Nice to see some quick followups! :)
I, too, prefer a Unix-based system with Java. I just started playing
with Mono, but I can't see myself switching over to it full-time. I'd
much rather use Java.
And I have the same problem as you do with Windows... there are lots of
nice tools on Windows, but that ship sailed for me YEARS ago (I was a
Windows developer for 15 years), and I don't miss it one bit. The same
goes for C... I spent YEARS writing C code, and I have no desire to
dive back into THAT pool.
So, for me, it's Unix/Linux and Java!
On Sep 30, 2004, at 5:12 PM, Ray Auge wrote:
> Hello Mark, Mark, Luca and all you other j-g developers,
> I've never really contributed. I'm more of a (ab)user... you might say
> "a leach".
> What I've "leached", though, I've loved.
> Frankly, I hate swing. I think it's ugly and convoluted. Windows, I
> it just as much AND I think it's ugly and convoluted and as such I
> have much interest in making my work available there. GTK? I love it,
> it's beautiful. Java? I love it. It effectively makes me a good
> programmer without much effort on my part.
> Now, where does java-gnome fit into this tirade.
> Well, I get to program in my favorite language (I'll never switch to
> mono, sorry; not as long as the gcj project is alive anyway) and I get
> to use my favorite widget/UI framework.
> Then there's Glade...
> Well let's just say that these are the contents of my tool chest:
> - gcj
> - java-gnome
> - glade (due to j-g)
> - Eclipse (to manage it all)
> I'd have to say that I would very much miss j-g. I can honestly admit
> that I've missed the activity on the g-j lists and I'd hoped that it
> (all your hard work) hadn't been all for naught.
> I suppose had I been a little more of a pest this summer as I'd been
> during the school year (I WAS using jg for my thesis and got many
> compliments on the beautiful UI) it might have indicated to you that
> have at least one satisfied user.
> But, now that I'm settled in a full time job, I plan to do more
> development and I wouldn't do that without opening my toolbox.
> Personally, the biggest barrier I can currently see in obtaining
> widespread use of j-g is it's non-availability on any standard distros.
> I think if the team made the next major task to ensure jg could be
> build, and as a result packaged, (even if it meant back-porting some of
> the features to gnome 2.6) on standard Fedora, Debian, Suse (and maybe
> attract some of the good Novell attention), Mandrake, etc. you'd see
> number of people exploring jg's use grow by double in six months.
> Right now, less savvy Linux users (many of them actually Java
> programmers) quickly give up on j-g because it's too complex to setup.
> That's my two cents,
> Ray Auge <rayauge@...>
> Check out what I've been doing at http://plaster.sourceforge.net
> On Thu, 2004-09-30 at 15:46 -0700, Mark Davidson wrote:
>> Hi Mark--
>> On Sep 30, 2004, at 2:00 PM, Mark Howard wrote:
>>> Hello everyone,
>>> I've been thinking a lot about java-gnome today.
>>> Questions like:
>>> - will java-gnome ever succeed
>>> - have we any chance of upgrading our bindings to the next gtk+
>>> - does anybody really want to use java-gnome anyway
>>> - will gnome be written in mono in a few years time
>>> - ... and so java-gnome never really be of any use
>>> - what should the project aims be in the next few months
>>> - is there anything we could do better than we're doing it no
>>> - (most importantly) should I invest more time in java-gnome and try
>>> my best to
>>> help it along
>> All *very* good questions! I'll throw my opinions in below...
>>> There doesn't seem to have been anything happening with the bindings
>>> lately as
>>> far as I can see. That seems true in general in the past. I'm
>>> wondering what can
>>> be done to change this. Is it just something with our build system we
>>> need to
>>> change? a new tutorial for glade perhaps? something else?
>> For me, I just let my time get eaten up with tons of other things in
>> everyday life. I want to get back into working on the gtkhtml
>> and make it so that people want to use them. One problem I've been
>> dealing with is getting some of this stuff working on my Mac. I
>> managed to get gcj working on the Mac, and with fink, I believe i can
>> make progress. My big problem is that my Linux box is at home... and
>> my Mac is a Powerbook, so I carry it everywhere. I'm hoping that if I
>> can make progress on using Mac OS X, I can work on this a lot more.
>>> Sorry if this message seems completely random - it is. I'm just not
>>> sure whether
>>> to spend my limited time on java-gnome or some other project right
>>> now. Please
>>> let me know what you think to the questions above and any others you
>>> Please also say what you think of the project in general and perhaps
>>> motivations for working on it. Thanks a lot in advance for any
>>> responses you
>>> give, or even if nobody responds; I'm sure it'll help me decide.
>> I think that your concerns are well-founded, and we (as a team) should
>> make an effort to move forward with this project. Having said that,
>> I'll provide answers to your questions... :)
>> Will java-gnome ever succeed? I'd like to think it has great
>> to succeed. With the push from Novell, I believe Gnome is going to
>> start moving even faster.
>> Have we any chance of upgrading our bindings to the next gtk+? I'm
>> sure how involved this is, but considering how helpful everyone has
>> been so far, I think we can do this. I'm certainly willing to help.
>> Does anyone ever want to use java-gnome? I DO. *grin* I enjoy Java
>> development and would love to use it for Gnome apps.
>> Will Gnome be written in Mono? I have no idea, but I have to believe
>> that they will provide hooks for as many languages as possible. I
>> can't imagine an edict coming down that requires every developer to
>> a CIL-compliant language.
>> What should the project aims be? I'd say we need to get everyone on
>> the same page (this especially applies to ME) and decide on our aims
>> and focus.
>> Whether or not you want to invest time in Java-gnome is, obviously,
>> your choice... I'd hope you will because, dammit, SOMEONE needs to
>> me when I do something stupid!
>> Mark Davidson
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