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#9 Nyagua 2.1 Windows XP bugs+recommendation

closed-fixed
5
2012-10-22
2012-10-04
Anonymous
No

Nice piece for aquarium enthusiasts.

1. The first run. Default setting for date format was j.n.aaaa (Slovak envrironment). Program did no save any data without alert. After changing to dd-MM-yy started running correctly. Set correct default setting.
2. I recommend default setting set to checked for utf8 checkbox in the tab Report settings.
3. I recommend to the manual add notice, that the database path must not include space (like Documents and Settings). The browser does not find the reports (in the same directory).
4. Compatibility graph for fishes. The green vertical line displays dKH, but the horizontal line displays dGH. Fishbase has dGH only.
5. Compatibility graph for fishes uses attribut Common name. Everywhere (Aquarium report, Listbox in the tab Fishes) is used attribut Name. I reccomend to use the attribute Name here too.
6. Tab Plantbase. The attribute Height has prompt on wrong place (1 line higher).

miklas@aiten.sk

Discussion

    • assigned_to: nobody --> rudigiacomini
    • labels: --> Interface (example)
    • status: open --> open-wont-fix
     
  • Hi Miklas. Tanks for your contributions. Here is my comment:
    1) This seems to be a bug in slovak implementation of java machine. The default date format is read from the system but not accepted as valid. In other languages it run. The problem is that j and n are no valid letters for date format

    2) Already decided to do it. It will be in next fix release (soon - days I hope).

    3) If I well remember this is not ever true has you tried another browser?

    4) In some cases (like this) the two terms has the same mean. Anyway it's only a translation so it will be fixed in next release.

    5) To do (I hope I can fix this in week end).

    6) To do (as 5)

    Thanks again! All suggestions and bug reports like this allow me to clean the program :-)

     
  • Hi Rudi,

    4) It is not translation. It is wrong value for vertical line. The plantsbase uses dKH and the vertical line is correct in the compatibility graph. The fishbase uses dGH and the vertical line shows dKH. They are different values in the test. The two terms have really different meaning.

    3) I use FireFox. You call browser with the filename. The filename is not in the aphostrophes, so the browser takes the filename until first aphostroph.

    1) I am not java programmer, but i thing, the system has more default date formats.Try to chose another, or notice it in the instructions. It is horrible, you dont know, what happened, no saving, no alert. I almost threw the program out as unfunctional. Fortunately I started it in the command window and I saw the java error message. I recognize, that the problem is wit the date. I changed it in the settings and I enjoyed the program .

    Nice to see your prompt answer.
    Marian Miklas.

     
  • sorry, point 3) until first space.

     
  • Hi, it seems that my previous answer was incorrect in some parts so I hope you can excuse me. I passed the evening testing here and there and now I've a better vision of problems.

    3) Me and someothers has already faced the browser problem. What we seen in tests was that some browsers in some OS breaks the path if it has spaces. Passing everithing in apostrophes doesn't solve (wan't run in Linux). It seems that new browsers doesn't suffer of the problem but now it's back.
    So I agree this is a problem and it should be fixed!!! I'll delay some days the fix release (2.1.2 version) to have the time to solve this.
    Thanks again to have raised the problem.

    1) Here I'll go a little bit in technical terms hoping some one reading this can suggest a solution:

    About dates: what I'm doing is to retrieve from the current locale three standard formats for date (short date/med date/ long date) In US format the
    should be (for example): M/d/yy 8/22/12, MMM d,yyyy Aug 22,2012, MMMM d,yyyy August 22,2012
    These formats are retrieved automatically from java code as SHORT/MEDIUM and LONG date. I has added a dd/M/YY format that is a most used standard to be shure there is at least a valid format. When Java ask for the three data formats through the Java Machine the OS should respond depending on locale, control panel(s) settings and O.S.
    standards...

    Yesterday I write a test.jar that prints current date for current language in the three formats. that's what's happen:

    LANG=it_IT.utf8
    Short format: dd/MM/yy --> 04/10/12
    Medium format: d-MMM-yyyy --> 4-ott-2012
    Long format: d MMMM yyyy --> 4 ottobre 2012

    LANG=en_EN.utf8
    Short format: M/d/yy --> 10/4/12
    Medium format: MMM d, yyyy --> Oct 4, 2012
    Long format: MMMM d, yyyy --> October 4, 2012

    LANG=sk_SK.utf8
    Exception in thread "main" java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Illegal pattern character 'j'
    at java.text.SimpleDateFormat.compile(SimpleDateFormat.java:845)
    [...]

    So as I explained this is a JAVA VM bug. The JVM for sk returns some j and n chars that are invalid for format.
    I'll write this in manual!!!

    4) Just seen the problem... the value in graphic should be GH but KH is keep from table. When I was talking about translation is because in some lang the caption has been translated as DH a sinonim than GH.
    The righ value to use is GH and this is the value that is write as DH in all *base tables.
    KH is used for CO2 <->PH evaluation.
    So I will fix using GH value that is the same as DH (Total Hardness).
    THANKS!!! this was a big mistake I made!!!!

    Any comment on what I explained is welcome.

     
  • Once again to "translation" GH,KH,DH.

    I started English (Italian too) version of Nyagua and I found out, what is the problem.
    You uses 3 prompts for two different values in both English and Italian version.
    Tab Readings uses prompt GH (General Hardness) and KH (Carbonate Hardness).
    Tab FishBase uses prompts DH min, DH max (GH,KH ???), which were clever translated to Slovak
    as dGH (your GH). For fishes is more important to check GH.
    Tab PlantBase uses same prompts DH min, DH max, which were clever translated to Slovak
    as dKH (your KH). For plants is more important to check KH.

    DH is used for German hardness, that is in any relation to KH, but I dont think,
    you mean this one.

    I recommend next:

    1. Change prompt GH to dGH (Degrees of General Hardness) in the tab Readings and
    prompt KH to dKH, which would be clearer.

    2. Change prompts DH min, DH max to dGH min, dGH max in the tab FishBase.

    3. Change prompts DH min, DH max to dKH min, dKH max in the tab PlantBase.

    4. Change prompt KH to dH (or Hardness) in the window Plotting Options.

    5. Take the value GH in the green vertical line of the Compatibility test for Fishes .
    Adopt prompts and texts in the window (to dGH).

    I recommend to use dGH for Invertebrates too.

     
  • Hi,to the date format problem.
    All versions except Slovakian seems to be OK. It seems, You are right that it is a bug. The listbox in the Date Format Settings is filled uncorrectly. When I chose any of uncorrect format and press OK comes alert like Wrong date format, setting do default value MM-dd-yy, which is correct.

     
  • Hi Marian (think this is the first name),
    It seems that we write at same time.
    I afixed lmost all problems but I need some time to test everithing -especially the browser solution-.

    As I stated initially the GH DH KH was also a translation problem. All labels come from translation table.
    Now I've changes source to use GH in compatibility plot. I agree with you this is the right value to use for fish and invertebrates - it is tied to envinronment where species live and is fundamental in breeding.
    What I don't understand is your statement that for plants KH value has to be used.
    I think no one of values is relevant but if any GH should be used.
    KH is the buffer value that limit the PH lowering. Has no direct effect on plant and PH is already in compat. chart.
    GH is not proved to have any effect on plants but in some cases a too high value show that there are too much of Mg and Ca in water and this can lead to: 1) some deficiency in assumption of other elements 2) umbalancement that lead to algae grow instead plants grow.
    So I think the right value should be in any case GH.

    Any opinion is welcome :-)

     
  • Hi Rudi,
    my first name is Marian, it sounds as a woman name for foreigner, but I am a man:-).
    I have been an aquarium enthuziast for more then 1 year. I had had the aquarium for more then 20 years before, but it had worked without "sofistical" actions. I had to change the aquarium (250l), because threat of leaking. After changing the aquarium I had big problems with plants. I had not use any fertiliyer before. I started to use PMDD and I was reading on the internet, how to use it, and what I shall measure. I am persuaded, that I need to check dKH for plants. Algae is connected with PO4 and NH3
    mainly. I agree with you, that high or low dGH can block some nutrients, but low or high dKH is more dangerous for platns (at least because of CO2). High dGH is usually connected with high dKH. The decision is up to you. I would like to see dKH for plants.

    Marian.

     
  • Slavko
    Slavko
    2012-10-06

    Hi Rudi a (ahoj) Marián,

    i am happy that i can see another Slovak user :-)

    I used the mentioned site (rybicky.net) as template for my (sk) translation of the Nyagua, in mean, that i am using dKH for plants and dGH for fishes and invertebrates. There are some problems with this, because some strings are shared for all tables (e.g. compatibility chart settings), then in my last translation's update i switched most of them back to the "dH", as neutral terms for degrees of hardeness and as i read, the Rudi is going into the same idea. This allows anybody to use this value for GH or for KH, by his own opinion. And this avoids the problems with sharing one string in both means.

    For the plants (IMO) are both (KH & GH) values important, because GH tells about Ca and Mg in the water, and second is CO2 value and pH stability related. But, the GH value is less important, becuase most of plants can healthy grow in relative any values range. But plants can have problems (or algae can be happy) in improper pH range (or fast changes) and CO2 values - but the latest dependends on more things.

    The KH (or GH) seems to be proper label, because the dKH or dGH is unit for the values only, but they seems to be often used as synonym. Finally, the "d" in dKH or dGH is not about degrees, but for Deutsch (as Deutsch degrees), and proper seems to by the e.g. "°dKH", but because it is not the SI unit, it is not important. And for me, it seems better to use the "dH" than "H" only.

    For Marian, be free to write me out of this tracker (i wrote to you by email some mins ago, to you can receive my email address) in our native language.

    regards

     
  • Hi, happy to see that we can exchange opinions to improve this program.
    As Slavko stated the term DH has ever been intended to leave everyone to choose to use GH or KH freely.
    We are not alone (as I showed with links) in preferring to use one or other value.

    The wrong news here are that:
    1) At now compatibility chart can show only one value between GH and KH
    2) I can change it to show one more diagram but this lead to have a PH / temp /GH /KH charting agains three values that are stored in *base
    3) For fishes and invertebrates there is no problem we all agree the right value is GH - but for plants if everyone is free to use KH or GHI will not able in code to chart it because I'll not know what is everyone storing in plantsbase...
    It's hard to explain but think in this way in plantsbase there is only one field and I need to know if it has to bee charted against KH or GH in readings.

    One solution can be in modify the plotting selection form:
    In low part you select fishes/Inverts/plants so when plants is selected the upper part can change and the selection can be
    [ ] PH
    [ ] temp
    [ ] o GH o KH

    Using an option for last choiche instead of

    [ ] PH
    [ ] temp
    [ ] GH

    That should be choices for fish and inverts.

    So everyone can say here if he uses GH or KH in plantsbase and what he wants in chart..

    This will require to me a little bit to change things but should be a good change.

    Comments?

     
  • Slavko
    Slavko
    2012-10-06

    From my point of view, there must be no problem with ploting and freedom of the GH/KH choice, simple ploting valuse is needed, then changing string must be enough :-) There can be only one problem . when sharing the databse will be taken into play and mixing of the values can happens. But for me, i do not see needeng of the GH values for plants, nor to have both values.

    But, as i wrote with Rudi some time ago, there will be needing of changes in the charting (do you remmeber my plant charts?) and i have the plan to prepare the suggestions of changes in chart's interface, then there can be considered these changes too and prepare two separate fields for hardness. Then anybody can leave empty one of them...

    I suggest to move this discussion about charting into feature request.

    regards

     
  • Hi,
    OK, I can admit, that we both Slovaks are influenced by the same czech site, where is used KH for plants. I agree with Rudi, GH is important too and with the given GH, KH must be less, so KH is limited by GH. I have compared some plants of "Rudi's best site" with czech site and it seems, that using GH for plants is good. Given KH for plants is comparable to given GH on another site.
    My recomendation is using GH for plants and Slavko will change the prompts in the slovak translation file.
    It is not necessary to complicate the program givig possibility of option GH or KH for plants.

    Marian.

     
  • For Slavko,
    I have not received any your e-mail.

    miklas@aiten.sk

     
  • Slavko
    Slavko
    2012-10-08

    It is possible to have KH > GH, but my English is not enought to describe this, then i will brief - e.g. the Na2CO3 has influence in KH, but not in GH.

    I asked on the rybicky.net forum, why in their plants atlas is KH only (http://rybicky.net/forum/6912).

    The mail problem was solved :-)

    regards

     
  • I'll resume:
    1) Date format problem: it's a java machine bug for slovak translation. I'll add a note on manual (maibe I'll add a FAQ section on home page).
    2) I've set it as default, already in cvs. It will be soon released
    3, 5, 6) Fixed in cvs soon released
    4) Moved everithing to GH. Fixed in cvs. It will be soon released

    If nothing goes wrong I'll release everything tomorrow as 2.1.2 with some other fixes.

     
  • New version is OK. Thanks.

    Marian.

     
  • Closed the track as fixed.
    Thanks for all help.

     
    • status: open-wont-fix --> closed-fixed