amforth-devel

Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise

[D N. <dny...@at...>]

On 3/20/2011 7:04:52 PM, Karl Lunt (kar...@se...) wrote:
 > Exactly. I've never had good luck using any simulator, AVRStudio's
 > included. I much prefer to trust the real hardware, even if you
 > start out using an LED for debug.
 >
 > BTW, have you tried out AVRStudio5 yet? It was released just a few
 > weeks ago and from the release notes, it looks like an excellent
 > upgrade.
 >
 > Karl


Well I first saw this effect while running on the hardware, using the 
dragon, and replicated it in the simulator to eliminate any possible 
faults in the dragon rider (as it's a newly soldered kit, and I don't 
much trust it yet). It manifested the same in both environments.

I'm using JTAG with dragon; does anyone have data to the effect that 
this sort of glitch is jtag specific, ie one of the other debug 
interfaces might behave differently? I would think using simulator would 
eliminate that variable.

I thought of trying 5, and may have to, but they made that one dependent 
on .net framework 4, which will not install on win2k, so only the xp 
machine runs that. I had hoped to be able to run the same toolchain at 
bench and desk.  Why they chose to restrict the next version that way I 
don't know, but they can do whatever they want without my permission. :( 
If I'm stuck using 5, then that suxxorz, as I'll have to do most of my 
coding at the bench, rather than the more comfortable desk place. :(

Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise

[D N. <dny...@at...>]

On 3/21/2011 2:19:15 AM, pito (pi...@vo...) wrote:
 > from my previous post...
 >
 > ....By chance I found the crash is caused
 > by the debugger - when the asm source wants to continue into a
 > "debugger" (for the code outside the "amforth.asm") the debuger is
 > called, but not set properly (my understanding) and crashes.
 > Now, how it works:
 > 1. compile amforth in AVR Studio as usuall
 > 2. then close all projects
 > 3. open file - e.g. amforth42_1284p.hex (MUST BE .HEX)
 > 4. Studio offers a new project name e.g. amforth42_1284p_hex.aps -
 > do save
 > 5. select device and debug platf

Okay, so I've been working with a clean (unmodified) amforth build in 
the simulator, using this trick of loading the .hex file into a new 
project. Determining what's going on in a forth system is hard enough as 
is, when we have labels, but okay, I'll give it a go.

When I tell it to run, it ends up in the weeds, executing illegal 
instruction ffff. As usual, it's hard to tell how it got there and as 
far as I know, there's no way to get studio4 to show a log or traceback. 
So I've been running it in autostep. Good news is it's not executing any 
illegal instructions, bad news is it's been running a long time, and I 
don't see any characters appearing at the simulated terminal (using hapsim).

So my question is, does anyone know how many instructions or cycles it 
takes for a correctly operating amforth to send its first characters out 
the uart, so I can tell if it's taken too long,or just has not yet 
gotten that far?

Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise

[pito <pi...@vo...>]

>From reset to the first characters ~3-4sec (old 1.7GHz notebook). P.

----- PŮVODNÍ ZPRÁVA -----
Od: "D Nyberg" <dny...@at...>
Komu: amf...@li...
Předmět: Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise
Datum: 22.3.2011 - 9:29:56

> On 3/21/2011 2:19:15 AM, pito (pi...@vo...)
> wrote:
> > from my previous post...
> >
> > ....By chance I found the crash is caused
> > by the debugger - when the asm source wants to
> > continue into a
> > > "debugger" (for the code outside the
> > "amforth.asm") the debuger is
> > > called, but not set properly (my understanding)
> > and crashes.
> > > Now, how it works:
> > 1. compile amforth in AVR Studio as usuall
> > 2. then close all projects
> > 3. open file - e.g. amforth42_1284p.hex (MUST BE
> > .HEX)
> > > 4. Studio offers a new project name e.g.
> > amforth42_1284p_hex.aps -
> > > do save
> > 5. select device and debug platf
> 
> Okay, so I've been working with a clean
> (unmodified) amforth build in 
> the simulator, using this trick of loading the
> .hex file into a new 
> project. Determining what's going on in a forth
> system is hard enough as 
> is, when we have labels, but okay, I'll give it a
> go.
> 
> When I tell it to run, it ends up in the weeds,
> executing illegal 
> instruction ffff. As usual, it's hard to tell how
> it got there and as 
> far as I know, there's no way to get studio4 to
> show a log or traceback. 
> So I've been running it in autostep. Good news is
> it's not executing any 
> illegal instructions, bad news is it's been
> running a long time, and I 
> don't see any characters appearing at the
> simulated terminal (using hapsim).
> 
> So my question is, does anyone know how many
> instructions or cycles it 
> takes for a correctly operating amforth to send
> its first characters out 
> the uart, so I can tell if it's taken too long,or
> just has not yet 
> gotten that far?
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Enable your software for Intel(R) Active
> Management Technology to meet the
> growing manageability and security demands of your
> customers. Businesses
> are taking advantage of Intel(R) vPro (TM)
> technology - will your software 
> be a part of the solution? Download the Intel(R)
> Manageability Checker 
> today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-dev2devmar
> _______________________________________________
> Amforth-devel mailing list
> Amf...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amforth-devel
> 

Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise

[pito <pi...@vo...>]

Which AvrStudio4 build do you run? I've upgraded to the latest 716
and the Hapsim2.17 does not hook..

----- PŮVODNÍ ZPRÁVA -----
Od: "D Nyberg" <dny...@at...>
Komu: amf...@li...
Předmět: Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise
Datum: 22.3.2011 - 9:29:56

> On 3/21/2011 2:19:15 AM, pito (pi...@vo...)
> wrote:
> > from my previous post...
> >
> > ....By chance I found the crash is caused
> > by the debugger - when the asm source wants to
> > continue into a
> > > "debugger" (for the code outside the
> > "amforth.asm") the debuger is
> > > called, but not set properly (my understanding)
> > and crashes.
> > > Now, how it works:
> > 1. compile amforth in AVR Studio as usuall
> > 2. then close all projects
> > 3. open file - e.g. amforth42_1284p.hex (MUST BE
> > .HEX)
> > > 4. Studio offers a new project name e.g.
> > amforth42_1284p_hex.aps -
> > > do save
> > 5. select device and debug platf
> 
> Okay, so I've been working with a clean
> (unmodified) amforth build in 
> the simulator, using this trick of loading the
> .hex file into a new 
> project. Determining what's going on in a forth
> system is hard enough as 
> is, when we have labels, but okay, I'll give it a
> go.
> 
> When I tell it to run, it ends up in the weeds,
> executing illegal 
> instruction ffff. As usual, it's hard to tell how
> it got there and as 
> far as I know, there's no way to get studio4 to
> show a log or traceback. 
> So I've been running it in autostep. Good news is
> it's not executing any 
> illegal instructions, bad news is it's been
> running a long time, and I 
> don't see any characters appearing at the
> simulated terminal (using hapsim).
> 
> So my question is, does anyone know how many
> instructions or cycles it 
> takes for a correctly operating amforth to send
> its first characters out 
> the uart, so I can tell if it's taken too long,or
> just has not yet 
> gotten that far?
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Enable your software for Intel(R) Active
> Management Technology to meet the
> growing manageability and security demands of your
> customers. Businesses
> are taking advantage of Intel(R) vPro (TM)
> technology - will your software 
> be a part of the solution? Download the Intel(R)
> Manageability Checker 
> today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-dev2devmar
> _______________________________________________
> Amforth-devel mailing list
> Amf...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amforth-devel
> 

Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise

[D N. <dny...@at...>]

On 3/22/2011 2:35:17 AM, pito (pi...@vo...) wrote:
 > Which AvrStudio4 build do you run? I've upgraded to the latest 716
 > and the Hapsim2.17 does not hook..

Well, rats! I too am running 716, so maybe that's why I'm not seeing 
anything on hapsim. Not having seen it run before, I don't have a 
standard of comparison to know what's normal. Um... I guess now I get to 
breakpoint emit and stuff and try to figure it out that way. :(

Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise

[D N. <dny...@at...>]

On 3/22/2011 2:35:17 AM, pito (pi...@vo...) wrote:
 > Which AvrStudio4 build do you run? I've upgraded to the latest 716
 > and the Hapsim2.17 does not hook..
 >
Okay, the hapsim page says it definitely works with studio 4 up to build 
684. I too am up to 716 right now. How does one go about downgrading to 
684, anyone know?

Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise

[Kalus M. <mic...@on...>]

Hi.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1170761/aStudio4b589.exe

michael



Am 23.03.2011 um 07:09 schrieb D Nyberg:

> On 3/22/2011 2:35:17 AM, pito (pi...@vo...) wrote:
>> Which AvrStudio4 build do you run? I've upgraded to the latest 716
>> and the Hapsim2.17 does not hook..
>>
> Okay, the hapsim page says it definitely works with studio 4 up to  
> build
> 684. I too am up to 716 right now. How does one go about  
> downgrading to
> 684, anyone know?

Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise

[D N. <dny...@at...>]

Thank you! :)

On 3/23/2011 2:04:04 AM, Kalus Michael (mic...@on...) wrote:
 > Hi.
 >
 > http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1170761/aStudio4b589.exe
 >
 > michael
 >
 >
 >
 > Am 23.03.2011 um 07:09 schrieb D Nyberg:
 >
 > > On 3/22/2011 2:35:17 AM, pito (pi...@vo...) wrote:
 > >> Which AvrStudio4 build do you run? I've upgraded to the latest 716
 > >> and the Hapsim2.17 does not hook..
 > >>
 > > Okay, the hapsim page says it definitely works with studio 4 up to
 > > build
 > > 684. I too am up to 716 right now. How does one go about
 > > downgrading to
 > > 684, anyone know?

Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise

[pito <pi...@vo...>]

Hi Helmut,
is there any chance to patch your hapsim 2.17 for working with
avrstudio4 build 716 (or the latest if any)? Thanks, Pito

----- PŮVODNÍ ZPRÁVA -----
Od: "D Nyberg" <dny...@at...>
Komu: amf...@li...
Předmět: Re: [Amforth-devel] Difficulty with Hello World exercise
Datum: 23.3.2011 - 10:10:24

> Thank you! :)
> 
> On 3/23/2011 2:04:04 AM, Kalus Michael
> (mic...@on...) wrote:
> > Hi.
> >
> > http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1170761/aStudio4b589.exe
> >
> > michael
> >
> >
> >
> > Am 23.03.2011 um 07:09 schrieb D Nyberg:
> >
> > > On 3/22/2011 2:35:17 AM, pito (pi...@vo...)
> > > wrote:
> > > > >> Which AvrStudio4 build do you run? I've
> > >> upgraded to the latest 716
> > >> > >> and the Hapsim2.17 does not hook..
> > >>
> > > Okay, the hapsim page says it definitely works
> > > with studio 4 up to
> > > > > build
> > > 684. I too am up to 716 right now. How does
> > > one go about
> > > > > downgrading to
> > > 684, anyone know?
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Enable your software for Intel(R) Active
> Management Technology to meet the
> growing manageability and security demands of your
> customers. Businesses
> are taking advantage of Intel(R) vPro (TM)
> technology - will your software 
> be a part of the solution? Download the Intel(R)
> Manageability Checker 
> today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-dev2devmar
> _______________________________________________
> Amforth-devel mailing list
> Amf...@li...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amforth-devel
>