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Re: [Anuga-user] Anuga-user Digest, Vol 61, Issue 3 [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
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From: Joaquim L. <jl...@ua...> - 2013-10-10 11:01:54
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Hi Gareth Thanks for you thoughts. I guess that I'm still puzzled how a wave that travels at the speed of the Moon can be modeled by the maths of SWE. Joaquim > Hi, > > Regarding the applicability of the shallow water wave equations (SWE) to tides and storm-surge --my understanding is that the SWE should be a reasonable approximation whenever you are modelling flows with a horizontal wavelength that is large compared with the water depth (e.g. 20 times larger is often quoted), and where the flow is not significantly affected by vertical variations in e.g. velocity/density. Actually ANUGA assumes a fixed water density. In these circumstances the SWE can be derived from the Navier Stokes equations by vertical integration, and I'd recommend going through that process if you need to clarify the underlying assumptions (it's been a few years since I did ...). > > I think it is pretty standard for tides to be modelled with the SWE. Storm surge is also often modelled on a shallow-water core, combined with forcings for wind/waves/pressure etc. > > Of course, more complex models can resolve more processes, and so might allow more accuracy -- but to my knowledge, SWE are common in these situations. > > Significant wave amplification can be caused by the wave transitioning from deeper to shallower water, or from the wave being 'squeezed' into funnel-type topography -- although I have no idea whether these factors are enough to explain Joaquim's results. However, from looking at the scenario in the movie, I would have expected the SWE to be applicable there. > > Cheers, > Gareth. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: anu...@li... [mailto:anu...@li...] > Sent: Wednesday, 9 October 2013 11:05 PM > To: anu...@li... > Subject: Anuga-user Digest, Vol 61, Issue 3 > > Send Anuga-user mailing list submissions to > anu...@li... > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/anuga-user > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > anu...@li... > > You can reach the person managing the list at > anu...@li... > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Anuga-user digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Question on boundary segment (Joaquim Luis) > 2. Re: Question on boundary segment (LILI) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2013 11:44:27 +0100 > From: Joaquim Luis<jl...@ua...> > Subject: Re: [Anuga-user] Question on boundary segment > To: LILI<fg...@un...> > Cc: anu...@li..., > anu...@li... > Message-ID:<525...@ua...> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Hi, > > Let me jump in with my (somewhat related) doubts as well. > If I remember well LI LI wants to model a storm surge but my basic question is, is ANUGA able to model such type of events? After all, ANUGA is a shallow water model and storm surges are not shallow water waves. > I am working on a (finite difference) shallow water code with nesting grids for Mirone, which BTW is able to create .sww files, and decided to try to model a tidal wave. For that I feed a boundary with a time series created by the OSU code. > You can see a quick animation at > http://w3.ualg.pt/~jluis/ftp/tmp/tide_flood.gif > Besides all the reflections (and some nosy border effects) what I noticed was that although the tide amplitude was 1.8 meters water accumulated inside the domain to more than 4 meters. > I am a solid Earth Geophysicist with only marginal knowledge on hydrodynamic modeling and but what I think is happening is that although the system is fed by a tidal wave, inside the domain the model propagates as if it as a shallow water wave (which travels much than the tidal wave) and hence water accumulates to unreasonable values. > > I think this is the same type of problem that would occur with Anuga when modeling tides or storm surge waves. But am I wrong in my reasoning? > > Thanks > > Joaquim > >> Dear Anuga research group, >> >> Sorry to interrupt again, I have already created a 'sww' file through >> 'ferret2sww.py',then applied to the boundary condition(the boundary >> condition generate by ocean model). Now I have a question, for the >> boundary condition, should the polygon has to fix the research area >> excatly? For example, the ocean boundary area is much bigger than the >> reseach area. Is that ok for simulation?! >> >> Because I got the error like this: >> >> Traceback (most recent call last): >> File "run_new_prd.py", line 144, in<module> >> for t in domain.evolve(yieldstep=120, finaltime=8164800): >> File >> "/home/lili/anuga_core/source/anuga/shallow_water/shallow_water_domain >> .py", >> line 1584, in evolve >> skip_initial_step=skip_initial_step): >> File >> "/home/lili/anuga_core/source/anuga/abstract_2d_finite_volumes/generic >> _domain.py", >> line 1514, in evolve >> self.update_boundary() >> File >> "/home/lili/anuga_core/source/anuga/abstract_2d_finite_volumes/generic >> _domain.py", >> line 1965, in update_boundary >> B.evaluate_segment(self, boundary_segment_edges) >> File >> "/home/lili/anuga_core/source/anuga/abstract_2d_finite_volumes/generic >> _boundary_conditions.py", >> line 59, in evaluate_segment >> q_bdry = self.evaluate(vol_id, edge_id) >> File >> "/home/lili/anuga_core/source/anuga/abstract_2d_finite_volumes/generic >> _boundary_conditions.py", >> line 692, in evaluate >> raise Exception(msg) >> Exception: NAN value found in file_boundary at point id #4: >> (962097.95, 2518235.38). >> This point refers to one outside the mesh defined by the file li.sww. >> Make sure that the file covers the boundary segment it is assigned to >> in set_boundary. >> >> >> Thank you very much. >> >> Have a nice day, >> >> Bests, >> LI LI >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> -------- October Webinars: Code for Performance Free Intel webinars >> can help you accelerate application performance. >> Explore tips for MPI, OpenMP, advanced profiling, and more. Get the >> most from the latest Intel processors and coprocessors. See abstracts >> and register> >> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=60134071&iu=/4140/ostg.c >> lktrk _______________________________________________ >> Anuga-user mailing list >> Anu...@li... >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/anuga-user >> >> > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2013 13:45:56 +0200 > From: LILI<fg...@un...> > Subject: Re: [Anuga-user] Question on boundary segment > To: Joaquim Luis<jl...@ua...>, anu...@li..., > anu...@li... > Message-ID:<525...@un...> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Hi, > > Thank you for your reminding. But I just had a quick scan with the user-maual and other papers related on ANUGA, there exites the case study for storm surge. But anuga model can not apply the field forcing such as wind and atmosphere pressure when simulating the storm surge. Is there anybody who has the expenrience with modeling the storm surge with ANUGA? > > Thank you very much. > > Cheers, > LI > > > > > On 10/09/2013 12:44 PM, Joaquim Luis wrote: >> Hi, >> >> Let me jump in with my (somewhat related) doubts as well. >> If I remember well LI LI wants to model a storm surge but my basic >> question is, is ANUGA able to model such type of events? After all, >> ANUGA is a shallow water model and storm surges are not shallow water >> waves. >> I am working on a (finite difference) shallow water code with nesting >> grids for Mirone, which BTW is able to create .sww files, and decided >> to try to model a tidal wave. For that I feed a boundary with a time >> series created by the OSU code. >> You can see a quick animation at >> http://w3.ualg.pt/~jluis/ftp/tmp/tide_flood.gif >> Besides all the reflections (and some nosy border effects) what I >> noticed was that although the tide amplitude was 1.8 meters water >> accumulated inside the domain to more than 4 meters. >> I am a solid Earth Geophysicist with only marginal knowledge on >> hydrodynamic modeling and but what I think is happening is that >> although the system is fed by a tidal wave, inside the domain the >> model propagates as if it as a shallow water wave (which travels much >> than the tidal wave) and hence water accumulates to unreasonable values. >> >> I think this is the same type of problem that would occur with Anuga >> when modeling tides or storm surge waves. But am I wrong in my reasoning? >> >> Thanks >> >> Joaquim >> >>> Dear Anuga research group, >>> >>> Sorry to interrupt again, I have already created a 'sww' file through >>> 'ferret2sww.py',then applied to the boundary condition(the boundary >>> condition generate by ocean model). Now I have a question, for the >>> boundary condition, should the polygon has to fix the research area >>> excatly? For example, the ocean boundary area is much bigger than the >>> reseach area. Is that ok for simulation?! >>> >>> Because I got the error like this: >>> >>> Traceback (most recent call last): >>> File "run_new_prd.py", line 144, in<module> >>> for t in domain.evolve(yieldstep=120, finaltime=8164800): >>> File >>> "/home/lili/anuga_core/source/anuga/shallow_water/shallow_water_domai >>> n.py", >>> >>> line 1584, in evolve >>> skip_initial_step=skip_initial_step): >>> File >>> "/home/lili/anuga_core/source/anuga/abstract_2d_finite_volumes/generi >>> c_domain.py", >>> >>> line 1514, in evolve >>> self.update_boundary() >>> File >>> "/home/lili/anuga_core/source/anuga/abstract_2d_finite_volumes/generi >>> c_domain.py", >>> >>> line 1965, in update_boundary >>> B.evaluate_segment(self, boundary_segment_edges) >>> File >>> "/home/lili/anuga_core/source/anuga/abstract_2d_finite_volumes/generi >>> c_boundary_conditions.py", >>> >>> line 59, in evaluate_segment >>> q_bdry = self.evaluate(vol_id, edge_id) >>> File >>> "/home/lili/anuga_core/source/anuga/abstract_2d_finite_volumes/generi >>> c_boundary_conditions.py", >>> >>> line 692, in evaluate >>> raise Exception(msg) >>> Exception: NAN value found in file_boundary at point id #4: >>> (962097.95, 2518235.38). >>> This point refers to one outside the mesh defined by the file li.sww. >>> Make sure that the file covers the boundary segment it is assigned to >>> in set_boundary. >>> >>> >>> Thank you very much. >>> >>> Have a nice day, >>> >>> Bests, >>> LI LI >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> --------- >>> >>> October Webinars: Code for Performance Free Intel webinars can help >>> you accelerate application performance. >>> Explore tips for MPI, OpenMP, advanced profiling, and more. Get the >>> most from the latest Intel processors and coprocessors. See abstracts >>> and >>> register> >>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=60134071&iu=/4140/ostg. >>> clktrk >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Anuga-user mailing list >>> Anu...@li... >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/anuga-user >>> >>> >> > > > > ------------------------------ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > October Webinars: Code for Performance > Free Intel webinars can help you accelerate application performance. > Explore tips for MPI, OpenMP, advanced profiling, and more. Get the most from the latest Intel processors and coprocessors. See abstracts and register> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=60134071&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Anuga-user mailing list > Anu...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/anuga-user > > > End of Anuga-user Digest, Vol 61, Issue 3 > ***************************************** > > Geoscience Australia Disclaimer: This e-mail (and files transmitted with it) is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, then you have received this e-mail by mistake and any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing or copying of this e-mail and its file attachments is prohibited. The security of emails transmitted cannot be guaranteed; by forwarding or replying to this email, you acknowledge and accept these risks. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > October Webinars: Code for Performance > Free Intel webinars can help you accelerate application performance. > Explore tips for MPI, OpenMP, advanced profiling, and more. Get the most from > the latest Intel processors and coprocessors. See abstracts and register> > http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=60134071&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk > _______________________________________________ > Anuga-user mailing list > Anu...@li... > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/anuga-user > > |
