#33 Midi sustain cc recognised by Bristol

closed
Nick Copeland
5
2010-04-30
2010-04-23
Andrew C
No

Having Bristol recognise and use the midi sustain cc would be rather cool, imo. Being able to do octave sweeps up and down the keyboard with a mono patch ala at 0:19 in this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jJNJ1YHqHA would be pretty cool.

Andrew.

Discussion

  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-24

    Bristol should already support CC 64 for a hold pedal. Do you have one? If not, you should be able to configure one of the buttons on your surface to send CC 64 and I think I interpret any value other than zero as sustain (this is not quite to spec, it should be <64 is off and I will change that.

    Now the hold pedal is binary, on or off. This is not a continuous footpedal to modulate a signal. Some of the emulators also support footpedals such as CC 4/36 (FootPedal) and 11/43 (ExpressionPedal) but that is very emulator specific. The MemoryMoog should give access to both and the Hammond should really track CC 11/43 for expression. The issue is that very few people actually have an expression pedal attached (they are surprisingly expensive). Perhaps I should put it back in and then default the control value to fully on - the reason I dropped support for it was that having all controls default to zero meant no signal unless you push the pedal open. I can rework that.

    Regards, nick.

     
  • Andrew C
    Andrew C
    2010-04-24

    Hm, I plugged in my sustain pedal to my controller, but holding down the sustain pedal doesn't cause the note to sustain indefinatly (I've tried this with the Odyssey emulation). I made sure to set the sustain pedal cc to 64 and that it was transmitting an on value of 127 and an off value of 00. I also assigned it to a button as well, but that didn't have any effect. Have I found a bug here?

    Andrew.

     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-25

    That does sound like a bug as the code is there. There are two things we can do - i will have another look through the code to look for what actually happens when CC #64 arrives, can you try a -mididbg -mididbg2 and show the output when you press the pedal?

    Regards, nick

     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-25

    Ah, does the sustain pedel does not get considered in the monophonic note logic, only the polyphonic assignement? You could test with the polysix, then also -nnp:

    startBristol -pro1 -nnp

    This will configure the -pro1 and override it's note logic with 'none = poly last note assigment'.

    Regards, nick

     
  • Yes, it seems to only work with polyphonic assignments. :/

    On a related note, I can't get the pro1 to make any noise. The polysix works fine and sustains the notes.

    Andrew.

     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-25

    I had a think about this and sustain with HNP or LNP does not make any sense, at all: If I have high note precedence and 'sustain' then the only sound you will ever hear is the highest note, very annoying if you are playing a complex solo.

    Sustain in this sense is just have the 'gate' open and you can achieve this with legato playing styles where you hold the lowest key and play trills above it (or the converse with LNP).

    Having sustain work with -mono -nnp (which is one single monophonic voice and last note precedence) will give you what you want, I think, but was not a feature of (m)any of the old monophonics - it really needed a CPU to do this and none of them had one.

    Kind regards nick.

     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-25

    I don't think the pro1 is broken, if you start the emulator and press sustain before any notes it goes dumb. Release the sustain pedal and press again it seems to open up, looking into it - I imagine it is some flag not initialised correctly for monophonic note logic. As a disclaimer, this description is what I see here, may not be what you are seeing there.

    Also, looking into a monophonic sustain system where the 'held' note for HNP is the lowest played during the sustain sequence - the rest follow the normal note preference but if you let go of everything there will still be a low note playing (the reverse for low note preference naturally - I sustain the highest not pressed). This basically saves you one finger, may or may not be a great idea.

    WIll try and track down the Pro1/mono sustain 'dumbness'.

    Regards, nick

     
  • "don't think the pro1 is broken, if you start the emulator and press
    sustain before any notes it goes dumb. Release the sustain pedal and press
    again it seems to open up, looking into it - I imagine it is some flag not
    initialised correctly for monophonic note logic. As a disclaimer, this
    description is what I see here, may not be what you are seeing there.
    "

    Um yeah, I didn't hold down the sustain pedal, I just clicked a note on the pro1 emulator and no sound came out of it.

    "Also, looking into a monophonic sustain system where the 'held' note for
    HNP is the lowest played during the sustain sequence - the rest follow the
    normal note preference but if you let go of everything there will still be
    a low note playing (the reverse for low note preference naturally - I
    sustain the highest not pressed). This basically saves you one finger, may
    or may not be a great idea."

    This was sort of what I'm talking about. :-)

     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-25

    I am looking at an issue with the first note not working on the monophonics. I know what happens just not quite why: The very first note for a mono instrument is a normal note on but then the note never stops playing, you just change the velocity/pitch/gate, etc. This is not quite operational and I am looking at it.

    Can try and get you some code to test the 'monophonic sustain'. It is a strange option and not something the original phat monophonics could do but see what you think when you try it.

    Kind regards, nick.

     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-25

    Posted some code that should give you the sustain pedal support as discussed and it has a workaround for the lost '1st note' of a synth. It is a workaround as it works but I cannot really say why (the fix is to play a note for you in monophonic mode - you will find an odd error message after starting the synth that is related to the actual cause which I will debug later).

    http://bristol.sf.net/files/bristol-0.60.2a.tar.gz

    Kind regards, nick

     
  • Nick,

    On my system, the pro1 makes no sound, regardless of whether I hold the sustain pedal down.

    The odyssey and mini emulators seem to work fine. i.e they make sound and the sustain pedal seems to work with them.

    Andrew

     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-26

    Hi Andrew,

    How many Pro1 patches have you tried - does it affect all of them?

    Regards, nick.

     
  • Whoops! I forgot the 1st patch on my system was the modwheel controlled filter patch that I used for that pro1/vox/mini demo I sent you a while back! The modwheel was all the way at 0 when the patch was loaded, so the filter was completely closed. :/

    But yes, all the patches on the pro1 work. :-P

    Andrew.

     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-26

    Good, it works. I will keep the case open for a while, there were changes to the monophonic note logic so will see if you get any issues. The upload will be in 0.60.2, not sure when I will send that out.

    Regards, nick

     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-28

    This is going on to pending. There have been changes to the voice assignement code to support the feaeture. If it needs more changes they will be bug reports against this code.

     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-28

    • status: open --> pending
     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-30

    Closed. Code has been integrated. If there are issues with this new monophonic note logic then they will be taken care of with bug reports.

     
  • Nick Copeland
    Nick Copeland
    2010-04-30

    • status: pending --> closed