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Ideas for new segment colors

MarcoA
2010-05-19
2012-09-17
  • MarcoA
    MarcoA
    2010-05-19

    Hi again Joan

    After creating an account, i will post some suggestions here. I like this
    program most because there is a sort of an ecosystem with species interaction,
    and genes manifest themselves clearly in shape and function of the
    organism/bot.It´s really concrete. I simulate it very often in the background
    while surfing in the web...

    For example "Swimbots/Gene Pool" has no ecosystem,and ends with only one
    species.

    I also like yours more than Primordial life. Everything else i found is really
    primitive or simulates only one thing like fast locomotion, and there is no
    "world".

    First of all, i will copy my suggestion about the gray segment, because it
    belongs here:

    I think that gray segments are too strong, they induct a uniformed world. I
    would made gray like a assassin segment (what it already is), means gray can
    only kill an organism at unprotected segments namely green, yellow, and cyan.
    Against blue it should stay like it is. White should infect gray, red should
    absorb energy of gray. Gray vs Gray should do nothing. I think that would make
    things interesting. Also it is not unrealistic, a snake is more dangerous,
    when the other animal doesn`t perceive the snake and stands up for a fight.
    Second, against parasites a snake can do nothing. And third, often venomous
    animals are immune against their own venom.

    Also very small organisms like "Mosquitos" get a great advantage by having a
    small surface (small hit chance), because gray is that deadly. Killing a huge
    competitor in one second, take a huge load of energy and reproduce like crazy.
    So they can easily obtain enough energy to have yellow segments too. Thereby
    all big predators will die out, all white Parasites will die out and all
    plants without blue. So we have small mosquitos and well armored plants.

    My ecosystems were much more diverse without the gray segment (probability 0),
    but yes, gray can end a deadlocked system,

    when there are few cyan segments because of red+ yellow+green plants. A gray
    segment, which has to aim precisely (like a bee stinger) at green, yellow or
    cyan segments should be enough to let gray subsist and not to dominate. Also
    it will work like before against armored plants.

    I dont know how difficult it is to change the function of gray, but if its
    easy you may install two different working gray segments for individual
    choice. (if you still like gray the way it works now)

    The other segments are very well balanced in my opinion,the balance is much
    better than in many computer games (only that it is not necessary to let white
    cost anything, its not overly strong). Strong balance leads to a diverse
    environment. Therefore my compliment.:)

    Now my ideas for new segments.

    The first three are all around the food chain.

    Mostly in nature there are Heterotrophs, which feed on plants, there are
    generalists which feed on many food sources, there are predators which feed on
    primary consumers, and there are Destruents. (choose color you like;))

    First new segment "Dark Red": They are strictly carnivorous, "Dark Red" can
    ONLY obtain energy from "red", "dark red" (and "orange", see below) and "gray"
    segments (see also my suggestion for gray segments above), but on the other
    hand "red" segments can NOT obtain energy from "dark red" segments. So they
    would protect green plants by controlling herbivores, and parasites can also
    spread more. Both two are normally not too successfull.

    Second new segment "Violet": They are strictly destruents, and obtain energy
    ONLY from death organisms.Further, normal Red segments will NOT obtain energy
    anymore from remains of beings. Violet will itself be consumed by Red, but not
    be harmed by "Dark Red". "Violet" can however make themselves carcasses with
    the help of gray segments, but if they use gray, they may now be consumed by
    "Dark Red" (else "Dark Red" would be totally helpless against gray
    "scavenger", see reasons above in the part about grey segment). Gray kills
    only cyan, yellow and green (and orange, see below) and therefore will not
    harm "Violet" too.

    Third new segment: "Orange": They are strictly herbivorous, and obtain energy
    ONLY from green and blue!!! (nutcracker:D) segments, they don`t harm
    themselves (school, herd, flock) and are helpless against "Red", "Dark Red"
    and "Gray" segments and would absolutely need yellow segments to survive
    versus white parasites.

    End of first section

    Greets, Marco

     
  • MarcoA
    MarcoA
    2010-05-19

    Second section

    The organisms in Biogenesis are haploid, so sexual reproduction is
    unrealistic, but a form of bacterial conjugation can take place.

    New segment "Pink": First it would have the same relations to all other
    segments like yellow or cyan (Green has new relations, see above).

    It will only do something, when two pink segments touch each other. Then both
    of the organisms will get "infected",

    and their next descendent will have a random mix of their genome. "Gene 0" of
    the new organism might then be former "Gene 0" of Organism 1 or "Gene 0" of
    Organism 2, Gene 1" of the new organism might then be former "Gene 1" of
    Organism 1 or "Gene 1" of Organism 2, and so on. If there is for example no
    Gene 3 in one of the organisms, there is a 50% chance to have it from the
    other organism, or alternatively have no Gene 3. The only Gene that should not
    be randomized would be the "Pink- Gene" Might be difficult to implement, i
    have no idea?! But otherwise, the probability would be high, that the new
    organism can`t

    conjugate, or has two versions of it. If an organism has enough energy to
    reproduce without being touched before, it would reproduce normally/asexually.
    If it has yellow segments, so only one descendent of each would be mixed (for
    a more stable species).

    Another aspect would be, that touching another pink organism would heal a
    white infection. Interestingly enough sexual reproduction is allegedly an
    adaption against parasites, see here:http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles
    /PMC53943/pdf/pnas01034-0320.pdf

    All in all, it is a bit Rock-paper-scissors, so there is always a possibility
    to counter evolutionary.

    And it should be quite realistic, hope you liked it.

    Greets, Marco

     
  • MarcoA
    MarcoA
    2011-07-16

    Hi Joan:)

    A suggestion for segment color "Yellow" :

    As it is now, it is only evolutionary effective to have very short (shortest)
    yellow segments.

    All other segments have some advantages...

    ...if they are short:

    Less energy consumption

    (+ some less obvious advantages like lesser target area... )

    ...and if they are long:

    Green obtains more energy

    Red absorbs more energy

    Blue protects better (not in all events but it surely isn´t better to have
    blue segments with a length of 2,0)

    Cyan improves speed

    White increases infection rate ( indirectly because of larger surface area)

    Gray increases death rate and protects better ( indirectly because of larger
    surface area)

    and YELLOW ONLY CONSUMES MORE ENERGY and increases target area (also a bad
    effect)

    My idea:

    I think you can translate long yellow segments (game) into a highly developed
    reproductive system (nature).

    The descendents of this organism should be stronger than the descendents of an
    organism that has a primitive

    reproductive system.

    How can you implement this?

    I think the best idea would be to reduce the starting energy of the
    descendents.

    18,0 yellow segment length = 100 % of the energy is transfered (nothing is
    lost)

    2,0 yellow segment length = 11,1111111 % of the energy is transfered (all the
    rest is released in the form of CO2)

    If a child of an organism with yellow segment length of 18,0 will start with
    an energy value of 10,0 (0 released)

    a child of an organism with yellow segment length of 2,0 will start with an
    energy value of 1,1 (8,9 released)

    If an organism has more than 8 yellow segments, the other segments should be
    added.

    For example a 8-symmetric organism with two genes (one for 10,0 and one for
    8,0 yellow segments)

    will transfer 100% of the energy to its descendents.

    Greetings , Marco

     
  • james philip
    james philip
    2011-08-12

    Hi I would also like to say what a great program and would second the Pink
    idea made above.

    I have two suggestions for segments/genes.

    1. Anti mutation gene - instead of a single value for mutation rate there would be a range. Where a particular organism fell in this range would be determined by the amount of anti-mutation segment it had in relation to the total mass of organism. I suggest this because the bigger/more complex an organism the more likely it is to mutate in biogenesis. Yet my understanding of biology is that the more complex an organism the more it invests in protecting its genome and the less it tends to mutate. If I am wrong in regards to the program or biology of unicellular organisms please tell me.

    the second is in the same theme.

    1. Longevity gene - instead of a single value of Life Expectancy there would be a range. Where a particular organism fell in this range would be determined by the amount of longevity segment it had in relation to the total Mass.
     
  • MarcoA
    MarcoA
    2011-08-14

    Hi James

    1.Quote:" I suggest this because the bigger/more complex an organism the more
    likely it is to mutate in biogenesis."

    This is true, because each gene (and each value) has its own mutation rate. If
    an organism has more genes, it has an overall higher mutation rate. As a
    result, the mutation rate of a small organism may be too low, while an
    extremely complex

    species has problems to keep its functionality, because of too many
    deleterious mutations. I would however suggest this:

    https://sourceforge.net/projects/biogenesis/forums/forum/571709/topic/4631574

    = Individual mutation rates for all organisms.

    Comparable to "Symmetry": 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8 there will be an individual
    "Mutation rate" with values from 0.001% to 0.1%

    2.Quote:"Longevity gene - instead of a single value of Life Expectancy there
    would be a range. Where a particular organism fell in this range would be
    determined by the amount of longevity segment it had in relation to the total
    Mass."

    I generally like this idea.

    I would do it this way:

    Organisms without "Longevity segments" would have a minimal life expectancy,
    adjustable in Parameters (it is 30 now)

    The overall length of all "Longevity segments" will enhance the life
    expectancy of this organism.

    For example: If an organism has 1 "Longevity segment" with the length of 18.0
    it´s life expectancy will be 30 + 18 = 48 time units ( has to be balanced of
    course). If it has 4 "Longevity segments", each with the length of 5.0,

    it will live for 30 + (4 * 5) = 50 time units.

    Greets, Marco

     
  • MarcoA
    MarcoA
    2011-08-17

    I had another idea:

    In nature, some single-celled organisms form colonies, a first step to
    multicellular life.

    Too difficult to deal with this in this game?

    Maybe not;) ( i admit, it won´t be too easy either, but it is not totally
    crazy)

    We need another segment (colour): "Olive-Green" (or "Woody Green"):

    -If two "Olive" segments touch each other, both segments will cohere (and merge), and these organisms will form a colony.

    -All organisms (or cells) within a colony will always share the energy they obtain through fotosysnthesis or from organic matter among themselves. This will allow symbiosis (or specialization) and real parasitism (White segment organisms are actually viruses) Parasites obtain their energy contingent from the colony, but do nothing for the colony (because of no red or green segments or other help) themselves.

    -Cells inside a colony will not infect, kill or consume each other.

    -If one of the cells inside the colony is killed, consumed or infected, only the individual cell will suffer. An attacker shouldn´t be allowed to kill the whole colony by killing or consuming only one single cell.

    -A cell with "Olive" segments, that doesn´t disperse its children will form a colony with its daughter cell(s) ( the "Olive" segments don´t need to touch). A cell with "Olive" segments, that does disperse its children will not (at least not automatically) form a colony with its daughter cell(s) (they will be afloat).

    -If there is no room to reproduce, cells within a colony will not reproduce (simple)

    -Death cells will be detached from the colony and can (of course) be consumed with the help of cells with red segments.

    Greets, Marco