MinGW - Minimalist GNU for Windows

--- Keith MARSHALL <keith.marshall@...>写道:

> Haibin Zhang wrote:
> > My project include all newest version of autotool
> that
> > mingw don't provide:
> 
> So what?

The following list that program ,mingw version and my
version's compare:

program		mingw version 	my version

m4		1.4		1.4.4

bison		2.0		2.1
flex		?		2.5.4a

autoconf	2.59		2.59
automake	1.8.2		1.9.6
libtool		1.5		1.5.22

libiconv	1.8.0		1.9.2				
gettext		0.11.5		0.14.5

> 
> As Earnie and I have both pointed out, it's your
> monolithic
> packaging format that we object to, not what you
> provide in
> your package.  Any user who needs those latest
> versions of
> the autotools, or gettext, will be well capable of
> updating
> their own installations, using our mingwPORTs.

This is a temporary schema, If I have time, I will
package it as cygwin install.exe. so that many people
can upgrade mingw as cygwin.

> If you *really* want to assist those users who you
> say need
> your package, then why not offer them an even better
> service,
> by helping us to keep the appropriate mingwPORTs up
> to date,
> instead of creating yet another software
> distribution?

I think that if you spend much time to update
mingwPORTS, maybe you can create a intall.exe like
cygwin.
sorry, maybe I am wrong, maybe I don't understand
mingwPORTS.

> Regards,
> Keith.
> 
> 
>
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Quoting Julien Lecomte <julien@...>:

> On 14/02/2006 00:21, Lennart Borgman wrote:
>> Earnie Boyd wrote:
>>>
>>> http://www.mingw.org/MinGWiki/index.php/FAQ
>>>
>>>
>>> Earnie Boyd
>> So there are two of them?:
>>
>>   http://www.mingw.org/mingwfaq.shtml
>>
>
> Yep. The latter is static html, the other a wiki. I'ld still like to 
> review and update both, but time's not a friend of mine ;-) I'ld like 
> to have them more in sync, and had added all the info on the static 
> FAQ to the wiki one.

Please don't waste your time on mingwfaq.shtml, I plan to update the 
sidebar pointer to point to the wiki.

> I suggest a Wiki Improvement Drive ;-)

Anyone at anytime can do that.

Earnie Boyd

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Julien Lecomte wrote:
> On 14/02/2006 00:21, Lennart Borgman wrote:
>> Earnie Boyd wrote:
>>>
>>> http://www.mingw.org/MinGWiki/index.php/FAQ
>>
>> So there are two of them?:
>> 
>>   http://www.mingw.org/mingwfaq.shtml
>
> Yep. The latter is static html, the other a wiki. I'ld still like
> to review and update both, but time's not a friend of mine ;-)
> I'ld like to have them more in sync, and had added all the info
> on the static FAQ to the wiki one.

The latter is an artifact, predating the introduction of MinGWiki.

It is potentially confusing to users, to say nothing of more time
consuming for Project admins, to maintain both.  Given its community
supported nature, the MinGWiki has more potential as a comprehensive
source of FAQ type info, and should be considered as the primary Q&A
resource.

There is some information, on mingw.org, which should rightfully be
maintained with administrative control.  I don't think that the FAQ
falls into that category.  Eventually, I think that mingwfaq.shtml
should go away, but that must not happen until all its content has
been integrated into MinGWiki.

> I suggest a Wiki Improvement Drive ;-)

Seconded, but how do you suggest we promote it?

As a community supported resource, *all* MinGW users are welcome to
contribute.  Here are some ideas you could all consider:--

1) If you find the answer to a question in mingw.org/mingwfaq, which
   isn't also answered by MinGWiki, then please add the information
   to MinGWiki's FAQ.

2) If you find yourself answering the same question again and again,
   on any of the MinGW mailing list, then that surely qualifies as a
   FAQ;  write up your solution as a FAQ entry on MinGWiki;  (if the
   answer requires more than two or three lines of text, please plant
   a reference for a new article in the FAQ, and write up the answer
   as a separate linked article).

3) If you find a dead `WikiPage?' reference, and you think you might
   have some useful information to fill the void, then please go ahead
   and create the missing page.

4) If you feel that some existing content is incomplete, incorrect, or
   could be better explained, then please amend it.

5) If you've solved some thorny problem, and think your solution may
   be useful to others, then please share it by adding a MinGWiki
   HOWTO article, or tutorial.

Regards,
Keith.

Haibin Zhang wrote, quoting me:
>> As Earnie and I have both pointed out, it's your monolithic
>> packaging format that we object to, not what you provide in
>> your package.  Any user who needs those latest versions of
>> the autotools, or gettext, will be well capable of updating
>> their own installations, using our mingwPORTs.
>
> This is a temporary schema, If I have time, I will package it
> as cygwin install.exe. so that many people can upgrade mingw
> as cygwin.

I hope you mean "like cygwin", rather than "as cygwin"; I don't
think the Cygwin folks will be too enamoured of you trying to
replace a Cygwin install with a MinGW rip-off.  Nor will we be
best pleased, if upgrading a MinGW installation turns it into
Cygwin.  (That aside, there is already significant co-operation
between the Cygwin and MinGW projects).

>> If you *really* want to assist those users who you say need
>> your package, then why not offer them an even better service,
>> by helping us to keep the appropriate mingwPORTs up to date,
>> instead of creating yet another software distribution?
>
> I think that if you spend much time to update mingwPORTS, maybe
> you can create a intall.exe like cygwin.  Sorry, maybe I am wrong,
> maybe I don't understand mingwPORTS.

We like the mingwPORT concept, because it allows users to select
those packages they want/need, download the PORT file, and run
`mingwPORT.sh' to handle the details of downloading, building
and installing the required package, while also optimising it to
best fit their own system configuration.

In many respects, each mingwPORT is like a mini installer, with
each one dedicated to its own optional add-on package for a MinGW
or MSYS system.  Certainly, there isn't currently any single
integrated installer, which can handle both a basic MinGW
installation, and also manage the optional add-ons.  It would be
nice to offer one, but that needs development effort, which in
turn needs time, and that is a scarce commodity.  That would
appear to be your goal, but isn't your effort misdirected?
Instead of impatiently going it alone, wouldn't you be better
working *with* us, to achieve that goal?  Together we could
achieve so much more than we can each produce independently.
I have no issue with letting you join the MinGW Developer Team,
and allowing you to participate in development discussions.
We already have a couple of developers, with an interest in
installers; why not share your ideas with them?  But please,
show some patience; you must give us an opportunity to review
your work, *before* we adopt it into MinGW, or give you carte
blanche to upload to our project pages.

Regards,
Keith.