Small Device C Compiler

Heri is a mail I sent to Alan Baldwin 2008-07-22 after he sent me the
permission to change the
> sdcc ASxxxx version to the GPL license.

Borut

----8<----
Alan,

I created the sdcc asxxxx license voting table at
http://sdcc.wiki.sourceforge.net/SDCC+ASXXXX+License

For more info about GPLv2 and GPLv3 see
http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl.html,
chapters http://www.gnu.org/licenses/quick-guide-gplv3.html,
http://www.gnu.org/licenses/rms-why-gplv3.html and
http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html


Borut


BALDWIN, ALAN wrote:
> Borut,
>
> I don't recall receiving any email from you. We have been in flux
> here with a new central email server and spam/spyware scanning
> software. (shop-pdp email is forwarded through that system.)
>
> I am pleased to give you permission to change the
> sdcc ASxxxx version to the GPL license. Have you any
> thoughts about which version, 2 or 3, of the GPL is best
> for the project? I haven't decided upon the GPL version
> for the newest ASxxxx and ASlink at this time.
>
> Alan
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Borut Razem [mailto:borut.razem@siol.net] Sent: Monday, July 21,
2008 3:32 PM
> To: BALDWIN, ALAN
> Cc: Ernst Stippl; Sdcc-Devel
> Subject: Re: possible License terms for ASxxxx and ASlink for use in
SDCC
>
> Hello Alan,
>
> Ernst Stippl forward me your response. I tried to contact you several
times but haven't receive an answer from you. Did you receive any of mails
I sent you?
>
> > Ernst,
> >
> > I am sorry for the delay in responding to your email.
> >
> > I anticipate that the next release of the ASxxxx Assemblers and
Linker
> > will be licensed under the GNU GPL. The time table has not been set,
but
> > will probably be within 6-8 months.
>
> this is a great news!
>
> But this won't solve the problem of asxxxx fork which is included in
sdcc.
> A possible solution would be to totally replace the sdcc asxxxx version
with the new official GPL one, but I think this is not feasible since many
sdcc specific changes were made in the sdcc asxxxx...
>
> So I'm asking you to give us a permission to change the license of
asxxxx fork included in sdcc to GPL too.
>
>
> Borut
>
>
>
> Borut Razem wrote:
>
>> Hello Ernst,
>>
>> this is a great news!
>>
>> The Alan's response is very important for all SDCC developers too, so
please send it to sdcc-devel mailing list or/and add it to the
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&atid=350599&aid=1896681&group_id=599
tracker.
>>
>> I'll write a new letter for Alan, aking him if he agree to change the
license of sdcc asxxxx fork to GPL too. This way we could release GPL-ed
sdcc asxxxx in the next sdcc release. Other way we will have to reapply all
changes, which were done for sdcc asxxxx, to the new Alan's asxxxx version,
which is not a trivial job and will take a lot of time.
>>
>> I still don't get if Alan received my letters or not and why he didn't
answer me. I'll ask you to forward him my letter again. I'll send you the
letter in next few days.
>>
>> Thank you,
>> Borut
>>
>>
>> Ernst Stippl wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Borut!
>>>
>>> I just received this answer from Alan.
>>>
>>> What do you think how to continue?
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> Ernst
>>> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>>> Von: BALDWIN, ALAN [mailto:baldwin@kent.edu] Gesendet: Montag, 16.
Juni 2008 22:46
>>> An: ernst@stippl.com
>>> Betreff: RE: possible License terms for ASxxxx and ASlink for use in
SDCC
>>>
>>> Ernst,
>>>
>>> I am sorry for the delay in responding to your email.
>>>
>>> I anticipate that the next release of the ASxxxx Assemblers and
Linker
>>> will be licensed under the GNU GPL. The time table has not been set,
but
>>> will probably be within 6-8 months.
>>>
>>> Alan
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Ernst Stippl [mailto:ernst@stippl.com]
>>> Sent: Friday, May 30, 2008 5:31 AM
>>> To: baldwin@shop-pdp.kent.edu
>>> Cc: borut.razem@siol.net
>>> Subject: possible License terms for ASxxxx and ASlink for use in SDCC
>>>
>>> Hello Alan!
>>>
>>> You may remember we had a brief mail exchange a few month ago about
the
>>> possibility of licenssing Asxxxx version 4 fur usage with SDCC.
>>>
>>> Back then you wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> quote
>>> I would gladly give permission to merge portions of ASxxxx V4.xx into
the
>>> SDCC project. I probably could be persuaded to allow the merged parts
to be
>>> licensed under the GNU license.
>>> At this time however I have not determine the future licensing terms
for the
>>> full ASxxxx Assembler package.
>>> Unquote
>>>
>>> So I contacted the SDCC development team and Mr. Borut Razem tried to
>>> contacted you. Unfortunately, these mails may not have reached you, so
I was
>>> asked to contact you again and forward Borut's message (see below) to
you.
>>>
>>> We would be very happy if you find the time (and interest, of course)
to let
>>> us know if and how there is a possibility to proceed.
>>>
>>> Thanks again and Best Regards Ernst Stippl
>>> Vienna, Austria
>>>
>>> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>>> Von: Borut Razem [mailto:borut.razem@siol.net]
>>> Gesendet: Samstag, 23. Februar 2008 19:02
>>> An: baldwin@shop-pdp.kent.edu; Sdcc-Devel
>>> Cc: Ernst Stippl
>>> Betreff: RE: License terms for ASxxxx and ASlink
>>>
>>> Hello Alan,
>>>
>>> I'm Borut Razem and I'm working as a developer on sdcc project since
2002.
>>> I saw the mail Ernst Stippl sent you and your response, so I'm writing
to
>>> you in the name of SDCC developers.
>>>
>>> I'm author of the "SDCC AS and LINK history" web page at
>>> http://sdcc.wiki.sourceforge.net/SDCC+AS+and+LINK+history. I wrote it
using
>>> information I could find in the sdcc svn repository and on ASxxxx home
page.
>>>
>>> > I would gladly give permission to merge portions of ASxxxx V4.xx
into the
>>> SDCC project.
>>>
>>> Sdcc is actually using only a part of ASxxxx:
>>> - asx8051 and aslink which supports also DS390 and DS400
>>> - as-z80, and link-z80 and as-gbz80, link-gbz80
>>> - as-hc08 and link-hc08
>>>
>>> My idea is to gradually re-merge both ASxxxx and SDCC branches. I
doubt that
>>> this can be done in short term, maybe it won't happen at all, but at
least
>>> we could share bug fixes and new features could be implemented on
both
>>> branches.
>>>
>>> > I probably could be persuaded to allow the merged parts to be
licensed
>>> under the GNU license.
>>>
>>> This is not our requirement to license ASxxxx under the GNU license,
since
>>> the sdcc version of ASxxxx is still using the old pre-4.0 "public
domain
>>> license". But you would probably have to change the ASxxxx license or
make
>>> an exception for use with sdcc.
>>>
>>> The statement "It is forbidden to distribute this software should
this
>>> file, or any of the remaining files, change in any way or be omitted
from
>>> the archive" makes it impossible to use (a part of) ASxxxx 4.0 or
newer with
>>> sdcc, since the code used with sdcc is changed and not full package
is
>>> distributed with sdcc.
>>>
>>> You should be aware that if you give a special permission to sdcc
project to
>>> reuse the code from ASxxxx and the sdcc asxxxx will remain in "public
>>> domain", someone could take the merged code from sdcc repository and
use it
>>> in closed source and/or commercial product without any (not even
moral)
>>> obligations to you as the original ASxxxx author or to sdcc asxxxx
project
>>> team.
>>>
>>> > At this time however I have not determine the future licensing
terms for
>>> the full ASxxxx Assembler package.
>>>
>>> You probably have personal reasons why not to use one of Free Open
Source
>>> Software licenses (GPL is just one of many). But if you have any
question or
>>> need any help to bring the package to open source (creating a source
code
>>> repository, ...), I'd be honored to help you.
>>>
>>> > I don't know if Sandeep Dutta is actively involved in the SDCC
project
>>> (he originally asked to use the ASxxxx and ASlink package) or if
someone
>>> else would like to discuss the options. Since I have never been an
active
>>> participant in the SDCC project I don't have any contacts with the
SDCC
>>> group.
>>>
>>> Sandeep Dutta is not actively involved in the SDCC project any more.
His
>>> last registered change is from 2002-03-16 (information from sdcc
ChangeLog).
>>> I'm glad to hear that you agreed about ASxxxx and ASlink usage with
sdcc,
>>> which means we are not doing enything illegal by using it. If you want
to
>>> get in contact with other sdcc developers, you can write a mail to
>>> sdcc-devel mailig list at sdcc-devel@lists.sourceforge.net.
>>>
>>> Sincerely Yours,
>>> Borut

I tried to send the following mail to Alan Baldwin two times, but I
haven't got any answer.

Ernst, can you try to resend it once more, maybe you'll have more luck...

----8<----
Dear Alan,

I'm Borut Razem and I'm working as a developer on sdcc project since
2002.
I saw the mail Ernst Stippl sent you and your response, so I'm writing to
you in the name of SDCC developers.

I'm author of the "SDCC AS and LINK history" web page at
http://sdcc.wiki.sourceforge.net/SDCC+AS+and+LINK+history. I wrote it using
information I could find in the sdcc svn repository and on ASxxxx home
page.

> I would gladly give permission to merge portions of ASxxxx V4.xx into
the SDCC project.

Sdcc is actually using only a part of ASxxxx:
- asx8051 and aslink which supports also DS390 and DS400
- as-z80, and link-z80 and as-gbz80, link-gbz80
- as-hc08 and link-hc08

My idea is to gradually re-merge both ASxxxx and SDCC branches. I doubt
that this can be done in short term, maybe it won't happen at all, but at
least we could share bug fixes and new features could be implemented on
both branches.

> I probably could be persuaded to allow the merged parts to be licensed
under the GNU license.

This is not our requirement to license ASxxxx under the GNU license, since
the sdcc version of ASxxxx is still using the old pre-4.0 "public domain
license". But you would probably have to change the ASxxxx license or make
an exception for use with sdcc.

The statement "It is forbidden to distribute this software should this
file, or any of the remaining files, change in any way or be omitted from
the archive" makes it impossible to use (a part of) ASxxxx 4.0 or newer
with sdcc, since the code used with sdcc is changed and not full package is
distributed with sdcc.

You should be aware that if you give a special permission to sdcc project
to reuse the code from ASxxxx and the sdcc asxxxx will remain in "public
domain", someone could take the merged code from sdcc repository and use it
in closed source and/or commercial product without any (not even moral)
obligations to you as the original ASxxxx author or to sdcc asxxxx project
team.

> At this time however I have not determine the future licensing terms for
the full ASxxxx Assembler package.

You probably have personal reasons why not to use one of Free Open Source
Software licenses (GPL is just one of many). But if you have any question
or need any help to bring the package to open source (creating a source
code repository, ...), I'd be honored to help you.

> I don't know if Sandeep Dutta is actively involved in the SDCC project
(he originally asked to use the ASxxxx and ASlink package) or if someone
else would like to discuss the options. Since I have never been an active
participant in the SDCC project I don't have any contacts with the SDCC
group.

Sandeep Dutta is not actively involved in the SDCC project any more. His
last registered change is from 2002-03-16 (information from sdcc
ChangeLog). I'm glad to hear that you agreed about ASxxxx and ASlink usage
with sdcc, which means we are not doing enything illegal by using it. If
you want to get in contact with other sdcc developers, you can write a mail
to sdcc-devel mailig list at sdcc-devel@lists.sourceforge.net.

Sincerely Yours,
Borut
---->8----

This is indeed very good news.

Just for the record, this developer mailing list thread is related:
http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_name=7aab3fde3b18fe63eb1f340d987fa499%40mac.com
In it Mark Swayne states he has tried to contact Alan Baldwin, but to no
avail.

Maarten

Ernst,

this is really a good news! I'll get in contact with Alan and we will see
if/how we can re-merge the asxxxx branches.

Thanks for the good job,
Borut

Some discussion was also here:
http://www.cygnal.org/ubb/Forum10/HTML/000058.html
It seems that SDCC team tried to contact Alan Baldwin before, but without
success.