gramps

I'm sorry, but your question makes no sense to me. What are the files
you're talking about? If you mean 'Family Trees' then you can only
have one open in one copy of gramps. If you need two trees open at
once, just open gramps first with one, then open another copy of
gramps for the other tree.

Duncan

2009/11/29 . . <lrlaskey@...>:
...
> As I stated in another post, I am just now returning to my genealogy and a
> newer version of GRAMPS. Prior versions allowed for the saving of surname
> files into surname directories. I have many, many such directories each of
> which holds gedcoms and surname files.

I don't believe that surname files or surname directories exists in
the current versions of Gramps. I've never heard of them.

 Looking at this post
http://www.geneamusings.com/2009_04_01_archive.html I think you might
be talking about the way gramps (before my time) used to help organise
external files. Gramps no longer does this, but of course you can do
it yourself, I have plenty of opinion and thought on the matter...

Duncan

Duncan,

My question was not clear, I apologize. Someone answered my message and
explained that the new method is to used the Family Manager to do the same.
That is resolved.

I do,however, have a question that I hope someone can respond to.

As I stated in another post, I am just now returning to my genealogy and a
newer version of GRAMPS. Prior versions allowed for the saving of surname
files into surname directories. I have many, many such directories each of
which holds gedcoms and surname files.

Since all surname files are now managed by the Family Manager, I hope I have
the name correct, will all existing surname database files be listed there
in the Family Manger drop down menu?

I viewed the .gramps > grampsdb directories and found my surname database
directories although I am not sure all of them are there, yet. Anyway, the
directory names were not recognizable being alpha numeric.

So if I wanted to find a particular surname database directory, I could not
easily do it although I found another less efficient method. So the question
arises, do I need to look for them in these GRAMPS directories or will they
all be listed in the "Family Manager"?

And, do I need to open each of these older surname files that I have created
in the past and re-save so they will now live in the correct GRAMPS
directories.

If so, once that is done, is it safe to delete the older surname files?



*******************************************


On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 5:22 PM, Duncan Lithgow <duncan.lithgow@...:

> I'm sorry, but your question makes no sense to me. What are the files
> you're talking about? If you mean 'Family Trees' then you can only
> have one open in one copy of gramps. If you need two trees open at
> once, just open gramps first with one, then open another copy of
> gramps for the other tree.
>
> Duncan
>

Duncan,

I visited the link you included but could not find any mention of GRAMPS. I
checked the current GRAMPS documentation and it does not mention the older
style of saving files. Since surname databases are now managed through the
Family Manager, I am wondering how to manage my older GRAMPS surname files.

   1. As I asked in my previous message, should I open the older files in
   the newest version of GRAMPS and re-save them?
   2. When/If doing so, would it be safe to delete the old files?
   3. Will all files re-saved as new databases be listed in the Family
   Manager?

I am particularly interested in this last question since the new
alpa-numeric naming of surname files make it hard to find databases by name.


****************************


On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 6:42 PM, Duncan Lithgow <duncan.lithgow@...:

> 2009/11/29 . . <lrlaskey@...>:
> ...
> > As I stated in another post, I am just now returning to my genealogy and
> a
> > newer version of GRAMPS. Prior versions allowed for the saving of surname
> > files into surname directories. I have many, many such directories each
> of
> > which holds gedcoms and surname files.
>
> I don't believe that surname files or surname directories exists in
> the current versions of Gramps. I've never heard of them.
>
>  Looking at this post
> http://www.geneamusings.com/2009_04_01_archive.html I think you might
> be talking about the way gramps (before my time) used to help organise
> external files. Gramps no longer does this, but of course you can do
> it yourself, I have plenty of opinion and thought on the matter...
>
> Duncan
>

On Sunday 29 November 2009 14:41:44 . . wrote:
> Duncan,
> 
> I visited the link you included but could not find any mention of GRAMPS. I
> checked the current GRAMPS documentation and it does not mention the older
> style of saving files. Since surname databases are now managed through the
> Family Manager, I am wondering how to manage my older GRAMPS surname files.
> 
>    1. As I asked in my previous message, should I open the older files in
>    the newest version of GRAMPS and re-save them?
>    2. When/If doing so, would it be safe to delete the old files?
>    3. Will all files re-saved as new databases be listed in the Family
>    Manager?
> 
I have been using Gramps since version 0.7 and have never heard of "surname 
files".  What is the format of these files you speak of? GEDCOM? XML?

Gramps now uses the Berkeley database format as its primary way of storing 
your family trees and these databases are all under .gramps/grampsdb.  You do 
not need to know the gory details of this format, including how the individual 
database files are named.  That is all managed by Gramps itself.

If you wish to import a GEDCOM or a Gramps XML format file into a new 
database, follow the instructions that are in the Gramps Wiki.  This works 
quite well if followed carefully.  There are problems importing very old 
Gramps XML files but there are documented ways to do that as well.

To summarise, Gramps stores family trees in Berkeley database files.  These 
files are totally managed by Gramps itself and tinkering with them is fraught 
with danger.  From the Gramps interface all databases (Family Trees) are 
managed from the Menu item Family Trees --> Manage Family Trees or the button 
"Family Trees" at the left of the interface.

To import data from elsewhere, create an empty (New) database (Family Tree) 
and import the data into it.  There are several options to do this.

Sage advice is that you should as far as possible, store all related Family 
Trees in one database.  This saves on duplicated data (and having to make any 
changes to this duplicated data multiple times) and filters can be used to 
view and manipulate only those parts of the data which you are currently 
working on.

-- 
====
Michael Lightfoot
Canberra, Australia
OPC Merther & St Breock, Cornwall
see http://www.cornwall-opc.org
michael.lightfoot@...
====

Michael,

Surname files are my name for GRAMPS ".grdb" and ".gramps files. I have many
of them because I have not been working on my genealogy for some time and I
let several versions pass by without updating them. So I now have old files
and GRAMPS cannot import them.

Not knowing GRAMPS had changed to the Berkeley database format, I began to
clean up my genealogy files by moving them from their original directories,
deleting unused files and trying to import/merge some files for efficiency.
I was house cleaning. The consequences are that now I am getting error
messages when I try to open or import older files.

Is there a way to create gedcoms from the command line without opening
GRAMPS? A gedcom could be opened in the new format.

I have already read the info in the manual regarding corrupted family trees
located here:
http://gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=Recover_corrupted_family_tree.
My husband and I will work on this in the near future by any advice will be
appreciated.

I have learned a hard lesson. Whenever a program upgrades, save files to the
new format. I should have done that several versions ago.


**************************************

On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 10:35 PM, Michael Lightfoot <
michael.lightfoot@...> wrote:

> On Sunday 29 November 2009 14:41:44 . . wrote:
> > Duncan,
> >
> > I visited the link you included but could not find any mention of GRAMPS.
> I
> > checked the current GRAMPS documentation and it does not mention the
> older
> > style of saving files. Since surname databases are now managed through
> the
> > Family Manager, I am wondering how to manage my older GRAMPS surname
> files.
> >
> >    1. As I asked in my previous message, should I open the older files in
> >    the newest version of GRAMPS and re-save them?
> >    2. When/If doing so, would it be safe to delete the old files?
> >    3. Will all files re-saved as new databases be listed in the Family
> >    Manager?
> >
> I have been using Gramps since version 0.7 and have never heard of "surname
> files".  What is the format of these files you speak of? GEDCOM? XML?
>
> Gramps now uses the Berkeley database format as its primary way of storing
> your family trees and these databases are all under .gramps/grampsdb.  You
> do
> not need to know the gory details of this format, including how the
> individual
> database files are named.  That is all managed by Gramps itself.
>
> If you wish to import a GEDCOM or a Gramps XML format file into a new
> database, follow the instructions that are in the Gramps Wiki.  This works
> quite well if followed carefully.  There are problems importing very old
> Gramps XML files but there are documented ways to do that as well.
>
> To summarise, Gramps stores family trees in Berkeley database files.  These
> files are totally managed by Gramps itself and tinkering with them is
> fraught
> with danger.  From the Gramps interface all databases (Family Trees) are
> managed from the Menu item Family Trees --> Manage Family Trees or the
> button
> "Family Trees" at the left of the interface.
>
> To import data from elsewhere, create an empty (New) database (Family Tree)
> and import the data into it.  There are several options to do this.
>
> Sage advice is that you should as far as possible, store all related Family
> Trees in one database.  This saves on duplicated data (and having to make
> any
> changes to this duplicated data multiple times) and filters can be used to
> view and manipulate only those parts of the data which you are currently
> working on.
>
> --
> ====
> Michael Lightfoot
> Canberra, Australia
> OPC Merther & St Breock, Cornwall
> see http://www.cornwall-opc.org
> michael.lightfoot@...
> ====
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Let Crystal Reports handle the reporting - Free Crystal Reports 2008 30-Day
> trial. Simplify your report design, integration and deployment - and focus
> on
> what you do best, core application coding. Discover what's new with
> Crystal Reports now.  http://p.sf.net/sfu/bobj-july
> _______________________________________________
> Gramps-users mailing list
> Gramps-users@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gramps-users
>

2009/11/29 . . <lrlaskey@...>:
> Surname files are my name for GRAMPS ".grdb" and ".gramps files.
Okay, now I'm with you. I can understand that you call them 'files',
they look like files. Actually they are databases, I think it's to
avoid this technical confusion that they are now just called 'Family
Trees' in Gramps.

> I have many
> of them because I have not been working on my genealogy for some time and I
> let several versions pass by without updating them.
Do you mean that your genealogy is composed of different parts of the
family stored in different 'Family Trees'? Or do you just mean that
you have many old backup copies?

> and GRAMPS cannot import them.
Don't worry, you can import them, it's just a matter of how
complicated it might get. As far as I know no-one has been forced to
lose data because of a format change.

> I was house cleaning. The consequences are that now I am getting error
> messages when I try to open or import older files.
I suggest you choose one example of your problem and ask for help with
that. Then while we solve one problem you will probably see how to
solve the others. The .gramps files you mentioned should import
without any problem. Make sure you import into a new _empty_ family
tree. The .grdb files are a bit trickier, but there are people on this
list who are happy to help (I've never had to recover a .grdb file
myself). Also you mentioned merging, for that I suggest you wait for a
later release of Gramps. There are no tools to help manage merging
databases - but the devs are working on fixing that.

> Is there a way to create gedcoms from the command line without opening
> GRAMPS? A gedcom could be opened in the new format.
I recommend you don't do that. Gramps can't promise that GEDCOM files
will have all the information inside that the original .gramps files
had.

> I have learned a hard lesson. Whenever a program upgrades, save files to the
> new format. I should have done that several versions ago.
And this problem is in no way unique to Gramps - but at least the
gramps devs have made sure there is always a way to recover your data.

Regards, Duncan
PS. Ask a very specific question and you'll get more useful, and
shorter, answers :-)

Duncan,

I appreciate your help with this matter and will be as specific and accurate
with my terms as possible. I have many older files saved as .gramps and
.grdb that are both surname databases and backup ,.bak, copies, too.

I'll start with those files that I cannot import first. This is the error
message I get when I attempt to import a  .grdb database into a new empty
family tree. This is probably of of those databases that I moved from it's
original directory.

/tmp/tmpni6tlW could not be opened




On Sun, Nov 29, 2009 at 5:27 AM, Duncan Lithgow <duncan.lithgow@...:

> 2009/11/29 . . <lrlaskey@...>:
> > Surname files are my name for GRAMPS ".grdb" and ".gramps files.
> Okay, now I'm with you. I can understand that you call them 'files',
> they look like files. Actually they are databases, I think it's to
> avoid this technical confusion that they are now just called 'Family
> Trees' in Gramps.
>
> > I have many
> > of them because I have not been working on my genealogy for some time and
> I
> > let several versions pass by without updating them.
> Do you mean that your genealogy is composed of different parts of the
> family stored in different 'Family Trees'? Or do you just mean that
> you have many old backup copies?
>
> > and GRAMPS cannot import them.
> Don't worry, you can import them, it's just a matter of how
> complicated it might get. As far as I know no-one has been forced to
> lose data because of a format change.
>
> > I was house cleaning. The consequences are that now I am getting error
> > messages when I try to open or import older files.
> I suggest you choose one example of your problem and ask for help with
> that. Then while we solve one problem you will probably see how to
> solve the others. The .gramps files you mentioned should import
> without any problem. Make sure you import into a new _empty_ family
> tree. The .grdb files are a bit trickier, but there are people on this
> list who are happy to help (I've never had to recover a .grdb file
> myself). Also you mentioned merging, for that I suggest you wait for a
> later release of Gramps. There are no tools to help manage merging
> databases - but the devs are working on fixing that.
>
> > Is there a way to create gedcoms from the command line without opening
> > GRAMPS? A gedcom could be opened in the new format.
> I recommend you don't do that. Gramps can't promise that GEDCOM files
> will have all the information inside that the original .gramps files
> had.
>
> > I have learned a hard lesson. Whenever a program upgrades, save files to
> the
> > new format. I should have done that several versions ago.
> And this problem is in no way unique to Gramps - but at least the
> gramps devs have made sure there is always a way to recover your data.
>
> Regards, Duncan
> PS. Ask a very specific question and you'll get more useful, and
> shorter, answers :-)
>

2009/11/29 . . <lrlaskey@...>:
> Duncan,
>
> I appreciate your help with this matter and will be as specific and accurate
> with my terms as possible. I have many older files saved as .gramps and
> .grdb that are both surname databases and backup ,.bak, copies, too.
>
> I'll start with those files that I cannot import first. This is the error
> message I get when I attempt to import a  .grdb database into a new empty
> family tree. This is probably of of those databases that I moved from it's
> original directory.
>
> /tmp/tmpni6tlW could not be opened

First, version 3.1.3 will be released 6 december. It reintroduces
support for XML import of old GRAMPS versions, which due to lack of
testing, did not work anymore in earlier versions.
So keep your .gramps files around, and when 3.1.3 arrives, try again
with  that, all .gramps files created with version 1.0.0 or later
should be supported I believe.

Second, the error you now give, is due to import of a grdb file of
which the database logs cannot be recovered. This is explained in
http://gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=Recover_corrupted_family_tree#Version_2.2.x:_GRDB_corruption

So, the only way to recover from this is:

Or: obtain a backup of your old .gramps directory, and move the files
in the .gramps/grampsdb directory to their original position
(carefull, don't remove the data of your already created family trees
which is also in .gramps/grampsdb). Once this is done, you should be
able to import the grdb files.

Or: use the xml files to import your data. You can use GEDCOM, but
GEDCOM does _not_ store all data you can save in Gramps, so do it for
one Gedcom file first, and see if the loss is acceptable to you before
continuing with Gedcom import. Xml import is safe, but you need to
wait for version 3.1.3. to be available for your system if 3.1.2 has
problems with the old xml.

Or: use the database dump and load tool to create a new grdb file that
can be opened without the log files being present in
./gramps/grampsdb. This is explained in
http://gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=Recover_corrupted_family_tree#The_environment_is_lost
It really is not difficult to do that, I did it for several people who
did not succeed to do this, all without problems. So if you fail at
home to do it, mail it to me, or to one of the other core developers,
and they will convert to xml for you.

PS: your email name is set to .., I find that a bit annoying in my
list of mails, would you mind assigning a real name in your mail
client? It is now: . . <lrlaskey@...>. If everybody starts to
use that technique, it would become really, really annoying.

Greetings,
Benny
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 29, 2009 at 5:27 AM, Duncan Lithgow <duncan.lithgow@...>
> wrote:
>>
>> 2009/11/29 . . <lrlaskey@...>:
>> > Surname files are my name for GRAMPS ".grdb" and ".gramps files.
>> Okay, now I'm with you. I can understand that you call them 'files',
>> they look like files. Actually they are databases, I think it's to
>> avoid this technical confusion that they are now just called 'Family
>> Trees' in Gramps.
>>
>> > I have many
>> > of them because I have not been working on my genealogy for some time
>> > and I
>> > let several versions pass by without updating them.
>> Do you mean that your genealogy is composed of different parts of the
>> family stored in different 'Family Trees'? Or do you just mean that
>> you have many old backup copies?
>>
>> > and GRAMPS cannot import them.
>> Don't worry, you can import them, it's just a matter of how
>> complicated it might get. As far as I know no-one has been forced to
>> lose data because of a format change.
>>
>> > I was house cleaning. The consequences are that now I am getting error
>> > messages when I try to open or import older files.
>> I suggest you choose one example of your problem and ask for help with
>> that. Then while we solve one problem you will probably see how to
>> solve the others. The .gramps files you mentioned should import
>> without any problem. Make sure you import into a new _empty_ family
>> tree. The .grdb files are a bit trickier, but there are people on this
>> list who are happy to help (I've never had to recover a .grdb file
>> myself). Also you mentioned merging, for that I suggest you wait for a
>> later release of Gramps. There are no tools to help manage merging
>> databases - but the devs are working on fixing that.
>>
>> > Is there a way to create gedcoms from the command line without opening
>> > GRAMPS? A gedcom could be opened in the new format.
>> I recommend you don't do that. Gramps can't promise that GEDCOM files
>> will have all the information inside that the original .gramps files
>> had.
>>
>> > I have learned a hard lesson. Whenever a program upgrades, save files to
>> > the
>> > new format. I should have done that several versions ago.
>> And this problem is in no way unique to Gramps - but at least the
>> gramps devs have made sure there is always a way to recover your data.
>>
>> Regards, Duncan
>> PS. Ask a very specific question and you'll get more useful, and
>> shorter, answers :-)
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Let Crystal Reports handle the reporting - Free Crystal Reports 2008 30-Day
> trial. Simplify your report design, integration and deployment - and focus
> on
> what you do best, core application coding. Discover what's new with
> Crystal Reports now.  http://p.sf.net/sfu/bobj-july
> _______________________________________________
> Gramps-users mailing list
> Gramps-users@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gramps-users
>
>

Benny,

Thank you for your help. My husband and I have looked at all of these
options in the documentation but were unsure whether any of these methods
would be successful. It is reassuring to learn this from someone who knows.
I had not thought to bring up our backup files, though. Thanks for the
reminder.

I look forward to the new release. I was concerned that my .gramps files
could not be saved. What a relief! Again, thanks for you kind offer to help.
I may contact you if we have trouble.

Lorrie


On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 2:50 AM, Benny Malengier
<benny.malengier@...:

> 2009/11/29 . . <lrlaskey@...>:
> > Duncan,
> >
> > I appreciate your help with this matter and will be as specific and
> accurate
> > with my terms as possible. I have many older files saved as .gramps and
> > .grdb that are both surname databases and backup ,.bak, copies, too.
> >
> > I'll start with those files that I cannot import first. This is the error
> > message I get when I attempt to import a  .grdb database into a new empty
> > family tree. This is probably of of those databases that I moved from
> it's
> > original directory.
> >
> > /tmp/tmpni6tlW could not be opened
>
> First, version 3.1.3 will be released 6 december. It reintroduces
> support for XML import of old GRAMPS versions, which due to lack of
> testing, did not work anymore in earlier versions.
> So keep your .gramps files around, and when 3.1.3 arrives, try again
> with  that, all .gramps files created with version 1.0.0 or later
> should be supported I believe.
>
> Second, the error you now give, is due to import of a grdb file of
> which the database logs cannot be recovered. This is explained in
>
> http://gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=Recover_corrupted_family_tree#Version_2.2.x:_GRDB_corruption
>
> So, the only way to recover from this is:
>
> Or: obtain a backup of your old .gramps directory, and move the files
> in the .gramps/grampsdb directory to their original position
> (carefull, don't remove the data of your already created family trees
> which is also in .gramps/grampsdb). Once this is done, you should be
> able to import the grdb files.
>
> Or: use the xml files to import your data. You can use GEDCOM, but
> GEDCOM does _not_ store all data you can save in Gramps, so do it for
> one Gedcom file first, and see if the loss is acceptable to you before
> continuing with Gedcom import. Xml import is safe, but you need to
> wait for version 3.1.3. to be available for your system if 3.1.2 has
> problems with the old xml.
>
> Or: use the database dump and load tool to create a new grdb file that
> can be opened without the log files being present in
> ./gramps/grampsdb. This is explained in
>
> http://gramps-project.org/wiki/index.php?title=Recover_corrupted_family_tree#The_environment_is_lost
> It really is not difficult to do that, I did it for several people who
> did not succeed to do this, all without problems. So if you fail at
> home to do it, mail it to me, or to one of the other core developers,
> and they will convert to xml for you.
>
> PS: your email name is set to .., I find that a bit annoying in my
> list of mails, would you mind assigning a real name in your mail
> client? It is now: . . <lrlaskey@...>. If everybody starts to
> use that technique, it would become really, really annoying.
>
> Greetings,
> Benny
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Nov 29, 2009 at 5:27 AM, Duncan Lithgow <
> duncan.lithgow@...>
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> 2009/11/29 . . <lrlaskey@...>:
> >> > Surname files are my name for GRAMPS ".grdb" and ".gramps files.
> >> Okay, now I'm with you. I can understand that you call them 'files',
> >> they look like files. Actually they are databases, I think it's to
> >> avoid this technical confusion that they are now just called 'Family
> >> Trees' in Gramps.
> >>
> >> > I have many
> >> > of them because I have not been working on my genealogy for some time
> >> > and I
> >> > let several versions pass by without updating them.
> >> Do you mean that your genealogy is composed of different parts of the
> >> family stored in different 'Family Trees'? Or do you just mean that
> >> you have many old backup copies?
> >>
> >> > and GRAMPS cannot import them.
> >> Don't worry, you can import them, it's just a matter of how
> >> complicated it might get. As far as I know no-one has been forced to
> >> lose data because of a format change.
> >>
> >> > I was house cleaning. The consequences are that now I am getting error
> >> > messages when I try to open or import older files.
> >> I suggest you choose one example of your problem and ask for help with
> >> that. Then while we solve one problem you will probably see how to
> >> solve the others. The .gramps files you mentioned should import
> >> without any problem. Make sure you import into a new _empty_ family
> >> tree. The .grdb files are a bit trickier, but there are people on this
> >> list who are happy to help (I've never had to recover a .grdb file
> >> myself). Also you mentioned merging, for that I suggest you wait for a
> >> later release of Gramps. There are no tools to help manage merging
> >> databases - but the devs are working on fixing that.
> >>
> >> > Is there a way to create gedcoms from the command line without opening
> >> > GRAMPS? A gedcom could be opened in the new format.
> >> I recommend you don't do that. Gramps can't promise that GEDCOM files
> >> will have all the information inside that the original .gramps files
> >> had.
> >>
> >> > I have learned a hard lesson. Whenever a program upgrades, save files
> to
> >> > the
> >> > new format. I should have done that several versions ago.
> >> And this problem is in no way unique to Gramps - but at least the
> >> gramps devs have made sure there is always a way to recover your data.
> >>
> >> Regards, Duncan
> >> PS. Ask a very specific question and you'll get more useful, and
> >> shorter, answers :-)
> >
> >
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Let Crystal Reports handle the reporting - Free Crystal Reports 2008
> 30-Day
> > trial. Simplify your report design, integration and deployment - and
> focus
> > on
> > what you do best, core application coding. Discover what's new with
> > Crystal Reports now.  http://p.sf.net/sfu/bobj-july
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gramps-users mailing list
> > Gramps-users@...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gramps-users
> >
> >
>