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## Re: [mh] Reducing Garden Watering due Rainfall

 [mh] Reducing Garden Watering due Rainfall From: Andy McCallum - 2009-05-20 03:44:43 Hi all,

Who is reducing the amount of water they deliver to their gardens, when it rains? What sort of algorithm are you using?

My MH is receiving rain fall data from the house weather station and also controls the irrigation controller.  So, I have the opportunity to automatically reduce the amount of water whenever it rains.

I realise, this is more of a "gardening question" rather than a straight programming query. I am hoping somebody has already done the research, and has a smart algorithm that accounts for the amount of rain and how long ago in a biologically correct manner. Obviously, the straight "don't water if it is raining" is simple enough to execute. I am hoping to do something a little more sensitive.

Andy.
 Re: [mh] Reducing Garden Watering due Rainfall From: Brad Yarotsky - 2009-05-20 05:13:47 I am also close to building this into my system. I will be putting up my weather station (1-wire) this summer to interface my sprinklers (weeder board). I haven't done any research, but have been thinking about it for a year or so. Here are some of the ideas that I have had. Here are some criteria of when or not to water - time of day (people may be using the yard) - days of week (don't want wet gardens if you weed on Saturdays) - too much wind (from weather station) delay for calmer conditions - has rained recently I was thinking is would be nice to calculate when and how much it has rained and by using a numbering system or percentage. These are just ideas and have no actual validity. On a scale from 1 to 10 1 = Just watered (don't need to water) 10 = Need to water 1 day, between 70 & 80 degrees = 2 1 day, between 80 & 90 degrees = 3 1 day, between 90 & 100 degrees = 5 1 inch of rain = -10 1/2 inch of rain = -5 1 watering session (1 inch) = -10 forecast rain tomorrow 90% = -2 etc... Or something like that... And then you could set different zones to have different limits, so the hanging pots have a limit of 5 and the grass is 10. May want to limit the system to not go below 0. Need to do some testing to get the desired results. Just some ideas. I suck at programming, but I would help out where I could. Brad > > > > > > Hi all,
>
>   Who is reducing the amount of water they deliver to their gardens, > when it rains? What sort of algorithm are you using?
>
>   My MH is receiving rain fall data from the house weather station and > also controls the irrigation controller.  So, I have the opportunity to > automatically reduce the amount of water whenever it rains.
>
>   I realise, this is more of a "gardening question" rather than a > straight programming query. I am hoping somebody has already done the > research, and has a smart algorithm that accounts for the amount of > rain and how long ago in a biologically correct manner. Obviously, the > straight "don't water if it is raining" is simple enough to execute. I > am hoping to do something a little more sensitive.
>
> Andy.
> > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Crystal Reports - New Free Runtime and 30 Day Trial > Check out the new simplified licensing option that enables > unlimited royalty-free distribution of the report engine > for externally facing server and web deployment. > http://p.sf.net/sfu/businessobjects________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe from this list, go to: > http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=1365 > >
 Re: [mh] Reducing Garden Watering due Rainfall From: Sean Mathews - 2009-05-20 06:02:44 I have pondered this myself recently. I finally have all of my zones working and connected to MH. I have setup commands to water from 5 to 20 minutes for a given zone. The biggest problem I see in any intelligent watering system is that most of my plants have different watering requirements. Some flowers don't like to be watered until they are almost dry or they will get root problems. Others like to be misted every morning like dew. Roses can be very picky check out this guide. I was just this morning wondering about a wireless sensor or some inexpensive sensors to place around the different plants to determine if the soil is dry before watering again. http://www.rose.org/watering-roses/ I have been considering something like this. http://www.eesensors.com/DocsPDFs/ESP06_moist.pdf Use an X10 keyfob and write some modified firmware for the PIC to periodically report the data back to my W800 http://www.camelspit.org/modified-x10-rf-transmitter/ Re Sean M > -----Original Message----- > From: Brad Yarotsky [mailto:brad@...] > Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 9:43 PM > To: The main list for the MisterHouse home automation program > Subject: Re: [mh] Reducing Garden Watering due Rainfall > > > I am also close to building this into my system. I will be putting up my > weather station (1-wire) this summer to interface my sprinklers (weeder > board). > > I haven't done any research, but have been thinking about it for a year or > so. > Here are some of the ideas that I have had. > > Here are some criteria of when or not to water > - time of day (people may be using the yard) > - days of week (don't want wet gardens if you weed on Saturdays) > - too much wind (from weather station) delay for calmer conditions > - has rained recently > > I was thinking is would be nice to calculate when and how much it has > rained > and by using a numbering system or percentage. These are just ideas and > have > no actual validity. > > On a scale from 1 to 10 > > 1 = Just watered (don't need to water) > 10 = Need to water > > 1 day, between 70 & 80 degrees = 2 > 1 day, between 80 & 90 degrees = 3 > 1 day, between 90 & 100 degrees = 5 > 1 inch of rain = -10 > 1/2 inch of rain = -5 > 1 watering session (1 inch) = -10 > forecast rain tomorrow 90% = -2 > etc... > > Or something like that... And then you could set different zones to have > different limits, so the hanging pots have a limit of 5 and the grass is > 10. > May want to limit the system to not go below 0. Need to do some testing to > get > the desired results. > > Just some ideas. I suck at programming, but I would help out where I > could. > Brad > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi all,
> >
> >   Who is reducing the amount of water they deliver to their > gardens, > > when it rains? What sort of algorithm are you using?
> >
> >   My MH is receiving rain fall data from the house weather station > and > > also controls the irrigation controller.  So, I have the > opportunity to > > automatically reduce the amount of water whenever it rains.
> >
> >   I realise, this is more of a "gardening question" rather than a > > straight programming query. I am hoping somebody has already done the > > research, and has a smart algorithm that accounts for the amount of > > rain and how long ago in a biologically correct manner. Obviously, the > > straight "don't water if it is raining" is simple enough to execute. I > > am hoping to do something a little more sensitive.
> >
> > Andy.
> > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ------ > > Crystal Reports - New Free Runtime and 30 Day Trial > > Check out the new simplified licensing option that enables > > unlimited royalty-free distribution of the report engine > > for externally facing server and web deployment. > > > http://p.sf.net/sfu/businessobjects_______________________________________ > _________________ > > To unsubscribe from this list, go to: > > http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=1365 > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---- > Crystal Reports - New Free Runtime and 30 Day Trial > Check out the new simplified licensing option that enables > unlimited royalty-free distribution of the report engine > for externally facing server and web deployment. > http://p.sf.net/sfu/businessobjects > ________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe from this list, go to: > http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=1365 > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.27/2111 - Release Date: 05/19/09 > 17:59:00
 Re: [mh] Reducing Garden Watering due Rainfall From: Andy McCallum - 2009-05-21 13:01:46
Thanks to everybody who has replied so far.

I do think it is time for us to build a common module for weather information reporting and sprinkler control which could then cater for different hardware and different weather websites. I have been trawling through all the various sprinkler control modules in MH and also the weather collection modules. What struck me most was the repetition of similar ideas being coded slightly differently for different hardware. The other common problem is code that relies upon a weather website peculiar to a particular locality - not much can be done to be fix this problem.

With regard to my initial question, my head is swimming with evapotranspiration models and whether the FAO modified Penman Monteith formula is better than some other ETzero calculation! Suffice to say, as Jim points out, this is the gold standard. If you can get ETzero calculated (or reported from a website) all you have to do is determine Kc for each of your watering zones. Kc is just the multiplier to relate your plants/grass/crop in your type of soil to the reference crop used to calculate ETzero. Kc in our case can be guesstimated and then tuned over time.

A moisture sensor would take out all the guess work, but they appear to be high maintenance (gypsum blocks) and require quite a few a different depths and spread around the property. Sean's reference to ESP06; looks interesting but quite experimental (unfortunately) - a good project for a quiet winter.

Brad brought up some interesting ideas especially with regards to sprinkler control. Sprinklers are banned here in Sydney, Australia due to drought, so I had not considered the variables he indicated. Definitely, worth supporting them in a generic module.

I was considering something very similar to Jim Serack's discounting recent rain method. I was thinking about varying the discount based on temperature and humidity.

I have discovered my local Bureau of Meteorology (Australia) is reporting open pan evaporation;. So that might also be useful. (This is different from evapotranspiration.) Yet again, though that will lead to a module unusable outside of my locality....

As Jim Skinner mentioned, it would be great to develop something that could be generalised and reused. I might start out with something quite simple that can have it's inputs defined and then hopefully we could look at a more generalised framework to control sprinklers in response to the weather...

Andy.