[Ebib-users] Fwd: Ebib 0.25 released!

[Jesse A. <al...@st...>]

Sorry, I meant to send this to the list, not just to Steve:

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Jesse Alama <al...@st...>
Date: Aug 19, 2006 12:40 PM
Subject: Re: Ebib 0.25 released!
To: Steve Youngs <ste...@pu...>


Steve Youngs <ste...@pu...> writes:

> * Joost Kremers <joo...@pu...> writes:
>
>   > Note that the key definitions are now all in .ebibrc. That means
>   > that if you install the new version, you must also copy the new
>   > ebibrc to your HOME dir (or at least copy the key definitions to
>   > your existing .ebibrc), otherwise no command keys will be defined.
>
> Wow, this is an incredibly _bad_ idea.  Why are you leaving the
> responsibility of default key bindings up to the user?
>
> What happens to the poor user that downloads the Ebib dist tarball,
> installs, and then deletes the tarball.  Then one day, disaster strikes
> and he blows away his ${HOME}[1]...

I'm afraid I may have asked Joost to pursue a red herring: he's
responding to me complaining about non-configurable keys.  I had in
mind some way of customizing keys different from the usual way of
hacking one's emac configuration file, but I didn't specify what I had
in mind to Joost, and actually I'm not even sure what I meant.

I do agree, though, that leaving the default keybindings up to the
user is a peculiar move.

I'm not sure I see the point of your comment about wiping out your
home directory.  If one does that, one has got more problems than
simply no longer having one's ebib key configuration...

> I also don't see any benefit or point to the `ebib-key' macro.
> Isn't...
>
>         (define-key ebib-foo-map [(control c) x] #'foo-function)
>
> ...good enough?

I think that may be right, for now.

>   > Jesse made a few other suggestions, that I'm considering
>   > incorporating. One thing I think I won't do, is to use Emacs'
>   > standard customisation interface (M-x customize) for Ebib.
>
> I'm not sure how much of Ebib is customisable, but I think this is a mistake.

Huh?

>   > Personally, I don't really like this interface,
>
> Neither do I.

I don't like it much, either, but I do use it a lot.  Moreover:

>   > and the elisp code it generates is so cluttered that it can hardly be
>   > modified by hand.
>
> The type of user that relies on `M-x customize' is most likely _not_
> the type of user to look at, or want to modify what it generates. :-)

I wouldn't say that I rely on Custom, but I certainly use it as often
as I can.  Please don't ignore users like me!

>   > Plus, I feel that the little customisation that Ebib might need
>   > can easily be handled through .ebibrc.
>
> OK, I'm heading off on a bit of a tangent here, but, from what I can
> see, there isn't anything in .ebibrc that couldn't be left in
> ebib.el.  I don't see the need to have an rc file.  Couldn't you just
> state in the manual... "if you want to add your own entry types, put
> (defentry foo-entry (...)) into your init.el/.emacs" ?

I think this is a good idea -- having that ebibrc file makes me
uncomfortable: the one included in the distribution specifies default
behavior, but if this file isn't included than the installation
breaks.  This makes it somewhat annoying to package ebib for debian
and fink, since the package description somehow has to indicate to the
user that his installation is incomplete until he puts that ebibrc
file in his home directory.  I think the contents ebibrc file should
be embedded in ebib.el, somehow, and ebib.el should be extended so
that it uses a configuration file, say, .ebibrc, ala .gnus (for
example).  And one should be able to use Custom to specify the
location of that configuration file :->

> One last tangent before I finish... Why oh why isn't the manual in
> Texinfo format?  From there you could generate your PDF and HTML,
> while the rest of us can read the Ebib manual inside our emacs in
> info. :-)

I agree that the documentation should be available within the Info
system.  I've taken up the task of converting Joost's LaTeX
documentation to TeXinfo.

Jesse

--
Jesse Alama (al...@st...)


-- 
Jesse Alama (al...@st...)