| From Steve the Fiddle <stevethefiddle@...>
| Tue, 12 Oct 2010 12:50:35 +0100
| Subject: [Audacity-quality] sync-lock (was Re: new beta?)
> On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 3:47 AM, Vaughan Johnson
> <vaughan@...> wrote:
> > On 10/11/2010 7:06 PM, Steve the Fiddle wrote:
> >> ...
> >> As a specific (more relevant?) point, I'm aware that there's been a
> >> lot of work done on SyncLock, but I've no idea how it currently
> >> relates to time tracks.
> >> In Audacity 1.3.12 the time track is highlighted (with chains) but
> >> shows no signs of actually being linked.
Linking (as called then) cannot even be enabled in 1.3.12 released by
us. It was Ubuntu's decision to enable linking and make it default in
their 1.3.12 package.
> > If you move the Time Track below the Wave Track, have Sync-Lock on, then
> > selecting in the Time Track with the selection tool, it sync-lock
> > selects the Wave Track. Seems to me only the tools that affect the Time
> > Track should be enabled when over a Time Track.
And another annoyance with that is if you select in the Time Track
underneath Sync-Locked audio tracks, it's easy to think you have an
actionable selection, but as you haven't, selection-dependent menus will
be greyed (and if you have "Select all if none..." enabled in Preferences
and cut the "selection", all the audio is removed).
> If Time track control points are never linked with Sync-lock, then +1
> as Envelope control points are now (Audacity 1.3.12 revision 10709)
> sync-locked, shouldn't control points on the Time track also be
> If control points on the Time track can be sync-locked, then the
> Selection tool should work on the Time track.
Yes if Time Tracks can be Sync-Locked, IMO you should be able to cut a
region out of the Time Track by selecting in the audio tracks (also if you
just select in the Time Track, you would cut the audio in Sync-Locked
audio tracks and cut a piece out of the Time Track).
If selection in a Time Track works with Sync-Lock on I think it should do
so with Sync-Lock off, if you select in the Time Track and the audio track.
But if we've decided not to Sync-Lock Time Tracks (as suggested by their
lacking the Sync-Lock icon) then you shouldn't be able to see Sync-Lock
selections in audio tracks above a Time Track, and the case for being able
to select regions in Time Tracks would probably be weaker. If you selected
and cut only in a Time Track with Sync-Lock off, presumably this would have
no effect (or it could possibly remove any control point included in the
I'd be +1 on leaving Time Tracks out of Sync-Lock but otherwise unchanged.
See if there is pressure after 2.0 for Time Tracks to work with Sync-Lock
in which case I think they must work with Selection Tool too.
> > And why not remove "Move Track *" for Time Tracks, as they control all
> > other tracks, so should arguably always be at top?
+1 (but would have to disabled for "Sort Tracks" as well). Some people
assume you can move Time Tracks to the bottom to disable them.
> or was the original idea that eventually there could be multiple time
> tracks. Then they only affect tracks that are below them, down as far
> as the next time track?
> > Also, if you try to create a second Time Track, you get an info alert
> > that "This version of Audacity only allows one time track for each
> > project window." Why "this version"? Did we ever do it differently? Are
> > there plans to do it differently? If not, "Only one time track is
> > allowed per project." is more to the point.
I can indeed recall suggestions that there could be per-track Time Tracks
(it has a grand total of 1 vote on Wiki Feature Requests). I think that's the
reason for "This version" in the message, and yes it was different in 1.2
where you could only have one Time Track per instance of Audacity.
Agreed "This Version" is redundant though.
> > Or why not just disable Tracks > Add New > Time Track when one already
> > exists?
Same reason we don't grey File > Export Multiple when it's invalid I think.
The message tells user they can open a new project window to have two
different Time Tracks (for the many that don't RTFM).
> Why not disable Time tracks altogether?
> I doubt that anyone uses them as they have never worked very well in
> any version of Audacity.
> It would be a shame to loose Time tracks as (potentially) it's a
> really cool feature, but currently the best way to create a smooth
> sliding speed change is to use the "Sliding Time Scale/Pitch Shift"
Michael has recently made bug fixes (not fully tested yet) so that tracks
slowed down with Time Track are properly exported, and so that the
warp goes in the correct direction:
Given those fixes and that Sliding Time Scale is slow and forces you to
modify the data, I feel Time Tracks are still worth keeping for 2.0, but
should be left out of Sync-Lock unless we want to spend time to fully
integrate them into Sync-Lock.