StepMania

Email Archive: stepmania-devs (read-only)

Re: [Stepmania-devs] Advice/directions/input on SM4 default theme

From: Chris Danford - 2007-01-03 13:30

I'm sorry for chiming in late.


> 2.) Are there specific requirements the theme must meet?
> Resolution/aspect ratio/localization/otherwise?

640x480 targeted for 4:3, but also works well in widescreen.  As few graphics with baked-in text as possible for easier
localization.


> 3.) What is the policy on differentiating StepMania 
> from DDR and ITG?

Don't use rips, and don't use re-creations from other games.  Styles inspired by other games are fine though.


> The one thing the DDR games, and well.. any dance game besides ITG 
> for the most part have in common is bright flashy colors.

I like the "bright colors" idea because it's more friendly than a darker ITG or IIDX-type palette.


-Chris
 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: stepmania-devs-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net 
> [mailto:stepmania-devs-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net] On 
> Behalf Of Roger Clark
> Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2006 9:25 PM
> To: stepmania-devs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: [Stepmania-devs] Advice/directions/input on SM4 default theme
> 
> For the past few months I've been working on some graphics for an SM
> theme; mostly prototypes, but I think I could flesh it out tty
> easily. Ideally, I'd like to work on the default theme, because I
> think it would benefit the project to have something relatively sharp,
> or at the very least coherent, to ship with. A fully original "free as
> in debian" theme would help us reach a lot more people, what with the
> huge Ubuntu crowd and whatnot.
> 
> Anyway, I've got a few questions.
> 
> 	1.) Is there any particular direction the developers 
> (Chris, Glenn,
> Steve) want to see the default theme go in?
> 	2.) Are there specific requirements the theme must meet?
> Resolution/aspect ratio/localization/otherwise?
> 	3.) What is the policy on differentiating StepMania 
> from DDR and ITG?
> 
> As for #3, primarily I'm asking about this this because I'm concerned
> that the main devs would disagree with the approach I'm taking. The
> liminary work I've done so far on SM4's theme takes it in a
> direction that is stylistically similar to the Extreme-era games, but
> of course uses original artwork. The idea is to create an enjoyable
> and familiar aesthetic.
> 
> Specifically, how much separation do we want to maintain from the
> interfaces of these games? Placement of elements? Judgment names? My
> personal view is that, although StepMania has evolved to become much
> more than a DDR simulator (even though the majority of game types are
> nonfunctional), the community largely views it (and uses it) as
> exactly that. There's obviously a lot of people who fall into all
> three of the DDR/ITG/SM camps, and I don't think it's really worth
> putting too much unnecessary distance between it all when the
> expectations of the audience are obvious.
> 
> I work full time and my schedule gets tty hectic, so I can't make
> any promises. It would be awesome if we could recruit some good people
> to buckle down and do some real work with the theme -- I know at least
> dieKatze88 is on this list, and he's tty familiar with this stuff.
> Anyone else?
> 
> -- 
> Roger Clark
> rogerclark@gmail.com
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> -----------
> Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
> Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the 
> chance to share your
> opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash
> http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge
> &CID=DEVDEV
> _______________________________________________
> Stepmania-devs mailing list
> Stepmania-devs@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stepmania-devs
>

Thread View

Thread	Author	Date
[Stepmania-devs] Advice/directions/input on SM4 default theme	Roger Clark <rogerclark@gm...>

Re: [Stepmania-devs] Advice/directions/input on SM4 default theme

From: Steve Checkoway <s@pa...> - 2006-12-14 05:35

Attachments: smime.p7s

On Dec 13, 2006, at 9:25 PM, Roger Clark wrote:

> For the past few 1.) Is there any particular direction the
> developers (Chris, Glenn,
> Steve) want to see the default theme go in?

Believe me, you don't want my input on graphic issues!

--
Steve Checkoway

Re: [Stepmania-devs] Advice/directions/input on SM4 default theme

From: Eric Gustafson <subwire@gm...> - 2006-12-14 06:06

Attachments: Message as HTML

Gmail + lists == loose
Sorry, here's my reply.

On 12/13/06, Eric Gustafson <subwire@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> On 12/13/06, Steve Checkoway <s@pahtak.org> wrote:
> >
> >
> > On Dec 13, 2006, at 9:25 PM, Roger Clark wrote:
> >
> > > For the past few 1.) Is there any particular direction the
> > > developers (Chris, Glenn,
> > > Steve) want to see the default theme go in?
> >
> > Believe me, you don't want my input on graphic issues!
> >
> >
> > --
> > Steve Checkoway
>
>
> I may not be a "core " developer, but I suggest talking to the community
> at large. That was really our mistake last time with the SZ-inspired theme,
> we didn't talk to people, and it sort of slopped together. If you know any
> graphic artists, bribe them.
> To be honest, the developers here are way more concerned with how the
> gameplay works than how the menus look, and in my opinion, that's the best
> way to look at it. Besides, we've got a whole community doing that for us.
> Look at some of the cool themes that have come out in the past. If you
> really want some inspiration, try this on for size. The one thing the DDR
> games, and well.. any dance game besides ITG for the most part have in
> common is bright flashy colors. Lots of eye-piercing neons shaped into
> dance club inspired patterns. Don't emulate a particular game, try to
> well.. simulate the feel. Treat it like a dance game, not an acid trip gone
> horribly wrong. Oh, and my personal gut feeling says use lots of
> polished-looking 3D effects like ITG had. A spinning Stepmania4 logo was
> one such idea bounced around in chat. We have the vector sources for such
> things stored in the repository.
> I also suggest including AJ in your discussion, as if you're going to tear
> apart his theme, you might as well have him in on it.
> Don't try to fit the theme to the music either. Make your theme, then
> SaxxonPike will redo the music for us. He's really darn good at it.
> And while you're at it, we need some new sound effects. This would be a
> great time to ditch those questionably-legal ones.
>
> Good luck!
> - Eric Gustafson
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
> > Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share
> > your
> > opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash
> >
> > http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge&CID=DEVDEV
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Stepmania-devs mailing list
> > Stepmania-devs@lists.sourceforge.net /> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stepmania-devs
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

Re: [Stepmania-devs] Advice/directions/input on SM4 default theme

From: Dan Colardeau <diekatze88@gm...> - 2006-12-14 17:46

I feel that the less 3d we use in the default theme, the better. 3d
rules out all low end computers tty quickly, and some people run SM
still because its one of the only freeware games that runs on a low
end p3/high end p2 now adays.

On 12/14/06, Eric Gustafson <subwire@gmail.com> wrote:
> Gmail + lists == loose
> Sorry, here's my reply.
>
> On 12/13/06, Eric Gustafson <subwire@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 12/13/06, Steve Checkoway <s@pahtak.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > On Dec 13, 2006, at 9:25 PM, Roger Clark wrote:
> > >
> > > > For the past few 1.) Is there any particular direction the
> > > > developers (Chris, Glenn,
> > > > Steve) want to see the default theme go in?
> > >
> > > Believe me, you don't want my input on graphic issues!
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Steve Checkoway
> >
> >
> > I may not be a "core " developer, but I suggest talking to the community
> at large. That was really our mistake last time with the SZ-inspired theme,
> we didn't talk to people, and it sort of slopped together. If you know any
> graphic artists, bribe them.
> > To be honest, the developers here are way more concerned with how the
> gameplay works than how the menus look, and in my opinion, that's the best
> way to look at it. Besides, we've got a whole community doing that for us.
> Look at some of the cool themes that have come out in the past. If you
> really want some inspiration, try this on for size. The one thing the DDR
> games, and well.. any dance game besides ITG for the most part have in
> common is bright flashy colors. Lots of eye-piercing neons shaped into
> dance club inspired patterns. Don't emulate a particular game, try to
> well.. simulate the feel. Treat it like a dance game, not an acid trip gone
> horribly wrong. Oh, and my personal gut feeling says use lots of
> polished-looking 3D effects like ITG had. A spinning Stepmania4 logo was
> one such idea bounced around in chat. We have the vector sources for such
> things stored in the repository.
> > I also suggest including AJ in your discussion, as if you're going to tear
> apart his theme, you might as well have him in on it.
> > Don't try to fit the theme to the music either. Make your theme, then
> SaxxonPike will redo the music for us. He's really darn good at it.
> > And while you're at it, we need some new sound effects. This would be a
> great time to ditch those questionably-legal ones.
> >
> > Good luck!
> > - Eric Gustafson
> >
> >
> > >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
> > > Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share
> your
> > > opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash
> > >
> http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge&CID=DEVDEV
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Stepmania-devs mailing list
> > > Stepmania-devs@lists.sourceforge.net /> > > >
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stepmania-devs
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
> Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your
> opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash
> http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge&CID=DEVDEV
>
> _______________________________________________
> Stepmania-devs mailing list
> Stepmania-devs@lists.sourceforge.net /> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stepmania-devs
>
>
>

--
- Dan 'dieKatze88' Colardeau

Re: [Stepmania-devs] Advice/directions/input on SM4 default theme

From: Eric Gustafson <subwire@gm...> - 2006-12-14 23:22

Attachments: Message as HTML

Someone should suggest the Gmail developers fix their damn replying. This is
so un-elegant.

On 12/14/06, Eric Gustafson <subwire@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> On 12/14/06, Dan Colardeau <diekatze88@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > I feel that the less 3d we use in the default theme, the better. 3d
> > rules out all low end computers tty quickly, and some people run SM
> > still because its one of the only freeware games that runs on a low
> > end p3/high end p2 now adays.
>
>
> Here's an idea. Lets have two themes. One has tons of cool 3D effects,
> and the other has the same visual style, but can be run on a P2. Keeping
> them almost the same (except for the 3D0 would allow metric changes to be
> easily made. Maybe we could have one theme, but have an option in Graphic
> Options to enable certain 3d features. Lets not let our work be tethered by
> legacy users, yet lets not forget they exist.
>
> - Eric
>
> On 12/14/06, Eric Gustafson < subwire@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Gmail + lists == loose
> > > Sorry, here's my reply.
> > >
> > > On 12/13/06, Eric Gustafson <subwire@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 12/13/06, Steve Checkoway <s@pahtak.org> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > On Dec 13, 2006, at 9:25 PM, Roger Clark wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > For the past few 1.) Is there any particular direction the
> > > > > > developers (Chris, Glenn,
> > > > > > Steve) want to see the default theme go in?
> > > > >
> > > > > Believe me, you don't want my input on graphic issues!
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Steve Checkoway
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I may not be a "core " developer, but I suggest talking to the
> > community
> > > at large. That was really our mistake last time with the SZ-inspired
> > theme,
> > > we didn't talk to people, and it sort of slopped together. If you
> > know any
> > > graphic artists, bribe them.
> > > > To be honest, the developers here are way more concerned with how
> > the
> > > gameplay works than how the menus look, and in my opinion, that's the
> > best
> > > way to look at it. Besides, we've got a whole community doing that
> > for us.
> > > Look at some of the cool themes that have come out in the past. If
> > you
> > > really want some inspiration, try this on for size. The one thing the
> > DDR
> > > games, and well.. any dance game besides ITG for the most part have in
> > > common is bright flashy colors. Lots of eye-piercing neons shaped
> > into
> > > dance club inspired patterns. Don't emulate a particular game, try to
> > > well.. simulate the feel. Treat it like a dance game, not an acid
> > trip gone
> > > horribly wrong. Oh, and my personal gut feeling says use lots of
> > > polished-looking 3D effects like ITG had. A spinning Stepmania4 logo
> > was
> > > one such idea bounced around in chat. We have the vector sources for
> > such
> > > things stored in the repository.
> > > > I also suggest including AJ in your discussion, as if you're going
> > to tear
> > > apart his theme, you might as well have him in on it.
> > > > Don't try to fit the theme to the music either. Make your theme,
> > then
> > > SaxxonPike will redo the music for us. He's really darn good at it.
> > > > And while you're at it, we need some new sound effects. This would
> > be a
> > > great time to ditch those questionably-legal ones.
> > > >
> > > > Good luck!
> > > > - Eric Gustafson
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > >
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
> > > > > Join SourceForge.net 's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to
> > share
> > > your
> > > > > opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys - and earn
> > cash
> > > > >
> > >
> > http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge&CID=DEVDEV
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Stepmania-devs mailing list
> > > > > Stepmania-devs@lists.sourceforge.net /> > > > > >
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stepmania-devs
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
> > > Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to
> > share your
> > > opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash
> > >
> > http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge&CID=DEVDEV
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Stepmania-devs mailing list
> > > Stepmania-devs@lists.sourceforge.net /> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stepmania-devs
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > - Dan 'dieKatze88' Colardeau
> >
>
>

Re: [Stepmania-devs] Advice/directions/input on SM4 default theme

From: Steve Checkoway <s@pa...> - 2006-12-15 01:02

Attachments: smime.p7s

On Dec 14, 2006, at 3:22 PM, Eric Gustafson wrote:

> Someone should suggest the Gmail developers fix their damn
> replying. This is so un-elegant.

I'd suggest starting with not using html email. It is inelegant.

> On 12/14/06, Dan Colardeau <diekatze88@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I feel that the less 3d we use in the default theme, the better. 3d
>> rules out all low end computers tty quickly, and some people
>> run SM
>> still because its one of the only freeware games that runs on a low
>> end p3/high end p2 now adays.

We already use 3D in the game engine so if you don't have 3D
acceleration, you're tty much out of luck.

> Here's an idea. Lets have two themes. One has tons of cool 3D
> effects, and the other has the same visual style, but can be run on
> a P2. Keeping them almost the same (except for the 3D0 would allow
> metric changes to be easily made. Maybe we could have one theme,
> but have an option in Graphic Options to enable certain 3d
> features. Lets not let our work be tethered by legacy users, yet
> lets not forget they exist.

Let's go for a single theme that works first, before considering two.

--
Steve Checkoway

Re: [Stepmania-devs] Advice/directions/input on SM4 default theme

From: Chris Danford - 2007-01-03 13:30

I'm sorry for chiming in late.

> 2.) Are there specific requirements the theme must meet?
> Resolution/aspect ratio/localization/otherwise?

640x480 targeted for 4:3, but also works well in widescreen. As few graphics with baked-in text as possible for easier
localization.

> 3.) What is the policy on differentiating StepMania
> from DDR and ITG?

Don't use rips, and don't use re-creations from other games. Styles inspired by other games are fine though.

> The one thing the DDR games, and well.. any dance game besides ITG
> for the most part have in common is bright flashy colors.

I like the "bright colors" idea because it's more friendly than a darker ITG or IIDX-type palette.

-Chris

> -----Original Message-----
> From: stepmania-devs-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net
> [mailto:stepmania-devs-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net] On
> Behalf Of Roger Clark
> Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2006 9:25 PM
> To: stepmania-devs@lists.sourceforge.net /> > Subject: [Stepmania-devs] Advice/directions/input on SM4 default theme
>
> For the past few months I've been working on some graphics for an SM
> theme; mostly prototypes, but I think I could flesh it out tty
> easily. Ideally, I'd like to work on the default theme, because I
> think it would benefit the project to have something relatively sharp,
> or at the very least coherent, to ship with. A fully original "free as
> in debian" theme would help us reach a lot more people, what with the
> huge Ubuntu crowd and whatnot.
>
> Anyway, I've got a few questions.
>
> 1.) Is there any particular direction the developers
> (Chris, Glenn,
> Steve) want to see the default theme go in?
> 2.) Are there specific requirements the theme must meet?
> Resolution/aspect ratio/localization/otherwise?
> 3.) What is the policy on differentiating StepMania
> from DDR and ITG?
>
> As for #3, primarily I'm asking about this this because I'm concerned
> that the main devs would disagree with the approach I'm taking. The
> liminary work I've done so far on SM4's theme takes it in a
> direction that is stylistically similar to the Extreme-era games, but
> of course uses original artwork. The idea is to create an enjoyable
> and familiar aesthetic.
>
> Specifically, how much separation do we want to maintain from the
> interfaces of these games? Placement of elements? Judgment names? My
> personal view is that, although StepMania has evolved to become much
> more than a DDR simulator (even though the majority of game types are
> nonfunctional), the community largely views it (and uses it) as
> exactly that. There's obviously a lot of people who fall into all
> three of the DDR/ITG/SM camps, and I don't think it's really worth
> putting too much unnecessary distance between it all when the
> expectations of the audience are obvious.
>
> I work full time and my schedule gets tty hectic, so I can't make
> any promises. It would be awesome if we could recruit some good people
> to buckle down and do some real work with the theme -- I know at least
> dieKatze88 is on this list, and he's tty familiar with this stuff.
> Anyone else?
>
> --
> Roger Clark
> rogerclark@gmail.com /> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> -----------
> Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
> Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the
> chance to share your
> opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys - and earn cash
> http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge
> &CID=DEVDEV
> _______________________________________________
> Stepmania-devs mailing list
> Stepmania-devs@lists.sourceforge.net /> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stepmania-devs
>

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