I think there are some important differences that make Player more desirable
than ROS for many applications. For starters, Player is lightweight. I had
great success packaging the Player server to run on a Beagleboard and use my
plugin drivers, and I know many other people have used it on Gumstix and
other embedded platforms, as well as across platforms on BSD, OSX and now
Windows machines. The fact that it's got a traditional build system means
it can be packaged nicely and included in major distributions without issue,
and it's been around long enough to collect support for a lot of varying and
popular hardware devices. ROS, on the other hand, is by design a (more or
less) self-contained operating system, complete with its own package
manager, build system, etc. It's at a much higher level, and trades
additional complexity for additional functionalities. At the moment, it
seems like the official focus is on making it run on Ubuntu, but I'm sure
the devs will branch out as the project matures.
Whatever your feelings, the reality is that people are getting paid to
develop ROS, some of whom were involved with the Player project. Stage and
Gazebo are still being actively maintained, but Player's future is unclear.
I'd like to see it continue to progress, if only because I've spent the past
3 years learning and developing drivers/clients for it. Personal
motivations aside, I think it fills an important niche for people who don't
need to learn the ins and outs of ROS to get their work done. I'd be happy
to contribute what I can if a long-term development plan was established
(not that I'm unhappy contributing now).
Now that I've sufficiently derailed this thread, I think some sort of
GUI-based Player launcher/configurator is still a decent idea, even if it's
something simple like playervcr: start, stop, load cfg buttons with a window
to see terminal output. Finding a way to parse doxygen comments would still
be nicer than adding separate drspec files, even if we have to change the
format a little bit.
From: Paul Osmialowski [mailto:newchief@...]
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2010 7:14 AM
Subject: Re: [Playerstage-developers] playerstage
As time goes by, I have more and more mixed feelings about it. Ideas
presented here http://vlab.pjwstk.edu.pl/?title=Vpconf (visual, easy to
use configurator) shows that Player needs more higher-level infrastructure
that AFAIK ROS already have. So all we're trying to do is to make Player
yet another ROS. Why should we not just join both projects and make Player
part of ROS instead? (I guess there's no point in that, as ROS on the
lower level has taken some code from Player). As Rich stated, 'the people
on this list are quite busy with other things'. That's true and as I can
see, because of that Player projects makes no significant progress
anymore. If ROS gained most of the robotics developers, I wonder if we
should join them instead of working on a project that has no clear future.
On Sun, 20 Jun 2010, Mohammed Rashad wrote:
> Dear Sir,
> First of all Thanks for the post. I had send many mail to ML because i
hadnt read the guidlines of sending the message. now i understand my fault
and promise that will never repeat this.
> will you please send me that link which Paul
> Osmialowski had send to wiki. Right now I am hacking playerstage code;
after successful hacks i do start developement.
> Once again sorry for sending bulk email to MailingList
> From: Rich Mattes <jpgr87@...>
> To: playerstage-developers@...
> Sent: Mon, June 21, 2010 10:21:54 AM
> Subject: Re: [Playerstage-developers] playerstage
> I don't think Captain Bedsock meant to be offensive. He's simply
> saying that most of the people on this list are quite busy with other
> things (research, projects, etc.) and don't have the time to guide you
> through a project every step of the way. Nobody is questioning your
> abilities or dedication, but this is your fifth or sixth email asking
> the list for guidance. Several of us have already sent you ideas and
> links (I know i sent you a large list of things in Player that could be
> improved, and links that tell you how to contribute changes.) Further,
> sending the same exact email more than once is bad form and tends to
> irritate people, as outlined in
> In this case, the lack of replies to your message probably indicates
> that nobody objects to your idea, so you should go ahead and get
> started, and report back when you've made progress to see if anyone has
> any feedback. The visual configurator is also something Paul
> Osmialowski is looking at, he's sent a link to a wiki page with his
> thoughts on it so far. If that's what you're interested in working on,
> you should join that conversation and provide feedback on what he's got
> so far.
> On 06/20/2010 05:05 AM, Mohammed Rashad wrote:
>> robotistics can only do with playerstage?. As a capable programmer cant
>> i contribute to playerstage?.
>>> I am currently hacking playerstage code. after some suceesfull hacks I
>> will start coding of modeller as i told before
>>> May I expect the help and support from playerstage developers as for
>> any other opensource projects.
>>> waiting for reply from other devs
> From: >Captain Bedsock <captain.bedsock@...>
>> To: rashadkm@...
>> Sent: Thu, June 17,
>> 2010 11:31:48 PM
>> Subject: Re:
>> [Playerstage-developers] gui for playerstage
>>> Hi. You should know that many young, inexperienced programmers want to
>>> do ambitious things but aren't ready for it, that is, they need lots
>>> of hand-holding. And also, typically, unfortunately, they flake out;
>>> is they don't finish; the work proves too hard for the momentary
>>> So people ignore them. Your current interaction
>>> with the list makes you look like this. If you're a capable programmer
>>> you can figure the code out yourself. And if you're just working toward
>>> a capable programmer, well, working at figuring the code out will be
>>> experience, a working programmer will spend a lot of his time figuring
>>> code that's new to him anyway. But the thing is, the
>> player/stage/gazebo devs
>>> are roboticists, interested in robots, the code is just a tool, so
>>> time helping someone with the code as opposed to robotics is very
>>> Your idea of a modeller probably isn't bad, but then, it's pretty
>>> So just do it; all the information, the files are there. If you
>>> contribute something
>>> without hand-holding, they may be more inclined to give you some time,
>>> you need it at that later date.
>>>> From: Mohammed Rashad <rashadkm@...>
>>>> Date: Thu, Jun 17, 2010 at 11:25 AM
>>>> Subject: [Playerstage-developers] gui for playerstage
>>>> To: playerstage-developers@...
>>>> I already send this mail to list and didnt get any response
>>>> the list . Maybe my mail have gone to spam folder. So I am sending
>>>> this again!
>>>> Hi playerstage developers,
>>>> I am planning to contribue on gui part of playerstage. But dont
>>>> where to start. please anyone provide me how to start contributing
>>>> gui of playerstage project.
>>>> I had some ideas to share with you all.
>>>> 1. When playerstage start a default gui is loaded for loading
>> world file.
>>>> 2. Create / design world files graphically.
>>>> A toolbox should be displayed on left pane including
>>>> drivers,camera,sensors etc.
>>>> Users can drag sensors and other grapically and place them
>>>> the worksheet and compile to make world files
>>>> An example of gui modeler
>>>> another example is pcb designers something like tina design
>>>> suite or ORCA
>>>> This displays toolbar on top and users drag item on the
>>>> mainwindow and finally print the required PCB
>>>> It will be nice if playerstage have such a user interface for
>>>> world files.
>>>> After building this new gui interface we can also plan for another
>>>> creating custom drivers graphically(after the first interface).
>>>> I need some starting point for this development. If you all like my
>>>> idea and playerstage needs such an interface, please support me
>>>> If anyone is unclear about this idea please send me an email. we
>>>> discuss on any irc channel!.
>> ThinkGeek and WIRED's GeekDad team up for the Ultimate
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>> lucky parental unit. See the prize list and enter to win:
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