Mixxx

Hello Mixxx,

I think it is time, to think about a library layout redesign for the
future versions of  Mixxx.

Every time, we think about new library features it is always an issue
where to place the controls. The current practice, to put them on top of
the track table is limited to a thin bar, which does not consumes much
of the valuable vertical space.

I have made a proposal that takes the fact in account, that most new
displays have a wide screen format. It's based on my evaluation of
various media players.

For me, Clementine-Player and Banshee have an Interface where the DJ
actually finds what he is looking for in a suitable time.
Mixxx makes a good progress with all the new finding features but it is
a bit hampered by its too static library layout.

Here is my proposal is based on my personal taste (... and I am not a DJ).

"library layout redesign with tabs for special purpose"
https://bugs.launchpad.net/mixxx/+bug/986704

This is a call for your Ideas and preferences, to get proposal widely
accepted.
So please leave your comment here, comment the Bug #986704 (better
retrievable), or file your own bugs or wish-list. Every detail matters.

Thank you in advanced.

Cheers

Daniel

If you're looking for space, in truth the "tree" on the left could replaced
by some kind of "drop down" selector - the fact is you're never using (or
selecting) more than one item at a time, so while its a sexy tree view, its
generally using up lots of space.

2012/4/22 Daniel Schürmann <daschuer@...>

> Hello Mixxx,
>
> I think it is time, to think about a library layout redesign for the
> future versions of  Mixxx.
>
> Every time, we think about new library features it is always an issue
> where to place the controls. The current practice, to put them on top of
> the track table is limited to a thin bar, which does not consumes much
> of the valuable vertical space.
>
> I have made a proposal that takes the fact in account, that most new
> displays have a wide screen format. It's based on my evaluation of
> various media players.
>
> For me, Clementine-Player and Banshee have an Interface where the DJ
> actually finds what he is looking for in a suitable time.
> Mixxx makes a good progress with all the new finding features but it is
> a bit hampered by its too static library layout.
>
> Here is my proposal is based on my personal taste (... and I am not a DJ).
>
> "library layout redesign with tabs for special purpose"
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/mixxx/+bug/986704
>
> This is a call for your Ideas and preferences, to get proposal widely
> accepted.
> So please leave your comment here, comment the Bug #986704 (better
> retrievable), or file your own bugs or wish-list. Every detail matters.
>
> Thank you in advanced.
>
> Cheers
>
> Daniel
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> For Developers, A Lot Can Happen In A Second.
> Boundary is the first to Know...and Tell You.
> Monitor Your Applications in Ultra-Fine Resolution. Try it FREE!
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/Boundary-d2dvs2
> _______________________________________________
> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> http://mixxx.org
>
>
> Mixxx-devel mailing list
> Mixxx-devel@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
>



-- 
keithsalisbury@...

I don't like a drop-down selecter. I would prefer some tabs on the right
and a third column to add stuff like Daniel suggested. Another thing is
that I want to have access to the preview deck all the time, to preview
some of the tracks in a playlist/crate/library. 

I've attached a design that I would like

best,
Max


On Mon, 23 Apr 2012 19:34:43 +0800
"keithsalisbury@..." <keithsalisbury@...> wrote:

> If you're looking for space, in truth the "tree" on the left could
> replaced by some kind of "drop down" selector - the fact is you're
> never using (or selecting) more than one item at a time, so while its
> a sexy tree view, its generally using up lots of space.
> 
> 2012/4/22 Daniel Schürmann <daschuer@...>
> 
> > Hello Mixxx,
> >
> > I think it is time, to think about a library layout redesign for the
> > future versions of  Mixxx.
> >
> > Every time, we think about new library features it is always an
> > issue where to place the controls. The current practice, to put
> > them on top of the track table is limited to a thin bar, which does
> > not consumes much of the valuable vertical space.
> >
> > I have made a proposal that takes the fact in account, that most new
> > displays have a wide screen format. It's based on my evaluation of
> > various media players.
> >
> > For me, Clementine-Player and Banshee have an Interface where the DJ
> > actually finds what he is looking for in a suitable time.
> > Mixxx makes a good progress with all the new finding features but
> > it is a bit hampered by its too static library layout.
> >
> > Here is my proposal is based on my personal taste (... and I am not
> > a DJ).
> >
> > "library layout redesign with tabs for special purpose"
> > https://bugs.launchpad.net/mixxx/+bug/986704
> >
> > This is a call for your Ideas and preferences, to get proposal
> > widely accepted.
> > So please leave your comment here, comment the Bug #986704 (better
> > retrievable), or file your own bugs or wish-list. Every detail
> > matters.
> >
> > Thank you in advanced.
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Daniel
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > For Developers, A Lot Can Happen In A Second.
> > Boundary is the first to Know...and Tell You.
> > Monitor Your Applications in Ultra-Fine Resolution. Try it FREE!
> > http://p.sf.net/sfu/Boundary-d2dvs2
> > _______________________________________________
> > Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> > http://mixxx.org
> >
> >
> > Mixxx-devel mailing list
> > Mixxx-devel@...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
> >
> 
> 
>

I agree Max, I don't like drop-down selectors either - but it made the
point.

I like your layouts

On 24 April 2012 02:12, Max Linke <max_linke@...> wrote:

> I don't like a drop-down selecter. I would prefer some tabs on the right
> and a third column to add stuff like Daniel suggested. Another thing is
> that I want to have access to the preview deck all the time, to preview
> some of the tracks in a playlist/crate/library.
>
> I've attached a design that I would like
>
> best,
> Max
>
>
> On Mon, 23 Apr 2012 19:34:43 +0800
> "keithsalisbury@..." <keithsalisbury@...> wrote:
>
> > If you're looking for space, in truth the "tree" on the left could
> > replaced by some kind of "drop down" selector - the fact is you're
> > never using (or selecting) more than one item at a time, so while its
> > a sexy tree view, its generally using up lots of space.
> >
> > 2012/4/22 Daniel Schürmann <daschuer@...>
> >
> > > Hello Mixxx,
> > >
> > > I think it is time, to think about a library layout redesign for the
> > > future versions of  Mixxx.
> > >
> > > Every time, we think about new library features it is always an
> > > issue where to place the controls. The current practice, to put
> > > them on top of the track table is limited to a thin bar, which does
> > > not consumes much of the valuable vertical space.
> > >
> > > I have made a proposal that takes the fact in account, that most new
> > > displays have a wide screen format. It's based on my evaluation of
> > > various media players.
> > >
> > > For me, Clementine-Player and Banshee have an Interface where the DJ
> > > actually finds what he is looking for in a suitable time.
> > > Mixxx makes a good progress with all the new finding features but
> > > it is a bit hampered by its too static library layout.
> > >
> > > Here is my proposal is based on my personal taste (... and I am not
> > > a DJ).
> > >
> > > "library layout redesign with tabs for special purpose"
> > > https://bugs.launchpad.net/mixxx/+bug/986704
> > >
> > > This is a call for your Ideas and preferences, to get proposal
> > > widely accepted.
> > > So please leave your comment here, comment the Bug #986704 (better
> > > retrievable), or file your own bugs or wish-list. Every detail
> > > matters.
> > >
> > > Thank you in advanced.
> > >
> > > Cheers
> > >
> > > Daniel
> > >
> > >
> > >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > For Developers, A Lot Can Happen In A Second.
> > > Boundary is the first to Know...and Tell You.
> > > Monitor Your Applications in Ultra-Fine Resolution. Try it FREE!
> > > http://p.sf.net/sfu/Boundary-d2dvs2
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> > > http://mixxx.org
> > >
> > >
> > > Mixxx-devel mailing list
> > > Mixxx-devel@...
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> For Developers, A Lot Can Happen In A Second.
> Boundary is the first to Know...and Tell You.
> Monitor Your Applications in Ultra-Fine Resolution. Try it FREE!
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/Boundary-d2dvs2
>
> _______________________________________________
> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> http://mixxx.org
>
>
> Mixxx-devel mailing list
> Mixxx-devel@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
>



-- 
keithsalisbury@...

Hello Mixxx,

thank you Keith and Max for your comments.

I think Max's mock-up includes very good ideas and is a good starting point
for checking against our requirements.

Here are my main library-use-cases. (Please correct me, if you have
different ideas)

1.) Browse the library and crates for upcoming tracks
* Sort and filter the track table
* Preview tracks in library player
* Read additional information about interesting the tracks like
** Metadata
** Similar tracks
** Lyrics
** Cover Arts
* select song as possible follower

2.) Seach for a special song
* Search in all meta information
* Preview Songs in Library player
* select song as possible follower

3.) Select a special song from file system
* Search in all meta information
* Preview tracks in library player
* select song as possible follower

4.) Prepare track's Meta data
* Mass Tagging
* Analyze Songs
* Rate Songs

5.) Sort Song's
* Into crates
* Into playlists

6.) Control Auto DJ

7.) Looking for track selector's tracks


Ideas:
* A static track table on the right with a small filter edit is always
useful.
** I like to have an option for grouping by album or genre.

* I agree with Max we should have an always visible preview player. This is
needed in nearly all use-cases
** Maybe we could add a view which displays additional Meta-Data of the
preview track if required

* I agree with Keith and Max that we the current tree view is only
interesting in short moments and need not to bee displayed at all the time
** Display the "old" tree on demand is good idea. For Me, This tree should
only what is displayed in the Track table

* Its a good Idea to have the file system browser not in the same tree,
because this gives the option to have also a symbol view with an address bar

* The selector tabs (buttons) on the left are looking very tidy. I would
like to have them horizontal, because I think we need some additional
buttons and our vertical space is already limited.
** For now I like to have:
*** Library | PC | Auto DJ | Track Sector |  Track Info | Filter (Banshee
like) | Second track table (Norton Commander) | Notepad

* I Am not sure how to control the second track table.
** We need something to collect the upcoming tracks (maybe the AutoDJ
playlists)
** And something to collect wishes and ideas like the CD stacks on the
desktop
** And to create new playlists
** Maybe its also a good Idea to allow to split the static track table on
demand, what do you think?

* Additional to the filters I like to have an Index based search. Maybe we
can put the edit also on top of the track table or we can integrate it with
track selector or ...

By the way: I don't think to should start to implement all Ideas. It's just
a vision to know in which direction we should go with each future project.

Kind regards,

Daniel

Hi

I've noticed that my layout doesn't allow to drag&drop tracks to a
playlist/crate. My idea would be to show a list of all playlists/crates
when a song is draged to the tab. 
And I like the idea to have the library and auto-dj playlist next to
each other in auto-dj view, this way you can add tracks to the playlist
without the need to switch between library and auto-dj view.

As for the tabs, I don't like to have more then 5. This Number should
be possible to show an all screens from 10" to 17" without the need of
a scrollbar. Also I don't know if we should have several search fields
I assume this would confuse people.

best,
Max

On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 17:24:00 +0200
Daniel Schürmann <daschuer@...> wrote:

> Hello Mixxx,
> 
> thank you Keith and Max for your comments.
> 
> I think Max's mock-up includes very good ideas and is a good starting
> point for checking against our requirements.
> 
> Here are my main library-use-cases. (Please correct me, if you have
> different ideas)
> 
> 1.) Browse the library and crates for upcoming tracks
> * Sort and filter the track table
> * Preview tracks in library player
> * Read additional information about interesting the tracks like
> ** Metadata
> ** Similar tracks
> ** Lyrics
> ** Cover Arts
> * select song as possible follower
> 
> 2.) Seach for a special song
> * Search in all meta information
> * Preview Songs in Library player
> * select song as possible follower
> 
> 3.) Select a special song from file system
> * Search in all meta information
> * Preview tracks in library player
> * select song as possible follower
> 
> 4.) Prepare track's Meta data
> * Mass Tagging
> * Analyze Songs
> * Rate Songs
> 
> 5.) Sort Song's
> * Into crates
> * Into playlists
> 
> 6.) Control Auto DJ
> 
> 7.) Looking for track selector's tracks
> 
> 
> Ideas:
> * A static track table on the right with a small filter edit is always
> useful.
> ** I like to have an option for grouping by album or genre.
> 
> * I agree with Max we should have an always visible preview player.
> This is needed in nearly all use-cases
> ** Maybe we could add a view which displays additional Meta-Data of
> the preview track if required
> 
> * I agree with Keith and Max that we the current tree view is only
> interesting in short moments and need not to bee displayed at all the
> time ** Display the "old" tree on demand is good idea. For Me, This
> tree should only what is displayed in the Track table
> 
> * Its a good Idea to have the file system browser not in the same
> tree, because this gives the option to have also a symbol view with
> an address bar
> 
> * The selector tabs (buttons) on the left are looking very tidy. I
> would like to have them horizontal, because I think we need some
> additional buttons and our vertical space is already limited.
> ** For now I like to have:
> *** Library | PC | Auto DJ | Track Sector |  Track Info | Filter
> (Banshee like) | Second track table (Norton Commander) | Notepad
> 
> * I Am not sure how to control the second track table.
> ** We need something to collect the upcoming tracks (maybe the AutoDJ
> playlists)
> ** And something to collect wishes and ideas like the CD stacks on the
> desktop
> ** And to create new playlists
> ** Maybe its also a good Idea to allow to split the static track
> table on demand, what do you think?
> 
> * Additional to the filters I like to have an Index based search.
> Maybe we can put the edit also on top of the track table or we can
> integrate it with track selector or ...
> 
> By the way: I don't think to should start to implement all Ideas.
> It's just a vision to know in which direction we should go with each
> future project.
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Daniel

Hi

I've been working on the design with Daniel and this is what we came up
with.

https://bugs.launchpad.net/mixxx/+bug/986704/+attachment/3164045/+files/mixxx-newLibraryWidget-7.svg

Any comments?

best Max

On Fri, 27 Apr 2012 10:43:37 +0200
Max Linke <max_linke@...> wrote:

> Hi
> 
> I've noticed that my layout doesn't allow to drag&drop tracks to a
> playlist/crate. My idea would be to show a list of all
> playlists/crates when a song is draged to the tab. 
> And I like the idea to have the library and auto-dj playlist next to
> each other in auto-dj view, this way you can add tracks to the
> playlist without the need to switch between library and auto-dj view.
> 
> As for the tabs, I don't like to have more then 5. This Number should
> be possible to show an all screens from 10" to 17" without the need of
> a scrollbar. Also I don't know if we should have several search fields
> I assume this would confuse people.
> 
> best,
> Max
> 
> On Thu, 26 Apr 2012 17:24:00 +0200
> Daniel Schürmann <daschuer@...> wrote:
> 
> > Hello Mixxx,
> > 
> > thank you Keith and Max for your comments.
> > 
> > I think Max's mock-up includes very good ideas and is a good
> > starting point for checking against our requirements.
> > 
> > Here are my main library-use-cases. (Please correct me, if you have
> > different ideas)
> > 
> > 1.) Browse the library and crates for upcoming tracks
> > * Sort and filter the track table
> > * Preview tracks in library player
> > * Read additional information about interesting the tracks like
> > ** Metadata
> > ** Similar tracks
> > ** Lyrics
> > ** Cover Arts
> > * select song as possible follower
> > 
> > 2.) Seach for a special song
> > * Search in all meta information
> > * Preview Songs in Library player
> > * select song as possible follower
> > 
> > 3.) Select a special song from file system
> > * Search in all meta information
> > * Preview tracks in library player
> > * select song as possible follower
> > 
> > 4.) Prepare track's Meta data
> > * Mass Tagging
> > * Analyze Songs
> > * Rate Songs
> > 
> > 5.) Sort Song's
> > * Into crates
> > * Into playlists
> > 
> > 6.) Control Auto DJ
> > 
> > 7.) Looking for track selector's tracks
> > 
> > 
> > Ideas:
> > * A static track table on the right with a small filter edit is
> > always useful.
> > ** I like to have an option for grouping by album or genre.
> > 
> > * I agree with Max we should have an always visible preview player.
> > This is needed in nearly all use-cases
> > ** Maybe we could add a view which displays additional Meta-Data of
> > the preview track if required
> > 
> > * I agree with Keith and Max that we the current tree view is only
> > interesting in short moments and need not to bee displayed at all
> > the time ** Display the "old" tree on demand is good idea. For Me,
> > This tree should only what is displayed in the Track table
> > 
> > * Its a good Idea to have the file system browser not in the same
> > tree, because this gives the option to have also a symbol view with
> > an address bar
> > 
> > * The selector tabs (buttons) on the left are looking very tidy. I
> > would like to have them horizontal, because I think we need some
> > additional buttons and our vertical space is already limited.
> > ** For now I like to have:
> > *** Library | PC | Auto DJ | Track Sector |  Track Info | Filter
> > (Banshee like) | Second track table (Norton Commander) | Notepad
> > 
> > * I Am not sure how to control the second track table.
> > ** We need something to collect the upcoming tracks (maybe the
> > AutoDJ playlists)
> > ** And something to collect wishes and ideas like the CD stacks on
> > the desktop
> > ** And to create new playlists
> > ** Maybe its also a good Idea to allow to split the static track
> > table on demand, what do you think?
> > 
> > * Additional to the filters I like to have an Index based search.
> > Maybe we can put the edit also on top of the track table or we can
> > integrate it with track selector or ...
> > 
> > By the way: I don't think to should start to implement all Ideas.
> > It's just a vision to know in which direction we should go with each
> > future project.
> > 
> > Kind regards,
> > 
> > Daniel
>

Hi Daniel and Max,

Here's some feedback to the message below and the new
mixxx-newLibraryWidget-7.svg:

On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 4:24 PM, Daniel Schürmann <daschuer@...> wrote:
> Hello Mixxx,
>
> thank you Keith and Max for your comments.
>
> I think Max's mock-up includes very good ideas and is a good starting point
> for checking against our requirements.
>
> Here are my main library-use-cases. (Please correct me, if you have
> different ideas)
>
> 1.) Browse the library and crates for upcoming tracks
> * Sort and filter the track table
> * Preview tracks in library player
> * Read additional information about interesting the tracks like
> ** Metadata
> ** Similar tracks
> ** Lyrics
> ** Cover Arts
> * select song as possible follower
>
> 2.) Seach for a special song
> * Search in all meta information
> * Preview Songs in Library player
> * select song as possible follower
>
> 3.) Select a special song from file system
> * Search in all meta information
> * Preview tracks in library player
> * select song as possible follower
>
> 4.) Prepare track's Meta data
> * Mass Tagging
> * Analyze Songs
> * Rate Songs
>
> 5.) Sort Song's
> * Into crates
> * Into playlists
>
> 6.) Control Auto DJ
>
> 7.) Looking for track selector's tracks
>

Yeah, I think that more or less covers the main use cases.


>
> Ideas:
> * A static track table on the right with a small filter edit is always
> useful.
> ** I like to have an option for grouping by album or genre.
>
> * I agree with Max we should have an always visible preview player. This is
> needed in nearly all use-cases

Maybe this is a job for Jus, but it would be good if the preview
player visually communicated what output it's going to. If the preview
deck doesn't make noise come out of my speakers the first time I run
Mixxx, I'm going to think Mixxx is broken.

> ** Maybe we could add a view which displays additional Meta-Data of the
> preview track if required
>
> * I agree with Keith and Max that we the current tree view is only
> interesting in short moments and need not to bee displayed at all the time
> ** Display the "old" tree on demand is good idea. For Me, This tree should
> only what is displayed in the Track table
>
> * Its a good Idea to have the file system browser not in the same tree,
> because this gives the option to have also a symbol view with an address bar

Yeah, although I like the work that was done to add support for a tree
in the left pane of our library, I think it's a bit awkward to
actually navigate a file tree there because you have to constantly
expand the divider. If we could somehow move file navigation back to
the right-hand pane, that might be nicer.

>
> * The selector tabs (buttons) on the left are looking very tidy. I would
> like to have them horizontal, because I think we need some additional
> buttons and our vertical space is already limited.

My personal opinion is that vertical buttons are very difficult to
read and should find a way to not use them. They're not part of any
interface guidelines on Windows or Mac, and they don't exist on any
platform outside KDE. They're not a standard widget and I can't read
text sideways, so I think we should try to avoid them.

> ** For now I like to have:
> *** Library | PC | Auto DJ | Track Sector |  Track Info | Filter (Banshee
> like) | Second track table (Norton Commander) | Notepad
>
> * I Am not sure how to control the second track table.
> ** We need something to collect the upcoming tracks (maybe the AutoDJ
> playlists)
> ** And something to collect wishes and ideas like the CD stacks on the
> desktop
> ** And to create new playlists
> ** Maybe its also a good Idea to allow to split the static track table on
> demand, what do you think?

After seeing the mockup with the split track view, I can definitely
see how this could be very useful. That might be a good main starting
point for moving forward with the UI design. (I'd suggest trying to
figure out how you'd want the two-pane view to work.) I think it would
make crate and playlist management much much easier if you could see
both a crate/playlist and the library at the same time.

>
> * Additional to the filters I like to have an Index based search. Maybe we
> can put the edit also on top of the track table or we can integrate it with
> track selector or ...
>
> By the way: I don't think to should start to implement all Ideas. It's just
> a vision to know in which direction we should go with each future project.
>

This is great, thanks for brainstorming guys! I'm looking forward to
seeing even more new ideas.

Thanks again,
Albert

I agree here with Albert about vertical text buttons - I would prefer a
vertical list of icons which shows a tooltip with the name. The same as the
Ubuntu unity panel, or the OSX dock (vertical), Using icons ensures
consistency of size, and after repeated use users will understand the
symbols without needing to read the tooltip.

On 27 May 2012 06:33, Albert Santoni <alberts@...> wrote:

>
> My personal opinion is that vertical buttons are very difficult to
> read and should find a way to not use them. They're not part of any
> interface guidelines on Windows or Mac, and they don't exist on any
> platform outside KDE. They're not a standard widget and I can't read
> text sideways, so I think we should try to avoid them.
> This is great, thanks for brainstorming guys! I'm looking forward to
> seeing even more new ideas.
>
> Thanks again,
> Albert
>
> --
keithsalisbury@...

Agree.

I don't think people using vertical text lists actually read the text: they twist their head once to read it and then memorize the shape just like an icon.

Another problem in mixxx UI for the vertical text panels would be translations. The language change can often double length of some strings, and the theme can't guarantee that all sidebar labels even fit to the vertical list for localized versions.

Now we just need the nice default icons!

On 27 May 2012, at 06:41, keithsalisbury@... wrote:

> I agree here with Albert about vertical text buttons - I would prefer a vertical list of icons which shows a tooltip with the name. The same as the Ubuntu unity panel, or the OSX dock (vertical), Using icons ensures consistency of size, and after repeated use users will understand the symbols without needing to read the tooltip.
> 
> On 27 May 2012 06:33, Albert Santoni <alberts@...> wrote:
> 
> My personal opinion is that vertical buttons are very difficult to
> read and should find a way to not use them. They're not part of any
> interface guidelines on Windows or Mac, and they don't exist on any
> platform outside KDE. They're not a standard widget and I can't read
> text sideways, so I think we should try to avoid them.
> This is great, thanks for brainstorming guys! I'm looking forward to
> seeing even more new ideas.
> 
> Thanks again,
> Albert
> 
> -- 
> keithsalisbury@...
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> http://mixxx.org
> 
> 
> Mixxx-devel mailing list
> Mixxx-devel@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel

Hi Albert, Ilkka and Keith

Thank you for you positive criticism. I am happy that you are pleased with
Max and my ideas!
The vertical buttons can be easily replaced with the icons we have already.
Maybe we can reuse the clementine side bar with different configuration
options.

Kind regards,

Daniel

On Sat, 26 May 2012 23:33:36 +0100
Albert Santoni <alberts@...> wrote:
 
> Yeah, although I like the work that was done to add support for a tree
> in the left pane of our library, I think it's a bit awkward to
> actually navigate a file tree there because you have to constantly
> expand the divider. If we could somehow move file navigation back to
> the right-hand pane, that might be nicer.

Isn't this what we are doing now in "Browse"?

Also what do you think of the option to view the library with a grid of
Album Covers? I've read in some Bug reports that people miss the
possibility to search through your library by picture when they use
DJ-Software and I've thought this could be a nice way to bring this
back. 

Also thanks for the great comments.

best Max

On 28 May 2012 23:13, Max Linke <max_linke@...> wrote:

> Also what do you think of the option to view the library with a grid of
> Album Covers? I've read in some Bug reports that people miss the
> possibility to search through your library by picture when they use
> DJ-Software and I've thought this could be a nice way to bring this
> back.
>

i love browsing by looking at cover art in itunes - would be great to have
similar options in mixxx

>     Also what do you think of the option to view the library with a grid of
>     Album Covers? I've read in some Bug reports that people miss the
>     possibility to search through your library by picture when they use
>     DJ-Software and I've thought this could be a nice way to bring this
>     back.
>
>
> i love browsing by looking at cover art in itunes - would be great to
> have similar options in mixxx

I second that. I remember things visually and not finding tunes by the 
CD or record sleeves has been the biggest hurdle for me to move to 
digital DJing.

Sincerely,
Sean M. Pappalardo
"D.J. Pegasus"
Mixxx Developer - Controller Specialist

I, on the other hand, can't stand album pictures. Whoever puts this in 
make sure there's an opt-out ;)

On 05/28/2012 04:52 PM, Sean M. Pappalardo - D.J. Pegasus wrote:
>
>
>>     Also what do you think of the option to view the library with a 
>> grid of
>>     Album Covers? I've read in some Bug reports that people miss the
>>     possibility to search through your library by picture when they use
>>     DJ-Software and I've thought this could be a nice way to bring this
>>     back.
>>
>>
>> i love browsing by looking at cover art in itunes - would be great to
>> have similar options in mixxx
>
> I second that. I remember things visually and not finding tunes by the 
> CD or record sleeves has been the biggest hurdle for me to move to 
> digital DJing.
>
> Sincerely,
> Sean M. Pappalardo
> "D.J. Pegasus"
> Mixxx Developer - Controller Specialist
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> http://mixxx.org
>
>
> Mixxx-devel mailing list
> Mixxx-devel@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel

This Qt-based implementation of a cover-flow like animation should be
easily re-usable: http://code.google.com/p/pictureflow/

On Mon, May 28, 2012 at 5:46 PM, nathan dotz <nathan.dotz@...> wrote:

> I, on the other hand, can't stand album pictures. Whoever puts this in
> make sure there's an opt-out ;)
>
> On 05/28/2012 04:52 PM, Sean M. Pappalardo - D.J. Pegasus wrote:
> >
> >
> >>     Also what do you think of the option to view the library with a
> >> grid of
> >>     Album Covers? I've read in some Bug reports that people miss the
> >>     possibility to search through your library by picture when they use
> >>     DJ-Software and I've thought this could be a nice way to bring this
> >>     back.
> >>
> >>
> >> i love browsing by looking at cover art in itunes - would be great to
> >> have similar options in mixxx
> >
> > I second that. I remember things visually and not finding tunes by the
> > CD or record sleeves has been the biggest hurdle for me to move to
> > digital DJing.
> >
> > Sincerely,
> > Sean M. Pappalardo
> > "D.J. Pegasus"
> > Mixxx Developer - Controller Specialist
> >
> >
> >
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Live Security Virtual Conference
> > Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> > threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> > will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> > threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> > http://mixxx.org
> >
> >
> > Mixxx-devel mailing list
> > Mixxx-devel@...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> http://mixxx.org
>
>
> Mixxx-devel mailing list
> Mixxx-devel@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
>

Coverflow - nice idea, looks "cool", not very practical though - everyone i
know with a mac/itunes switches off that gimmick after a while.
Browse by picture tiles - this has more validity, mainly because as noted,
many people have better visual memory.

Both ideas would be a great addition to the existing view (which is more
like a power users view).

Vertical buttons - we should definitely use the existing icons as users
have grown accustomed to them and their meaning. We could tweak a little.

On 29 May 2012 09:23, RJ Ryan <russelljryan@...> wrote:

> This Qt-based implementation of a cover-flow like animation should be
> easily re-usable: http://code.google.com/p/pictureflow/
>
>
> On Mon, May 28, 2012 at 5:46 PM, nathan dotz <nathan.dotz@...:
>
>> I, on the other hand, can't stand album pictures. Whoever puts this in
>> make sure there's an opt-out ;)
>>
>> On 05/28/2012 04:52 PM, Sean M. Pappalardo - D.J. Pegasus wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >>     Also what do you think of the option to view the library with a
>> >> grid of
>> >>     Album Covers? I've read in some Bug reports that people miss the
>> >>     possibility to search through your library by picture when they use
>> >>     DJ-Software and I've thought this could be a nice way to bring this
>> >>     back.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> i love browsing by looking at cover art in itunes - would be great to
>> >> have similar options in mixxx
>> >
>> > I second that. I remember things visually and not finding tunes by the
>> > CD or record sleeves has been the biggest hurdle for me to move to
>> > digital DJing.
>> >
>> > Sincerely,
>> > Sean M. Pappalardo
>> > "D.J. Pegasus"
>> > Mixxx Developer - Controller Specialist
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > Live Security Virtual Conference
>> > Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
>> > threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond.
>> Discussions
>> > will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in
>> malware
>> > threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
>> > http://mixxx.org
>> >
>> >
>> > Mixxx-devel mailing list
>> > Mixxx-devel@...
>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Live Security Virtual Conference
>> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
>> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
>> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
>> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
>> _______________________________________________
>> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
>> http://mixxx.org
>>
>>
>> Mixxx-devel mailing list
>> Mixxx-devel@...
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> http://mixxx.org
>
>
> Mixxx-devel mailing list
> Mixxx-devel@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
>



-- 
keithsalisbury@...

On Mon, May 28, 2012 at 9:13 PM, Max Linke <max_linke@...> wrote:
> On Sat, 26 May 2012 23:33:36 +0100
> Albert Santoni <alberts@...> wrote:
>
>> Yeah, although I like the work that was done to add support for a tree
>> in the left pane of our library, I think it's a bit awkward to
>> actually navigate a file tree there because you have to constantly
>> expand the divider. If we could somehow move file navigation back to
>> the right-hand pane, that might be nicer.
>
> Isn't this what we are doing now in "Browse"?

Yes, I'm criticizing the current implementation's usability, but
trying to still be positive. :)

Now is a good time to suggest that everyone interested in doing any
work on the library go and look at old versions of Mixxx. We're going
in circles:

Mixxx 1.4 and 1.5:
- Tree view in the left-hand pane
- (Fun fact: The library used to be a single in-memory QList.)
http://g1.idg.pl/ftp/linux/mixxx14.jpg
http://www.threadbox.net/files/blogpics/sets/mixxx/mixxx.png

Mixxx 1.6:
- Elimination of the left-hand pane, replaced with a combobox
- Search box added, placed above the library beside the combobox
- "Browse" mode added. This was a "flat" browse mode, where the
library showed the contents of a directory, and you could browse by
double clicking on a directory name, or on ".." to go back up. (Based
on QDirModel I think...)
http://download.net.pl/img/3c565e8562e46edf8171795cea824dce.png.png


Mixxx 1.7:
- Nothing really changed in the library


Mixxx 1.8:
- New QtSql-based library + TrackInfoObject cache
- The left-hand pane is back, but it only supports 1 level of children
(it wasn't really a tree).
- iTunes / Rhythmbox sources
- Crates, Playlists
- Auto DJ introduced because the "NEXT" playback mode on the decks was
eliminated
- Bulk BPM detection, better song properties dialog
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TCwnmXHaw4I/AAAAAAAAAtw/eetZSEfj4cc/s1600/Screenshot-Mixxx+1.8.0~beta2.png

Mixxx 1.9:
- Inline track editing (double-clicking on the the table to edit track metadata)
- Revamped search function, faster everything.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TPniOgGWFWI/AAAAAAAAA6M/_6SUXHBkM4M/s1600/Picture+12.png


Mixxx 1.10:
- The left-hand pane is turned back into a tree!
- Directory browsing now happens back in the left-hand pane, like in Mixxx 1.4.
- Auto DJ improvements, recordings saved in the library, other
incremental improvements.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TPniOgGWFWI/AAAAAAAAA6M/_6SUXHBkM4M/s1600/Picture+12.png


>
> Also what do you think of the option to view the library with a grid of
> Album Covers? I've read in some Bug reports that people miss the
> possibility to search through your library by picture when they use
> DJ-Software and I've thought this could be a nice way to bring this
> back.

I think we should prioritize improving the usability of the library in
general before we expand to features like this that won't necessarily
benefit many users. For example, addressing the difficultly organizing
playlists and crates (possibly by offering a two-pane view) is one
thing you could tackle.

That said, I'm a big fan of the library preview player and Keith's
track selector because they're both relative self contained, they
benefit a large number of users, and they didn't require redesigning
the library to implement. :)

Cheers,
Albert




>
> Also thanks for the great comments.
>
> best Max
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> http://mixxx.org
>
>
> Mixxx-devel mailing list
> Mixxx-devel@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel



-- 
Albert Santoni
Developer, Mixxx
http://www.mixxx.org
http://www.oscillicious.com

Hi Albert,

Thank you for your overview to the mixxx layout history.

Yes it looks like we are going in circles, that the same as in fashion.
They always mix new ideas with old ones to have success and thats not
bad. ;-)

I think I understand your concerns. And I fully agree that it is more
important to improve the small
annoying details instead of start a big library project.

I have started the library discussion because there simply no space for
extensions in our current layout.
Every new feature like auto DJ and track selector feels like stuffed
into the library view.

I am glad that Max has pushed it to really high end solution, that can
be created step by step.
Here is a proposal for the fist step:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/mixxx/+bug/986704/+attachment/3168122/+files/mixxx-newLibraryWidget-step1.svg
I would be happy if we can go the first step during the summer so that
the new features suits perfectly into the library view.


Kind regards,

Daniel
 

 
    


Am 29.05.2012 16:56, schrieb Albert Santoni:
> On Mon, May 28, 2012 at 9:13 PM, Max Linke <max_linke@...> wrote:
>> On Sat, 26 May 2012 23:33:36 +0100
>> Albert Santoni <alberts@...> wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah, although I like the work that was done to add support for a tree
>>> in the left pane of our library, I think it's a bit awkward to
>>> actually navigate a file tree there because you have to constantly
>>> expand the divider. If we could somehow move file navigation back to
>>> the right-hand pane, that might be nicer.
>> Isn't this what we are doing now in "Browse"?
> Yes, I'm criticizing the current implementation's usability, but
> trying to still be positive. :)
>
> Now is a good time to suggest that everyone interested in doing any
> work on the library go and look at old versions of Mixxx. We're going
> in circles:
>
> Mixxx 1.4 and 1.5:
> - Tree view in the left-hand pane
> - (Fun fact: The library used to be a single in-memory QList.)
> http://g1.idg.pl/ftp/linux/mixxx14.jpg
> http://www.threadbox.net/files/blogpics/sets/mixxx/mixxx.png
>
> Mixxx 1.6:
> - Elimination of the left-hand pane, replaced with a combobox
> - Search box added, placed above the library beside the combobox
> - "Browse" mode added. This was a "flat" browse mode, where the
> library showed the contents of a directory, and you could browse by
> double clicking on a directory name, or on ".." to go back up. (Based
> on QDirModel I think...)
> http://download.net.pl/img/3c565e8562e46edf8171795cea824dce.png.png
>
>
> Mixxx 1.7:
> - Nothing really changed in the library
>
>
> Mixxx 1.8:
> - New QtSql-based library + TrackInfoObject cache
> - The left-hand pane is back, but it only supports 1 level of children
> (it wasn't really a tree).
> - iTunes / Rhythmbox sources
> - Crates, Playlists
> - Auto DJ introduced because the "NEXT" playback mode on the decks was
> eliminated
> - Bulk BPM detection, better song properties dialog
> http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TCwnmXHaw4I/AAAAAAAAAtw/eetZSEfj4cc/s1600/Screenshot-Mixxx+1.8.0~beta2.png
>
> Mixxx 1.9:
> - Inline track editing (double-clicking on the the table to edit track metadata)
> - Revamped search function, faster everything.
> http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TPniOgGWFWI/AAAAAAAAA6M/_6SUXHBkM4M/s1600/Picture+12.png
>
>
> Mixxx 1.10:
> - The left-hand pane is turned back into a tree!
> - Directory browsing now happens back in the left-hand pane, like in Mixxx 1.4.
> - Auto DJ improvements, recordings saved in the library, other
> incremental improvements.
> http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TPniOgGWFWI/AAAAAAAAA6M/_6SUXHBkM4M/s1600/Picture+12.png
>
>
>> Also what do you think of the option to view the library with a grid of
>> Album Covers? I've read in some Bug reports that people miss the
>> possibility to search through your library by picture when they use
>> DJ-Software and I've thought this could be a nice way to bring this
>> back.
> I think we should prioritize improving the usability of the library in
> general before we expand to features like this that won't necessarily
> benefit many users. For example, addressing the difficultly organizing
> playlists and crates (possibly by offering a two-pane view) is one
> thing you could tackle.
>
> That said, I'm a big fan of the library preview player and Keith's
> track selector because they're both relative self contained, they
> benefit a large number of users, and they didn't require redesigning
> the library to implement. :)
>
> Cheers,
> Albert
>
>
>
>
>> Also thanks for the great comments.
>>
>> best Max
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Live Security Virtual Conference
>> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
>> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
>> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
>> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
>> _______________________________________________
>> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
>> http://mixxx.org
>>
>>
>> Mixxx-devel mailing list
>> Mixxx-devel@...
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
>
>

Not related to layout, but to items discussed anyway, someone(™) should really work on these as well, preferably before 1.12 already.

I have one big issue with current 1.11 code: we should NOT reload whole 'Library' element from scratch, if you move to any other section in the sidebar: right now, the waveform display freezes for a short time and you clearly can see the library playlist being reconstructed, even if you just click on 'auto dj' and immediately again on 'library'. Same of course applies to other elements, they should be cached after first loading (and have a 'reload' in context menu if this becomes an issue). 

And oh yeah, anything in sidebar should be mappable in scripts: right now missing important control objects:
- expand/collapse/toggle tree item (crates,playlists) from midi, for example:
  engine.setValue("[Sidebar]", "SelectedItemExpanded", true);
  engine.setValue("[Sidebar]", "SelectedItemExpanded", false);
  engine.getValue("[Sidebar]", "IsItemExpandable");
  engine.getValue("[Sidebar]", "IsItemExpanded");

- address crates and playlists and other items by name in script, modify them from midi, for example:
  engine.setValue( "[Playlist]", "AddSelectedTrackToAutoDJ", true);
  engine.setValue( "[Playlist]", "AddSelectedTrackToAutoDJAsNext", true);
  engine.setValue( "[Playlist]", "AddSelectedTrackToCrate", "Bad Music"];
  engine.setValue( "[Playlist]", "AddSelectedTrackToCrateAsNext", "Bad Music"];
  engine.setValue( "[Playlist]", "AddSelectedTrackToPlaylist", "Worse Music"];
  engine.setValue( "[Playlist]", "AddSelectedTrackToPlaylistAsNext", "Worse Music"];
  engine.setValue( "[Sidebar]", "SelectLibrary",true);
  engine.setValue( "[Sidebar]", "SelectAutoDJ",true);
  engine.setValue( "[Sidebar]", "SelectCrate", "Bad Music");
  engine.setValue( "[Sidebar]", "SelectPlaylist", "Worse Music");

the 'AsNext' methods expect the playlists have active item (playing / selected track): if this is not available, we just need to add to end.

I don't think actions like 'create new playlist' or 'rename playlist' need to be mappable to controllers, because they require keyboard input anyway.

On 29 May 2012, at 21:33, Daniel Schürmann wrote:

> Hi Albert,
> 
> Thank you for your overview to the mixxx layout history.
> 
> Yes it looks like we are going in circles, that the same as in fashion.
> They always mix new ideas with old ones to have success and thats not
> bad. ;-)
> 
> I think I understand your concerns. And I fully agree that it is more
> important to improve the small
> annoying details instead of start a big library project.
> 
> I have started the library discussion because there simply no space for
> extensions in our current layout.
> Every new feature like auto DJ and track selector feels like stuffed
> into the library view.
> 
> I am glad that Max has pushed it to really high end solution, that can
> be created step by step.
> Here is a proposal for the fist step:
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/mixxx/+bug/986704/+attachment/3168122/+files/mixxx-newLibraryWidget-step1.svg
> I would be happy if we can go the first step during the summer so that
> the new features suits perfectly into the library view.
> 
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Daniel
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Am 29.05.2012 16:56, schrieb Albert Santoni:
>> On Mon, May 28, 2012 at 9:13 PM, Max Linke <max_linke@...> wrote:
>>> On Sat, 26 May 2012 23:33:36 +0100
>>> Albert Santoni <alberts@...> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Yeah, although I like the work that was done to add support for a tree
>>>> in the left pane of our library, I think it's a bit awkward to
>>>> actually navigate a file tree there because you have to constantly
>>>> expand the divider. If we could somehow move file navigation back to
>>>> the right-hand pane, that might be nicer.
>>> Isn't this what we are doing now in "Browse"?
>> Yes, I'm criticizing the current implementation's usability, but
>> trying to still be positive. :)
>> 
>> Now is a good time to suggest that everyone interested in doing any
>> work on the library go and look at old versions of Mixxx. We're going
>> in circles:
>> 
>> Mixxx 1.4 and 1.5:
>> - Tree view in the left-hand pane
>> - (Fun fact: The library used to be a single in-memory QList.)
>> http://g1.idg.pl/ftp/linux/mixxx14.jpg
>> http://www.threadbox.net/files/blogpics/sets/mixxx/mixxx.png
>> 
>> Mixxx 1.6:
>> - Elimination of the left-hand pane, replaced with a combobox
>> - Search box added, placed above the library beside the combobox
>> - "Browse" mode added. This was a "flat" browse mode, where the
>> library showed the contents of a directory, and you could browse by
>> double clicking on a directory name, or on ".." to go back up. (Based
>> on QDirModel I think...)
>> http://download.net.pl/img/3c565e8562e46edf8171795cea824dce.png.png
>> 
>> 
>> Mixxx 1.7:
>> - Nothing really changed in the library
>> 
>> 
>> Mixxx 1.8:
>> - New QtSql-based library + TrackInfoObject cache
>> - The left-hand pane is back, but it only supports 1 level of children
>> (it wasn't really a tree).
>> - iTunes / Rhythmbox sources
>> - Crates, Playlists
>> - Auto DJ introduced because the "NEXT" playback mode on the decks was
>> eliminated
>> - Bulk BPM detection, better song properties dialog
>> http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TCwnmXHaw4I/AAAAAAAAAtw/eetZSEfj4cc/s1600/Screenshot-Mixxx+1.8.0~beta2.png
>> 
>> Mixxx 1.9:
>> - Inline track editing (double-clicking on the the table to edit track metadata)
>> - Revamped search function, faster everything.
>> http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TPniOgGWFWI/AAAAAAAAA6M/_6SUXHBkM4M/s1600/Picture+12.png
>> 
>> 
>> Mixxx 1.10:
>> - The left-hand pane is turned back into a tree!
>> - Directory browsing now happens back in the left-hand pane, like in Mixxx 1.4.
>> - Auto DJ improvements, recordings saved in the library, other
>> incremental improvements.
>> http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TPniOgGWFWI/AAAAAAAAA6M/_6SUXHBkM4M/s1600/Picture+12.png
>> 
>> 
>>> Also what do you think of the option to view the library with a grid of
>>> Album Covers? I've read in some Bug reports that people miss the
>>> possibility to search through your library by picture when they use
>>> DJ-Software and I've thought this could be a nice way to bring this
>>> back.
>> I think we should prioritize improving the usability of the library in
>> general before we expand to features like this that won't necessarily
>> benefit many users. For example, addressing the difficultly organizing
>> playlists and crates (possibly by offering a two-pane view) is one
>> thing you could tackle.
>> 
>> That said, I'm a big fan of the library preview player and Keith's
>> track selector because they're both relative self contained, they
>> benefit a large number of users, and they didn't require redesigning
>> the library to implement. :)
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> Albert
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> Also thanks for the great comments.
>>> 
>>> best Max
>>> 
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Live Security Virtual Conference
>>> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
>>> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
>>> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
>>> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
>>> http://mixxx.org
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Mixxx-devel mailing list
>>> Mixxx-devel@...
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and 
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On Tue, May 29, 2012 at 11:29 PM, Ilkka Tuohela <ilkka.tuohela@...:

> I have one big issue with current 1.11 code: we should NOT reload whole
> 'Library' element from scratch, if you move to any other section in the
> sidebar: right now, the waveform display freezes for a short time and you
> clearly can see the library playlist being reconstructed, even if you just
> click on 'auto dj' and immediately again on 'library'. Same of course
> applies to other elements, they should be cached after first loading (and
> have a 'reload' in context menu if this becomes an issue).
>

You'd think that this was caused by something like reloading the data --
but it's actually just the view switching and repopulating. We don't do any
data reloading on view switches (you could put a printline in select() to
show when data models refresh themselves from SQL). The library is written
to aggressively cache data in memory to avoid roundtrips to the database.

The exception here is switching between playlists (if you select playlist B
when A was selected, then it does do a query for track ids in B but the
rest is cached in the BaseTrackCache). Typically, looking up the ids here
takes single-digit milliseconds (there are commented debug statements you
can uncomment if you want to check the timing you get in practice) while
the pause you're talking about is typically hundreds of milliseconds. I
believe (from profiling a while back) the big time waste is Qt
abstract-item-view redrawing itself -- not any Mixxx code.

The way it works right now is there is one WTrackTableView (sort of, there
are exceptions) that we load a table-model into. If it's true that the
pause comes from switching the models then we could switch it so that there
is a different WTrackTableView for every section of the library (so much
for Qt's MVC promise).



> On 29 May 2012, at 21:33, Daniel Schürmann wrote:
>
> > Hi Albert,
> >
> > Thank you for your overview to the mixxx layout history.
> >
> > Yes it looks like we are going in circles, that the same as in fashion.
> > They always mix new ideas with old ones to have success and thats not
> > bad. ;-)
> >
> > I think I understand your concerns. And I fully agree that it is more
> > important to improve the small
> > annoying details instead of start a big library project.
> >
> > I have started the library discussion because there simply no space for
> > extensions in our current layout.
> > Every new feature like auto DJ and track selector feels like stuffed
> > into the library view.
> >
> > I am glad that Max has pushed it to really high end solution, that can
> > be created step by step.
> > Here is a proposal for the fist step:
> >
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/mixxx/+bug/986704/+attachment/3168122/+files/mixxx-newLibraryWidget-step1.svg
> > I would be happy if we can go the first step during the summer so that
> > the new features suits perfectly into the library view.
> >
> >
> > Kind regards,
> >
> > Daniel
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Am 29.05.2012 16:56, schrieb Albert Santoni:
> >> On Mon, May 28, 2012 at 9:13 PM, Max Linke <max_linke@...> wrote:
> >>> On Sat, 26 May 2012 23:33:36 +0100
> >>> Albert Santoni <alberts@...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Yeah, although I like the work that was done to add support for a tree
> >>>> in the left pane of our library, I think it's a bit awkward to
> >>>> actually navigate a file tree there because you have to constantly
> >>>> expand the divider. If we could somehow move file navigation back to
> >>>> the right-hand pane, that might be nicer.
> >>> Isn't this what we are doing now in "Browse"?
> >> Yes, I'm criticizing the current implementation's usability, but
> >> trying to still be positive. :)
> >>
> >> Now is a good time to suggest that everyone interested in doing any
> >> work on the library go and look at old versions of Mixxx. We're going
> >> in circles:
> >>
> >> Mixxx 1.4 and 1.5:
> >> - Tree view in the left-hand pane
> >> - (Fun fact: The library used to be a single in-memory QList.)
> >> http://g1.idg.pl/ftp/linux/mixxx14.jpg
> >> http://www.threadbox.net/files/blogpics/sets/mixxx/mixxx.png
> >>
> >> Mixxx 1.6:
> >> - Elimination of the left-hand pane, replaced with a combobox
> >> - Search box added, placed above the library beside the combobox
> >> - "Browse" mode added. This was a "flat" browse mode, where the
> >> library showed the contents of a directory, and you could browse by
> >> double clicking on a directory name, or on ".." to go back up. (Based
> >> on QDirModel I think...)
> >> http://download.net.pl/img/3c565e8562e46edf8171795cea824dce.png.png
> >>
> >>
> >> Mixxx 1.7:
> >> - Nothing really changed in the library
> >>
> >>
> >> Mixxx 1.8:
> >> - New QtSql-based library + TrackInfoObject cache
> >> - The left-hand pane is back, but it only supports 1 level of children
> >> (it wasn't really a tree).
> >> - iTunes / Rhythmbox sources
> >> - Crates, Playlists
> >> - Auto DJ introduced because the "NEXT" playback mode on the decks was
> >> eliminated
> >> - Bulk BPM detection, better song properties dialog
> >>
> http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TCwnmXHaw4I/AAAAAAAAAtw/eetZSEfj4cc/s1600/Screenshot-Mixxx+1.8.0~beta2.png
> >>
> >> Mixxx 1.9:
> >> - Inline track editing (double-clicking on the the table to edit track
> metadata)
> >> - Revamped search function, faster everything.
> >>
> http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TPniOgGWFWI/AAAAAAAAA6M/_6SUXHBkM4M/s1600/Picture+12.png
> >>
> >>
> >> Mixxx 1.10:
> >> - The left-hand pane is turned back into a tree!
> >> - Directory browsing now happens back in the left-hand pane, like in
> Mixxx 1.4.
> >> - Auto DJ improvements, recordings saved in the library, other
> >> incremental improvements.
> >>
> http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_hUprAdIclgE/TPniOgGWFWI/AAAAAAAAA6M/_6SUXHBkM4M/s1600/Picture+12.png
> >>
> >>
> >>> Also what do you think of the option to view the library with a grid of
> >>> Album Covers? I've read in some Bug reports that people miss the
> >>> possibility to search through your library by picture when they use
> >>> DJ-Software and I've thought this could be a nice way to bring this
> >>> back.
> >> I think we should prioritize improving the usability of the library in
> >> general before we expand to features like this that won't necessarily
> >> benefit many users. For example, addressing the difficultly organizing
> >> playlists and crates (possibly by offering a two-pane view) is one
> >> thing you could tackle.
> >>
> >> That said, I'm a big fan of the library preview player and Keith's
> >> track selector because they're both relative self contained, they
> >> benefit a large number of users, and they didn't require redesigning
> >> the library to implement. :)
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Albert
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> Also thanks for the great comments.
> >>>
> >>> best Max
> >>>
> >>>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>> Live Security Virtual Conference
> >>> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> >>> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond.
> Discussions
> >>> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in
> malware
> >>> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> >>> http://mixxx.org
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Mixxx-devel mailing list
> >>> Mixxx-devel@...
> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Live Security Virtual Conference
> > Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> > threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> > will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> > threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> > _______________________________________________
> > Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> > http://mixxx.org
> >
> >
> > Mixxx-devel mailing list
> > Mixxx-devel@...
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> http://mixxx.org
>
>
> Mixxx-devel mailing list
> Mixxx-devel@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel
>

Hi,
One my concerns with this design is that, as I have understood from the
mockup, we will not be able anymore to drag and drop directly into
crates/playlists from other views (e.g. browser). What do you think of
it?

Hi Mutil,

I think you refert to:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/mixxx/+bug/986704/+attachment/3168122/+files/mixxx-newLibraryWidget-step1.svg


Yes, you are right, this is the cost for having more space for auto DJ
and track selector feature in this step
For me it is a rare use case to put a track from the browser to the
library. But anyhow, we have still the context menu to do this.

Kind regards,

Daniel


 

Am 30.05.2012 17:17, schrieb mutil:
> Hi,
> One my concerns with this design is that, as I have understood from the
> mockup, we will not be able anymore to drag and drop directly into
> crates/playlists from other views (e.g. browser). What do you think of
> it?
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Live Security Virtual Conference
> Exclusive live event will cover all the ways today's security and 
> threat landscape has changed and how IT managers can respond. Discussions 
> will include endpoint security, mobile security and the latest in malware 
> threats. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfrnl04242012/114/50122263/
> _______________________________________________
> Get Mixxx, the #1 Free MP3 DJ Mixing software Today
> http://mixxx.org
>
>
> Mixxx-devel mailing list
> Mixxx-devel@...
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/mixxx-devel

> Am 30.05.2012 17:17, schrieb mutil:
> > Hi,
> > One my concerns with this design is that, as I have understood from
> > the mockup, we will not be able anymore to drag and drop directly
> > into crates/playlists from other views (e.g. browser). What do you
> > think of it?


We could open a popUP listing all playlists/crates if we detect a
dragEnterEvent on the library-symbol on the left. This would then allow
for drag'n'drop from other views