colinux-users

Re: [coLinux-users] [coLinux-devel] Fw: Virtual Machine OpenGL

[Agustin P. <agu...@ya...>]

You are right Xen needs special care and may be the main reason, but that software is useful on Vmware and VirtualBox too. I think it is on colinux too.

>From my experience getting non accelerated OpenGL (MesaGL) from colinux is not an easy task. Getting HW accelerated OpenGL even with commercial (expensive!) X-servers has been impossible at least for me. Even Cygwin/Xserver still has lots of problems with clipboard copy-pasting between host and guest (client-server). So I have been forced to use VNC most of the time (still losing special chars copy-pasting though).

Now it seems that we could be able to get Xgl accelerated desktops with VNC and some (most?) framebuffer applications can be made to work windowed on X-Windows so I see a lot of apps running a nearly native speeds without the need to develop framebuffer. 

I think moving from old VNC to HW OpenGL _easily_ is a good thing. Of course, there may be some apps, mainly games and installers, that would need framebuffer support anyway because they work with framebuffer (fullscreen) only.

To make this work we do not need to touch colinux kernel, we just need to help porting that VNC-GL client to Windows, currently it only work on linux host, on our own benefit.

"ric...@gm..." <ric...@gm...> escribió: There already is OpenGL support provided in several Win32 X servers,
both free and commercial.

The framebuffer support in colinux has never been intended for
X-Windows AFAIK, although it is serendipitously working with
X-Windows.  There is however demand for small linux guests with the
ability to run framebuffer applications without all the overhead of
X-Windows.  Also a lot of Linux installers need framebuffer support.

At any rate, OpenGL support in X or vnc doesn't require any kernel
support, so I'm not sure how this is related to colinux or why there
needs to be a special solution for virtual machines hosted on a full
OS vs LAN.

The project mentioned looks to be more concerned with the problems
presented by Xen, which has a separate hypervisor, not reusing a
kernel with existing hw accel support.

On Sat, Feb 23, 2008 at 4:19 PM, Henry Nestler  wrote:
> agu...@ya... wrote:
>  > Hi all,
>  >
>  > I would like to let you know about this project:
>  > http://www.cs.toronto.edu/~andreslc/xen-gl/
>  >
>  > This project enables to use 3D hardware through Xvnc on most VM's.
>  >
>  > Right now it only works on linux guest and linux host, but I think we just
>  > need to port linux host code to Windows to be able to use it on Colinux.
>  >
>  > If we work on this we may be able to skip framebuffer development at all.
>  >
>  > Thank you
>  >
>  > Regards
>
>  Thanks, and forwarded to devel list to.
>
>  --
>  Henry N.
>
>  -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>  This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
>  Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
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>  _______________________________________________
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>  https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/colinux-devel
>


       
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Re: [coLinux-users] [coLinux-devel] Fw: Virtual Machine OpenGL

[<ric...@gm...>]

On Mon, Feb 25, 2008 at 5:44 PM, Agustin Pizarro <agu...@ya...> wrote:
> You are right Xen needs special care and may be the main reason, but that
> software is useful on Vmware and VirtualBox too. I think it is on colinux
> too.
>
> From my experience getting non accelerated OpenGL (MesaGL) from colinux is
> not an easy task. Getting HW accelerated OpenGL even with commercial
> (expensive!) X-servers has been impossible at least for me. Even
> Cygwin/Xserver still has lots of problems with clipboard copy-pasting
> between host and guest (client-server). So I have been forced to use VNC
> most of the time (still losing special chars copy-pasting though).

I found that the key to making GL work over TCP/IP (e.g. with colinux)
was passing the -Y option to ssh to enable trusting (insecure) X11
extensions.  You may also need to set an option in your
~/.ssh/sshd_config or /etc/sshd_config to allow incoming connections
to run insecure extensions.

>
> Now it seems that we could be able to get Xgl accelerated desktops with VNC
> and some (most?) framebuffer applications can be made to work windowed on
> X-Windows so I see a lot of apps running a nearly native speeds without the
> need to develop framebuffer.
>
> I think moving from old VNC to HW OpenGL _easily_ is a good thing. Of
> course, there may be some apps, mainly games and installers, that would need
> framebuffer support anyway because they work with framebuffer (fullscreen)
> only.

I think so too, but it doesn't do anything to help distro installers
and other framebuffer apps, framebuffer support will still be a very
good thing.

>
> To make this work we do not need to touch colinux kernel, we just need to
> help porting that VNC-GL client to Windows, currently it only work on linux
> host, on our own benefit.

True.  Sadly I can't run colinux anymore since I've moved to Vista 64-bit.

OTOH, GL-over-RFB doesn't seem to me to be a very good idea, they are
completely different approaches.  Remote GL is a natural extension to
XWindows, while to make it work with RFB you have to build VNC into a
full client/server API with as many intricacies and difficulties as
XWindows.

>
> "ric...@gm..." <ric...@gm...> escribió:
>  There already is OpenGL support provided in several Win32 X servers,
> both free and commercial.
>
> The framebuffer support in colinux has never been intended for
> X-Windows AFAIK, although it is serendipitously working with
> X-Windows. There is however demand for small linux guests with the
> ability to run framebuffer applications without all the overhead of
> X-Windows. Also a lot of Linux installers need framebuffer support.
>
> At any rate, OpenGL support in X or vnc doesn't require any kernel
> support, so I'm not sure how this is related to colinux or why there
> needs to be a special solution for virtual machines hosted on a full
> OS vs LAN.
>
> The project mentioned looks to be more concerned with the problems
> presented by Xen, which has a separate hypervisor, not reusing a
> kernel with existing hw accel support.
>
> On Sat, Feb 23, 2008 at 4:19 PM, Henry Nestler wrote:
> > agu...@ya... wrote:
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > I would like to let you know about this project:
> > > http://www.cs.toronto.edu/~andreslc/xen-gl/
> > >
> > > This project enables to use 3D hardware through Xvnc on most VM's.
> > >
> > > Right now it only works on linux guest and linux host, but I think we
> just
> > > need to port linux host code to Windows to be able to use it on Colinux.
> > >
> > > If we work on this we may be able to skip framebuffer development at
> all.
> > >
> > > Thank you
> > >
> > > Regards
> >
> > Thanks, and forwarded to devel list to.
> >
> > --
> > Henry N.
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
> > Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
> > http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
> > _______________________________________________
> > coLinux-devel mailing list
> > coL...@li...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/colinux-devel
> >
>
>
>
>  ________________________________
>
> ¿Con Mascota por primera vez? - Sé un mejor Amigo
> Entra en Yahoo! Respuestas.
>