[CEDET-devel] Fwd: CEDET, future and Emacs
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[CEDET-devel] Fwd: CEDET, future and Emacs
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From: Fermin <fm...@po...> - 2021-03-28 08:49:52
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No problem, forwarded to the mailing list.
Giving that CEDET is now part of GNU Emacs, I think that is more
appropriate to ask for a mailing list (like others projects have),
rather than using an external one, there is no rush to this, of course.
Regards,
Fermin
-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: Re: [CEDET-devel] CEDET, future and Emacs
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 16:33:16 +0800
From: Vladimir Nikishkin <loc...@gm...>
To: Fermin <fm...@po...>
Yes, sure. I misclicked "reply to the author" instead of "reply to all".
My bad.
--
Yours sincerely, Vladimir Nikishkin
(Sent with Google mail mobile.)
Fermin <fm...@po... <mailto:fm...@po...>> 于 2021年3月28日周日
16:24写道：
Hello Vladimir,
> It's always great when software gets the attention it deserves. In
> fact, cedet is a quite good tool, which unfortunately feels
> unfinished. I'm feeling happy that someone is ready to dedicate
> effort to it.
Thank you!
> 1. Cedet feels a bit orthogonal to the Emacs standard way of doing
> things. (Same has been said about helm!) For example, rebinding
> right-click (mouse-3), seems a bit too much.
You are right, even tho I'm a fan (and user) of helm, the monolithic
design make it way more harder to
change, and giving that CEDET is written with EIEIO (which is no
largely used AFAIK) and it's a rather complex
software, I can understand why there are not too much people willing
to invest time into it.
> 2. The parser is not very good at tolerating non-conforming
> source. I had especially a lot of this with the scheme-mode.
> Scheme exists in 9 "standards" (of which 6 are in use, of which 3
> are in wide use), and numerous extensions to those standards
> (essentially, a set of extensions per compiler), so it's almost
> guaranteed that "something not in the grammar" is going to be
> found in the source. It would be nice to either be able to recover
> after failures (to a certain extent), or to provide "hooks" for
> extensions, or something like that.
Yes, I was these past weeks changing the Emacs Lisp parser and
adapting it to Common Lisp, the way that semantic has
to deal with errors seems like is just ignoring it, which it's not
the great thing for debuggable reasons. Having a nice error
recovery system can really benefit CEDET, also point out, that using
the Emacs reader is not always the best thing,
because there are certain symbols that either doesn't understand
(and break) or ignore, which can lead to confusing
data structures.
The speed is also a concern, giving that some software today has
large codebases with hundreds of files and dependencies,
if CEDET need to parse all of that synchronous in a computer not
that powerful, it can be a real pain for the user, some of
the complains a read online were in that matter.
> Better documentation would also be totally amazing!
Yes, I think that this project needs more visibility, and a nice
informative webpage can really help in that regard,
having a page with outdated information is not a good sign for a
project.
> Thanks for your effort!
Thank you for your suggestions!
(Should we copy this conversation to the mailing list?)
Regards,
Fermin
On 28/03/2021 04:20, Vladimir Nikishkin wrote:
> It's always great when software gets the attention it deserves. In
> fact, cedet is a quite good tool, which unfortunately feels
> unfinished. I'm feeling happy that someone is ready to dedicate
> effort to it.
>
> If I may express a few suggestions:
>
> 1. Cedet feels a bit orthogonal to the Emacs standard way of doing
> things. (Same has been said about helm!) For example, rebinding
> right-click (mouse-3), seems a bit too much.
>
> 2. The parser is not very good at tolerating non-conforming
> source. I had especially a lot of this with the scheme-mode.
> Scheme exists in 9 "standards" (of which 6 are in use, of which 3
> are in wide use), and numerous extensions to those standards
> (essentially, a set of extensions per compiler), so it's almost
> guaranteed that "something not in the grammar" is going to be
> found in the source. It would be nice to either be able to recover
> after failures (to a certain extent), or to provide "hooks" for
> extensions, or something like that.
>
> Better documentation would also be totally amazing!
> Thanks for your effort!
>
> --
> Yours sincerely, Vladimir Nikishkin
> (Sent with Google mail mobile.)
>
> Fermin <fm...@po... <mailto:fm...@po...>> 于 2021年3月28日周日
> 04:35写道：
>
> Hello everyone!
>
> My name is Fermin, I'm an Emacs hacker (among other things)
> and I've
> been messing around with CEDET these past year or so, and I
> really like
> it overall,
> I can understand his faults and how/why the Emacs community is
> not
> taking it into account too much these days, but I also think
> that this
> can change.
>
> I will propose myself as a maintainer of CEDET in the Emacs
> mailing
> list, I have experience working with "legacy" software or
> software that
> is not
> in active development anymore and I can bring modern ideas to
> the table.
>
> The most important thing for me right now is to make CEDET
> more visible,
> provide good documentation and encourage the community to
> contribute.
>
> Even tho I have the luck to have a good amount of time to
> dedicate to
> CEDET, I can understand that a project like this cannot
> compete with
> other tools in
> the industry if I'm the only one improving it, so a community
> effort
> will be necessary if the project want to succeed in the future.
>
> I started with changing the CEDET webpage to the HTML5
> standard, but
> with the same (awesome) aesthetic, thanks to Eric, I have the
> source code so
> I can replicate it easily, this is the repository
> https://gitlab.com/sasanidas/cedet-webpage
> <https://gitlab.com/sasanidas/cedet-webpage>, and this is the
> webpage
> online https://sasanidas.gitlab.io/cedet-webpage/
> <https://sasanidas.gitlab.io/cedet-webpage/> .
>
> If the GNU Emacs maintainers approve my position, my intention
> is to
> make a branch with a lot of new changes, even tho I think the
> send patch
> workflow is valid,
> for a package like CEDET that needs a lot of changes, this can
> really
> slow down the process, so I will also try that.
>
> Let me know what do you guys think.
>
> Regards,
>
> Fermin
>
>
>
>
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>
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