FlightGear - Flight Simulator

hi Syd,

is the Beaver model available anywhere else for download apart from the 
FG-Live CD??

Slainte,

Andy




> Hi , and thank you .
> Sometimes I feel like Im not really contributing much unless I dive into
> the code and create something....
> And then I get a message like this and remember again why I spend so
> much time on the aircraft. Thanks again .
>
> Cheers,
> Syd

On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 14:12:06 +1200
Andrew Gorman wrote:
>
> hi Syd,
>=20
> is the Beaver model available anywhere else for download apart from the=20
> FG-Live CD??

I'm not Syd, but the dhc2F Beaver is available for download on the
FlightGear web page.

-c

--=20
Chris Metzler			cmetzler@...
		(remove "snip-me." to email)

"As a child I understood how to give; I have forgotten this grace since I
have become civilized." - Chief Luther Standing Bear

hi Chris,

for some reason all your emails come in as attachments on my 
system....however, its the same plane on the Flightgear site??

Excellent....thought it was a different version.....will download now! :)

Slainte,

Andy

On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 14:52:07 +1200
Andrew Gorman wrote:
>
> hi Chris,
>=20
> for some reason all your emails come in as attachments on my=20
> system....

Hi.  It's because you use Outlook Express (according to your
mail headers, anyway), and Outlook Express has a very famous
bug concerning its handling of the MIME standard (basically,
it doesn't obey the MIME standard), which causes it to screw
up how it presents a lot of emails, including emails that
include PGP signatures in MIME-encoded attachments, like
mine.

See, for example,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outlook_Express (in particular, subsection 2.2)
http://lists.gnupg.org/pipermail/gnupg-users/2003-September/020155.html
http://www.phildev.net/pgp/pgp_clear_vs_mime.html

This bug has been well known for *years*; but Microsoft being
Microsoft, they'll probably never fix it.

-c

--=20
Chris Metzler			cmetzler@...
		(remove "snip-me." to email)

"As a child I understood how to give; I have forgotten this grace since I
have become civilized." - Chief Luther Standing Bear

Hi Chris,

cheers for that.....was going to use something like Opera later on but now 
might be a good idea :)

Slainte,

Andy

On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 23:08:49 -0400, Chris wrote in message 
<20060622230849.6452c8f1@...>:

> On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 14:52:07 +1200
> Andrew Gorman wrote:
> >
> > hi Chris,
> > 
> > for some reason all your emails come in as attachments on my 
> > system....
> 
> Hi.  It's because you use Outlook Express (according to your
> mail headers, anyway), and Outlook Express has a very famous
> bug concerning its handling of the MIME standard (basically,
> it doesn't obey the MIME standard), which causes it to screw
> up how it presents a lot of emails, including emails that
> include PGP signatures in MIME-encoded attachments, like
> mine.
> 
> See, for example,
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outlook_Express (in particular,
> subsection 2.2)
> http://lists.gnupg.org/pipermail/gnupg-users/2003-September/020155.html
> http://www.phildev.net/pgp/pgp_clear_vs_mime.html
> 
> This bug has been well known for *years*; but Microsoft being
> Microsoft, they'll probably never fix it.

..aye.   Now, Flamebait, who _is_ using, and, _why_ use:
" Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=
"===============1980762402==" ",
" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ", 
" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline ", etc?  ;o)


-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt... ;o)
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 13:54:01 +0200
Arnt Karlsen wrote:
>=20
> ..aye.   Now, Flamebait, who _is_ using, and, _why_ use:
> " Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=3D
> "=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D1980762402=3D=3D" ",
> " Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ",=20
> " Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"us-ascii"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Content-Disposition: inline ", etc?  ;o)

I have no idea what you're saying/asking.

-c

--=20
Chris Metzler			cmetzler@...
		(remove "snip-me." to email)

"As a child I understood how to give; I have forgotten this grace since I
have become civilized." - Chief Luther Standing Bear

On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 09:04:18 -0400, Chris wrote in message 
<20060623090418.3c8b7120@...>:

> On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 13:54:01 +0200
> Arnt Karlsen wrote:
> > 
> > ..aye.   Now, Flamebait, who _is_ using, and, _why_ use:
> > " Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=
> > "===============1980762402==" ",
> > " Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ", 
> > " Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> > Content-Disposition: inline ", etc?  ;o)
> 
> I have no idea what you're saying/asking.

.. ;o)  The above snippet comes from your messages.  I have only seen
these in Microsofts default setups of their mail clients, and found your
exchange with Andrew amusing, considering how he heeds advice you 
don't heed, like http://www.expita.com/nomime.html

..common wisdom is shy away Microsoft classics like 
" Content-Type: multipart/mixed " and 
" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ".

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt... ;o)
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

hi guys,

getting back on topic.....is there a wheeled version of the Beaver 
available??
Floats are nice but not very practicle when using tarmac runways :)

Slainte,

Andy
NZCH


> .. ;o)  The above snippet comes from your messages.  I have only seen
> these in Microsofts default setups of their mail clients, and found your
> exchange with Andrew amusing, considering how he heeds advice you
> don't heed, like http://www.expita.com/nomime.html
>

Andrew Gorman wrote:
> hi guys,
>
> getting back on topic.....is there a wheeled version of the Beaver 
> available??
> Floats are nice but not very practicle when using tarmac runways :)
>
> Slainte,
>
> Andy
> NZCH
>
>
>   
>> .. ;o)  The above snippet comes from your messages.  I have only seen
>> these in Microsofts default setups of their mail clients, and found your
>> exchange with Andrew amusing, considering how he heeds advice you
>> don't heed, like http://www.expita.com/nomime.html
>>
>>     
>
>   

Hi Andy, I couldn't find one in the FG aircraft downloads but;
1) the floats work on tarmac...they just don't look that good.
2) Try initial placement on water... Lyttleton might be fun ;-)

My fav is Evans Bay, Wellington Harbour

:-D ene

hi Dene,

I tried to find one in the downloads section as well I had the same luck =
as you did.
Went for a quick flight from NZCH 02 and headed to the sea (New Brighton =
actually..), but got side tracked and landed in the Waimakariri instead! =
:)

(naieve mode on) Can you place aircraft anywhere in FG and not just in =
airports?? (naieve mode off)

Slainte,

Andy

PS. when is the next Wellington update coming out????

:)



>Hi Andy, I couldn't find one in the FG aircraft downloads but;
>1) the floats work on tarmac...they just don't look that good.
>2) Try initial placement on water... Lyttleton might be fun ;-)

>My fav is Evans Bay, Wellington Harbour

>:-D ene

Andy,
Sure (he says madly looking for his printout of the FG help)  to the 
command-line add; --lat=??????(in signed decimal degrees)
--lon=??????(in signed decimal degrees)
--altitude=?????(in feet asl)
--heading=?????? (degrees)

I'm using it all the time at the moment to test flight-plans by starting 
the UFO at the start of a flight-plan and flying formation with the 
aircraft over the flightplan.

I use Georg's FGTools to launch FGFS, as it has a help file for all the 
commandline parameters and can save sets of parameters for re-use. IE 
can save "Lyttleton-Beaver-Real-Time" to be reloaded whenever you might 
want to try it again.

FGRun is great for the beginner, when you want to be a bit more 
adventurous and are more familiar with FGFS, FGTools is the way to go IMHO.

:-D ene

Andrew Gorman wrote:
> hi Dene,
>  
> I tried to find one in the downloads section as well I had the same 
> luck as you did.
> Went for a quick flight from NZCH 02 and headed to the sea (New 
> Brighton actually..), but got side tracked and landed in the 
> Waimakariri instead! :)
>  
> (naieve mode on) Can you place aircraft anywhere in FG and not just in 
> airports?? (naieve mode off)
>  
> Slainte,
>  
> Andy
>  
> PS. when is the next Wellington update coming out????
>  
> :)
>  
>  
>  
> >Hi Andy, I couldn't find one in the FG aircraft downloads but;
> >1) the floats work on tarmac...they just don't look that good.
> >2) Try initial placement on water... Lyttleton might be fun ;-)
>
> >My fav is Evans Bay, Wellington Harbour
>
> >:-D ene
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security?
> Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier
> Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo
> http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Flightgear-users mailing list
> Flightgear-users@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-users
>

On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 18:02:04 +0200
Arnt Karlsen wrote:
>
> On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 09:04:18 -0400, Chris wrote in message=20
> <20060623090418.3c8b7120@...>:
>=20
> > On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 13:54:01 +0200
> > Arnt Karlsen wrote:
> > >=20
> > > ..aye.   Now, Flamebait, who _is_ using, and, _why_ use:
> > > " Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=3D
> > > "=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D1980762402=3D=3D" ",
> > > " Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ",=20
> > > " Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"us-ascii"
> > > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> > > Content-Disposition: inline ", etc?  ;o)
> >=20
> > I have no idea what you're saying/asking.
>=20
> .. ;o)  The above snippet comes from your messages.  I have only seen
> these in Microsofts default setups of their mail clients, and found your
> exchange with Andrew amusing, considering how he heeds advice you=20
> don't heed, like http://www.expita.com/nomime.html
>=20
> ..common wisdom is shy away Microsoft classics like=20
> " Content-Type: multipart/mixed " and=20
> " Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ".

I'm sorry, but what you're saying makes no sense to me at all.  The
above is all a bunch of bog-standard MIME message and message part
headers -- please see RFC 1341, which set the original standard for
MIME-encoded email, and which Microsoft had exactly zero to do with.
You're going to see "multipart/mixed", for instance, in the header
of any MIME-encoded email with multiple, independantly typed parts.
They'll come that way out of Thunderbird, Evolution, mutt, balsa,
and sylpheed-claws (which I use); and it has nothing to do with
Microsoft at all.

If you're convinced you're onto something here, then feel free to file
some sort of bug against the Debian packages that implement MIME
handling (metamail, IIRC, but I'm not sure).  But I can't imagine
what the problem would be.

-c

--=20
Chris Metzler			cmetzler@...
		(remove "snip-me." to email)

"As a child I understood how to give; I have forgotten this grace since I
have become civilized." - Chief Luther Standing Bear

Hi Dene,

awsome!!!!

I use FGTools to boot Flight Gear these days instead of the default icon =
link as it allows me to boot up with or without Atlas....usually I boot =
with Atlas as it is soooo cool to have (Im not a command line person and =
coding is a foriegn language to me...im an illustrator...)  :)

Will try the command line thing and see what happens :)

Slainte,

Andy




  Andy,
  Sure (he says madly looking for his printout of the FG help)  to the =
command-line add; --lat=3D??????(in signed decimal degrees)=20
  --lon=3D??????(in signed decimal degrees)=20
  --altitude=3D?????(in feet asl)=20
  --heading=3D?????? (degrees)

  I'm using it all the time at the moment to test flight-plans by =
starting the UFO at the start of a flight-plan and flying formation with =
the aircraft over the flightplan.

  I use Georg's FGTools to launch FGFS, as it has a help file for all =
the commandline parameters and can save sets of parameters for re-use. =
IE can save "Lyttleton-Beaver-Real-Time" to be reloaded whenever you =
might want to try it again.

  FGRun is great for the beginner, when you want to be a bit more =
adventurous and are more familiar with FGFS, FGTools is the way to go =
IMHO.

  :-D ene

Hi mate,
aaah...I run atlas on another PC(in another room) on the network...and 
watch progress on that...

have you flown to the Chatham Islands with the 09.10 scenery?.... big 
news...the airport is there!!!! (wasn't in 099 scenery).... I flew the 
C310 (without instrument panel) 400NM @ 175knts=2hour + trip 
(NZWN-NZCI)... without the panel 50-65fps all the way...taxi-ed off the 
runway re-fueled and flew NZCI to NZCH (to refuel) another 400NM+ trip 
50-60fps all the way... only when I tried the NZCH to NZWN leg did fps 
drop and eventually crash (overland)...it was great, about 6 hours 
flying at 50+FPS.... another Air Crash in the Kaikoura's... ;-)

I'm putting the power pylons around NZWN then finish the Seaview 
industrial area and I'll be happy to release my work(objects and AI 
scenarios) for Wellington  & Hutt Valley ... will let you know as soon 
as done (and anyone else interested).

The only immediate NZCH enhancement I can do is close the airport with 
fog and have a Air NZ 737 endlessly circling ;->

Cheers
:-D ene

Andrew Gorman wrote:
> Hi Dene,
>  
> awsome!!!!
>  
> I use FGTools to boot Flight Gear these days instead of the default 
> icon link as it allows me to boot up with or without Atlas....usually 
> I boot with Atlas as it is soooo cool to have (Im not a command line 
> person and coding is a foriegn language to me...im an illustrator...)  :)
>  
> Will try the command line thing and see what happens :)
>  
> Slainte,
>  
> Andy
>
>      
>      
>
>     Andy,
>     Sure (he says madly looking for his printout of the FG help)  to
>     the command-line add; --lat=??????(in signed decimal degrees)
>     --lon=??????(in signed decimal degrees)
>     --altitude=?????(in feet asl)
>     --heading=?????? (degrees)
>
>     I'm using it all the time at the moment to test flight-plans by
>     starting the UFO at the start of a flight-plan and flying
>     formation with the aircraft over the flightplan.
>
>     I use Georg's FGTools to launch FGFS, as it has a help file for
>     all the commandline parameters and can save sets of parameters for
>     re-use. IE can save "Lyttleton-Beaver-Real-Time" to be reloaded
>     whenever you might want to try it again.
>
>     FGRun is great for the beginner, when you want to be a bit more
>     adventurous and are more familiar with FGFS, FGTools is the way to
>     go IMHO.
>
>     :-D ene
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security?
> Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier
> Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo
> http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Flightgear-users mailing list
> Flightgear-users@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-users
>

hi Dene,

owed to have 2 systems that can be used for Flight Gear!!!! I have yet =
to set my second monitor up (not enough space on desk for 2 at =
moment...), once that is donwe I can then run both progs at full =
screen!!!

Im running the 9.10 scenery for NZ, Aust, Japan and England. Everything =
else is the scenery.=20

Have flown from NZCH to NZWN with no problems, even crossing the nasty =
Kaikoura's. A friend of mine flys X-Plane (as do I now days...), and he =
has problems with the same area, yet I have no problems. Tried to =
recreate the situation and nothing...came in on approach for 34, touched =
down and that was it....apart from the massaive cross wind, cant say I =
have lasnded a 737 sideways before but that came damned close!!!

Is the Kaikoura area buggy? I have had no problems with it, buzzed it =
many times and nothing happens, no glitches or anything.

Will try the Chathams this week sometime as I have been working 6 nights =
a week I am becoming Flight sim deprived!!! Might try it in something a =
little quicker though :)

The NZCH enhancement you suggested would be far off from =
reality....yesterday was a monkey for flying. Visibility was down to =
nothing! The only thing I want to add si an airport, Sugarloaf tower and =
maybe the Cathederal. The port of Lyttleton is an easy one as most of =
the models are already available and can be placed in no time (I =
guess....right???).

Look forward to the next release of Wellington from you ;)

Slainte,

Andy
NZCH


     =20


  Hi mate,
  aaah...I run atlas on another PC(in another room) on the network...and =
watch progress on that...

  have you flown to the Chatham Islands with the 09.10 scenery?.... big =
news...the airport is there!!!! (wasn't in 099 scenery).... I flew the =
C310 (without instrument panel) 400NM @ 175knts=3D2hour + trip =
(NZWN-NZCI)... without the panel 50-65fps all the way...taxi-ed off the =
runway re-fueled and flew NZCI to NZCH (to refuel) another 400NM+ trip =
50-60fps all the way... only when I tried the NZCH to NZWN leg did fps =
drop and eventually crash (overland)...it was great, about 6 hours =
flying at 50+FPS.... another Air Crash in the Kaikoura's... ;-)

  I'm putting the power pylons around NZWN then finish the Seaview =
industrial area and I'll be happy to release my work(objects and AI =
scenarios) for Wellington  & Hutt Valley ... will let you know as soon =
as done (and anyone else interested).

  The only immediate NZCH enhancement I can do is close the airport with =
fog and have a Air NZ 737 endlessly circling ;->

  Cheers
  :-D ene

  Andrew Gorman wrote:=20
    Hi Dene,

    awsome!!!!

    I use FGTools to boot Flight Gear these days instead of the default =
icon link as it allows me to boot up with or without Atlas....usually I =
boot with Atlas as it is soooo cool to have (Im not a command line =
person and coding is a foriegn language to me...im an illustrator...)  =
:)

    Will try the command line thing and see what happens :)

    Slainte,

    Andy




      Andy,
      Sure (he says madly looking for his printout of the FG help)  to =
the command-line add; --lat=3D??????(in signed decimal degrees)=20
      --lon=3D??????(in signed decimal degrees)=20
      --altitude=3D?????(in feet asl)=20
      --heading=3D?????? (degrees)

      I'm using it all the time at the moment to test flight-plans by =
starting the UFO at the start of a flight-plan and flying formation with =
the aircraft over the flightplan.

      I use Georg's FGTools to launch FGFS, as it has a help file for =
all the commandline parameters and can save sets of parameters for =
re-use. IE can save "Lyttleton-Beaver-Real-Time" to be reloaded whenever =
you might want to try it again.

      FGRun is great for the beginner, when you want to be a bit more =
adventurous and are more familiar with FGFS, FGTools is the way to go =
IMHO.

      :-D ene


-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
---
Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, =
security?
Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job =
easier
Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache =
Geronimo
http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=3Dlnk&kid=3D120709&bid=3D263057&dat=3D=
121642-------------------------------------------------------------------=
---------
_______________________________________________
Flightgear-users mailing list
Flightgear-users@...
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-users
 =20

-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----


  Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, =
security?
  Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job =
easier
  Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache =
Geronimo
  =
http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=3Dlnk&kid=3D120709&bid=3D263057&dat=3D=
121642


-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----


  _______________________________________________
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  Flightgear-users@...
  https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-users



-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----


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6/23/2006

Andrew Gorman wrote:
> hi Dene,
>  
> owed to have 2 systems that can be used for Flight Gear!!!!
One system (my partners) that'll run 098a. My ol' P1/166 is just enough 
to run Atlas.


> I have yet to set my second monitor up (not enough space on desk for 2 
> at moment...), once that is donwe I can then run both progs at full 
> screen!!!
>  
> Im running the 9.10 scenery for NZ, Aust, Japan and England. 
> Everything else is the scenery. 
>  
> Have flown from NZCH to NZWN with no problems, even crossing the nasty 
> Kaikoura's. A friend of mine flys X-Plane (as do I now days...), and 
> he has problems with the same area, yet I have no problems. Tried to 
> recreate the situation and nothing...came in on approach for 34, 
> touched down and that was it....apart from the massaive cross wind, 
> cant say I have lasnded a 737 sideways before but that came damned 
> close!!!
>  
> Is the Kaikoura area buggy? I have had no problems with it, buzzed it 
> many times and nothing happens, no glitches or anything.
not that area specifically, just after 6+ hours, fps starts getting a 
bit lumpy. At reasonable altitude(7500 asl) and a forgiving plane 
J3cub/172P even I can recover in time. Even at 7500 asl the C310 hits 
the deck before I can recover and the AP does no better.

>  
> Will try the Chathams this week sometime as I have been working 6 
> nights a week I am becoming Flight sim deprived!!! Might try it in 
> something a little quicker though :)
>  
> The NZCH enhancement you suggested would be far off from 
> reality....yesterday was a monkey for flying. Visibility was down to 
> nothing! The only thing I want to add si an airport, Sugarloaf tower 
> and maybe the Cathederal. The port of Lyttleton is an easy one as most 
> of the models are already available and can be placed in no time (I 
> guess....right???).
If you can get me lat/long i'll put a tower at Sugarloaf (the same one I 
use for Kaukau should do) and a cathederal off the square (orientation 
of the front would be handy too)

>  
> Look forward to the next release of Wellington from you ;)
I'll throw in a Qantas and Air New Zealand 737 on the apron in lieu of 
terminals for the moment

>  
> Slainte,
>  
> Andy
> NZCH
>  
Cheers
:-D ene



>  
>
>        
>
>     Hi mate,
>     aaah...I run atlas on another PC(in another room) on the
>     network...and watch progress on that...
>
>     have you flown to the Chatham Islands with the 09.10 scenery?....
>     big news...the airport is there!!!! (wasn't in 099 scenery).... I
>     flew the C310 (without instrument panel) 400NM @ 175knts=2hour +
>     trip (NZWN-NZCI)... without the panel 50-65fps all the
>     way...taxi-ed off the runway re-fueled and flew NZCI to NZCH (to
>     refuel) another 400NM+ trip 50-60fps all the way... only when I
>     tried the NZCH to NZWN leg did fps drop and eventually crash
>     (overland)...it was great, about 6 hours flying at 50+FPS....
>     another Air Crash in the Kaikoura's... ;-)
>
>     I'm putting the power pylons around NZWN then finish the Seaview
>     industrial area and I'll be happy to release my work(objects and
>     AI scenarios) for Wellington  & Hutt Valley ... will let you know
>     as soon as done (and anyone else interested).
>
>     The only immediate NZCH enhancement I can do is close the airport
>     with fog and have a Air NZ 737 endlessly circling ;->
>
>     Cheers
>     :-D ene
>
>     Andrew Gorman wrote:
>>     Hi Dene,
>>      
>>     awsome!!!!
>>      
>>     I use FGTools to boot Flight Gear these days instead of the
>>     default icon link as it allows me to boot up with or without
>>     Atlas....usually I boot with Atlas as it is soooo cool to have
>>     (Im not a command line person and coding is a foriegn language to
>>     me...im an illustrator...)  :)
>>      
>>     Will try the command line thing and see what happens :)
>>      
>>     Slainte,
>>      
>>     Andy
>>
>>          
>>          
>>
>>         Andy,
>>         Sure (he says madly looking for his printout of the FG help) 
>>         to the command-line add; --lat=??????(in signed decimal degrees)
>>         --lon=??????(in signed decimal degrees)
>>         --altitude=?????(in feet asl)
>>         --heading=?????? (degrees)
>>
>>         I'm using it all the time at the moment to test flight-plans
>>         by starting the UFO at the start of a flight-plan and flying
>>         formation with the aircraft over the flightplan.
>>
>>         I use Georg's FGTools to launch FGFS, as it has a help file
>>         for all the commandline parameters and can save sets of
>>         parameters for re-use. IE can save
>>         "Lyttleton-Beaver-Real-Time" to be reloaded whenever you
>>         might want to try it again.
>>
>>         FGRun is great for the beginner, when you want to be a bit
>>         more adventurous and are more familiar with FGFS, FGTools is
>>         the way to go IMHO.
>>
>>         :-D ene
>>
>>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>     Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security?
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>>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
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>>     Flightgear-users@...
>>     https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-users
>>       
>
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>
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>

Hi Dene,
  One system (my partners) that'll run 098a. My ol' P1/166 is just =
enough to run Atlas.

  -------not bad though, at least each system only has to cope with one =
application running at a time. Mine is running atlas and Fg all at =
once.....gets a bit nervous sometimes and atlas locks then refreshes =
itself and continues on from the currnet position.


  not that area specifically, just after 6+ hours, fps starts getting a =
bit lumpy. At reasonable altitude(7500 asl) and a forgiving plane =
J3cub/172P even I can recover in time. Even at 7500 asl the C310 hits =
the deck before I can recover and the AP does no better.

  -------ah....happened t me once, but the aircraft never "fell out of =
the sky", it just locked on me and had to be rebooted. Hasnt happened =
since. Have you updated your graphics drivers? Might not mean much but =
its amazing how these little buggers can screw things up! :)
  =20

  If you can get me lat/long i'll put a tower at Sugarloaf (the same one =
I use for Kaukau should do) and a cathederal off the square (orientation =
of the front would be handy too)


  -----I will do that this weekend. The square is a difficult one. If I =
had a GPS I could stand in front of the place and "ping" my =
position....actually, friends of mine have GPS's in thier cars (security =
patrolmen...), so I might get them to pop a loc for me.


  I'll throw in a Qantas and Air New Zealand 737 on the apron in lieu of =
terminals for the moment


  -------AWSOME!!!!!!!


  Cheers
  :-D ene


  -----Dude you totally rock!!!!

  Slainte,

  Andy

Hi Andy
>
>     not that area specifically, just after 6+ hours, fps starts
>     getting a bit lumpy. At reasonable altitude(7500 asl) and a
>     forgiving plane J3cub/172P even I can recover in time. Even at
>     7500 asl the C310 hits the deck before I can recover and the AP
>     does no better.
>     -------ah....happened t me once, but the aircraft never "fell out
>     of the sky", it just locked on me and had to be rebooted. Hasnt
>     happened since. Have you updated your graphics drivers? Might not
>     mean much but its amazing how these little buggers can screw
>     things up! :)
>
latest nvidia driver installed (from nVidia) but it's only a 32M card so 
not expecting much from it. While I was in Wellington this morning I had 
a look at the nVidia 7900GT hmmmm drool, drool. :-)

>     If you can get me lat/long i'll put a tower at Sugarloaf (the same
>     one I use for Kaukau should do) and a cathederal off the square
>     (orientation of the front would be handy too)
>
>     -----I will do that this weekend. The square is a difficult one.
>     If I had a GPS I could stand in front of the place and "ping" my
>     position....actually, friends of mine have GPS's in thier cars
>     (security patrolmen...), so I might get them to pop a loc for me.
>
Getting the correct lat and long is often the hardest part of accurately 
placing objects. I visiually selected two likely looking hills for the 
Wellington Primary Radar and wind-turbine, then found out their proper 
lat/long... I was miles off... all fixed now though.. I have a program 
called UIView that can load jpegs (maps, satellite images what ever) as 
the back ground and as long as you can provide the lat and long of the 
boundaries you can find the lat and long of any point on that image. 
getting alt for me is a matter of trial and error as I don't have 
Melchiors "UFO Tool". Fred's FGSD is another method of determining the 
height of the terrain at a specific lat and long and has it's advantages 
as it works directly with the FG btg terrain files.That would be a nice 
addition to TaxiDraw too for assisting in the placement of airport models.

>      
>      
>     I'll throw in a Qantas and Air New Zealand 737 on the apron in
>     lieu of terminals for the moment
>
>     -------AWSOME!!!!!!!
>
What's the path to your NZCH scenery directory, I will duplicate it here 
so the zip file will place the stg file in the correct location?

>      
>      
>     Cheers
>     :-D ene
>
>
>     -----Dude you totally rock!!!!
>      
>     Slainte,
>      
>     Andy
>
Just for that I'll even add skybridges for you ;->

Cheers
:-D ene

Andrew Gorman schrieb:
> Hi Dene,
>  
> awsome!!!!
>  
> I use FGTools to boot Flight Gear these days instead of the default icon 
> link as it allows me to boot up with or without Atlas....usually I boot 
> with Atlas as it is soooo cool to have (Im not a command line person and 
> coding is a foriegn language to me...im an illustrator...)  :)
>  
> Will try the command line thing and see what happens :)
>  
> Slainte,
>  
> Andy

Hi Andy,
I had to work the whole weekend and just looking through the eMails, 
therefore the delay.
I don't know which version of FGTools you are using - but although this 
project is dead now I put the latest version (1.3-39) on my homepage, 
there is also a new (incomplete) pdf doc for this version enclosed.

http://home.arcor.de/vollnhals-bremen/FGT/__FGTools14.zip

Regards
Georg EDDW

Hi Georg

Georg Vollnhals wrote:
> Andrew Gorman schrieb:
>   
>> Hi Dene,
>>  
>> awsome!!!!
>>  
>> I use FGTools to boot Flight Gear these days instead of the default icon 
>> link as it allows me to boot up with or without Atlas....usually I boot 
>> with Atlas as it is soooo cool to have (Im not a command line person and 
>> coding is a foriegn language to me...im an illustrator...)  :)
>>  
>> Will try the command line thing and see what happens :)
>>  
>> Slainte,
>>  
>> Andy
>>     
>
> Hi Andy,
> I had to work the whole weekend and just looking through the eMails, 
> therefore the delay.
> I don't know which version of FGTools you are using - but although this 
> project is dead now I put the latest version (1.3-39) on my homepage, 
> there is also a new (incomplete) pdf doc for this version enclosed.
>
> http://home.arcor.de/vollnhals-bremen/FGT/__FGTools14.zip
>
> Regards
> Georg EDDW
>
>   
Hi Georg, It's a real pity that FGTools is considered a "dead project" 
and that the documentation will be the final chapter.... I truly believe 
that with a little more work ( maybe advanced/beginner interface 
settings) FGTools is the obvious successor to FGRun... but I realize how 
much of your time these sorts of projects can take up and fully respect 
your decision.

If/when you get the "bug" again..my next suggestion would be a slight 
expansion of the initial selection criteria to include runway (ie 
Airport, Runway & Aircraft).

You might have gathered from some of my posts that I am a big fan of 
your FGTools and shall continue to use it in preference to FGRun...

Cheer
:-D ene

On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 23:06:54 -0400, Chris wrote in message 
<20060623230654.4ffdd63a@...>:

> On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 18:02:04 +0200
> Arnt Karlsen wrote:
> >
> > On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 09:04:18 -0400, Chris wrote in message 
> > <20060623090418.3c8b7120@...>:
> > 
> > > On Fri, 23 Jun 2006 13:54:01 +0200
> > > Arnt Karlsen wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > ..aye.   Now, Flamebait, who _is_ using, and, _why_ use:
> > > > " Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=
> > > > "===============1980762402==" ",
> > > > " Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ", 
> > > > " Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> > > > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> > > > Content-Disposition: inline ", etc?  ;o)
> > > 
> > > I have no idea what you're saying/asking.
> > 
> > .. ;o)  The above snippet comes from your messages.  I have only
> > seen these in Microsofts default setups of their mail clients, and
> > found your exchange with Andrew amusing, considering how he heeds
> > advice you  don't heed, like http://www.expita.com/nomime.html
> > 
> > ..common wisdom is shy away 

..my senselessly missing " from " here may have confused.  ;o)

> > Microsoft classics like 
> > " Content-Type: multipart/mixed " and 
> > " Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ".
> 
> I'm sorry, but what you're saying makes no sense to me at all.  The
> above is all a bunch of bog-standard MIME message and message part
> headers -- please see RFC 1341, which set the original standard for
> MIME-encoded email, and which Microsoft had exactly zero to do with.
> You're going to see "multipart/mixed", for instance, in the header
> of any MIME-encoded email with multiple, independantly typed parts.
> They'll come that way out of Thunderbird, Evolution, mutt, balsa,
> and sylpheed-claws (which I use); and it has nothing to do with
> Microsoft at all.
> 
> If you're convinced you're onto something here, then feel free to file
> some sort of bug against the Debian packages that implement MIME
> handling (metamail, IIRC, but I'm not sure).  But I can't imagine
> what the problem would be.

..I don't consider your compliance to rfc 1341 exposing Microsoft bugs,
a bug, just an inconvenience to our dear windroids using Microsoft mail
clients here, and the commonly accepted wisdom here is minimize any 
such inconvenience, by using plain text messages only and avoiding
"fancy" stuff like "multipart/mixed" and "quoted-printable."

..in the long term however, I guess they will likely be better served by
suffering your mild pressure away from Microsoft software towards what
we use.  Am I onto something here?  ;o)

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt... ;o)
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

Arnt Karlsen wrote:

> ..I don't consider your compliance to rfc 1341 exposing Microsoft bugs,
> a bug, just an inconvenience to our dear windroids using Microsoft mail
> clients here, and the commonly accepted wisdom here is minimize any 
> such inconvenience, by using plain text messages only and avoiding
> "fancy" stuff like "multipart/mixed" and "quoted-printable."

I say take it even further. This X-windows thing really makes my
computer a lot more complex and unstable. I say we all go back to text
terminals, you know, to minimize inconvenience.

Josh

Josh Babcock wrote:
> Arnt Karlsen wrote:
>
>   
>> ..I don't consider your compliance to rfc 1341 exposing Microsoft bugs,
>> a bug, just an inconvenience to our dear windroids using Microsoft mail
>> clients here, and the commonly accepted wisdom here is minimize any 
>> such inconvenience, by using plain text messages only and avoiding
>> "fancy" stuff like "multipart/mixed" and "quoted-printable."
>>     
>
> I say take it even further. This X-windows thing really makes my
> computer a lot more complex and unstable. I say we all go back to text
> terminals, you know, to minimize inconvenience.
>
> Josh
>
>   
Hiya all
This thread seems to be pointing to the need for "List Protocol" 
document. It might be more constructive to new contributors than 
criticizing their choice of operating system ;-)

Such this as;
using Text Only (if this is indeed the preference)
Cutting those parts of a post that you aren't replying to.
Adding new comments at the end of an existing post instead of the top.
etc.

I'm sure there are some I haven't learnt yet, and some that I have 
learnt by being on the receiving end of less than constructive "flaming" 
although some might naively maintain that if they achieve their purpose 
they are constructive.

Having such a document might encourage new contributors rather than 
discouraging them for fear of making a mistake.

:-D ene

Hi Dene,


  latest nvidia driver installed (from nVidia) but it's only a 32M card =
so not expecting much from it. While I was in Wellington this morning I =
had a look at the nVidia 7900GT hmmmm drool, drool. :-)

  ------sorry for the late reply....the 7900GT is nice but requitres its =
own small nuclear reactor to run! Very fast though. Was looking at this =
with the idea of creating a "Shuttle" system with one included...have to =
find the PCIe motherboard though as this will make it sing! Also =
required are.... :)

  Getting the correct lat and long is often the hardest part of =
accurately placing objects. I visiually selected two likely looking =
hills for the Wellington Primary Radar and wind-turbine, then found out =
their proper lat/long... I was miles off... all fixed now though.. I =
have a program called UIView that can load jpegs (maps, satellite images =
what ever) as the back ground and as long as you can provide the lat and =
long of the boundaries you can find the lat and long of any point on =
that image. getting alt for me is a matter of trial and error as I don't =
have Melchiors "UFO Tool". Fred's FGSD is another method of determining =
the height of the terrain at a specific lat and long and has it's =
advantages as it works directly with the FG btg terrain files.That would =
be a nice addition to TaxiDraw too for assisting in the placement of =
airport models.


  ------- A friend of mine has offered the use of his GPS unit that =
gives not only Lats and lons but eleveation as well!! I can get the =
exact data you need for the main tourist spots (the Catherdral, =
Sugarloaf and the New Brighton Pier...), so we now have the ability to =
get these things in the right place at the right height...all we need =
now is time :)

  The port of Lyttleton is going to be fun......


  What's the path to your NZCH scenery directory, I will duplicate it =
here so the zip file will place the stg file in the correct location?

  ------dude, no worries, just wack it in a zipo file and let me know =
where it needs to reside and I will pop in there.

  Just for that I'll even add skybridges for you ;->


  -------wicked!

  Cheers
  :-D ene


  -----did I mention ,how much you rocked?

  Slainte,

  Andy
  NZCH

Andrew Gorman wrote:
> Hi Dene,
>
>      
>      
>     latest nvidia driver installed (from nVidia) but it's only a 32M
>     card so not expecting much from it. While I was in Wellington this
>     morning I had a look at the nVidia 7900GT hmmmm drool, drool. :-)
>     ------sorry for the late reply....the 7900GT is nice but requitres
>     its own small nuclear reactor to run! Very fast though. Was
>     looking at this with the idea of creating a "Shuttle" system with
>     one included...have to find the PCIe motherboard though as this
>     will make it sing! Also required are.... :)
>
Was also looking at the 750W power supply ;-)
>
>      
>     Getting the correct lat and long is often the hardest part of
>     accurately placing objects. I visiually selected two likely
>     looking hills for the Wellington Primary Radar and wind-turbine,
>     then found out their proper lat/long... I was miles off... all
>     fixed now though.. I have a program called UIView that can load
>     jpegs (maps, satellite images what ever) as the back ground and as
>     long as you can provide the lat and long of the boundaries you can
>     find the lat and long of any point on that image. getting alt for
>     me is a matter of trial and error as I don't have Melchiors "UFO
>     Tool". Fred's FGSD is another method of determining the height of
>     the terrain at a specific lat and long and has it's advantages as
>     it works directly with the FG btg terrain files.That would be a
>     nice addition to TaxiDraw too for assisting in the placement of
>     airport models.
>      
>      
>     ------- A friend of mine has offered the use of his GPS unit that
>     gives not only Lats and lons but eleveation as well!! I can get
>     the exact data you need for the main tourist spots (the
>     Catherdral, Sugarloaf and the New Brighton Pier...), so we now
>     have the ability to get these things in the right place at the
>     right height...all we need now is time :)
>      
>     The port of Lyttleton is going to be fun......
>      
>
Real Life elevation is a good start. It can vary significantly from FG 
elevation in my experience.
>
>      
>     What's the path to your NZCH scenery directory, I will duplicate
>     it here so the zip file will place the stg file in the correct
>     location?
>
>     ------dude, no worries, just wack it in a zipo file and let me
>     know where it needs to reside and I will pop in there.
>
the paths can get rather long and need to exactly right. Do you stick 
all your scenery in the "~fg/data/scenery" folder or do you have a 
separate one for downloaded scenery (especially NZ ).
eg I have "~fg/data/scenery" the core (KSFO) scenery and "~fg/scenery" 
for extra downloaded stuff

Its no extra trouble and will make it a whole lot easier (I just share 
the appropriate folder on the FG PC and map a drive letter to it on this 
(the utility) PC.
>
>      
>     Just for that I'll even add skybridges for you ;->
>      
>     -------wicked!
>
>
>     Cheers
>     :-D ene
>
-----did I mention ,how much you rocked?
>
>      
>     Slainte,
>      
>     Andy
>     NZCH
>
>
As this is getting a bit specific do you want to take it off list?

Cheers
:-D ene
NZWN

Hi Dene,
  off list is fine....send me an email when you get the chance and we =
can carry this on without dsiturbing anyone else.

  Slainte,

  Andy






  Andrew Gorman wrote:=20
    Hi Dene,


      latest nvidia driver installed (from nVidia) but it's only a 32M =
card so not expecting much from it. While I was in Wellington this =
morning I had a look at the nVidia 7900GT hmmmm drool, drool. :-)

      ------sorry for the late reply....the 7900GT is nice but requitres =
its own small nuclear reactor to run! Very fast though. Was looking at =
this with the idea of creating a "Shuttle" system with one =
included...have to find the PCIe motherboard though as this will make it =
sing! Also required are.... :)
  Was also looking at the 750W power supply ;-)


      Getting the correct lat and long is often the hardest part of =
accurately placing objects. I visiually selected two likely looking =
hills for the Wellington Primary Radar and wind-turbine, then found out =
their proper lat/long... I was miles off... all fixed now though.. I =
have a program called UIView that can load jpegs (maps, satellite images =
what ever) as the back ground and as long as you can provide the lat and =
long of the boundaries you can find the lat and long of any point on =
that image. getting alt for me is a matter of trial and error as I don't =
have Melchiors "UFO Tool". Fred's FGSD is another method of determining =
the height of the terrain at a specific lat and long and has it's =
advantages as it works directly with the FG btg terrain files.That would =
be a nice addition to TaxiDraw too for assisting in the placement of =
airport models.


      ------- A friend of mine has offered the use of his GPS unit that =
gives not only Lats and lons but eleveation as well!! I can get the =
exact data you need for the main tourist spots (the Catherdral, =
Sugarloaf and the New Brighton Pier...), so we now have the ability to =
get these things in the right place at the right height...all we need =
now is time :)

      The port of Lyttleton is going to be fun......

  Real Life elevation is a good start. It can vary significantly from FG =
elevation in my experience.


      What's the path to your NZCH scenery directory, I will duplicate =
it here so the zip file will place the stg file in the correct location?

      ------dude, no worries, just wack it in a zipo file and let me =
know where it needs to reside and I will pop in there.
  the paths can get rather long and need to exactly right. Do you stick =
all your scenery in the "~fg/data/scenery" folder or do you have a =
separate one for downloaded scenery (especially NZ ).=20
  eg I have "~fg/data/scenery" the core (KSFO) scenery and "~fg/scenery" =
for extra downloaded stuff

  Its no extra trouble and will make it a whole lot easier (I just share =
the appropriate folder on the FG PC and map a drive letter to it on this =
(the utility) PC.


      Just for that I'll even add skybridges for you ;->


      -------wicked!

      Cheers
      :-D ene

  -----did I mention ,how much you rocked?=20

      Slainte,

      Andy
      NZCH


  As this is getting a bit specific do you want to take it off list?=20

  Cheers
  :-D ene
  NZWN



-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----


  Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, =
security?
  Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job =
easier
  Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache =
Geronimo
  =
http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=3Dlnk&kid=3D120709&bid=3D263057&dat=3D=
121642


-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----


  _______________________________________________
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  Flightgear-users@...
  https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-users



-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----


  No virus found in this incoming message.
  Checked by AVG Free Edition.
  Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: =
6/26/2006

Dene wrote:
>
>
> Andrew Gorman wrote:
>> Hi Dene,
>>
>>      
>>      
>>     latest nvidia driver installed (from nVidia) but it's only a 32M
>>     card so not expecting much from it. While I was in Wellington
>>     this morning I had a look at the nVidia 7900GT hmmmm drool,
>>     drool. :-)
>>     ------sorry for the late reply....the 7900GT is nice but
>>     requitres its own small nuclear reactor to run! Very fast though.
>>     Was looking at this with the idea of creating a "Shuttle" system
>>     with one included...have to find the PCIe motherboard though as
>>     this will make it sing! Also required are.... :)
>>
> Was also looking at the 750W power supply ;-)

Here is something that might interest a few people: the FlightGear 
marketing department has been talking to WidowPC 
(http://www.widowpc.com/) to see if they would offer their systems with 
FlightGear preloaded.  WidowPC isn't the place you go for the cheapest 
PC you can find, they are the place you go to for the *fastest* PC (and 
laptops) you can buy.

Places like WidowPC are perhaps of less interest to the skilled system 
builders in our midst, but for those that get lost in the myriad of 
hardware options, memory speeds, bus interfaces, socket this, slot that, 
northbridge, southbridge, DRAM, SDRAM, PCI-Express, SATA, cooling 
options, etc. etc. and you just want a rocking fast, top of the line 
system that works straight out of the box with good tech support ... 
they offer a pretty good product.

This wouldn't necessarily count as an "official" endorsement of this 
particular company, but more of an option to consider if you are 
shopping for a new PC, especially if we can get them to offer a 
FlightGear bundled option.

Stay tuned ...

Curt.

-- 
Curtis Olson        http://www.flightgear.org/~curt
HumanFIRST Program  http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/
FlightGear Project  http://www.flightgear.org
Unique text:        2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d

Curtis L. Olson wrote:
> Dene wrote:
>   
>> Andrew Gorman wrote:
>>     
>>> Hi Dene,
>>>
>>>      
>>>      
>>>     latest nvidia driver installed (from nVidia) but it's only a 32M
>>>     card so not expecting much from it. While I was in Wellington
>>>     this morning I had a look at the nVidia 7900GT hmmmm drool,
>>>     drool. :-)
>>>     ------sorry for the late reply....the 7900GT is nice but
>>>     requitres its own small nuclear reactor to run! Very fast though.
>>>     Was looking at this with the idea of creating a "Shuttle" system
>>>     with one included...have to find the PCIe motherboard though as
>>>     this will make it sing! Also required are.... :)
>>>
>>>       
>> Was also looking at the 750W power supply ;-)
>>     
>
> Here is something that might interest a few people: the FlightGear 
> marketing department has been talking to WidowPC 
> (http://www.widowpc.com/) to see if they would offer their systems with 
> FlightGear preloaded.  WidowPC isn't the place you go for the cheapest 
> PC you can find, they are the place you go to for the *fastest* PC (and 
> laptops) you can buy.
>
> Places like WidowPC are perhaps of less interest to the skilled system 
> builders in our midst, but for those that get lost in the myriad of 
> hardware options, memory speeds, bus interfaces, socket this, slot that, 
> northbridge, southbridge, DRAM, SDRAM, PCI-Express, SATA, cooling 
> options, etc. etc. and you just want a rocking fast, top of the line 
> system that works straight out of the box with good tech support ... 
> they offer a pretty good product.
>
> This wouldn't necessarily count as an "official" endorsement of this 
> particular company, but more of an option to consider if you are 
> shopping for a new PC, especially if we can get them to offer a 
> FlightGear bundled option.
>
> Stay tuned ...
>
> Curt.
>   
Eyes peeled Curt... be very interested to hear more... particularly if 
they anticipate; installed, tested and all issues resolved ;-)

:-D ene

> I say take it even further. This X-windows thing
> really makes my
> computer a lot more complex and unstable. I say we
> all go back to text
> terminals, you know, to minimize inconvenience.

I dunno, if you want fast + X-Windows, have you ever
tried Damn Small Linux? Its like lightning!

Paul
~~~~~

__________________________________________________
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On Tue, 27 Jun 2006 04:54:04 -0700 (PDT), Paul wrote in message 
<20060627115404.39161.qmail@...>:

> 
> > I say take it even further. This X-windows thing
> > really makes my
> > computer a lot more complex and unstable. I say we
> > all go back to text
> > terminals, you know, to minimize inconvenience.
> 
> I dunno, if you want fast + X-Windows, have you ever
> tried Damn Small Linux? Its like lightning!

..but needs the XFree86.dsl to do hw accellerated OpenGL, 
or a new X.org dsl package.  I'd start off DSL-N 0.1, has a 
2.6 kernel, dsl has a 2.4.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt... ;o)
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--- Arnt Karlsen <arnt@...> wrote:

> On Tue, 27 Jun 2006 04:54:04 -0700 (PDT), Paul wrote
> in message 

> > I dunno, if you want fast + X-Windows, have you
> ever
> > tried Damn Small Linux? Its like lightning!
> 
> ..but needs the XFree86.dsl to do hw accellerated
> OpenGL, 
> or a new X.org dsl package.  I'd start off DSL-N
> 0.1, has a 
> 2.6 kernel, dsl has a 2.4.

Ah. I'd not visited the DSL site for a while.
Interesting. Thanks for the tip :-)

Paul
~~~~~

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> 
> You might have gathered from some of my posts that I am a big fan of 
> your FGTools and shall continue to use it 
> Cheer
> :-D ene
> 
> 


Hi Dene,
thank you very much for the compliments :-)

Ok, you and Andrew have at least used it at some time.
But there was absolutely no other feedback, either good or bad. So I 
think there is not that big common interest among Windows user for it.
Development-time splits into different parts - coding, user 
GUI/help/security and documentation. You need a lot more time for the 
two last parts when coding is already finished and it works fine.
This makes only sense if there is an interest for the tool in the community.

I decided better to improve the local scenery within the next months. 
This will be more profitable for the FlightGear community, at least for 
all these flying in Europe.

Of course I will inform you and anyone interested if I make further 
improvements to FGTools (ie as you suggested).

All the best to you down-under scenery builder!

Regards
Georg

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I have just looked at the forum rules for an Open Source, GPL
compatible software site... they seem to be a very sensible set of
rules and with some name changes might provide the basis of a set of
rules for FlightGear postings for both newbies and old-hands<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.mozilla.org/community/etiquette.html">http://www.mozilla.org/community/etiquette.html</a><br>
<br>
regards all<br>
Dene<br>
<br>
Dene wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid44A063DD.6040700@..." type="cite">
  <blockquote type="cite">
    <blockquote type="cite">
      <pre wrap="">..I don't consider your compliance to rfc 1341 exposing Microsoft bugs,
a bug, just an inconvenience to our dear windroids using Microsoft mail
clients here, and the commonly accepted wisdom here is minimize any 
such inconvenience, by using plain text messages only and avoiding
"fancy" stuff like "multipart/mixed" and "quoted-printable."
    
      </pre>
    </blockquote>
    <pre wrap="">I say take it even further. This X-windows thing really makes my
computer a lot more complex and unstable. I say we all go back to text
terminals, you know, to minimize inconvenience.

    </pre>
  </blockquote>
  <pre wrap=""><!---->Hiya all
This thread seems to be pointing to the need for "List Protocol" 
document. It might be more constructive to new contributors than 
criticizing their choice of operating system ;-)

Such this as;
using Text Only (if this is indeed the preference)
Cutting those parts of a post that you aren't replying to.
Adding new comments at the end of an existing post instead of the top.
etc.

I'm sure there are some I haven't learnt yet, and some that I have 
learnt by being on the receiving end of less than constructive "flaming" 
although some might naively maintain that if they achieve their purpose 
they are constructive.

Having such a document might encourage new contributors rather than 
discouraging them for fear of making a mistake.

:-D ene

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