Re: [binarycloud-dev] Re: binarycloud r2 - init [off-list]

[Alex B. <en...@tu...>]

I've cc'd the list, after I re-read this. I think it's worth people reading.

> Just to give you some background info, Nick is a member of the phpWebsite
> team. I have been evangelizing about Binarycloud over there (see
> http://phpwebsite.appstate.edu/article.php?sid=50&mode=flat&order=0 ) and
> he's actually come for more info...!  While I don't think that BC as it
> stands could be converted into a PHP-Nuke rival, I do think that some of

Thanks for the post :)

There's no intention to do so ("compete" with phpNuke) - any more than I
would try and compete with phpLib. binarycloud is a very specialized system
for building big, deep things. It has all kinds of design requirements
implicit in the system that your average web application just doesn't care
about. If I'm building a forum application in isolation, all I care about
are a few tables, some session stuff, and a bit of html.

If, however, I need to be able to make that form app _aware_ of a larger
system, possibly registering events with the core eventManager, running
queries through a central query engine, etc, etc. - then bc starts to be
relevant. You need a certain amount of "scale critical mass" to make full
use of a system like bc.

The point of the system is advanced integration, which is why I gave up on
phpLib and the like. In isolation, they all work well. As soon as I needed
them to work together, I had to download 50 little snippets of code, and
fight with them to get things working. And I couldn't make important
changes. Which is why bc was born.

So, bc probably won't ever have the kind of developer audience that phplib
or phpnuke have. But those that need the kind of functionality r2 offers
will instantly recognize the difference in scale and complexity.

Also, as part of r2, there are going to be a couple apps that will be so
smokin' that people can't resist...

I'm going to publish the first rev of the editor interface soon, on that
note.

> The only drawback I can find with r2 is that it needs so many special PHP
> modules installed.

Ehfoo? Maybe I should update the docs, because there's a good, standard
recommended list of compiled modules, but the only things really required
are sablot an mcrypt so far.

I prefer the kitchen sink approach to php installs, but there will be few
"core" php module dependencies.

> It is possible to install r1 on a virtual host - I've
> done it at http://www.binarycloud.f2s.com and you cannot access the
> binarycloud/ directory (have a go) which is in htdocs, can you? - but this
> won't be possible with r2 unless the dependencies on all these extra
> modules are optional.

again, ehfoo?

I run binarycloud on virtualhosts all the time, and have _absolutely_no_
intention of _ever_ disabling that.

I actually can't imagine how I _would_, now that I think about it.

If anything, I'm going to make sure it has fewer requirements of the
environment: r1 assumes a bunch of things because that's the way I work, but
there's no reason why you shouldn't be able to install r2 in a vhost setup
and run it just fine, assuming some basic php.ini config requirements are
met.

> Maybe I'm looking for the wrong thing in BC, or maybe I just don't need
> something of the complexity of BC. So far I haven't found anything which
> really suits my needs (managing small business websites), which is why I am
> excited about the phpWebsite proposal.  Whether it works or not remains to
> be seen!

I think the above is the best response to that. If you're building
relatively simple applications, you're not going to see the most benefit
that the system can offer.

This is especially true of r2, with a rule engine, and entities, etc - it's
too much of a pain in the butt if you're just trying to run a simple cart
and some forums.

But if you need to build an exchange, or a hefty commerce platform, or a
publishing site with 50 article types, you'll love it.

_alex


--
alex black, ceo
en...@tu...

the turing studio, inc.
http://www.turingstudio.com

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