Re: [chiPHPug-discuss] CHIPHPUG REDACTED

SourceForge Headquarters 225 Broadway Suite 1600 San Diego, CA 92101 +1 (858) 422-6466

Let me nip something in the bud before this gets out of hand...

The hosting is paid for already, by me, and it's on the php.net
domain, as well as the sourceforge servers, and that is not changing.

I already volunteer enough thank you very much, and don't need your
"requirement" to do so.

If you don't like the jobs being posted, just hit delete.

If you want better discussion, start one.

Failing that, if you dislike the list that much, just leave, and start
your own list.
[shrug]

On Thu, October 25, 2007 11:33 pm, matt donohue wrote:
> Some thoughts-
> Picture this press release:
> "Chicago PHP Society builds web site for No Kill Animal Shelter".
> Or- you can be a list that answers 3 newbie questions a year and 1
> really bad quote request.
> Like I said- re-invent yourselves and have a purpose or die. There is
> no PHP pulse anyone on this list needs to be abreast of. I don't need
> any advice or job off this list so what am I doing? No offense but,
> the last newbie we had was and is a jag.
>
> As for volunteering- Yes, I'll build and host a site. Any members
> would need to commit to a volunteer schedule for Chicago non-profits.
> Not sure you would want me in that position as I'm extremely liberal
> and quite dogmatic.
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Anacreo <an...@gm...>
> To: chi...@li...
> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 10:42:06 PM
> Subject: Re: [chiPHPug-discuss] CHIPHPUG REDACTED
>
>
> Hmm I guess I'm more the care bare spirit.  While I do nod and agree
> with
> much of what you say Matt.  I do think slamming someone looking for
> help as
> a bit harsh.  For me I'm not much of a meeting type either, I'm more
> of the
> go it alone and toss an idea out when I'm frustrated by a problem.  I
> do
> enjoy problem solving which is why I join lists like this in the first
> place.  If someone has a problem I enjoy the challenge of trying to
> figure
> it out, that's all I am looking for in this user group, so to each
> their
> own.  I agree about the website though as a community user group who
> am I to
> complain about it if I'm not going to fix it.  If you want a new site
> /
> majordomo try building it and propose it and see if it gets ratified.
>
> Alec
>
> On 10/25/07, matt donohue <mm_...@ya...> wrote:
>>
>> Young? No. I said I've been on the almost list since it started.
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----
>> From: Jason Rexilius <ja...@ho...>
>> To: chi...@li...
>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 8:27:21 PM
>> Subject: Re: [chiPHPug-discuss] CHIPHPUG REDACTED
>>
>>
>> Matt,
>>
>>    Forgive me, but you must be fairly young. ;-)
>>
>>    User groups never have a "purpose" or "vision" or any such
>> thing..
>> It's like a street market.. lotsa "other peoples treasure" and the
>> odd
>> thing that you find valuable.
>>
>>    That being said, the value I find in it is keeping a loose finger
>> on
>> the pulse of local mindsets in relation to PHP.  That helps about as
>> much as watching CNN helps the average person, but I still find it
>> useful.
>>
>>    The other purpose it serves is a place for young people with
>> energy
>> to use it as a springboard to do interesting things with their time,
>> passion and energy.  It does sound like you are volunteering ;-)
>>
>>    It is a pool of people, although not like-minded, with at least
>> one
>> or more common interest that you can draw from, serve or dismiss as
>> your
>> enthusiasm dictates.
>>
>>    I organize a yearly tech event and try and keep in touch with the
>> user groups and support other people doing interesting things.  Do
>> something interesting and I'll support it.
>>
>>    As to discussion, it is a community with _widely_ varying levels
>> of
>> expertise so its hard to have a standard.  I personally would like
>> to
>> have more involved discussions about some advanced topics but its
>> difficult on a list.  Meetings are better places for the discussion
>> I
>> enjoy, usually.
>>
>>    Cheers and have fun.. Maybe build a new website to help with some
>> shortcomings you see.
>>
>> -jason
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> matt donohue wrote:
>> > Preface- I know I must be wrong at least 51% of the time
>> otherwise, I
>> would be way ahead at poker.
>> >
>> > In case anyone was put off by the snark (Arlo already vented), I
>> profer
>> this rant,
>> >
>> > I sometimes find myself frustrated by the purpose of the list (and
>> it's
>> lack of humor). There is hardly any dialog on the list beyond what
>> framework
>> is best to use and the rare question. Is it a list of vetted
>> professionals
>> or a loose collection of hacks? I know some people are on the list
>> because
>> they enjoy the meetings and socializing with other like minded
>> people but,
>> I've never been that interested in any meeting topics and I prefer
>> to learn
>> things on my own (my being anti-social plays no part). That said-
>> I'm sure I
>> pissed off the other half of the list but, I don't really care.
>> Start a new
>> dialog- what is the value of the list? Because if it doesn't change
>> and grow
>> it becomes irrelevant, and If the list is supposed to be some
>> adjunct to
>> Craigslist's Computer Gigs you can color me gone. I do enjoy helping
>> other
>> PHP users and believe I have good track record regarding, I just
>> think the
>> list should have a higher standard, more diverse purpose and
>> some
>> >  benefits for the members.
>> >
>> > Things that bug:
>> > * The list has never had a good website since maybe the first year
>> or
>> two when there where actual profiles on it. What are peoples
>> skill-sets?
>> Where do they work? Outside interests? How many members are there?
>> I'm sure
>> I could get all that at a meeting but, like I said, I haven't been
>> to a
>> meeting ever in 8 plus years, and if we do want to represent a
>> 'guild' as it
>> where, we should make some member data available to the public.
>> > * If the list was organized (i.e. a real website) and did
>> represent a
>> list of vetted professionals it would serve as a go-to resource for
>> advertising agencies and other freelance opportunities. The fact
>> that there
>> is no organization (and hence no respect I'm guessing), has these
>> potential
>> revenue resources using other venues like craigslist and recruiters
>> (uhhg).
>> The list 'could' represent a job bench, if the effort was made and
>> some
>> minor marketing where applied. I mean- look at other professions,
>> they have
>> societies that promote the members. CHIPHPUG doesn't even know who
>> it's
>> members are?
>> > * Jobs posted to the list should meet a standard or be called out-
>> otherwise the list becomes as relevant as the most base job posted.
>> Does the
>> 'list' work for $15 an hour and hack designers? I hope not. It's not
>> about
>> being elitist- It's standing up for your vocation and not allowing
>> other
>> people to trivialize your skills and what you represent. Other lists
>> are
>> much more mercenary. I have no idea why this one is so inclusive.
>> > It reminds me of when my college would post $10 p/hr jobs on the
>> job
>> board (I paid you $20K a year and you post that?). That debases
>> everything
>> you represent.
>> > * A Chicago PHP using company survey would be helpful, considering
>> everyone on the list has either applied or worked at probably every
>> PHP
>> advocating company there is. Helpful info might include:
>> > hiring status, salary, reporting supervisor, environment, opinion
>> etc..
>> I could fill a small book with my knowledge. I mean, think about the
>> time
>> that would save people.
>> > * There isn't a PHP job out there that doesn't require knowledge
>> of PHP
>> and AJAX. So, since everyone
>> > on the list is, for the most part, beyond proficient at PHP,
>> extending
>> the list to AJAX/Javascript concerns might invigorate it. I know, I
>> personally have way more to offer regarding JS than PHP and all of
>> it is
>> practical or relevant to the group. I doubt the list is composed of
>> PHP
>> 'backenders' and I've never had a job myself that didn't involve
>> both UI and
>> and backend development.
>> > * Lastly- I know I already stated my reticence to meetings but, a
>> CHIPHPUG poker showdown I could get behind. $100 a pop- winner gets
>> bragging
>> rights for a year. I'll host West loop.
>> >
>> > Hope this stirs the nest... I really would like the list to have
>> more
>> purpose cause I know Java and C# and still prefer the crack of PHP.
>> Just
>> wish it was represented better.
>> >
>> > Oh- and go Chicago Fire!!!
>> >
>> > Rant over,
>> > Matt
>> >
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