMO, if I understood that
philosophy correctly.
>
> Lyle
>
        Thank you,
        Hugh
>

Re: [Fxruby-users] (Non)modal dialogues.

[Lyle J. <jl...@cf...>]

Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:

> FXDialogBoxes can be modal or nonmodal, and if they are model it
> makes sense to use ID_ACCEPT or ID_CANCEL to effect the return value
> of execute, otherwise one makes them disappear with hide.
> 
> So, how does code in a subclassed FXDialogBox test whether the box
> is modal or not?

You should be able to use:

     getApp().modal?(theDialogBox)

Hope this helps,

Lyle

Re: [Fxruby-users] FXImage and FXIcon

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Fri, 18 Jul 2003, Dmitry Morozhnikov wrote:

> On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 11:56:08 +0100 (BST)
> Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng <hg...@dm...> wrote:

> > I've not done this, but I think you can just call FXIcon.new using
> > the same pixel buffer as you did for making the FXImage, and the
> > options (opts) appear to be the same too.
>
> gm.. do you mean:
>
> image = FXImage.new(...)

image = FXImage.new(app, pixels)

> icon = FXIcon.new(..., image.data, ...)

icon = FXIcon.new(app, pixels, ...)
>
> it not work. image.data looks like raw RGB, but it not work with FXRGBIcon too..

FXRGBIcon uses similar args, but is based on the same data buffer as
FXRGBImage.  FXRGBImage and FXImage are not the same thing, of
course.  So it really depends on what you are passing in to create
your image, which you have not stated.  As I say, I have not had to
do this yet.  Maybe:
(a) show us more code so we can see what failed
(b) someone who knows better than me can answer from the above info.

I just found the above out from
http://www.fxruby.org/doc/api/
>
> DMIceman, Dmitry Morozhnikov, PGPKEY: 0xB6C14D95

        Hugh

Re: [Fxruby-users] FXImage and FXIcon

[Dmitry M. <dmi...@ma...>]

On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 11:56:08 +0100 (BST)
Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng <hg...@dm...> wrote:

> On Fri, 18 Jul 2003, Dmitry Morozhnikov wrote:
> 
> > hi all
> >
> > sorry for stupid question, but how i can convert FXImage to FXIcon (to show it in FXLabel for example)?
> 
> I've not done this, but I think you can just call FXIcon.new using
> the same pixel buffer as you did for making the FXImage, and the
> options (opts) appear to be the same too.

gm.. do you mean:

image = FXImage.new(...)
icon = FXIcon.new(..., image.data, ...)

it not work. image.data looks like raw RGB, but it not work with FXRGBIcon too..

-- 
DMIceman, Dmitry Morozhnikov, PGPKEY: 0xB6C14D95

Re: [Fxruby-users] FXImage and FXIcon

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Fri, 18 Jul 2003, Dmitry Morozhnikov wrote:

> hi all
>
> sorry for stupid question, but how i can convert FXImage to FXIcon (to show it in FXLabel for example)?

I've not done this, but I think you can just call FXIcon.new using
the same pixel buffer as you did for making the FXImage, and the
options (opts) appear to be the same too.
>
> --
> DMIceman, Dmitry Morozhnikov, PGPKEY: 0xB6C14D95
>
>
        Hugh

[Fxruby-users] FXImage and FXIcon

[Dmitry M. <dmi...@ma...>]

hi all

sorry for stupid question, but how i can convert FXImage to FXIcon (to show it in FXLabel for example)?

-- 
DMIceman, Dmitry Morozhnikov, PGPKEY: 0xB6C14D95

[Fxruby-users] (Non)modal dialogues.

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

FXDialogBoxes can be modal or nonmodal, and if they are model it
makes sense to use ID_ACCEPT or ID_CANCEL to effect the return value
of execute, otherwise one makes them disappear with hide.

So, how does code in a subclassed FXDialogBox test whether the box
is modal or not?

        Hugh

Re: [Fxruby-users] layout probs with TreeList.

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003, Lyle Johnson wrote:

> Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:
>
> > Oh, so that is an inherited attribute then, as it is not listed....
>
> Yes.
>
> > Yes, that did the job.
>
> Good.
>
> > I have since tried removing the layout hints from contents (the
> > horizontal frame, and found that I get the uncorrected behaviour.
>
> Right.
>
> > I see from the FOX Docs that these FILL_ hints cause this hehaviour:
> > "If more than one child with this option is placed side by side, the
> > available space will be subdivided proportionally to their default
> > size."
> > So when I had not set the FILL_X before, I was effectively getting
> > this anyway because of how LAYOUT_MIN_(WIDTH|HEIGHT) behave, and
> > when I turned this off in the contents (Horiz.  frame) I was getting
> > this too.  Only if One child and the the parent use LAYOUT_FILL will
> > that child be stretched to fill the parent.  Is that about right?
>
> Ummm, you lost me somewhere in there ;)
>
> When you don't specify, say, LAYOUT_FILL_X, the widget will usually just
> take up as much space as it needs (a.k.a. its "default" width). I don't
> think LAYOUT_FILL_* is ever a default behavior, though.

I think LAYOUT_MIN_WIDTH and LAYOUT_MIN_HEIGHT are the defaults for
the child widgets.  So the parent would, by default, allocate
according to that space.  If two children in the same (X|Y) have
LAYOUT_FILL_(X|Y) they conflict, so the parent must still use the
defaults.  If only one child has LAYOUT_FILL_(X|Y) then the parent
must have it too for it to take notice.  Is that right?
It is the parent's need for this hint that is difficult for me: I
thought it got the hints from its children...


> > If so this feels rather like Tk: I remember having to use fill
> > rather a lot when I used that.
>
> Yes, most modern GUI toolkits' layout managers owe a lot of their
> heritage to Tk's Packer layout manager. I know that some of GTK's layout
> managers are based on this concept, and I'm guessing that Qt's are as well.

Yes, I have got this impression, too. But there is a surprising
amount of criticism of Tk, particularly about it being "old
fashioned", about the place.
>
>
        Hugh

Re: [Fxruby-users] layout probs with TreeList.

[Lyle J. <jl...@cf...>]

Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:

> Oh, so that is an inherited attribute then, as it is not listed....

Yes.

> Yes, that did the job.

Good.

> I have since tried removing the layout hints from contents (the
> horizontal frame, and found that I get the uncorrected behaviour.

Right.

> I see from the FOX Docs that these FILL_ hints cause this hehaviour:
> "If more than one child with this option is placed side by side, the
> available space will be subdivided proportionally to their default
> size."
> So when I had not set the FILL_X before, I was effectively getting
> this anyway because of how LAYOUT_MIN_(WIDTH|HEIGHT) behave, and
> when I turned this off in the contents (Horiz.  frame) I was getting
> this too.  Only if One child and the the parent use LAYOUT_FILL will
> that child be stretched to fill the parent.  Is that about right?

Ummm, you lost me somewhere in there ;)

When you don't specify, say, LAYOUT_FILL_X, the widget will usually just 
take up as much space as it needs (a.k.a. its "default" width). I don't 
think LAYOUT_FILL_* is ever a default behavior, though.

> If so this feels rather like Tk: I remember having to use fill
> rather a lot when I used that.

Yes, most modern GUI toolkits' layout managers owe a lot of their 
heritage to Tk's Packer layout manager. I know that some of GTK's layout 
managers are based on this concept, and I'm guessing that Qt's are as well.

Re: [Fxruby-users] layout probs with TreeList.

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003, Lyle Johnson wrote:

> Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:
>
> > OK, so the problem is not due to using that ATTR to do the job,
> > anyway....
>
> Whoops, yes, that is a problem. My mistake. The 'listStyle' attribute
> only deals with the treelist-specific options (e.g.
> TREELIST_SHOWS_LINES). So let's break that line up into:
>
>      @treeview[""].listStyle |=
>          TREELIST_SHOWS_LINES|TREELIST_SHOWS_BOXES|TREELIST_ROOT_BOXES
>      @treeview[""].layoutHints = LAYOUT_FILL_X|LAYOUT_FILL_Y

Oh, so that is an inherited attribute then, as it is not listed....
>
> and see if the layout hints "take" this time ;)

Yes, that did the job.

I have since tried removing the layout hints from contents (the
horizontal frame, and found that I get the uncorrected behaviour.
I see from the FOX Docs that these FILL_ hints cause this hehaviour:
"If more than one child with this option is placed side by side, the
available space will be subdivided proportionally to their default
size."
So when I had not set the FILL_X before, I was effectively getting
this anyway because of how LAYOUT_MIN_(WIDTH|HEIGHT) hehave, and
when I turned this off in the contents (Horiz.  frame) I was getting
this too.  Only if One child and the the parent use LAYOUT_FILL will
that child be stretched to fill the parent.  Is that about right?

If so this feels rather like Tk: I remember having to use fill
rather a lot when I used that.

        Hugh
>
>

Re: [Fxruby-users] layout probs with TreeList.

[Lyle J. <jl...@cf...>]

Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:

>> Similarly, change the layout hints on the tree list so that it stretches
>> in both the x and y directions:
>>
>>      @treeview[""].listStyle |=
>             [...]
>>           LAYOUT_FILL_X|LAYOUT_FILL_Y)
> 
> OK, so the problem is not due to using that ATTR to do the job,
> anyway....

Whoops, yes, that is a problem. My mistake. The 'listStyle' attribute 
only deals with the treelist-specific options (e.g. 
TREELIST_SHOWS_LINES). So let's break that line up into:

     @treeview[""].listStyle |=
         TREELIST_SHOWS_LINES|TREELIST_SHOWS_BOXES|TREELIST_ROOT_BOXES
     @treeview[""].layoutHints = LAYOUT_FILL_X|LAYOUT_FILL_Y

and see if the layout hints "take" this time ;)

Re: [Fxruby-users] layout probs with TreeList.

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003, Lyle Johnson wrote:

> Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:
>
> > I find that the TreeList only takes up half the space of contents,
> > [...]  Also the right hand half of contents is blank, despite
>
> This is just based on a quick scan of the code, but see what (if
> anything) happens if you make these changes:
>
> First, remove the LAYOUT_FILL_X from the dialog box's constructor
> options. I don't guess it's hurting anything, but it's being ignored; a
> dialog box is a top-level window and thus doesn't have a parent
> container to stretch out in:

Oh, yes, of course.... You were right: that alone made no
difference, but I can just let the layout default now.

> Next, change the layout hints for the contents frame so that it
> stretches in both the x and y directions:
>
>      contents = FXHorizontalFrame.new(self,
>          LAYOUT_FILL_X|LAYOUT_FILL_Y)

This seemed to make no difference, but I'll leave it in for now.
>
> Similarly, change the layout hints on the tree list so that it stretches
> in both the x and y directions:
>
>      @treeview[""].listStyle |=
            [...]
>           LAYOUT_FILL_X|LAYOUT_FILL_Y)

OK, so the problem is not due to using that ATTR to do the job,
anyway....
>
> By telling these two widgets to (additionally) stretch to fill up the
> remaining space in the y-direction, you shouldn't see any wasted space,
> vertically speaking.

I didn't notice much difference here.  But since my problem is in
the X direction that is reasonable.
>
> Now as for your comment about the right-hand side of contents being
> blank: is it drawn with a white background? If so, that is just the tree

No, it is grey like the rest of the tool, not white like the
TreeList background.  I have managed to capture a small == low
quality jpg of it, gzipped and attached.

> list stretching to fill in the x-direction. But it doesn't "stretch" the
> tree items, if that's what you're asking. In other words, the tree
> items' text is going to be drawn in whatever the current text font is
> for that tree list.

Agreed, I expected it to stretch the rectangle that is white, which
holds all these.
>
> Hope this helps; please follow up if this doesn't cover it.
>
> Lyle
>
> Lyle
>
        Thank you,
        Hugh
>

Re: [Fxruby-users] Icons: Are any standard? where?

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003, Lyle Johnson wrote:

> Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:
>
> > But there is no system-wide place where FOX will look for [icons], once
> No.

OK.
>
> >> [...] What Linux distro are you using [...]
> >
> > The one called DEC OSF4 :-) and Solaris9, as well.
>
> Ah yes, I've heard of that "Solaris Linux" distribution ;)

:-)  I will later be using RedHat I suspect.
>
> >
> >> installable package? Note that I'm not "pushing" the GIMP on you, but it
> >> would surely do the trick (in a sledgehammer sort of fashion ;)
> >
> > Yes, it seems very nice from what I have read.  I'm completely
> > confused about how to build that on Windows as well, but since I
> > don't have any compilers on there except within CYGWIN, that's
> > another (long) story.
>
> I think you can get precompiled version of the GIMP for Windows here:
>
>      http://www.gimp.org/~tml/gimp/win32

The clarity of that page seems to have improved, it looks like I can
get the thing from
http://www2.arnes.si/~sopjsimo/gimp/
now as 2 archives, which is considerably simpler.  Sodipodi is
working well for now.
>
> -- Lyle
>
        Thank you.
        Hugh
>

Re: [Fxruby-users] layout probs with TreeList.

[Lyle J. <jl...@cf...>]

Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:

> I find that the TreeList only takes up half the space of contents,
> the lower pane, and that it is too narrow.  LAYOUT_FILL_X is not
> doing what I expected in this regard.  Have I missed some layout
> facilities?  Also the right hand half of contents is blank, despite
> there being nothing in it: I thought it would expand to fit its
> contents, which in this case would be not expand at all.

This is just based on a quick scan of the code, but see what (if 
anything) happens if you make these changes:

First, remove the LAYOUT_FILL_X from the dialog box's constructor 
options. I don't guess it's hurting anything, but it's being ignored; a 
dialog box is a top-level window and thus doesn't have a parent 
container to stretch out in:

     super(parent, "Category Dialogue", DECOR_TITLE|DECOR_BORDER)

Next, change the layout hints for the contents frame so that it 
stretches in both the x and y directions:

     contents = FXHorizontalFrame.new(self,
         LAYOUT_FILL_X|LAYOUT_FILL_Y)

Similarly, change the layout hints on the tree list so that it stretches 
in both the x and y directions:

     @treeview[""].listStyle |=
         (TREELIST_SHOWS_LINES |
          TREELIST_SHOWS_BOXES |
          TREELIST_ROOT_BOXES|
          LAYOUT_FILL_X|LAYOUT_FILL_Y)

By telling these two widgets to (additionally) stretch to fill up the 
remaining space in the y-direction, you shouldn't see any wasted space, 
vertically speaking.

Now as for your comment about the right-hand side of contents being 
blank: is it drawn with a white background? If so, that is just the tree 
list stretching to fill in the x-direction. But it doesn't "stretch" the 
tree items, if that's what you're asking. In other words, the tree 
items' text is going to be drawn in whatever the current text font is 
for that tree list.

Hope this helps; please follow up if this doesn't cover it.

Lyle

Lyle

Re: [Fxruby-users] Icons: Are any standard? where?

[Lyle J. <jl...@cf...>]

Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:

> But there is no system-wide place where FOX will look for [icons], once
> you have created them, either?

No.

>> OK, that's a good point. What Linux distro are you using that doesn't
>> come with the GIMP pre-installed, though? Or at least available as a
> 
> The one called DEC OSF4 :-) and Solaris9, as well.

Ah yes, I've heard of that "Solaris Linux" distribution ;)

> 
>> installable package? Note that I'm not "pushing" the GIMP on you, but it
>> would surely do the trick (in a sledgehammer sort of fashion ;)
> 
> Yes, it seems very nice from what I have read.  I'm completely
> confused about how to build that on Windows as well, but since I
> don't have any compilers on there except within CYGWIN, that's
> another (long) story.

I think you can get precompiled version of the GIMP for Windows here:

     http://www.gimp.org/~tml/gimp/win32

-- Lyle

[Fxruby-users] layout probs with TreeList.

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

I have an FXDialog window with a treelist created like this:



class CategoryDialog < FXDialogBox
    CATEGORIES = :CATEGORIES
    ITEMS = :ITEMS
    BOTH = :BOTH
    def initialize(parent, edit=CATEGORIES)
        super(parent, "Category Dialogue",DECOR_TITLE|DECOR_BORDER|LAYOUT_FILL_X)

        puts "called FXDialogBox.initialize"
        menubar = FXMenubar.new(self)
        filemenu = FXMenuPane.new(self)
        FXMenuCommand.new(filemenu, "&Quit", nil, getApp(), FXApp::ID_QUIT, 0)
        FXMenuTitle.new(menubar, "&File", nil, filemenu)

        FXHorizontalSeparator.new(self)
        # Contents
        contents = FXHorizontalFrame.new(self, LAYOUT_FILL_X )
        @treeview = Hash.new()
        @treeview[""] = FXTreeList.new(contents, 10)
        @treeview[""].listStyle |= TREELIST_SHOWS_LINES | TREELIST_SHOWS_BOXES | TREELIST_ROOT_BOXES|LAYOUT_FILL_X
        @treeview["equipment"] =
        @treeview[""].addItemLast(nil,
        "equipment",nil, # openIcon
        nil, # closedIcon
        TreeData.new(@treeview[""], "#{$equipdir}" ) # data
        )
    end

    #...
end

I find that the TreeList only takes up half the space of contents,
the lower pane, and that it is too narrow.  LAYOUT_FILL_X is not
doing what I expected in this regard.  Have I missed some layout
facilities?  Also the right hand half of contents is blank, despite
there being nothing in it: I thought it would expand to fit its
contents, which in this case would be not expand at all.

        Hugh

RE: [Fxruby-users] Icons: Are any standard? where?

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Tue, 15 Jul 2003, Jordan, Tom wrote:

> You can always use sodipodi @
> http://sodipodi.sf.net

I've heard of this one, and there's a Windows binary, so I can
transfer the data from the PC to the other machine(s).  This should
do the job.  Thank you.

> like SVG Icons did (see: http://svgicons.sf.net )
>
> hth,
> -- Tom.
        Thank you,
        Hugh

Re: [Fxruby-users] Icons: Are any standard? where?

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Tue, 15 Jul 2003, Lyle Johnson wrote:

> Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:
>
> > Is [calling them "stock" icons] perjorative?
>
> Oh, no, and I didn't take it that way. I guess I thought you were asking

OK, I was not sure.
> > I did see a few, but no evidence of a central place to keep them,
> > etc.
>
> Exactly my point ;) You are free to use anything there, but they aren't
> "official" or anything.

But there is no system-wide place where FOX will look for them, once
you have created them, either?

>
> > [...]editors and similar are a good way to pickup spyware...
> > get gtk+, which requires libungif, which requires libpng, which
>
> OK, that's a good point. What Linux distro are you using that doesn't
> come with the GIMP pre-installed, though? Or at least available as a

The one called DEC OSF4 :-) and Solaris9, as well.

> installable package? Note that I'm not "pushing" the GIMP on you, but it
> would surely do the trick (in a sledgehammer sort of fashion ;)

Yes, it seems very nice from what I have read.  I'm completely
confused about how to build that on Windows as well, but since I
don't have any compilers on there except within CYGWIN, that's
another (long) story.
>
> On Windows, I think I used to use one called Michelangelo (sp?) but I

Well, my best efforts with google still are clogged by refs to the
sculptor even with -sculpture -sculptor.

> couldn't tell you if it's still around, if it was shareware versus
> freeware, etc.
>
>
        Thank you,
        Hugh
>

RE: [Fxruby-users] Icons: Are any standard? where?

[Jordan, T. <Tom...@ca...>]

You can always use sodipodi @ 
http://sodipodi.sf.net
like SVG Icons did (see: http://svgicons.sf.net )

hth,
-- Tom.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Lyle Johnson [mailto:jl...@cf...] 
> Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2003 6:27 PM
> To: Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng
> Cc: fxr...@li...
> Subject: Re: [Fxruby-users] Icons: Are any standard? where?
> 
> 
> Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:
> 
> > Is [calling them "stock" icons] perjorative?
> 
> Oh, no, and I didn't take it that way. I guess I thought you 
> were asking 
> something like, "Is there some set of standard icons that 
> everyone knows 
> that you're supposed to use in FOX icons?" -- and the answer to that 
> question is no, just use whatever looks good to you ;)
> 
> > I did see a few, but no evidence of a central place to keep 
> them, etc.
> 
> Exactly my point ;) You are free to use anything there, but 
> they aren't 
> "official" or anything.
> 
> > True, but I need [an icon-editing] program from a reputable 
> community, 
> > I bet Icon editors and similar are a good way to pickup spyware...  
> > The GNU imaging programs, OTOH, seem to go: get gtk+, which 
> requires 
> > libungif, which requires libpng, which requires zlib which 
> I can't get 
> > to build. [Harris, R: "The Court of King Caractacus"] :-)
> 
> OK, that's a good point. What Linux distro are you using that doesn't 
> come with the GIMP pre-installed, though? Or at least available as a 
> installable package? Note that I'm not "pushing" the GIMP on 
> you, but it 
> would surely do the trick (in a sledgehammer sort of fashion ;)
> 
> On Windows, I think I used to use one called Michelangelo (sp?) but I 
> couldn't tell you if it's still around, if it was shareware versus 
> freeware, etc.
> 
> > Tried that [looking for free icons], but I've found it difficult
>  > to search the licencing aspects as well as the image with 
> Google.  > Maybe a better engine exists for this pupose?
> 
> Sorry, don't know if such an engine exists.
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Fxruby-users] Icons: Are any standard? where?

[Lyle J. <jl...@cf...>]

Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:

> Is [calling them "stock" icons] perjorative?

Oh, no, and I didn't take it that way. I guess I thought you were asking 
something like, "Is there some set of standard icons that everyone knows 
that you're supposed to use in FOX icons?" -- and the answer to that 
question is no, just use whatever looks good to you ;)

> I did see a few, but no evidence of a central place to keep them,
> etc.

Exactly my point ;) You are free to use anything there, but they aren't 
"official" or anything.

> True, but I need [an icon-editing] program from a reputable community, I bet Icon
> editors and similar are a good way to pickup spyware...  The GNU
> imaging programs, OTOH, seem to go:
> get gtk+, which requires libungif, which requires libpng, which
> requires zlib which I can't get to build.
> [Harris, R: "The Court of King Caractacus"] :-)

OK, that's a good point. What Linux distro are you using that doesn't 
come with the GIMP pre-installed, though? Or at least available as a 
installable package? Note that I'm not "pushing" the GIMP on you, but it 
would surely do the trick (in a sledgehammer sort of fashion ;)

On Windows, I think I used to use one called Michelangelo (sp?) but I 
couldn't tell you if it's still around, if it was shareware versus 
freeware, etc.

> Tried that [looking for free icons], but I've found it difficult
 > to search the licencing aspects as well as the image with Google.
 > Maybe a better engine exists for this pupose?

Sorry, don't know if such an engine exists.

Re: [Fxruby-users] Icons: Are any standard? where?

[Hugh S. S. E. E. <hg...@dm...>]

On Tue, 15 Jul 2003, Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng wrote:

> (Been there, done that, send corrections to Blinux faq! :-))
Oops: s/send/sent/
        Hugh