Linux Infrared Remote Control

I figure either:
	1) I sent this to the wrong newsgroup, or
	2) There is a group policy against members endorsing
	     any hardware, or
	3) Nobody here uses any transmitters with LIRC.

I hope I haven't offended anyone, but I have seen a number of 
possibilities so if anyone has experience with a particular transmitter 
that has a range of at least 15 feet, that would be a huge help so I 
wouldn't have to go through buying many different trial devices.

Or if someone can recommend a link or a page with a circuit that would 
allow me to drive a number of IR LEDs from the serial or USB port of a 
computer, that would also help.

Have I done something wrong or is there some reason I've not been able 
to get any comments or suggestions?

Thank you!


Hal

On Thursday 04 September 2008, Hal Vaughan wrote:
> I've seen some of the devices listed on the LIRC website for both
> transmitters and receivers.  I've never done anything with IR on
> Linux, but now I'd like to set up a system using my Nokia N770
> Internet tablet.  I figure I could write a GUI on my computer that I
> access through SSH and pull up on my N770 and use it as a universal
> remote where I can put all the buttons where I want them and don't
> have to switch from one device to another.
>
> I saw one USB transceiver, for example, that claims a range of only
> 10 feet.  I have a few devices on a shelf and about 5 feet away is
> the sound system and then another 2 feet to the TV, or rather, the IR
> receiver on the TV.  I'd like to either use one transmitter that I
> could mount on the ceiling or far wall that would cover that whole
> area (which would also help if I ever moved the DVR and other devices
> to the other side of the TV) or it might be possible, if everything
> is small enough and only needs minimal cables, to make a long cable
> with IR LEDs at at least three points along the cable (which would
> probably be about 12 feet long from computer connection to the last
> LED).
>
> By looking over the LIRC site and links, it looks like a lot of
> people using LIRC are doing hardware hacking, which I haven't done in
> so long I can't remember much of it.
>
> Can a serial port on the average computer drive 3-5 IR LEDs on a
> cable as long as 12-15 feet?  Would there be problems with the LEDs
> having to be real close to the receivers on the devices?
>
> Also, can someone recommend a good transmitter with a range of 15-18
> feet?  Or am I better off building the cable?
>
> I'm brand new at this and definitely don't want to get bogged down in
> recreating the wheel and I'm sure others have done similar things, so
> I'm open to any comments or suggestions on using transmitters to
> control several devices.  (If it matters, I have a DVR, DVD,
> Squeezebox (plays music over wifi from my server), sound system, and
> TV.)
>
> Thanks for any help or suggestions!
>
> Hal
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>---- This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move
> Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with
> Moblin SDK & win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an
> Open Source event anywhere in the world
> http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/

Okay, since it seems I'm not going to get any help with suggestions, 
does anyone have a suggestion on a mailing list where people can help 
me with this?  I don't need to know a transmitter is perfect, but does 
anyone have one that gives them a good range?

Or does anyone know for sure that they have a circuit that lets them 
drive 3-4 LEDs?

Or can someone at least tell me what I've done wrong here?  I looked 
over the site, saw some transmitters, but wanted to know what kind of 
personal experience people had.  Was that the wrong question?

Thanks for anyone who can give me some suggestions.  I don't want to 
just start spending wildly on different transmitters if people can tell 
me what they like.  I'm sure there are people here who use LIRC for 
transmitting and not just receiving -- or am I wrong?

I've worked on and with FOSS projects before and I find it rare that a 
question that is on topic gets ignored like this one has.  Usually the 
few times that happens, the OP then says, "Thanks, guys, it's clear 
nobody wants to help a newbie here, so I'm bagging it," and suddenly he 
gets answers.  I'm trying not to do that, but a few comments from 
someone would be nice.

Hal

On Monday 08 September 2008, Hal Vaughan wrote:
> I figure either:
> 	1) I sent this to the wrong newsgroup, or
> 	2) There is a group policy against members endorsing
> 	     any hardware, or
> 	3) Nobody here uses any transmitters with LIRC.
>
> I hope I haven't offended anyone, but I have seen a number of
> possibilities so if anyone has experience with a particular
> transmitter that has a range of at least 15 feet, that would be a
> huge help so I wouldn't have to go through buying many different
> trial devices.
>
> Or if someone can recommend a link or a page with a circuit that
> would allow me to drive a number of IR LEDs from the serial or USB
> port of a computer, that would also help.
>
> Have I done something wrong or is there some reason I've not been
> able to get any comments or suggestions?
>
> Thank you!
>
>
> Hal
>
> On Thursday 04 September 2008, Hal Vaughan wrote:
> > I've seen some of the devices listed on the LIRC website for both
> > transmitters and receivers.  I've never done anything with IR on
> > Linux, but now I'd like to set up a system using my Nokia N770
> > Internet tablet.  I figure I could write a GUI on my computer that
> > I access through SSH and pull up on my N770 and use it as a
> > universal remote where I can put all the buttons where I want them
> > and don't have to switch from one device to another.
> >
> > I saw one USB transceiver, for example, that claims a range of only
> > 10 feet.  I have a few devices on a shelf and about 5 feet away is
> > the sound system and then another 2 feet to the TV, or rather, the
> > IR receiver on the TV.  I'd like to either use one transmitter that
> > I could mount on the ceiling or far wall that would cover that
> > whole area (which would also help if I ever moved the DVR and other
> > devices to the other side of the TV) or it might be possible, if
> > everything is small enough and only needs minimal cables, to make a
> > long cable with IR LEDs at at least three points along the cable
> > (which would probably be about 12 feet long from computer
> > connection to the last LED).
> >
> > By looking over the LIRC site and links, it looks like a lot of
> > people using LIRC are doing hardware hacking, which I haven't done
> > in so long I can't remember much of it.
> >
> > Can a serial port on the average computer drive 3-5 IR LEDs on a
> > cable as long as 12-15 feet?  Would there be problems with the LEDs
> > having to be real close to the receivers on the devices?
> >
> > Also, can someone recommend a good transmitter with a range of
> > 15-18 feet?  Or am I better off building the cable?
> >
> > I'm brand new at this and definitely don't want to get bogged down
> > in recreating the wheel and I'm sure others have done similar
> > things, so I'm open to any comments or suggestions on using
> > transmitters to control several devices.  (If it matters, I have a
> > DVR, DVD, Squeezebox (plays music over wifi from my server), sound
> > system, and TV.)
> >
> > Thanks for any help or suggestions!
> >
> > Hal
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >-- ---- This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move
> > Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications
> > with Moblin SDK & win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to
> > an Open Source event anywhere in the world
> > http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>---- This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move
> Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with
> Moblin SDK & win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an
> Open Source event anywhere in the world
> http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/

On 9/9/08, Hal Vaughan <hal@...> wrote:
> Okay, since it seems I'm not going to get any help with suggestions,
>  does anyone have a suggestion on a mailing list where people can help
>  me with this?  I don't need to know a transmitter is perfect, but does
>  anyone have one that gives them a good range?

You can't use the N770 as an IR remote. There is no power supplied to
the USB port. You'd have to use and external USB hub with a wall wart
for power and then it's not portable.

What you can do is use the N770 to talk wifi to your home net. Then
buy a little $100 development board like an Efika or an Atom and plug
it unto your net. Get a MS USB IR transceiver for the development
board. Run a tiny web server on the development board. Use the browser
on the N770 to get to it.


>
>  Or does anyone know for sure that they have a circuit that lets them
>  drive 3-4 LEDs?
>
>  Or can someone at least tell me what I've done wrong here?  I looked
>  over the site, saw some transmitters, but wanted to know what kind of
>  personal experience people had.  Was that the wrong question?
>
>  Thanks for anyone who can give me some suggestions.  I don't want to
>  just start spending wildly on different transmitters if people can tell
>  me what they like.  I'm sure there are people here who use LIRC for
>  transmitting and not just receiving -- or am I wrong?
>
>  I've worked on and with FOSS projects before and I find it rare that a
>  question that is on topic gets ignored like this one has.  Usually the
>  few times that happens, the OP then says, "Thanks, guys, it's clear
>  nobody wants to help a newbie here, so I'm bagging it," and suddenly he
>  gets answers.  I'm trying not to do that, but a few comments from
>  someone would be nice.
>
>
>  Hal
>
>
>  On Monday 08 September 2008, Hal Vaughan wrote:
>  > I figure either:
>  >       1) I sent this to the wrong newsgroup, or
>  >       2) There is a group policy against members endorsing
>  >            any hardware, or
>  >       3) Nobody here uses any transmitters with LIRC.
>  >
>  > I hope I haven't offended anyone, but I have seen a number of
>  > possibilities so if anyone has experience with a particular
>  > transmitter that has a range of at least 15 feet, that would be a
>  > huge help so I wouldn't have to go through buying many different
>  > trial devices.
>  >
>  > Or if someone can recommend a link or a page with a circuit that
>  > would allow me to drive a number of IR LEDs from the serial or USB
>  > port of a computer, that would also help.
>  >
>  > Have I done something wrong or is there some reason I've not been
>  > able to get any comments or suggestions?
>  >
>  > Thank you!
>  >
>  >
>  > Hal
>  >
>  > On Thursday 04 September 2008, Hal Vaughan wrote:
>  > > I've seen some of the devices listed on the LIRC website for both
>  > > transmitters and receivers.  I've never done anything with IR on
>  > > Linux, but now I'd like to set up a system using my Nokia N770
>  > > Internet tablet.  I figure I could write a GUI on my computer that
>  > > I access through SSH and pull up on my N770 and use it as a
>  > > universal remote where I can put all the buttons where I want them
>  > > and don't have to switch from one device to another.
>  > >
>  > > I saw one USB transceiver, for example, that claims a range of only
>  > > 10 feet.  I have a few devices on a shelf and about 5 feet away is
>  > > the sound system and then another 2 feet to the TV, or rather, the
>  > > IR receiver on the TV.  I'd like to either use one transmitter that
>  > > I could mount on the ceiling or far wall that would cover that
>  > > whole area (which would also help if I ever moved the DVR and other
>  > > devices to the other side of the TV) or it might be possible, if
>  > > everything is small enough and only needs minimal cables, to make a
>  > > long cable with IR LEDs at at least three points along the cable
>  > > (which would probably be about 12 feet long from computer
>  > > connection to the last LED).
>  > >
>  > > By looking over the LIRC site and links, it looks like a lot of
>  > > people using LIRC are doing hardware hacking, which I haven't done
>  > > in so long I can't remember much of it.
>  > >
>  > > Can a serial port on the average computer drive 3-5 IR LEDs on a
>  > > cable as long as 12-15 feet?  Would there be problems with the LEDs
>  > > having to be real close to the receivers on the devices?
>  > >
>  > > Also, can someone recommend a good transmitter with a range of
>  > > 15-18 feet?  Or am I better off building the cable?
>  > >
>  > > I'm brand new at this and definitely don't want to get bogged down
>  > > in recreating the wheel and I'm sure others have done similar
>  > > things, so I'm open to any comments or suggestions on using
>  > > transmitters to control several devices.  (If it matters, I have a
>  > > DVR, DVD, Squeezebox (plays music over wifi from my server), sound
>  > > system, and TV.)
>  > >
>  > > Thanks for any help or suggestions!
>  > >
>  > > Hal
>  > >
>  > > -------------------------------------------------------------------
>  > >-- ---- This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move
>  > > Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications
>  > > with Moblin SDK & win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to
>  > > an Open Source event anywhere in the world
>  > > http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/
>  >
>  > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>  >---- This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move
>  > Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based applications with
>  > Moblin SDK & win great prizes Grand prize is a trip for two to an
>  > Open Source event anywhere in the world
>  > http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge
>  Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK & win great prizes
>  Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world
>  http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/
>


-- 
Jon Smirl
jonsmirl@...

Thanks for an answer!  Much appreciated!

On Tuesday 09 September 2008, you wrote:
> On 9/9/08, Hal Vaughan <hal@...> wrote:
> > Okay, since it seems I'm not going to get any help with
> > suggestions, does anyone have a suggestion on a mailing list where
> > people can help me with this?  I don't need to know a transmitter
> > is perfect, but does anyone have one that gives them a good range?
>
> You can't use the N770 as an IR remote. There is no power supplied to
> the USB port. You'd have to use and external USB hub with a wall wart
> for power and then it's not portable.
>
> What you can do is use the N770 to talk wifi to your home net. 

I was thinking of using the N770 through wifi, just like you suggest.  
I'm going to write an app in Perl/TK that lets me add buttons to the 
window and specify the function for each button, so I can redesign the 
GUI on-the-fly when I find more functions I want from different 
controls.  The app will run on a computer in my living room and the 
N770 will connect with ssh and forward an X session through that.

I figure I am not restricted to having to switch from TV to DVD to DVR 
since I can put the buttons I use all the time on one page of a tab 
panel, then put a set of all the buttons I use when watching DVDs on 
another tab panel and so on.  I can easily add a button to any tab 
panel and give it a list of IR commands to send out.

With this setup, the USB device will be powered by the computer, which 
will eventually have MythTV and some other stuff on it (and dual boot 
to XP so I can play Myst -- the one game I enjoy).

> buy a little $100 development board like an Efika or an Atom and plug
> it unto your net. Get a MS USB IR transceiver for the development
> board. Run a tiny web server on the development board. Use the
> browser on the N770 to get to it.

That's what I was trying to find out about -- what people here use.  
I'll look over these.  I didn't want to start spending on parts for a 
DIY transmitter or get factory made ones and have to go through one 
after another when I figured there should be a lot of experience here 
that says some of those things are great and some are less than 
functional.

I have thought about what you're talking about: running a web server and 
serving up some web pages.  That would be easier, but there are a few 
draw backs that a regular GUI would solve.  If I found I could do all I 
want with a web server and HTML instead of Perl/TK and a GUI, I'd do 
it.  (For instance, if I hold down the LOUDER button on a GUI, it can 
keep sending the "raise volume" command until I let go, but I don't 
know how to do that on a web page.  Also, I don't know what kind of 
latency to expect if I add a web server as an intermediate step.)

Thanks for giving me a few good suggestions from where I can start!


Hal

On 9/9/08, Hal Vaughan <hal@...> wrote:
> Thanks for an answer!  Much appreciated!
>
>
>  On Tuesday 09 September 2008, you wrote:
>  > On 9/9/08, Hal Vaughan <hal@...> wrote:
>  > > Okay, since it seems I'm not going to get any help with
>  > > suggestions, does anyone have a suggestion on a mailing list where
>  > > people can help me with this?  I don't need to know a transmitter
>  > > is perfect, but does anyone have one that gives them a good range?
>  >
>  > You can't use the N770 as an IR remote. There is no power supplied to
>  > the USB port. You'd have to use and external USB hub with a wall wart
>  > for power and then it's not portable.
>  >
>  > What you can do is use the N770 to talk wifi to your home net.
>
>
> I was thinking of using the N770 through wifi, just like you suggest.
>  I'm going to write an app in Perl/TK that lets me add buttons to the
>  window and specify the function for each button, so I can redesign the
>  GUI on-the-fly when I find more functions I want from different
>  controls.  The app will run on a computer in my living room and the
>  N770 will connect with ssh and forward an X session through that.
>
>  I figure I am not restricted to having to switch from TV to DVD to DVR
>  since I can put the buttons I use all the time on one page of a tab
>  panel, then put a set of all the buttons I use when watching DVDs on
>  another tab panel and so on.  I can easily add a button to any tab
>  panel and give it a list of IR commands to send out.
>
>  With this setup, the USB device will be powered by the computer, which
>  will eventually have MythTV and some other stuff on it (and dual boot
>  to XP so I can play Myst -- the one game I enjoy).
>
>
>  > buy a little $100 development board like an Efika or an Atom and plug
>  > it unto your net. Get a MS USB IR transceiver for the development
>  > board. Run a tiny web server on the development board. Use the
>  > browser on the N770 to get to it.
>
>
> That's what I was trying to find out about -- what people here use.
>  I'll look over these.  I didn't want to start spending on parts for a
>  DIY transmitter or get factory made ones and have to go through one
>  after another when I figured there should be a lot of experience here
>  that says some of those things are great and some are less than
>  functional.
>
>  I have thought about what you're talking about: running a web server and
>  serving up some web pages.  That would be easier, but there are a few
>  draw backs that a regular GUI would solve.  If I found I could do all I
>  want with a web server and HTML instead of Perl/TK and a GUI, I'd do
>  it.  (For instance, if I hold down the LOUDER button on a GUI, it can
>  keep sending the "raise volume" command until I let go, but I don't
>  know how to do that on a web page.  Also, I don't know what kind of
>  latency to expect if I add a web server as an intermediate step.)

It is easier to use the browser on the 770 to play with the web server
until you know what you want.  Just click the button multiple times.

After that write a custom app for the 770 and have it open a socket to
the web server and send down post commands. Like a web service. You
can write an equivalent app for an iPod Touch.

This is a good CPU/motherboard for MythTV, $69
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813121342

I haven't tried it but it has the right specs. Drawback is that it has
a fan on it. You will have to spend significantly more to get rid of
the fan. Efika is too slow run MythTV.

Myth's usefulness is declining rapidly as cable systems remove the
unencrypted SD channels. In a few years they will all be gone except
for the broadcast channels. Get a media player like a DSM-320 and suck
shows down from the Internet. There are several free media server
programs for Linux.


>
>  Thanks for giving me a few good suggestions from where I can start!
>
>
>
>  Hal
>
>  -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>  This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge
>  Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK & win great prizes
>  Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world
>  http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/
>


-- 
Jon Smirl
jonsmirl@...

On Tuesday 09 September 2008, you wrote:
...
> >  I have thought about what you're talking about: running a web
> > server and serving up some web pages.  That would be easier, but
> > there are a few draw backs that a regular GUI would solve.  If I
> > found I could do all I want with a web server and HTML instead of
> > Perl/TK and a GUI, I'd do it.  (For instance, if I hold down the
> > LOUDER button on a GUI, it can keep sending the "raise volume"
> > command until I let go, but I don't know how to do that on a web
> > page.  Also, I don't know what kind of latency to expect if I add a
> > web server as an intermediate step.)
>
> It is easier to use the browser on the 770 to play with the web
> server until you know what you want.  Just click the button multiple
> times.

I guess if I used AJAX, then that would work without having to reload 
the page.

> After that write a custom app for the 770 and have it open a socket
> to the web server and send down post commands. Like a web service.
> You can write an equivalent app for an iPod Touch.

I doubt I'll do it as an app for the 770 specifically, since I can write 
it as an X app that can be used through ssh and forwarding and then it 
can be used on any Internet tablet or PDA that uses Linux and has ssh & 
X on it.

> This is a good CPU/motherboard for MythTV, $69
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813121342
>
> I haven't tried it but it has the right specs. Drawback is that it
> has a fan on it. You will have to spend significantly more to get rid
> of the fan. Efika is too slow run MythTV.
>
> Myth's usefulness is declining rapidly as cable systems remove the
> unencrypted SD channels. In a few years they will all be gone except
> for the broadcast channels. Get a media player like a DSM-320 and
> suck shows down from the Internet. There are several free media
> server programs for Linux.

Yes, I'm aware it's limited, but it has everything in place for a lot of 
other features as well and I figure it's a basic media center.

You mentioned an MS USB transceiver previously.  I did a search and 
didn't get anything clear on that.  Could you give me anything that 
would help me pull up a few solid hits in Google on it?

Thanks!


Hal

On 9/9/08, Hal Vaughan <hal@...> wrote:
> On Tuesday 09 September 2008, you wrote:
>
> ...
>
> > >  I have thought about what you're talking about: running a web
>  > > server and serving up some web pages.  That would be easier, but
>  > > there are a few draw backs that a regular GUI would solve.  If I
>  > > found I could do all I want with a web server and HTML instead of
>  > > Perl/TK and a GUI, I'd do it.  (For instance, if I hold down the
>  > > LOUDER button on a GUI, it can keep sending the "raise volume"
>  > > command until I let go, but I don't know how to do that on a web
>  > > page.  Also, I don't know what kind of latency to expect if I add a
>  > > web server as an intermediate step.)
>  >
>  > It is easier to use the browser on the 770 to play with the web
>  > server until you know what you want.  Just click the button multiple
>  > times.
>
>
> I guess if I used AJAX, then that would work without having to reload
>  the page.
>
>
>  > After that write a custom app for the 770 and have it open a socket
>  > to the web server and send down post commands. Like a web service.
>  > You can write an equivalent app for an iPod Touch.
>
>
> I doubt I'll do it as an app for the 770 specifically, since I can write
>  it as an X app that can be used through ssh and forwarding and then it
>  can be used on any Internet tablet or PDA that uses Linux and has ssh &
>  X on it.
>
>
>  > This is a good CPU/motherboard for MythTV, $69
>  > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813121342
>  >
>  > I haven't tried it but it has the right specs. Drawback is that it
>  > has a fan on it. You will have to spend significantly more to get rid
>  > of the fan. Efika is too slow run MythTV.
>  >
>  > Myth's usefulness is declining rapidly as cable systems remove the
>  > unencrypted SD channels. In a few years they will all be gone except
>  > for the broadcast channels. Get a media player like a DSM-320 and
>  > suck shows down from the Internet. There are several free media
>  > server programs for Linux.
>
>
> Yes, I'm aware it's limited, but it has everything in place for a lot of
>  other features as well and I figure it's a basic media center.
>
>  You mentioned an MS USB transceiver previously.  I did a search and
>  didn't get anything clear on that.  Could you give me anything that
>  would help me pull up a few solid hits in Google on it?

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1644435
Free ship at this place: http://www.xpcgear.com/xpremote.html

There is an old and a new version. I've forgotten how to tell them
apart but they both work.


>
>  Thanks!
>
>
>
>  Hal
>
>  -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>  This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge
>  Build the coolest Linux based applications with Moblin SDK & win great prizes
>  Grand prize is a trip for two to an Open Source event anywhere in the world
>  http://moblin-contest.org/redirect.php?banner_id=100&url=/
>


-- 
Jon Smirl
jonsmirl@...